Why would she know that? Was there an Arya role in the play?
**** Game of Thrones Season 6 - Show Only ****
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Last: 8 yr ago by Rex Racer
quote:No no. There was no Arya part in the play. It just wasnt farfetched in my mind that she would have known a description of her (they had a detailed play about Ned/Sansa(very delightful)/Joffrey/Cersei/Robert)
Why would she know that? Was there an Arya role in the play?
No theory here, just a simple, "hey that would have been a good line".
quote:thatsthejoke.jpgquote:about as crazy as it would be to recycle the same story line currently going on in kings landing where someone is/was married to a baratheon and gets preggo by incest....
How crazy would it be if Marg wants dear old brother to knock her up?
quote:
Considering all of the rest of the crew looked pretty close to the real characters they obviously knew general descriptions of them. She would have known that Arya was a short girl with short dark hair.
Did they or did they just have the right hair color?
I think Margary is denying Tommen to further her "I'm so ashamed of my past and am now a chaste, modest woman" persona. she knows Tommen will complain to the sparrow about it, which gives credence to her change of heart, even behind closed doors, away from the eyes of the sparrows.
She might also be saving it as a negotiating tool with Tommen.
She might also be saving it as a negotiating tool with Tommen.
quote:quote:quote:Ya the Hound isn't the best looking fellow on the show.
That's just gross and would be a total disservice to Arya's character.
He is aptly named and cast. He has the sad eyes of a hound.
I noticed that either this week or last. He really does have puppy dog eyes.
quote:Yep, this is how I took it. She's trying to further prove her change of heart and that her desires for power have also changed.
I think Margary is denying Tommen to further her "I'm so ashamed of my past and am now a chaste, modest woman" persona. she knows Tommen will complain to the sparrow about it, which gives credence to her change of heart, even behind closed doors, away from the eyes of the sparrows.
She might also be saving it as a negotiating tool with Tommen.
Think Varys will run into Sam? Thus learning about the WW?
Don't really know where else he would go, plot wise. Dorne, I suppose.
Don't really know where else he would go, plot wise. Dorne, I suppose.
As a someone who is a big fan of the show and has seen every episode, I have to say this season has been a big disappoint.
The last three episodes have been pretty lame, but I'd still say this season is better than the previous, which I think is the worst.
What shows are you watching? This season has been great. Every story line has been advanced greatly. Characters are coming together and the final acts are being set up. What more do you want?
They want some type of crazy event/cliffhanger/killing in each episode. People forget that each season has had some pretty slow episodes in it
quote:if we had 6 seasons of the red wedding or (name your main character dying) we would be out of people we give a **** about....
They want some type of crazy event/cliffhanger/killing in each episode. People forget that each season has had some pretty slow episodes in it
quote:Agree completely...it's just what people must expect if they ***** about this season being the worst of the bunchquote:if we had 6 seasons of the red wedding or (name your main character dying) we would be out of people we give a **** about....
They want some type of crazy event/cliffhanger/killing in each episode. People forget that each season has had some pretty slow episodes in it
quote:Probably because we're in Season 6 with characters we know. It naturally feels like things are moving a tad slower than earlier seasons.
They want some type of crazy event/cliffhanger/killing in each episode. People forget that each season has had some pretty slow episodes in it
The show has gone off the rails especially when they deviate from source. Motivations no longer make sense. Davos for instance, loyal servant to Stannis, dear friend to Stannis' daughter, hater of black magic. Suddenly when the writers need someone to spearhead the resurrection of Jon, they conveniently pick out Davos as a main character who is nearby. He conveniently stays ignorant of the fact that Mel burned Shireen in an attempt at black magic, for some reason he becomes obsessed with using magic to resurrect Snow, who he hardly knows, and asks Mel to try an resurrect him despite his earlier hatred of her magic. He had even tried to assassinate her in an earlier episode.
Characters are just plodding along the plot lines now because the script tells them to, their decisions and depth are no longer influencing the plot, they are just mindlessly doing what the plot needs them to do.
Characters are just plodding along the plot lines now because the script tells them to, their decisions and depth are no longer influencing the plot, they are just mindlessly doing what the plot needs them to do.
that has bothered me about Davos... didn't think he knew Snow that well... and he was always so loyal to Stannis. now he's suddenly okay with this magic and seems to be Jon and Sansa's right hand.
...but who else's motivations no longer make sense?
...but who else's motivations no longer make sense?
I used to think like you about Davos, but when you rewatch the series, it's clear that he is the main reason Stannis' army heads to the wall to begin with. He (and Mel) seems to be the only ones taking the WW threat seriously, and once Stannis is killed, Jon is the next best choice by far to lead an army against them. And it's not like they had Stannis' corpse nearby to resurrect.
Is it a bit convenient? Sure. But it does make sense.
Is it a bit convenient? Sure. But it does make sense.
quote:Sorry, but I disagree with you here. Ever since they made it to the north, Davos was doubting Stannis's actions. He thought taking his wife and daughter to the battle were a bad idea. He thought not uniting his forces with Jon Snow's was a bad idea. And he thought pushing forward through the storm was a bad idea. Enough so, that Stannis sent Davos away, hence why he was at the wall and wasn't killed with the rest. Davos lost his confidence in Stannis and rightfully believes Stannis's over-confidence and stubbornness lead to the death of his daughter, wife, and men. The only person still alive that witnessed what happened to Shireen is Melisandre and she sure isn't talking about it.
The show has gone off the rails especially when they deviate from source. Motivations no longer make sense. Davos for instance, loyal servant to Stannis, dear friend to Stannis' daughter, hater of black magic. Suddenly when the writers need someone to spearhead the resurrection of Jon, they conveniently pick out Davos as a main character who is nearby. He conveniently stays ignorant of the fact that Mel burned Shireen in an attempt at black magic, for some reason he becomes obsessed with using magic to resurrect Snow, who he hardly knows, and asks Mel to try an resurrect him despite his earlier hatred of her magic. He had even tried to assassinate her in an earlier episode.
Characters are just plodding along the plot lines now because the script tells them to, their decisions and depth are no longer influencing the plot, they are just mindlessly doing what the plot needs them to do.
I suppose at that point, he could go back to being a crabber or a smuggler, but I don't think it is a stretch of the imagination that he was attracted to a REAL leader who just happens to have a REAL war worth fighting. He's a very loyal guy looking for a good leader to advise. He may hate Melisandre, but he's worked side-by-side with her for a long time and she sure hasn't been trying to take a leadership role in their current war pack.
quote:Why would Davos think that Jon Snow, the guy who got himself murdered by his own men shortly after they arrived, is the best leader? Especially to go to the lengths of using magic to get him back? He even used the word "miracles" to describe it now, when he had been vehemently against the **** she did before. Saying that she was spawning demons and such.
I used to think like you about Davos, but when you rewatch the series, it's clear that he is the main reason Stannis' army heads to the wall to begin with. He (and Mel) seems to be the only ones taking the WW threat seriously, and once Stannis is killed, Jon is the next best choice by far to lead an army against them. And it's not like they had Stannis' corpse nearby to resurrect.
Is it a bit convenient? Sure. But it does make sense.
Maybe because Jon Snow was the ONLY person there who was actually trying to fight the war against the WWs, which we know Davos most certainly believes in.
LOL. If so, Davos must be regretting that now. Instead of fighting the WW, Jon renounced the night's watch, and now Davos is trundling around hat in hand with him trying to gain forces to retake Winterfell just like Stannis and even camping in the same spots Stannis was. Davos doesn't seem to be going against Jon Snow doing the same things that you say he was against Stannis doing now that he brought him back.
Reality is that Davos is just mindlessly doing whatever wooden things the writers need him to do to advance the plot in a predetermined direction.
quote:This is incorrect. He agrees with Jon that they can't stay there long, because if a storm comes, they'll be forced to retreat. He agrees with Jon that they need to take Winterfell back from the Bolton's to be able to unite the North in the battle against the WWs. He was there when Jon read the letter from Ramsey, threatening him, his brother, his sister, and all his wildling men. Davos knows Jon can't beat the WWs with Ramsey attacking them from behind.
LOL. If so, Davos must be regretting that now. Instead of fighting the WW, Jon renounced the night's watch, and now Davos is trundling around hat in hand with him trying to gain forces to retake Winterfell just like Stannis and even camping in the same spots Stannis was. Davos doesn't seem to be going against Jon Snow doing the same things that you say he was against Stannis doing now that he brought him back.
I don't know if you're just jaded from the story in the north or what, but you don't appear willing to give much thought to the character development Davos has gone through over the last 4 seasons.
Take his speech to the Mormot girl. Jon got stuck trying to convince her to follow the Stark name, but Davos was the one who stepped in and reminded everyone EVERYTHING IS POINTLESS if we don't end up defeating the WWs. This is just part of the bigger war.
quote:The other most egregious example lately is Arya. It's not necessarily a motivation issue, since we have a nicely fleshed out character, and one who is in a very personal and confusing struggle inside what is basically a cult. However her actions don't make any sense, she does things specifically so the writers can get in action and chase scenes. She comes off as dumb and lucky, and her storyline stretches the bounds of credulity when compared to other events that happened in this same show. We've seen King Robert, Khal Drogo, Grey Worm all either killed or taken out of action for seemingly long periods by similar or lesser wounds than Arya received. The writers just threw something in there to add suspense, then to "fix" it she just happens to know someone who can sew her up good as new and set up the chase scene the writers want to have. Its lazy.
that has bothered me about Davos... didn't think he knew Snow that well... and he was always so loyal to Stannis. now he's suddenly okay with this magic and seems to be Jon and Sansa's right hand.
...but who else's motivations no longer make sense?
Then once she triumphed and killed the girl she takes her face back to the cult? What? Why? How did she know Jaqen wouldnt kill her anway? Was she going to fight him if he didnt let her go? She's seen a guy in that form murder people with ease back in Westeros. I guess she read the script and knew it would all work out ok if she went and had some last words with him.
I don't have a problem with Davos' motivations. He is extremely pragmatic and realm-smart. He sees the bigger picture. He also sees Jon as the one leader in the whole realm whose goal and purpose has nothing to do with the iron throne. In other words, someone who is worth saving, regardless of how it is done.
He also saw that the slim chance they had against the bigger enemy would be gone if the watch was left to Allister. They need the wildings if they have any chance, and Allister's first move would be to revoke their peaceful existence north of the wall and kill them all. With Ramsey's help.
Davos and Brienne are probably the only (live) characters whose honor cannot be questioned. (RIP Ned)
He also saw that the slim chance they had against the bigger enemy would be gone if the watch was left to Allister. They need the wildings if they have any chance, and Allister's first move would be to revoke their peaceful existence north of the wall and kill them all. With Ramsey's help.
Davos and Brienne are probably the only (live) characters whose honor cannot be questioned. (RIP Ned)
quote:I'm not saying every little detail doesnt make sense or is stupid, I'm just saying that overall the writing style has flipped from one where meaningful character development and decisions appeared to be influencing the plot to one in which the character's decisions are being made so that the plot flows in the direction preferred by the writing.
Take his speech to the Mormot girl. Jon got stuck trying to convince her to follow the Stark name, but Davos was the one who stepped in and reminded everyone EVERYTHING IS POINTLESS if we don't end up defeating the WWs. This is just part of the bigger war.
There is less heed lately to "what would this character really do if in this situation?" What would Randall Tarly do if his hated son who he threatened to kill on multiple occasions stole his Valyrian steel sword of which only a handful exist and which he had just told him he could never have? Maybe he'll get a posse together and ride Sam down in a future ep...it would make sense, but Im doubtful.
quote:I think Arya realized that she cannot so easily lose and forget her past life and family and become a faceless assassin across the world when she "saw" her family depicted in the play. She was visibly moved by the memory of her family and her motivations changed from that point forward. She also realized that despite all she had been through, she was still "good" and would not take part in the killing of an innocent actress just because she was paid to do so.quote:The other most egregious example lately is Arya. It's not necessarily a motivation issue, since we have a nicely fleshed out character, and one who is in a very personal and confusing struggle inside what is basically a cult. However her actions don't make any sense, she does things specifically so the writers can get in action and chase scenes. She comes off as dumb and lucky, and her storyline stretches the bounds of credulity when compared to other events that happened in this same show. We've seen King Robert, Khal Drogo, Grey Worm all either killed or taken out of action for seemingly long periods by similar or lesser wounds than Arya received. The writers just threw something in there to add suspense, then to "fix" it she just happens to know someone who can sew her up good as new and set up the chase scene the writers want to have. Its lazy.
that has bothered me about Davos... didn't think he knew Snow that well... and he was always so loyal to Stannis. now he's suddenly okay with this magic and seems to be Jon and Sansa's right hand.
...but who else's motivations no longer make sense?
Then once she triumphed and killed the girl she takes her face back to the cult? What? Why? How did she know Jaqen wouldnt kill her anway? Was she going to fight him if he didnt let her go? She's seen a guy in that form murder people with ease back in Westeros. I guess she read the script and knew it would all work out ok if she went and had some last words with him.
She went back to Jaqen with the face because he was owed a life. She paid that debt in full and was free to leave.
I know that there are alot of superfans that will refuse to ever criticize the show, but how anyone can say this is one of the better seasons is beyond me. I don't need a red wedding every season, but so many characters have been killed off in the past seasons and there have been no new ones to take their place. I do expect some action and killing through the first 8 episodes but have seen very little. The only true plot lines going on right now is Jon trying to build an army, the happenings in Kings Landing, and Danny's story, which are all moving very slow. They are trying to incorporate the Greyjoys and Boltons storys but its kind of meaningless if they never do anything. the Hound is back but for what? Hopefully something will start to take shape in the next two episodes.
I don't disagree with you on this. It has been a bit frustrating as the dialogue has slipped. But that is to be expected when you go from a, literally, world renowned writer writing a novel to screen writers writing a script for a TV show. The thing that made the show such a success was that they were able to read the dialogue in the books and summarize that into scripts. But they can't do that anymore so it is certainly going to take a toll on the finished product. Yes, I admit that I've noticed it too, but what good does complaining about it do? I can't blame the show writers, they are doing an actually phenomenal job of it, considering they aren't getting any literary help from GRRM and are basically just doing their own version of fan fiction.
So...in other words...the show has gone off the rails...but we should just be quiet about it and try to enjoy it for what it has become and it's not their fault.
It's a bit different, but I wouldn't say it has "gone off the rails".
Just curious, what do you think you're going to change by complaining on here?
Just curious, what do you think you're going to change by complaining on here?
Typical Texags: "Let's burn the place down because we have an 8 win season instead of a 10 win season."
Personally, this has been my favorite season thus far.
I do agree with the above points that the character motivations and plot lines not being completely the same as before but there has been undeniable major character development. Even the characters that in the last episode reverted back to their "old" selves. (Arya, Jamie, Theon, hound) have had major changes along the way that now influence their decisions and abilities.
I do agree with the above points that the character motivations and plot lines not being completely the same as before but there has been undeniable major character development. Even the characters that in the last episode reverted back to their "old" selves. (Arya, Jamie, Theon, hound) have had major changes along the way that now influence their decisions and abilities.
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