Don't forget this is what Tyrion is supposed to look like:
**Official Game of Thrones: Season 5 Thread (BOOK READERS/SPOILERS ALLOWED)**
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Last: 8 yr ago by Al Bula
quote:quote:yeah but not nearly as good as gutting Ramsay on the way out the door first....
I think Sansa and Theon escaping would be a good storyline.
like make Reek do the weird wedding night business in the books only for Sansa (instead of fake Arya)....and that flips a switch for Reek and he goes insane and tears a naked Ramsay to pieces for Sansa and the Starks.....
Speaking of weird wedding night business...
did anyone else think Ramsay was gonna make Reek EAD when he put him on his knees?
Yes, I did think that
quote:quote:quote:yeah but not nearly as good as gutting Ramsay on the way out the door first....
I think Sansa and Theon escaping would be a good storyline.
like make Reek do the weird wedding night business in the books only for Sansa (instead of fake Arya)....and that flips a switch for Reek and he goes insane and tears a naked Ramsay to pieces for Sansa and the Starks.....
Speaking of weird wedding night business...
did anyone else think Ramsay was gonna make Reek EAD when he put him on his knees?
for half a second... yes, to loosely quote Shawshank, "he doesn't qualify, you have to be human first."
quote:
It's very chaotic in the books. You have the bloody flux going on during a siege and Barristan has just arrested Hizdahr and is pretty much in control. Daario is a hostage of the Yunkai and there is a battle raging outside and there are some folks from Astapor and Pyatt Pree from . Tyrion is a slave outside the city. Victarion's fleet is closing in on Mereen for a surprise attack. Essentially it is setting up for a monster battle.
And don't forget Dany coming back. I'm 95% sure that now that she has control of Drogon she will retake control of the Dothraki and save the day at the battle of Mereen.
quote:To me this set up the notion that Dany has a plan beyond the initial appearance of the plan, much like when she "sold" her dragon for the unsullied. I believe she will open the pits and lure the Sons of the Harpy out to kill them.quote:
Daenerys - well they set it up with Melissandre telling her she has seen her listen to advice or not liosten to advice, but has seen her at her best when she does something nobody else sees as a solution....
As for Tyrion, although it is not quite clear yet, it seems he did not get infected with greyscale like Jorah. I think the show doesn't really show much of the stone men fight on purpose so they wouldn't reveal too much into Tyrion not catching it -- kind of leaving us to wonder if he just got lucky or if there's something more to it. I think this foreshadows Tyrion's future and blood line.
quote:maybe Jon Snow is Aegon VI?? Now that's a wild theory
Either R+L = J or Aegon VI survived Robert's rebellion, or both. There are no other options. Ned's dream proves it. It is all about royal succession.
In Westeros, succession goes through the the eldest male child's line. So, let's work through the line after Aerys II was killed. Rhaegar is dead, so we pass over him. Westeros succession passes over females to get to males, so we pass over his daughter Rhaenys. We stop at Aegon, who was Aegon VI for less than a day before he was killed (let's assume for now Young Griff is not Aegon). After Aegon, the Rhaegar line is extinguished. So, we move to the next child after Rhaegar. That's a male (Viserys), so we can stop there.
After Aegon VI had his head crushed, every Targaryen supporter would agree that Viserys is the rightful king of Westeros, if it weren't for that pesky Usurper.
Every Targaryen supporter, except for the three most important. Why didn't Viserys have the support of the three surviving uncaptured Kingsguard, including the Lord Commander?
These are three men who knew the score and made the conscious decision to NOT follow Viserys to Dragonstone. As the story goes:
"Ser Willem Darry is fled to Dragonstone, with your queen and Prince Viserys. I thought you might have sailed with him.""Ser Willem is a good man and true," said Ser Oswell."But not of the Kingsguard," Ser Gerold pointed out. "The Kingsguard does not flee.""Then or now," said Ser Arthur. He donned his helm."We swore a vow," explained old Ser Gerold.
There can be only one explanation...seriously, only one explanation. Kingsguard should not be with Viserys, because he is not the King. Kingsguard do not flee when they are guarding the King. Therefore, the Tower of Joy contains the person the Lord Commander of the Kingsguard knows to be the rightful King. That can only mean the Tower of Joy contains a legitimate (non-*******) son or daughter of Rhaegar.
That could be Aegon VI or it could be Jon. If I were going to smuggle Aegon VI across the Narrow Sea, I'm not doing it out of Kings Landing. I'm getting him to the safest place possible in the short term; Dorne.
Also, it would be nothing for Rhaegar to take Lyanna as a second wife, so her child (jon) would be legitimate. He can work out the details when he gets back from killing the Usurper on the Trident.
It is also entirely possible that Aegon VI and Rhaegar's love child Jon were both in the Tower at the time. We know Ned doesn't murder children, so it is conceivable that he would take Aegon VI to Starfall and take Jon home. Without working through the details, it seems to me that Aegon VI going with Ned to Starfall solves a lot of the questions about nursemaids. Also explains how Ashara ends up as the Young Griff's septon.
So, to sum up, the rightful line is:
Aegon VI, if he is alive...and if not;
Jon Snow, if he is the legit child of R+L...and if not;
Daenerys Stormborn.
Those are your three dragonriders.
quote:I do not believe that Daenerys and Melissandre have ever met (unless Quaithe is Melissandre in disguise).
Daenerys - well they set it up with Melissandre telling her she has seen her listen to advice or not liosten to advice, but has seen her at her best when she does something nobody else sees as a solution....
You mean Missandei, right?
quote:
Btw, that story Roose told about hanging the man and boning the women underneath...should I just assume this is the sort of thing Ned Stark would have never heard about? Can't imagine him letting one of his lords treat the people that way.
I have been rereading book 5 and pretty much keeping the same pace as the show, which has been interesting to see how often some of the show dialogue is straight out of the books. I was on a Reek chapter last night and the story that Roose told on the show is basically straight out of the book.
quote:reticulating splines
You mean Missandei, right?
quote:yes, sorryquote:I do not believe that Daenerys and Melissandre have ever met (unless Quaithe is Melissandre in disguise).
Daenerys - well they set it up with Melissandre telling her she has seen her listen to advice or not liosten to advice, but has seen her at her best when she does something nobody else sees as a solution....
You mean Missandei, right?
missandei = dany's asst.
melisandre = red priestess
my bad
I don't think Lord Manderly will ever be cast on the show.
quote:
I don't think Lord Manderly will ever be cast on the show.
would love to see John Goodman cook up some Frey pie
quote:quote:
I don't think Lord Manderly will ever be cast on the show.
would love to see John Goodman cook up some Frey pie
Those bible salesmen and their Great North Conspiracies...
quote:quote:
Btw, that story Roose told about hanging the man and boning the women underneath...should I just assume this is the sort of thing Ned Stark would have never heard about? Can't imagine him letting one of his lords treat the people that way.
I have been rereading book 5 and pretty much keeping the same pace as the show, which has been interesting to see how often some of the show dialogue is straight out of the books. I was on a Reek chapter last night and the story that Roose told on the show is basically straight out of the book.
Right, but wasn't this after basically everyone is dead and Ramsay is the one doing the hanging/raping bc no one is around to stop him? The story as told by Roose would have been risky while Ned was alive and ruling the North.
What? No Roose raped that chick and had Ramsey well before Ned died.
Every lord got to dole out justice as they saw fight.
Ned was just Warden of the North, not micro-manager of the north and all its territories.
Every lord got to dole out justice as they saw fight.
Ned was just Warden of the North, not micro-manager of the north and all its territories.
Answer is pretty simple: Ned didn't know. If he did, he'd have executed Roose as he planned to execute Jorah.
Yeah by all accounts Ned ruled the North fairly but heavy handed. The Bolton's have had to keep their "traditions" quiet, Ned would not approve of flaying or "Lord's Right" or whatever it was called.
I think of them as Missy and Lady Mel to keep it straight in my dome
quote:
missandei = dany's asst.
melisandre = red priestess
I think of them as Missy and Lady Mel to keep it straight in my dome
I'm talking about differences b/w book and show. The story Roose told in the show is not the same in the book, I thought. Maybe I'm remembering incorrectly, but I thought once Ramsay was in control while his dad was at Harrenhal he did the hanging/raping of the married couple.
I'm not saying Ned was supposed to micromanage the other lords in the North, only that he would likely have not approved of that sort of justice. Similar how the Starks of an earlier generation stopped the Boltons from flaying prisoners.
I'm not saying Ned was supposed to micromanage the other lords in the North, only that he would likely have not approved of that sort of justice. Similar how the Starks of an earlier generation stopped the Boltons from flaying prisoners.
No, the hanging of the husband and rape of the wife was at Roose's hands and that is how Ramsey came about as the bas-turd born child of rape. Roose came across the couple and had not been made aware of the marriage (therefore shielding them from his right to have the wife before the wedding). He flipped out and hung the husband and raped the wife under the swinging corpse. Again, that is how Ramsey came to be.
In A Clash of Kings, Ramsey, disguised as Reek, was taken as prisoner to Winterfell by Ser Roderik after putting down the chaos on the Hornwood lands caused when Ramsey forced Lady Hornwood to marry him. After Ser Rodrik left to go south to one of the other castle's under attack, Theon took Winterfell and took Reek (Ramsey ) in to his service. Reek promised several hundred troops to Theon if he would let him return to the Dreadfort. When Reek (now back to Ramsey) returned to Winterfell he basically ambushed Rodrik's men and slaughtered them. Theon then let them in the castle and Ramsey had all the ironborn killed, took Theon prisoner, killed or dispersed the residents of Winterfell then put the castle to the torch. He returned to the Dreadfort with Theon as his play toy and began transforming him to the new Reek.
All of that is basically going on in the background during ASOS and AFFC until Theon comes back as a first person character in ADWD.
In A Clash of Kings, Ramsey, disguised as Reek, was taken as prisoner to Winterfell by Ser Roderik after putting down the chaos on the Hornwood lands caused when Ramsey forced Lady Hornwood to marry him. After Ser Rodrik left to go south to one of the other castle's under attack, Theon took Winterfell and took Reek (Ramsey ) in to his service. Reek promised several hundred troops to Theon if he would let him return to the Dreadfort. When Reek (now back to Ramsey) returned to Winterfell he basically ambushed Rodrik's men and slaughtered them. Theon then let them in the castle and Ramsey had all the ironborn killed, took Theon prisoner, killed or dispersed the residents of Winterfell then put the castle to the torch. He returned to the Dreadfort with Theon as his play toy and began transforming him to the new Reek.
All of that is basically going on in the background during ASOS and AFFC until Theon comes back as a first person character in ADWD.
Thanks for the reminder.
I had to re-read the end of A Clash of Kings a while back to get that right myself.
quote:quote:
I don't think Lord Manderly will ever be cast on the show.
would love to see John Goodman cook up some Frey pie
Goodman would be great. This is out of left field but I think Robbie Coltrane could pull it off. If the name doesn't ring a bell, he played Hagrid in the Harry Potter films. He is a big guy, could pull off the jolly persona Manderley puts forward, and is in his 60s so he could have sons of fighting age.
quote:
Goodman would be good, man.
Missed an opportunity at a lame pun
Regarding Jon dying in episode 9 or 10, I really think it's going to be 10. I don't think it's going to be that big of a cliffhanger, as pretty much everyone who has read the books knows he's coming back. The only question is how. Also, they have to have Sansa escape so Jon can get the letter from Ramsay. I think episode 9 will be the Battle for Winterfell, and Sansa's escape. Episode 10 will be the where Jon gets knifed. I think most watchers, like readers, will be smart enough to know he's coming back, so any leaks of him filming won't be that big of a deal. The real question is how, and they can easily keep that secret.
Also, I'm surprised how many readers here seem to think Martin is a terrible writer, yet they read all his books.
Also, I'm surprised how many readers here seem to think Martin is a terrible writer, yet they read all his books.
A stray thought of what I'd love to see coming up.
Theon is able to tell Sansa somehow, someway that he didn't really kill Bran & Rickon. And she presses him into helping her avenge her family to make up for all the crap he's done.
She lights the candle in the window, and Brienne manages to smuggle a dagger or somesuch to Sansa/Theon.
After the wedding vows, Ramsay prepares to have Reek do that thing from the books that we really don't want to see Reek doing, and when Theon struggles to comply, Ramsay gives him the speech about "remembering his name" to which Sansa replies that the North remembers, right before stabbing him right in his ******* heart.
Of course, they'd still be stuck in a castle full of enemies, unless Stannis or Howland "Don't call me Sparrow" Reed or the Riders of Rohan or the 6th Fleet or Han & Chewie show up to rescue them, but it would be the best fist pump moment in a while for GOT.
Theon is able to tell Sansa somehow, someway that he didn't really kill Bran & Rickon. And she presses him into helping her avenge her family to make up for all the crap he's done.
She lights the candle in the window, and Brienne manages to smuggle a dagger or somesuch to Sansa/Theon.
After the wedding vows, Ramsay prepares to have Reek do that thing from the books that we really don't want to see Reek doing, and when Theon struggles to comply, Ramsay gives him the speech about "remembering his name" to which Sansa replies that the North remembers, right before stabbing him right in his ******* heart.
Of course, they'd still be stuck in a castle full of enemies, unless Stannis or Howland "Don't call me Sparrow" Reed or the Riders of Rohan or the 6th Fleet or Han & Chewie show up to rescue them, but it would be the best fist pump moment in a while for GOT.
Who said he's a terrible writer? I just think he has made the story so long that the last two books dragged because they are the low points of the story. The books are not episodic like most series: as in there is not an individual plot for each book like there is for Haary Potter or LOTR. It pretty unique that it basically reads like a seven installment novel. The level of detail he puts in each book is parallel to none.
quote:I haven't laughed this hard in a long time. Thank you.
Of course, they'd still be stuck in a castle full of enemies, unless Stannis or Howland "Don't call me Sparrow" Reed or the Riders of Rohan or the 6th Fleet or Han & Chewie show up to rescue them, but it would be the best fist pump moment in a while for GOT.
quote:I try to remind myself that he never intended to write most of books 4 & 5 (some of would have been included in later books). I'm optimistic that he will recover in the next book as it gets back to his original ideas, and that he could even get book 7 out faster than books 4 & 5. It's almost amazing that book 6 will likely be released late this year or early next year when you consider how busy he has been with the show and appearances. If he was simply writing, it likely would have come out much sooner. Even still, it'll be out faster than 4 & 5 were.
Who said he's a terrible writer? I just think he has made the story so long that the last two books dragged because they are the low points of the story. The books are not episodic like most series: as in there is not an individual plot for each book like there is for Haary Potter or LOTR. It pretty unique that it basically reads like a seven installment novel. The level of detail he puts in each book is parallel to none.
quote:Some day when you have intellectual property, you can criticize another's protectiveness towards their works.
You are making assumptions that he is interested in pleasing his fans with a quick release. I think he has made it very apparent he is writing for himself and on his own schedule. Maybe I have gotten the wrong impression of GRRM but he seems very arrogant and self absorbed with this whole process.
quote:quote:Some day when you have intellectual property, you can criticize another's protectiveness towards their works.
You are making assumptions that he is interested in pleasing his fans with a quick release. I think he has made it very apparent he is writing for himself and on his own schedule. Maybe I have gotten the wrong impression of GRRM but he seems very arrogant and self absorbed with this whole process.
Tell that to the people who piss and moan over George Lucas
Touche
quote:Eh, I was really just referring to how slow his process normally is but how it was much slower with 4 & 5 possibly because he never intended to write them and struggled with it. I hope that now that he has solved the "multi-year gap problem" he will back to his original writing pace (still slow but following a general outline which makes it easier/faster.
You are making assumptions that he is interested in pleasing his fans with a quick release. I think he has made it very apparent he is writing for himself and on his own schedule. Maybe I have gotten the wrong impression of GRRM but he seems very arrogant and self absorbed with this whole process.
quote:In my experience, people are seldom pleased with a quick release.
You are making assumptions that he is interested in pleasing his fans with a quick release
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