**** Game of Thrones Season 6 - Show Only ****

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smokeythebear
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In reply to The Debt • 12:18p, 5/17/16
AG
quote:
Perhaps, I think he hopes to marry Sansa to Arryn, solidifying the North with the East, both under his command.

If he has the Umbers in his pocket, then he is already forming alliances with the northern houses. (This probably started to moment he married Sansa away.)

And there is the million dollar question, if the Umbers super-hate the Starks, why keep Rickon Stark alive? That part makes no sense. "Oh we are gonna hold him until we need something from the Boltons" The whole reason the Umbers disserted the Starks was because Robb wanted to hold Jaime Lannister rather than kill him in his cage. Now the Umbers have their own Jaime and they show restraint?
Whoa what???

1) The Umbers DON'T "super hate" the Starks. They are siding with Ramsey right now because Jon let in too many wildlings and they can't hold their own land without the help of a more powerful army (right now, that's the Warden of the North). Greatjon Umber would never have sided with Ramsey because he was a staunch Stark guy, but he recently died so the son is taking over for him and is much more neutral. This explains why Rickon was kept hidden, because Greatjon Umber protected him until he died.

2) Where do you get the notion that Little Finger has the Umbers in his pocket?

3) I think you have the Umbers confused with the Karstarks. The Umbers never disserted Robb, but the Karstarks did kill Lanisters as retribution for Jaime killing one of theirs so Robb punished Lord Karstark by beheading him. It was a younger Karstark who watched as Ramsey killed Roose, but the Umbers were the ones that came later on with Rickon and the dire wolf head.
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hunter2012
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In reply to smokeythebear • 12:33p, 5/17/16
AG
We don't know for sure whether GreatJon is dead. His son claims it but he disappeared around the Red Wedding and we know he wasn't present or they would have had him on screen.
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Aggie Joe 93
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12:39p, 5/17/16
AG
Whatever KF is going to do, he better hurry up; he's only got 13-ish episodes to complete his life-long ambition before he's too dead to enjoy it.

There's no benefit for him to reveal he helped kill Jofrey; Sansa has the most motivation to like him for it; but she hates him now. (If she's not dumb.)
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wangus12
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In reply to smokeythebear • 12:47p, 5/17/16
AG
Agreed. I think the Karstarks and Umbers are being mixed up there
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smokeythebear
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In reply to hunter2012 • 12:57p, 5/17/16
AG
quote:
We don't know for sure whether GreatJon is dead. His son claims it but he disappeared around the Red Wedding and we know he wasn't present or they would have had him on screen.
Well his son came in and said basically "Ramsey, cool thing you did there by killing your dad. I would have done the same, but mine died on his own before I could". You're right, it is possible Greatjon Umber is still alive and the son is lying, but I suspect that would be a pretty easy fact-check for Ramsey. It could be as much as the directors just not being interested in paying the actor to come back for a 30 second clip of him dying.

But you're right, there's still plenty of possibilities open with this particular storyline.
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wangus12
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1:00p, 5/17/16
AG
quote:
You're right, it is possible Greatjon Umber is still alive and the son is lying, but I suspect that would be a pretty easy fact-check for Ramsey
Not really if the Umbers are in on a conspiracy to take out Ramsey.
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smokeythebear
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In reply to Aggie Joe 93 • 1:07p, 5/17/16
AG
quote:
Whatever KF is going to do, he better hurry up; he's only got 13-ish episodes to complete his life-long ambition before he's too dead to enjoy it.

There's no benefit for him to reveal he helped kill Jofrey; Sansa has the most motivation to like him for it; but she hates him now. (If she's not dumb.)
This is going to be very interesting. Little Finger likely doesn't know the Boltons very well and I can't recall exactly the terms of him passing Sansa on to them. Did he trick her? Was she pissed about it? Did she go willingly? She had a brief few episodes where it seemed like her and LF were actually getting along and becoming friends, but that seems like a decade ago now. He basically saved her from Joffrey and delivered her to Ramsey. Is that considered a wash?

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smokeythebear
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In reply to wangus12 • 1:14p, 5/17/16
AG
quote:
quote:
You're right, it is possible Greatjon Umber is still alive and the son is lying, but I suspect that would be a pretty easy fact-check for Ramsey
Not really if the Umbers are in on a conspiracy to take out Ramsey.
Right, but Greatjon Umber is a very well known house leader. If he died, lots of other houses would probably send their condolences, possibly travel to the funeral, and it would be quite a big ordeal. You're right, it COULD all be part of the act, but there would be lots of preparation needed in order to fake the death of Greatjon Umber and not let it slip that he is, indeed, still alive. I just don't see that as very likely. I think it is unlikely there is any Umber plan to take out Ramsey, but I think it even MORE unlikely that faking Greatjon's death was part of the plan.
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TexasAggiesWin
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In reply to smokeythebear • 1:22p, 5/17/16
S
quote:
I know book isn't allowed...
But here is something from the book.
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The Debt
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In reply to wangus12 • 1:25p, 5/17/16
quote:
Agreed. I think the Karstarks and Umbers are being mixed up there
fffffffffffffffffff
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wangus12
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In reply to TexasAggiesWin • 1:26p, 5/17/16
AG
quote:
quote:
I know book isn't allowed...
But here is something from the book.
Welp there goes this thread
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Independent George
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1:27p, 5/17/16
AG
How is this hard????
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Brian Earl Spilner
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1:28p, 5/17/16
AG
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The Debt
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1:30p, 5/17/16
quote:
Anyway, Lady Olenna thinks LF is a lowborn fraud so she would never allow him to dictate an alliance, nor get anywhere near her grand-daughter.
I can see Lady Olenna saying "I have seen dozens of high born hedges in my life that amount to nothing more than brushfire; it is truly rare to see lowborn tree rise above those hedges."
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Zombie Jon Snow
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In reply to smokeythebear • 1:33p, 5/17/16
AG
quote:
quote:
quote:
I know book isn't allowed...
But here is something from the book.
Can you just get over it and not derail the thread?
let's flay the *******!!!!

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wangus12
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In reply to The Debt • 1:41p, 5/17/16
AG
Thats actually well said!
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Goldie Wilson
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In reply to Zombie Jon Snow • 2:17p, 5/17/16
quote:
quote:
quote:
quote:
I know book isn't allowed...
But here is something from the book.
Can you just get over it and not derail the thread?
let's flay the *******!!!!

For the watch!
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4
PatAg
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2:45p, 5/17/16
AG
I think something being overlooked, if I remember correctly what Umber said to Ramsay, is that he can't defend himself from the wildlings Jon has let in. Implying they are raiding.
Except we know Jon and Tormund have them in check and they aren't raiding, no?
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Independent George
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In reply to PatAg • 3:21p, 5/17/16
AG
quote:
I think something being overlooked, if I remember correctly what Umber said to Ramsay, is that he can't defend himself from the wildlings Jon has let in. Implying they are raiding.
Except we know Jon and Tormund have them in check and they aren't raiding, no?
I was thinking there wasnt enough time for the wildlings to really get out there and pillage the lands yet. I know time moves pretty quick off screen but still only seemed like a couple of days.

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Independent George
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3:25p, 5/17/16
AG
Where is Dany's story likely headed in the immediate future?

Is she going to pack up the Dothraki mega army and roll back to Mereen or is she gonna march them to various other cities (the ones funding the harpies) and raid/steal their ships?

She has Jorah there to command if his greyscale doesnt get him first.
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boy09
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In reply to PatAg • 3:30p, 5/17/16
AG
quote:
I think something being overlooked, if I remember correctly what Umber said to Ramsay, is that he can't defend himself from the wildlings Jon has let in. Implying they are raiding.
Except we know Jon and Tormund have them in check and they aren't raiding, no?
They've always defended themselves against Wildlings since they are furthest north, but just a few here and there, which they can handle with no problem. Now word has gotten out the Jon Snow has let a few thousand Wildlings through the wall. They're just assuming they will be heading south and raiding villages, and they are just preparing. At least that's the way I understood it.
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mm98
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In reply to Quinn • 3:42p, 5/17/16
AG
quote:
Did he just whip up a Bolton crest for the letter before sending it?
Along with a Bolton rider and banner?
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dcaggie04
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3:56p, 5/17/16
AG
quote:
the only real threats armies left are Dorne (dessert folk)
Ah yes, Dorne, great land of cakes, pies and cookies.
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LHIOB
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In reply to Independent George • 6:10p, 5/17/16
AG
quote:
Where is Dany's story likely headed in the immediate future?

Is she going to pack up the Dothraki mega army and roll back to Mereen or is she gonna march them to various other cities (the ones funding the harpies) and raid/steal their ships?

She has Jorah there to command if his greyscale doesnt get him first.

I know where she can find ships...Pyke
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The Debt
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In reply to dcaggie04 • 6:18p, 5/17/16
quote:
quote:
the only real threats armies left are Dorne (dessert folk)
Ah yes, Dorne, great land of cakes, pies and cookies.

I was referring to Dornish wine
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ja86
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In reply to LHIOB • 6:39p, 5/17/16
AG
quote:
quote:
Where is Dany's story likely headed in the immediate future?

Is she going to pack up the Dothraki mega army and roll back to Mereen or is she gonna march them to various other cities (the ones funding the harpies) and raid/steal their ships?

She has Jorah there to command if his greyscale doesnt get him first.

I know where she can find ships...Pyke


That is a given since they are the only ones left with a fleet big enough to move the hord....
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Joan Wilder
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8:35p, 5/17/16
AG
Isn't Pyke on the west coast of Westeros? Dany is way out east with the Dothraki.

As much as I'd like to see a dragon or a giant rip Ramsey to shreds, this show doesn't usually deliver justice like that. It says something about how bleak last year was that episodes where a woman and a baby are eaten by dogs and Tonks is stabbed in the neck are considered some of the happier episodes in recent memory.
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The Debt
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In reply to Joan Wilder • 9:02p, 5/17/16
quote:
Isn't Pyke on the west coast of Westeros? Dany is way out east with the Dothraki.

As much as I'd like to see a dragon or a giant rip Ramsey to shreds, this show doesn't usually deliver justice like that. It says something about how bleak last year was that episodes where a woman and a baby are eaten by dogs and Tonks is stabbed in the neck are considered some of the happier episodes in recent memory.

And the earth is flat
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Joan Wilder
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9:10p, 5/17/16
AG
We haven't seen the Pykes venture further than Westeros or seem all that interested in life outside the Iron Islands, have we? Would they want to join forces with Dany? What's in it for them?

I can't remember - were they involved in Blackwater?
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jbanda
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In reply to Joan Wilder • 9:11p, 5/17/16
AG
Nope they were busy trying to invade the mainland and no one really noticed and failed.
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gougler08
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In reply to Joan Wilder • 9:15p, 5/17/16
AG
quote:
We haven't seen the Pykes venture further than Westeros or seem all that interested in life outside the Iron Islands, have we? Would they want to join forces with Dany? What's in it for them?

I can't remember - were they involved in Blackwater?


They may enter the battle now that Balon is dead and we presume Yara will take the lead of the Ironborn
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wangus12
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In reply to gougler08 • 9:38p, 5/17/16
AG
Don't forget about the brother that offed Balon. He said it was time for a new ruler
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Serious Lee
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10:16p, 5/17/16
all this talk about the umbers reminded me of an old character whose fate i cant remember. In the 3rd season there was a guy that was robbs ally and was reluctantly getting married to a fray girl (who hilariously turned out to be attractive). What was his name and did we (non book readers) ever find out what became of him?
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The Debt
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In reply to Serious Lee • 10:20p, 5/17/16
quote:
all this talk about the umbers reminded me of an old character whose fate i cant remember. In the 3rd season there was a guy that was robbs ally and was reluctantly getting married to a fray girl (who hilariously turned out to be attractive). What was his name and did we (non book readers) ever find out what became of him?

That was the heir to the riverlands, Caitlin tully-starks something. Younger brother?


Supposedly rotting in a Frey cell, iirc
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gougler08
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In reply to wangus12 • 10:24p, 5/17/16
AG
quote:
Don't forget about the brother that offed Balon. He said it was time for a new ruler


True, do we think he shows up when they figure out who will rule? I assume he has to or it would be such a random appearance to kill Balon and then not show back up
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