You know that part in a movie when **** seems like it's reached a good point and then it just completely goes to ***** Well, that's where we are in this show. I don't know how, but I fully expect the siblings to go at each other the rest of the way and devolve in an amazing manner.
*** SUCCESSION *** (Season 4)
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Last: 5 mo ago by LawHall88
It does feel like Roman is the only one that genuinely wants to work with the other 2
Ebba will be the key to unraveling/killing the deal. They'll pay her off and get her book/story with all the Madsen horror stories.
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Ebba and the blood bricks ending things it a plotline that belongs in Billions, not Succession.
Four Seasons Landscaping said:
Ebba and the blood bricks ending things it a plotline that belongs in Billions, not Succession.
Exactly. The blood thing was basically a throwaway line to emphasize that Mads is a weirdo too who doesn't have it totally together and to give Shiv the opportunity to talk to him.
The more this season unfolds, the more I think I'm rooting for the Roy kids, as dysfunctional and messed up as they are.
I think the talk on the mountaintop where Mattsen basically called their moves play by play shows that the kids really do suck at trying to play the game their dads way. I think they have so much emotional baggage there that they're just finally learning how to shed. They've literally never been able to stretch their business wings/acumen or develop their own "style" without their dad berating and belittling them.
I think what we see is that when each kid uses their own individual talents and stop trying to play the WWLD game, they can actually be pretty successful. And when each kid uses their individual talents in combination with the other siblings, they can actually accomplish some pretty good stuff. We didn't see Ken give Roman a hard time about going off script, potentially ruining things, etc. I thought that was pretty significant. It seemed like he knew what he was going to do and didn't try to intervene. That, to me, showed a certain level of trust and ceding power that Ken normally doesn't do.
I am hoping they finally realize that they work best together and get out from under Logan's shadow. Whether that means taking over or going through with the deal, idk. But I wouldn't be mad if the show had a "happy ending"; as happy as it can be for a bunch of ultra wealthy power hungry sycophants, anyways.
I think the talk on the mountaintop where Mattsen basically called their moves play by play shows that the kids really do suck at trying to play the game their dads way. I think they have so much emotional baggage there that they're just finally learning how to shed. They've literally never been able to stretch their business wings/acumen or develop their own "style" without their dad berating and belittling them.
I think what we see is that when each kid uses their own individual talents and stop trying to play the WWLD game, they can actually be pretty successful. And when each kid uses their individual talents in combination with the other siblings, they can actually accomplish some pretty good stuff. We didn't see Ken give Roman a hard time about going off script, potentially ruining things, etc. I thought that was pretty significant. It seemed like he knew what he was going to do and didn't try to intervene. That, to me, showed a certain level of trust and ceding power that Ken normally doesn't do.
I am hoping they finally realize that they work best together and get out from under Logan's shadow. Whether that means taking over or going through with the deal, idk. But I wouldn't be mad if the show had a "happy ending"; as happy as it can be for a bunch of ultra wealthy power hungry sycophants, anyways.
I don't think there will be anything close to a happy ending, especially with Jesse Armstrong at the helm. I know a lot of people are predicting who will be the "winner" at the end and I seriously doubt there will be.Quote:
But I wouldn't be mad if the show had a "happy ending"; as happy as it can be for a bunch of ultra wealthy power hungry sycophants, anyways.
If I'm rooting for anyone it's Roman...despite all his quirks and deviant behavior he still seems to have a core decency about him which he desperately tries to cover up with his quips and rejoinders. The problem with Roman is I don't know what a "happy ending" looks like for him except I know exactly how he would respond to that term lol.
I've heard speculation that everyone destroys each other and the only person left standing is Greg, who takes over as CEO. I could see Jesse going that route and if done correctly could be hilarious and right up his alley. Perhaps that is why he's being written as more of a lecherous dolt this season to make it ever more preposterous that he would "win" at the end. Who knows but I can't wait to find out!
I would be very disappointed if this show had anything close to a happy ending for the kids.
Four Seasons Landscaping said:
Ebba and the blood bricks ending things it a plotline that belongs in Billions, not Succession.
It was definitely Mattson f****** with Shiv and seeing if he could trust her (seeing if she would leak that info). I don't believe the writers would have such a powerful character be stupid enough to reveal damning information to the opposing team.
Quote:
I would be very disappointed if this show had anything close to a happy ending for the kids.
I'm not one for speculating where this - or any other - show may take us, but I would also be in the disappointed camp if any of the three all of a sudden had the smarts to come out ahead with respect to Waystar/Royco/ATN.
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Finally watched.
1. The opening with Kendall driven to the office listening to "Takeover" was...*chef's kiss*
2. Matsson is an all-time great character. Skarsard chews up every scene he's in.
3. The "tribute band" diss was so mean. That one hurt. That's a Tank Davis liver punch diss. Rich white people insults hit different, I'm sorry. There's no other way to explain it. I gasped.
1. The opening with Kendall driven to the office listening to "Takeover" was...*chef's kiss*
2. Matsson is an all-time great character. Skarsard chews up every scene he's in.
3. The "tribute band" diss was so mean. That one hurt. That's a Tank Davis liver punch diss. Rich white people insults hit different, I'm sorry. There's no other way to explain it. I gasped.
the kids are morons
To be clear, when I say "happy ending", I don't mean it in the traditional sense. What I think of as a happy ending and what these characters think of as a happy ending are likely two very different things.
I could easily see a situation where they are all "content", but in reality are personally in a worse place than they were when we started from an outsider's perspective.
But these people live in a different world than 99.9% of human beings. I think they could end up being in a position where they actually become "successful" in a business sense, but that success comes at the cost of the personal torture that they've either willingly or unwittingly subjected themselves to throughout their lives.
I could easily see a situation where they are all "content", but in reality are personally in a worse place than they were when we started from an outsider's perspective.
But these people live in a different world than 99.9% of human beings. I think they could end up being in a position where they actually become "successful" in a business sense, but that success comes at the cost of the personal torture that they've either willingly or unwittingly subjected themselves to throughout their lives.
cone said:
the kids are morons
I'm not cut out to be a billionaire I guess. If someone is wanting to give me tens or hundreds of millions of dollars, I'm not bickering over a couple dollars a share. Show me the money, baby, and I'm headed to a beach for the rest of my life, happily retired.CC09LawAg said:
To be clear, when I say "happy ending", I don't mean it in the traditional sense. What I think of as a happy ending and what these characters think of as a happy ending are likely two very different things.
I could easily see a situation where they are all "content", but in reality are personally in a worse place than they were when we started from an outsider's perspective.
But these people live in a different world than 99.9% of human beings. I think they could end up being in a position where they actually become "successful" in a business sense, but that success comes at the cost of the personal torture that they've either willingly or unwittingly subjected themselves to throughout their lives.
No one mentioned the resort. Holy hell.
None of them care about the money. Ken says himself they're already rich.
The money is merely a tool being used for leverage by Mattsen. Remember, he only upped his offer as a response to seeing the real, genuine pain and emotions of Roman.
He literally only gave them more money so he could gloat and revel in their misery. It had nothing to do with the companies or the merits of the deal.
Now, I think a portion of it was him being afraid of them going through with blowing up the deal, etc. but again, I think that's more about pride than $$ at this point.
The money is merely a tool being used for leverage by Mattsen. Remember, he only upped his offer as a response to seeing the real, genuine pain and emotions of Roman.
He literally only gave them more money so he could gloat and revel in their misery. It had nothing to do with the companies or the merits of the deal.
Now, I think a portion of it was him being afraid of them going through with blowing up the deal, etc. but again, I think that's more about pride than $$ at this point.
Nice resort. Think I saw that it was the same one they used in Ex Machina
As someone who has made a living in recruiting for more of my life than not, money is emotional and not always about the money.CC09LawAg said:
None of them care about the money. Ken says himself they're already rich.
The money is merely a tool being used for leverage by Mattsen. Remember, he only upped his offer as a response to seeing the real, genuine pain and emotions of Roman.
He literally only gave them more money so he could gloat and revel in their misery. It had nothing to do with the companies or the merits of the deal.
Now, I think a portion of it was him being afraid of them going through with blowing up the deal, etc. but again, I think that's more about pride than $$ at this point.
When you already have so much money that you are literally set for life money doesn't matter anymore. This is only about winning.Tailgate88 said:I'm not cut out to be a billionaire I guess. If someone is wanting to give me tens or hundreds of millions of dollars, I'm not bickering over a couple dollars a share. Show me the money, baby, and I'm headed to a beach for the rest of my life, happily retired.CC09LawAg said:
To be clear, when I say "happy ending", I don't mean it in the traditional sense. What I think of as a happy ending and what these characters think of as a happy ending are likely two very different things.
I could easily see a situation where they are all "content", but in reality are personally in a worse place than they were when we started from an outsider's perspective.
But these people live in a different world than 99.9% of human beings. I think they could end up being in a position where they actually become "successful" in a business sense, but that success comes at the cost of the personal torture that they've either willingly or unwittingly subjected themselves to throughout their lives.
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I think Logan and Matsson said it best to each other in the last episode of S3:
"Everything is ****ing boring…"
"…except this."
"Everything is ****ing boring…"
"…except this."
The Milkman said:
Nice resort. Think I saw that it was the same one they used in Ex Machina
When they showed Kendall in his room, on the phone with Roman across the way, that was my first thought. Looked identical.
TCTTS said:The Milkman said:
Nice resort. Think I saw that it was the same one they used in Ex Machina
When they showed Kendall in his room, on the phone with Roman across the way, that was my first thought. Looked identical.
It is the same place. Juvet enviro lodge or something. mididle of ****ing nowhere.
Sadly I don't feel like Roman can win. He burnt Gerri as an ally and she has leverage against him. (Dick pics, sexual harrasment.)
If Gerri sees a way to wipe him off the table to further herself, she will.
If Gerri sees a way to wipe him off the table to further herself, she will.
210 said:I chose to look at it as a nod to Trueblood.Proposition Joe said:
IMO if the the blood brick story becomes significant in killing the deal, then the writers got lazy. As previous poster said, it becomes way too deus ex machina. There's a million ways a deal can get killed, I trust this isn't going to be one of them.
Same here.
I was late to the game on Succession but have binge watched it over the last 3 weeks and I'm now caught up and able to click on this thread. Lots of great insight here and will be a very interesting last 5 episodes.
https://juvet.com/en/ChipFTAC01 said:TCTTS said:The Milkman said:
Nice resort. Think I saw that it was the same one they used in Ex Machina
When they showed Kendall in his room, on the phone with Roman across the way, that was my first thought. Looked identical.
It is the same place. Juvet enviro lodge or something. mididle of ****ing nowhere.
Only like $600-700/night. I was expecting something way more outrageous than that.
She just has to ask herself "how does this advance my personal position?"Brian Earl Spilner said:
Sadly I don't feel like Roman can win. He burnt Gerri as an ally and she has leverage against him. (Dick pics, sexual harrasment.)
If Gerri sees a way to wipe him off the table to further herself, she will.
I was dying when Roman shoved his finger into the caviar when walking into that first negotiating session with Lukas.
I can understand why people might want Roman to "win" because he's a hurt dude who people sympathize with ,but he's also pretty ****ing trash. They all are and they are all ultimately out for themselves to the detriment of everyone else because that's the giant takeaway they got form their father. EVERYTHING is transactional, and maybe ONE kid breaks out of this mindset (if so I think it'll be Shiv) but no one will "win".
These are all severely broken people, and maybe someone ends up as a long term CEO or something of that nature, but I think a big part of the theme of the show is that that success only comes if you're ruthless and sociopathic. I mean even in this epsisode the kids don't win. They didn't get what they wanted, because a Matteson realized that he could hurt them by making them an offer they wouldn't be able to turn down. Thats why he didn't tell THEM the offer, but made sure the others had it so the board knew about it. Thats why he wanted the picture. it wasn't about what made business sense, it was about what he could do to hurt them and win. THAT is the shows definition of winning IMO which isn't really winning at all. So maybe someone slides into that role fully, but its hard to draw that up as a win.
These are all severely broken people, and maybe someone ends up as a long term CEO or something of that nature, but I think a big part of the theme of the show is that that success only comes if you're ruthless and sociopathic. I mean even in this epsisode the kids don't win. They didn't get what they wanted, because a Matteson realized that he could hurt them by making them an offer they wouldn't be able to turn down. Thats why he didn't tell THEM the offer, but made sure the others had it so the board knew about it. Thats why he wanted the picture. it wasn't about what made business sense, it was about what he could do to hurt them and win. THAT is the shows definition of winning IMO which isn't really winning at all. So maybe someone slides into that role fully, but its hard to draw that up as a win.
It's true that I've grown more sympathetic to Roman over time. He was a true ahole in that first episode when he offered cash to the worker at the softball game.
— Chris Evangelista (@cevangelista413) April 26, 2023
You are assuming Gerri is still "in the game". Billionaires have methods of changing things.Brian Earl Spilner said:
Sadly I don't feel like Roman can win. He burnt Gerri as an ally and she has leverage against him. (Dick pics, sexual harrasment.)
If Gerri sees a way to wipe him off the table to further herself, she will.
They've utilized Hugo so well this season. His delivery, much like Karl's, is friggin hilarious.
But did his dig lose some bite when he flubbed how close it was in seconds rather than millimeters, or did it enhance it by saying "I don't even care enough about your almost-show to learn about it"?The Milkman said:
It was hysterical.
"They tell me you nearly got a bronze at Sochi. That's almost huge."
Loved Roman's raw emotion.
And Greg's description of Matteson's sexual acts to Tom and Tom's candid admission that no one cares what happens to France.
"Hanna Barbara School of Business" was such a cold line.
Loved this episode. Feel like I'm watching a different show than about 25% of you, but I really enjoy the dialogue and speculation here
Loved this episode. Feel like I'm watching a different show than about 25% of you, but I really enjoy the dialogue and speculation here