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PSA M4 Rifle Kit -419.99

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Yep, things are cheap right now.

I hope they stay that way.

But I'm pessimistic.

I know nothing about building and nothing about what is quality or not...

So question, is that everything you need to build that AR? How is the quality of that AR once built?

You would also need a stripped lower receiver and a rear sight of some sort.

The lower would need to be transferred to you from an FFL if you buy it online, as the lower is the serialized part of the gun. Everything else can be shipped right to your front door.

That specific kit would be a decent quality gun, though I'm not a huge fan of the M4 set up for a couple of reasons, the biggest being the front sight.

ETA: You would also need some basic tools to put together the kit.

Agree with the front sight, eventually I'll take the MOE handguard off mine and replace it and the FSB with a free float rail.

Thanks! When you say tools, do you mean just basic tools any handyman would have? Can someone with no experience with building put that together?

Can someone link a front site?

Can someone post a pic of what that finished AR would look like?

I put my AR together with an Armorer's wrench, vice grips, rubber/brass hammer and a set of roll pin punches. I ended up using the vice grips to squeeze pins in more than the hammer and punches.

Don't usually like AR15.com but this thread has a lot of good pictures, if you can put IKEA stuff together you can build an AR. Link

Front sight on that kit looks like this

This is going to be a long post.

First, what I was talking about with that M4 and its front sight: An AR with the triangle looking front sight is generally a combination front sight/gas block. Here's a picture without the handguards so you can see what I'm talking about:



The M4 style AR-15 uses what is referred to as a carbine length gas system, which is shorter than the original rifle length gas used on the 20" guns. Later a compromise length that worked well for 16" barrels was developed known as midlength. The problem with carbine length gas systems is that when you use a front sight/gas block like in the picture above, your sight radius is fairly short. Here is a picture of 3 different 16" AR uppers. The top one is M4 carbine length, the middle is a midlength set up, and the bottom is a rifle gas system on a 16" barrel. You can easily see how the front sight/gas block combo shortens your sight radius.



Now, a more modern and popular option these days is an upper that does not use the old front sight/gas block combo, but instead has a low profile gas block that can be hidden under longer handguards...so you can use the shorter gas system, but still enjoy a longer sight radius by adding iron sights to the end of the long handguard like so:



Now compare that to your standard M4 set up:



Both guns have the same gas system, but much different sight set ups. I much prefer the longer sight radius.

Now, for the last part:

A finished AR could look about a million different ways. They're incredibly modular, and civilian ownership in the US for 40+ years has helped drive all kinds of innovation.

So you have the "modern" style above, the M4 style above as well....you could also build a heavier gun set up for more long range shooting, with a bipod and scope:



Or a really simple, lightweight set up:



You could go 20" A4 (Marine Corps standard issue for most of the War on Terror), a longer, heavier option:



Or you could get a SBR tax stamp and build something really short.



There are a ton of options out there. You just have to decide what fits you and the type of shooting you do best.

I really really appreciate the info. As I was reading I thought of another question... So the option with longer hand guard and site radius, can that be added to the m4 build kit linked above? If so, how much would that add?

I really like that longer hand guard look and functionality.

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I really really appreciate the info. As I was reading I thought of another question... So the option with longer hand guard and site radius, can that be added to the m4 build kit linked above? If so, how much would that add?

I really like that longer hand guard look and functionality.

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It can, but you are going to have to replace the gas block and buy the hand guard, which even with the cheapest options for a free float that I know of, is going to cost you close to a hundred bucks. Instead, take a look at this kit:

https://www.geauxarmory.com/carbine-build-foxtrot-p-54.html

I built one a couple weeks ago. The trigger is a little rough, but the rest of the kit was good to go. You can have a much nicer trigger for as little as $30 by buying this trigger: http://palmettostatearmory.com/psa-ar15-pa10-enhanced-polished-trigger.html


I just put a lower together with this kit about 30 minutes ago and it is a really good feeling trigger for the price.

Or, if you are dead set on getting a PSA kit, go with this one: http://palmettostatearmory.com/psa-16-m4-5-56-nato-1-7-melonite-13-5-lightweight-moe-freedom-rifle-kit.html

I assume if long range shooting is the main goal, longer barrel is better?

Great thanks. I guess the lower linked earlier would still work for this kit? Sorry, I think that was already addressed but wanted to make sure.

Any mil-spec lower will work. Personally, I'd avoid the magnesium and polymer lowers unless you specifically are trying to build as light as possible and save a few ounces. Stick with a forged or billet lower and you shouldn't have any issues.

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I assume if long range shooting is the main goal, longer barrel is better?

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What do you mean by long range?

300 yards? 1000 yards?

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I put my AR together with an Armorer's wrench, vice grips, rubber/brass hammer and a set of roll pin punches. I ended up using the vice grips to squeeze pins in more than the hammer and punches.

Don't usually like AR15.com but this thread has a lot of good pictures, if you can put IKEA stuff together you can build an AR. Link

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Yep, the pistol stuff I've done with both my 22/45 and my CZs were more difficult than putting an AR together by far.

Lots of good videos, links, etc out there to follow. It's not hard to put together, but really does help you appreciate just how ingenious the rifle really is.

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I put my AR together with an Armorer's wrench, vice grips, rubber/brass hammer and a set of roll pin punches. I ended up using the vice grips to squeeze pins in more than the hammer and punches.

Don't usually like AR15.com but this thread has a lot of good pictures, if you can put IKEA stuff together you can build an AR. Link

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Yep, the pistol stuff I've done with both my 22/45 and my CZs were more difficult than putting an AR together by far.

Lots of good videos, links, etc out there to follow. It's not hard to put together, but really does help you appreciate just how ingenious the rifle really is.

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Legos with recoil

Thanks, can you provide a link to a good option if this, if the one linked is not what you are describing?

The ones linked earlier by Bender and myself are.

400-1000

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400-1000

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400 yards is no problem with a 16" barrel. However that is the farthest I've taken mine due to where I was shooting not because I felt I was anywhere near mine or my equipment's limit. I also know my scope (PA ACSS 4x) has BDC marked to 800.

If I was building a gun to go 1000 it wouldn't be an AR, but if you just want to shoot that distance for ****s and giggles every now and then it wouldn't be terrible. OAL of an AR with a 20" barrel will be similar to a bolt action of same barrel length so don't let people try to steer you away from because its too long/other crap

A good friend of mine built an AR rig in .308 that he just used for a long range class. It's the reason I ask.

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400-1000

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At the farther ranges, look into a grendel build instead. I'm probably the biggest SPC homer there is (reasonably) but will defer to the grendel for true long range. SPC is a great middle of the road that doesn't suffer anywhere. Is it quite as good upclose as a 300 blk when both are being run subsonic? Not quite. Is it as good as a grendel at extreme range? No. But does it do both of those in a serviceable manner while shining at the 300-400 yard range? Definitely. Popped a hog at 425 with mine and it just went down. Not sure that I'd personally shoot a deer with it but no qualms popping a hog at that range.

If you want a 308 platform... let's talk about an AR10 creedmoor build like mine. Absolutely love that gun.

Did you see my can question in your March thread?

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A good friend of mine built an AR rig in .308 that he just used for a long range class. It's the reason I ask.

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.308 is a different ball game

No problem with taking that to 1000, thought you were talking 5.56.

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If you want a 308 platform... let's talk about an AR10 creedmoor build like mine. Absolutely love that gun.

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Do this.

6.5CM is a sexy round

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Did you see my can question in your March thread?

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Have had enough interest that I emailed thunderbeast about getting an account. They were closed yesterday due to bad weather though so we'll see when they get back in.

OK, thanks. He's ready to go depending on price as his normal guy already gave him a price.

He's the West Pointer I brought by the day I bought the A&M Yeti cup on our way to shoot at ASC. He'd rather buy through you if the price is right.

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If you want a 308 platform... let's talk about an AR10 creedmoor build like mine. Absolutely love that gun.

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Do this.

6.5CM is a sexy round

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I agree, except I also want this to be my Colorado hunting gun and I'm concerned it isn't enough caliber for elk. I don't have lots of excess capital right now and it seems silly to spend all the time shooting long range with one rifle only to hunt with another

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If you want a 308 platform... let's talk about an AR10 creedmoor build like mine. Absolutely love that gun.

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Do this.

6.5CM is a sexy round

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I agree, except I also want this to be my Colorado hunting gun and I'm concerned it isn't enough caliber for elk. I don't have lots of excess capital right now and it seems silly to spend all the time shooting long range with one rifle only to hunt with another

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http://www.hornady.com/store/6.5-Creedmoor-143-gr-ELD-X-Precision-Hunter/

Something to look at, their chart has it at 1300 FT/LBS at 500 from a 24" barrel

Heavier .308, very similiar FT/LB at 500

http://www.hornady.com/store/308-Win-178-gr-ELD-X-Precision-Hunter/

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If you want a 308 platform... let's talk about an AR10 creedmoor build like mine. Absolutely love that gun.

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Do this.

6.5CM is a sexy round

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I agree, except I also want this to be my Colorado hunting gun and I'm concerned it isn't enough caliber for elk. I don't have lots of excess capital right now and it seems silly to spend all the time shooting long range with one rifle only to hunt with another

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Creedmoor is definitely enough for elk. However, I would be more concerned about the weight of an AR10 in the mountains myself.

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If you want a 308 platform... let's talk about an AR10 creedmoor build like mine. Absolutely love that gun.

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Do this.

6.5CM is a sexy round

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I agree, except I also want this to be my Colorado hunting gun and I'm concerned it isn't enough caliber for elk. I don't have lots of excess capital right now and it seems silly to spend all the time shooting long range with one rifle only to hunt with another

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Creedmoor is definitely enough for elk. However, I would be more concerned about the weight of an AR10 in the mountains myself.

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True, but it's not like my dad's .300 Win mag (that I currently borrow) is light anyway. It will stay in my pack most of the time anyway.

Since I did say "and other semi auto" in the title....

Prices on AUGs, Tavors, FALs, PTRs (G3 clones) etc are as good as they've been in a long time.

If you don't have anything, I recommend an AR first. It's the best of the group, by far.

But if you've already got an AR or 3 or 4 and are looking for a little variety, there are other fun options out there too.

Here's a PTR and a Tavor next to the 10.5" AR pistol.

O.K., thanks again for all of the detailed replys and links.

To summarize

Build Kit
https://www.geauxarmory.com/carbine-build-foxtrot-p-54.html

Stripped Lower Receiver
http://www.andersonrifles.com/product/stripped-lower-7075-t6-2235-56-a-federal-firearms-license-is-required-to-purchase-this-item/

Upgraded Trigger
http://palmettostatearmory.com/psa-ar15-pa10-enhanced-polished-trigger.html

Besides the upgraded trigger, is this everything needed for a functional gun? Does it include both rear and front sites?

So I am trying to figure out what kinda value I am getting for these parts... Is there a way to compare this to something you can just go and buy at a store like academy or a gun store? Or is this exact gun something I can just go and buy already built, if so, for how much?



PSA kit
http://palmettostatearmory.com/psa-16-m4-5-56-nato-1-7-melonite-13-5-lightweight-moe-freedom-rifle-kit.html

Does this include everything needed, or do you still have to get the stripped lower? I thought I read on the link that it includes a " Includes the PSA MOE Lower Build Kit"... is that not the same thing as a stripped lower?

TIA

The PSA kit still needs a lower. The lower build kit is the stock, buffer tube, buffer spring and buffer plus the lower parts kit.

You are going to need sights of some sort, either irons, a red dot or a scope. There are pluses and minuses to each system. I prefer red dots or scopes personally and don't shoot iron sights much at all.

IMO, one of the best deals on optics right now is being put on by Burris. If you buy their 3x or5x fixed power scope you can get a free Fastfire 3 micro red dot sight. The 3x is $299 and the 5x is $349 at Cabelas. Mount the scope on top of the receiver and the micro dot on a 45 degree offset and you have sighting options for short or longer range, for speed or precision.

WRT value, a similar rifle at a big box store would probably retail for $900-$1200, depending on manufacturer...and it would still need sights too.