He'll get stuffed a lot in the NFL too if he's constantly facing loaded boxes.
****Cowboys 2016 Offseason Thread***
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Last: 8 yr ago by jr15aggie
Yeah, he jsut doesn't seem to have that shift and burst. He's a friggin beast with some road-plowing in front of him, but if you can make him shift before he gets a few strides in, he doesn't really get the motor going. Most of his career has been made by plowing through inferior athletes.
He's a perfect fit to be one side of a tandem. Team him with someone like Jamal Charles or Lamar Miller(just examples...not draft fits per se) and he could be lethal.
I just can't believe some are not OK with a RB at #4 that is a stud... But ok with using our 2nd on another overhyped Bama RB!
Cmon people!
Cmon people!
Elliot isnt coming to the boys at #4. You can wish all you want. It wont happen. Theyve had a plan the last few years and theyre sticking with it. Building inside out.
quote:
Elliot isnt coming to the boys at #4. You can wish all you want. It wont happen. Theyve had a plan the last few years and theyre sticking with it. Building inside out.
They also dont reach in the first round. If Zeke is rated that much higher he'll be the pick. They won't go dline at #4 if nobody is worthy.
I think they proved with Frederick they stick to their board with the first pick whether it's popular out not.
The Claiborne pick being another example.
quote:
The Claiborne pick being another example.
Yep... And it's funny how that was one of the most applauded Cowboys trade and pick on recent drafts. And the Frederick pick was criticised even after he was a day 1 starter.
He's not rated higher. He's a RB. If he was they dont go sign alfred morris. They had McFadden #4 in rushing last year only playing half the season? How much production are you expecting out of your RB?
I'm just glad the LA pick happened...gave us a lot to think\talk about.
I'm still thinking either Ramsey is there at 4 and we take him, or a QB is still there and we trade back to 7 or 8 (SF or Philly) for a reasonable price and get Zeke.
If we aren't going QB at #4 I would love nothing more than to trade back and take Zeke. If we could get SF 2nd rounder it would almost be like having 3 first round picks (or we could package those 2nd rounders and get back into the late first).
I'm still thinking either Ramsey is there at 4 and we take him, or a QB is still there and we trade back to 7 or 8 (SF or Philly) for a reasonable price and get Zeke.
If we aren't going QB at #4 I would love nothing more than to trade back and take Zeke. If we could get SF 2nd rounder it would almost be like having 3 first round picks (or we could package those 2nd rounders and get back into the late first).
quote:I think it was Broaddus that said Jerry likes to see which player makes coaches or scouts pound on table... Claiborne was a Rob Ryan pick. The year before Ryan was begging for JJ Watt instead of Tyron Smith and Jerry gave the pick to Garrett. I can see Ryan pounding on the table for Claiborne. Jerry gave him his player and Ryan screwed the pooch.
The Claiborne pick being another example.
The killer is the 2nd rounder we gave up would've been Bobby Wagner according to Jerry.
I'm not questioning you or anything but it's pretty convenient one of the worst draft busts ever is blamed on the guy no longer in the building.
I have hard time believing Jerry traded up for a guy they all said was the highest graded D player since Deoin all because Rob Ryan said so.
I have hard time believing Jerry traded up for a guy they all said was the highest graded D player since Deoin all because Rob Ryan said so.
I'd be ok with Ramsey or QB at 4. Otherwise, trade out of it. It does take 2 to tango though.
We still dont know about claiborne. He's a "bust" because of injuries and they drafted a pure man cover cornerback and then asked him to play cover 2 and zone.. If he were brought in and played in the scheme he was built for (and didnt stay injured) he may have become a star.
Scheme has a lot to do with players being good. And then some players trenscend scheme ala Revis, Von, Fletcher Cox, JJ etc
Scheme has a lot to do with players being good. And then some players trenscend scheme ala Revis, Von, Fletcher Cox, JJ etc
I saw something the other day asking what if Tunsil fell to 4 and Tenn moved back up to get him.
At first it seems ridiculous cause they'd have to give Dallas a lot to make it happen. Why would they give away some of the fortune they just inherited? But another way to think about it would be if Tenn was gonna take Tunsil #1 if they couldn't trade, they are geniuses when they still get him and still have LAs #1 next year for their trouble!
For Dallas it's a large move down. But we would no doubt get 2 of their 3 second rounders (one of them being the 2nd pick in round 2) as well as a 3rd rounder.
I see virtually no chance of this happening, but I thought it was a fun what if question.
At first it seems ridiculous cause they'd have to give Dallas a lot to make it happen. Why would they give away some of the fortune they just inherited? But another way to think about it would be if Tenn was gonna take Tunsil #1 if they couldn't trade, they are geniuses when they still get him and still have LAs #1 next year for their trouble!
For Dallas it's a large move down. But we would no doubt get 2 of their 3 second rounders (one of them being the 2nd pick in round 2) as well as a 3rd rounder.
I see virtually no chance of this happening, but I thought it was a fun what if question.
These guys get it! This is my current best case scenario!
http://mweb.cbssports.com/nfl/eye-on-football/25554964/nfl-mock-draft-49ers-trade-up-to-no-4-spot-land-carson-wentz
http://mweb.cbssports.com/nfl/eye-on-football/25554964/nfl-mock-draft-49ers-trade-up-to-no-4-spot-land-carson-wentz
So apparently the first thing Nkemdiche wants to buy with his NFL money is a pet Panther. Of course "take care of my family" too. Let me tell you, that's gotta be the one thing NFL GM's want to hear about a guy they already think is weird and already has a list of ? character concerns.
A friggin panther! Does he even know how much it would cost to feed that thing!?!
Pass... no thanks... Dallas does not need that kind of crazy in the locker room!
A friggin panther! Does he even know how much it would cost to feed that thing!?!
Pass... no thanks... Dallas does not need that kind of crazy in the locker room!
I hope he buys one and it goes all Sigfreid and Roy on him. that would be cool.
maybe he meant a Carolina Panther
Orlando Ayala Cant Read
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If they can get San Frans 2nd rounder outa that trade it would be awesome. Im elated to land Elliot at 7 and pretty thrilled to get Buckner there too. Especially combined with that additional 2.
Id take Lawson at 7. I'd like to see Lawson go to the Jags too and team up with Dante Fowler.. That'd be a ferocious tandem both against the run and pass
Word is Myles Jack's recent medical check on his knee (I think they had their pro day) wasn't horrible, but it wasn't that great either. It's still a big ? and he's probably off the board for most teams drafting early. Too much of a gamble to draft that high.
Worst case scenario is both QBs and Ramsey are gone 1,2,3... that is bad because Tunsil is the one guy we don't care about so having him be the one guy to fall would suck! No QB and no Ramsey and I think our trade back options are slim to none. I'd personally be happy taking Zeke and moving along, but I know many would consider that disappointing. But not much we can do if the draft plays out that way.
Worst case scenario is both QBs and Ramsey are gone 1,2,3... that is bad because Tunsil is the one guy we don't care about so having him be the one guy to fall would suck! No QB and no Ramsey and I think our trade back options are slim to none. I'd personally be happy taking Zeke and moving along, but I know many would consider that disappointing. But not much we can do if the draft plays out that way.
I wouldn't entertain the thought of Jack at 4 (or 7) for a second. That was either microfracture or something similar - no simple cleanup. That knee is likely to be trouble for his entire career.
Joey Bosa, Shaq Lawson
quote:I like the film on Bosa... liked what I saw whenever I happened to watch OSU randomly. But he doesn't project to be a big sack machine and at #4 that's what you are hoping to get (and he has noted off the field issues). Lawson is another really good player and he is more of that weak-side quick twitch sack artist that you are looking for.
Joey Bosa, Shaq Lawson
Only problem I have is Lawson isn't one of the "elite" prospects in this draft and Zeke is. If I'm stuck at #4 I'm not getting cute, I'm taking one of those "elite" prospects (other than Tunsil because let's be honest, that would be dumb with our O-line). I don't want to even reach slightly for a need position.
We earned #4 through misery last year. I'm not wasting that pick!
As far as DE is concerned, I'd rather take a gamble if Noah Spence is there in the 2nd. Some say he is the best DE in the class but his off the field stuff hurts him. I know we gambled last year (and lost) with Gregory. But hey, gamblers don't stop after they lose a hand! The difference is that Spence has been clean since his early college errors unlike Mr. Combine drug failing Gregory!
You could be right... I'm just scared of another Bama RB underachieving in the NFL.
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lotsa continuing concerns about Jack's knee.
there's even talk now he could be that guy who plummets down the boards into the late 1st or early 2nd.
there's even talk now he could be that guy who plummets down the boards into the late 1st or early 2nd.
quote:
I'm not questioning you or anything but it's pretty convenient one of the worst draft busts ever is blamed on the guy no longer in the building.
I have hard time believing Jerry traded up for a guy they all said was the highest graded D player since Deoin all because Rob Ryan said so.
Claiborne isn't very good, but "worst draft busts ever" is rather harsh considering the history of failed Top 10 picks in NFL history. Ryan Leaf and Tony Mandarich come to mind off the top.
They traded up into the top 5 and called him the best defensive prospect since Deion.
Based on their own evaluation he's one of the worst ever IMO. We can have a semantics debate all day about guys who were worse or bigger busts but that sounds pretty boring.
It was a terrible, terrible pick. That's the point.
Based on their own evaluation he's one of the worst ever IMO. We can have a semantics debate all day about guys who were worse or bigger busts but that sounds pretty boring.
It was a terrible, terrible pick. That's the point.
The ceiling isn't as high with Henry as Elliot, but I'm much more comfortable with him as a 2nd rd pick than I am with Elliot as a 4th overall.. Even though I still want either a safety or a NT with that 2nd rd pick.
quote:
They traded up into the top 5 and called him the best defensive prospect since Deion.
Based on their own evaluation he's one of the worst ever IMO. We can have a semantics debate all day about guys who were worse or bigger busts but that sounds pretty boring.
It was a terrible, terrible pick. That's the point.
1. When healthy this past season, Claiborne played well enough for Dallas to give him another year. This becomes his boom or bust year.
2. Claiborne wasn't a Top 5 pick.
3. Actually, boom or bust draft talk is always fun. For example, many on this board talk about certain players as being "elite" even though they've never played an NFL down. Five years from now, we may all have a great laugh about when Dallas almost drafted Player X who wound up bombing. Mandarich is considered the greatest offensive line prospect in the history of the sport...and he bombed. So, yes, it's oodles of fun to talk about.
Claiborne is a really interesting situation. The cowboys basically traded a 2nd round pick to move from 14 to 6. In return they got a guy who ran a 4.4, was a unanimous selection for all american, SEC defensive player of the year and Jim Thorpe winner. On paper he was easily one of the best players headed to the NFL. The consensus opinion was that he had lockdown corner potential.
I am not a Cowboys fan so I dont exactly know why he was so bad. It looks like injuries were a big deal, but he also always just seemed kind of dumb to me. The guy made a 4 on the Wunderlich. Maybe that test is good for something...
By the way, that draft was very unkind to anyone who traded up into the top 10. Washington traded up for RG3, Cleveland traded up from Trent Richardson, Jacksonville traded up for Justin Blackmon and Dallas traded up for Claiborne...Ouch.
I am not a Cowboys fan so I dont exactly know why he was so bad. It looks like injuries were a big deal, but he also always just seemed kind of dumb to me. The guy made a 4 on the Wunderlich. Maybe that test is good for something...
By the way, that draft was very unkind to anyone who traded up into the top 10. Washington traded up for RG3, Cleveland traded up from Trent Richardson, Jacksonville traded up for Justin Blackmon and Dallas traded up for Claiborne...Ouch.
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its hindsight as at the time most of us thought it was a solid move i think, but Claiborne has not been good. he had a mediocre last season and because he's spent so much time injured with the Cowboys the Cowboys more or less deem him with an Incomplete type grade. they brought him back because they get to evaluate him another year at a reasonable price (in the context of the market) and buy another year before deciding what to do long term there.
we can sit around arguing about the definition of "bust" but in my own personal definition he so far is one.
we can sit around arguing about the definition of "bust" but in my own personal definition he so far is one.
My bad. He was 6.
Still a terrible pick and at his best league average corner.
Still a terrible pick and at his best league average corner.
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