*** Better Call Saul: Season 4 *** (SEE NOTE IN OP)

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Bunk Moreland
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In reply to AgGrad99 • 11:23a, 9/5/18
AgGrad99 said:
Belton Ag said:
Old Tom Morris said:
It's like the contractor that comes in and tells you something that just sounds too good to be true. It's because it is. Your project is going to end up over-promised, under-delivered, over budget, and with who knows what other problems. And this isn't one that can afford problems.
Plus I'm sure they're not thrilled about the guy running his mouth about his past jobs; the last thing they want is this guy talking about this job sometime down the road.
That's what I thought as well. He told them exactly where the illegal tunnel was, that he dug before. Not smart.

And the 3rd layer was that he showed he's adept with his surroundings and understands basically what's going on when he mentioned knowing they must be near a city given the noise on the way in.

But yes, this is a lot of extrapolating on a very basic plot point that they were testing guys to see which one would be the right guy to work with and the 2nd guy passed the test.
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aTmAg
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11:28a, 9/5/18
AG
I think it was dumb of Gus to show his face. He is a famous business owner. What's the point of all the secrecy if he's going to do that?
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Old Tom Morris
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In reply to aTmAg • 11:41a, 9/5/18
aTmAg said:
I think it was dumb of Gus to show his face. He is a famous business owner. What's the point of all the secrecy if he's going to do that?
I think the secrecy was purely so they could interview candidates, while leaving them no information about location or who is involved (other than Mike's face). But once you have a guy for the project, actually doing it is too big to not involve Gus.
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Liquid Wrench
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In reply to Old Tom Morris • 11:58a, 9/5/18
I was surprised Gus came out too. I figured Mike could be a buffer on the whole thing.
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dave94
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12:02p, 9/5/18
AG
I think we've seen that Gus isn't scared of sh*t. If the engineer even appears to be untrustworthy then he'll be dealt with swiftly anyway.

The guy has to know that.
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aTmAg
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In reply to Old Tom Morris • 12:06p, 9/5/18
AG
Old Tom Morris said:
aTmAg said:
I think it was dumb of Gus to show his face. He is a famous business owner. What's the point of all the secrecy if he's going to do that?
I think the secrecy was purely so they could interview candidates, while leaving them no information about location or who is involved (other than Mike's face). But once you have a guy for the project, actually doing it is too big to not involve Gus.
Why? I see no reason why Gus ever has to meet him at all. That's a lose end that didn't need to be created.
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Old Tom Morris
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In reply to aTmAg • 12:14p, 9/5/18
It's a huge, complicated project and going to be the center of his entire operation in the future. Mike has done basically one job for him.. Awfully big leap to have Mike basically have to run the project for him. A buffer sounds good in theory, but something this complicated and critical is going to take involvement.

Gus is directly involved with the guy that he's planning to have run the lab and even his street level operators (i.e. the guys that kill bicycle kid). It's not like he's insulated himself entirely from this business with buffers. Once you're in, Gus is involved.
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aTmAg
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In reply to Old Tom Morris • 12:37p, 9/5/18
AG
Old Tom Morris said:
It's a huge, complicated project and going to be the center of his entire operation in the future. Mike has done basically one job for him.. Awfully big leap to have Mike basically have to run the project for him. A buffer sounds good in theory, but something this complicated and critical is going to take involvement.

Gus is directly involved with the guy that he's planning to have run the lab and even his street level operators (i.e. the guys that kill bicycle kid). It's not like he's insulated himself entirely from this business with buffers. Once you're in, Gus is involved.
It doesn't have to be Mike. It could be any of his trusted circle. Just as long as that trusted guy is not all over TV like Gus is.

They could have pretended it was a government project. Have him sign a fake NDA and tell him that he must keep it secret under the penalty of law. As soon as Gus's face shows up all that is down the tubes. It's no big deal, I just think it's a mistake by the writers (or Gus.. depending what the writers had in mind).
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TXAG 05
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In reply to aTmAg • 12:39p, 9/5/18
AG
aTmAg said:
Old Tom Morris said:
It's a huge, complicated project and going to be the center of his entire operation in the future. Mike has done basically one job for him.. Awfully big leap to have Mike basically have to run the project for him. A buffer sounds good in theory, but something this complicated and critical is going to take involvement.

Gus is directly involved with the guy that he's planning to have run the lab and even his street level operators (i.e. the guys that kill bicycle kid). It's not like he's insulated himself entirely from this business with buffers. Once you're in, Gus is involved.
It doesn't have to be Mike. It could be any of his trusted circle. Just as long as that trusted guy is not all over TV like Gus is.

They could have pretended it was a government project. Have him sign a fake NDA and tell him that he must keep it secret under the penalty of law. As soon as Gus's face shows up all that is down the tubes. It's no big deal, I just think it's a mistake by the writers (or Gus.. depending what the writers had in mind).


Chances are, they don't have Pollos Hermanos commercials in Germany, where I assume they guy is from. Gus may have him killed after the job is done anyway.
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Old Tom Morris
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In reply to aTmAg • 12:46p, 9/5/18
Gus is the brains of the operation though. He's got security muscle. He's got dealer muscle. He's got cooks (or cooks to be). And while he's very careful cover to the outside world, he's never been shy about being hands on with running his business and meeting with who he needs to within it. Given his history with the rest of his business, I'd find it weird if he didn't interact with the PM of his largest-meth-lab-in-the-southwest project. At least once they've landed on a guy.
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aTmAg
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In reply to TXAG 05 • 12:57p, 9/5/18
AG
Cstrickland05 said:
aTmAg said:
Old Tom Morris said:
It's a huge, complicated project and going to be the center of his entire operation in the future. Mike has done basically one job for him.. Awfully big leap to have Mike basically have to run the project for him. A buffer sounds good in theory, but something this complicated and critical is going to take involvement.

Gus is directly involved with the guy that he's planning to have run the lab and even his street level operators (i.e. the guys that kill bicycle kid). It's not like he's insulated himself entirely from this business with buffers. Once you're in, Gus is involved.
It doesn't have to be Mike. It could be any of his trusted circle. Just as long as that trusted guy is not all over TV like Gus is.

They could have pretended it was a government project. Have him sign a fake NDA and tell him that he must keep it secret under the penalty of law. As soon as Gus's face shows up all that is down the tubes. It's no big deal, I just think it's a mistake by the writers (or Gus.. depending what the writers had in mind).


Chances are, they don't have Pollos Hermanos commercials in Germany, where I assume they guy is from. Gus may have him killed after the job is done anyway.
If he didn't show his face he wouldn't have to do any of that.
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aTmAg
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In reply to Old Tom Morris • 1:04p, 9/5/18
AG
Old Tom Morris said:
Gus is the brains of the operation though. He's got security muscle. He's got dealer muscle. He's got cooks (or cooks to be). And while he's very careful cover to the outside world, he's never been shy about being hands on with running his business and meeting with who he needs to within it. Given his history with the rest of his business, I'd find it weird if he didn't interact with the PM of his largest-meth-lab-in-the-southwest project. At least once they've landed on a guy.
I'm the other way around. Gus could have hired a professional firm to do the work and pretended it was a classified government project. As long as he didn't show his face. By showing his face he severely limits his options.
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TexasAggie008
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1:19p, 9/5/18
AG
Still think Hank is the (or one of the) bigger B.B. characters yet to make an apperance this season

Gus rolling through a DEA fundraiser etc wouldn't be "forced" on the story at all... bet it happens by the end of season
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Koldus131
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2:06p, 9/5/18
AG
Ok theory time...

Who do y'all think was on the business card Saul handed the receptionist in the opening flashback to BB. I feel like they wouldn't have shown that if it wasn't going to be significant.
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TXAG 05
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In reply to Koldus131 • 2:12p, 9/5/18
AG
Koldus131 said:
Ok theory time...

Who do y'all think was on the business card Saul handed the receptionist in the opening flashback to BB. I feel like they wouldn't have shown that if it wasn't going to be significant.


I'd say Kim if she is still alive and practicing law, but the receptionist knows her and he probably would have said "go talk to Kim".

Maybe Howard? But I see him possibly killing himself over the stress of thinking he was responsible for Chuck.

Probably someone we meet in either this season or next.
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expresswrittenconsent
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3:19p, 9/5/18
Clearly it is Ed Bagley Jr from Davis & Main's card.
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TP Ag '87
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In reply to TXAG 05 • 4:58p, 9/5/18
AG
Regarding Howard offing himself:

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Stive
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5:06p, 9/5/18
AG
That B.B. flashforward is really making me want to go back and rewatch that whole thing.
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Mozart Paintings
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In reply to Stive • 5:31p, 9/5/18
AG
Stive said:
That B.B. flashforward is really making me want to go back and rewatch that whole thing.
I did it this past spring. Still so great.
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Burdizzo
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In reply to Mozart Paintings • 5:46p, 9/5/18
AG
I drove bus said:
Stive said:
That B.B. flashforward is really making me want to go back and rewatch that whole thing.
I did it this past spring. Still so great.


Every once in a while I rewatched Ozymandius. Good stuff.
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fightinags2013
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10:54p, 9/5/18
AG
Best part about my recent BB rewatch= skipping all the Skyler stuff.
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Baby Billy
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11:14p, 9/5/18
AG
I may be going crazy but I seem to remember a time in BB where a bag was put over Walters head and he was driven somewhere while he carefully calculated each turn so he could remember exactly how to get there next time.

Could also be a random movie or something else I'm remembering that from.

If my memory serves, I thought it was interesting that the bags were placed over both engineers heads so they didn't know where they were.
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TexasAggie008
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11:19p, 9/5/18
AG
When Gus brought him out to the desert and "fired him" and said he'd kill his family / infant daughter if he didn't disappear
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Old Tom Morris
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In reply to aTmAg • 7:02a, 9/6/18
I guess I need to explain mine better. But I'll be brief:

Joke.

Non-joke: Gus could have stayed in a closet like Tom Cruise and run his etire operation. Meeting Walt - unnecessary. Meeting Jesse - unnecessary. Meeting street level dealers - unnecessary. That's not how he worked the entire series, mostly because it would be boring and suck.
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aTmAg
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In reply to Old Tom Morris • 7:12a, 9/6/18
AG
Old Tom Morris said:
I guess I need to explain mine better. But I'll be brief:

Joke.
Gotcha.
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aTmAg
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7:17a, 9/6/18
AG
But seriously dudes.. I love this show and think BB is the best series ever, but even BB writers can make mistakes. However, this may not be a writer mistake, but the writers intentionally writing in a Gus mistake. In BB season 3, Gus told WW (while eating a Gus's house) that he had made mistakes in the past. Perhaps this is one of them. Maybe Gus ends up having to kill this guy and wishes he had done it better so that wouldn't have been necessary. It's hard to say.

But there were better ways for Gus to have gotten this done.
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Complete Idiot
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7:22a, 9/6/18
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Old Tom Morris
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In reply to aTmAg • 7:47a, 9/6/18
He was hands on with his business throughout the series. In fact, so much so in BB it ends up being his downfall. Yes, he was cautious about people on the outside. But once in his employ, he was hands on. Like many/most entreprenuers. It's partly why many of them have success to begin with. For Gus, there's probably no rise to then fall without it. This cautious-then-meet/work-woth approach is absolutely within character for the entire show.
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aTmAg
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In reply to Old Tom Morris • 8:06a, 9/6/18
AG
Old Tom Morris said:
He was hands on with his business throughout the series. In fact, so much so in BB it ends up being his downfall. Yes, he was cautious about people on the outside. But once in his employ, he was hands on. Like many/most entreprenuers. It's partly why many of them have success to begin with. For Gus, there's probably no rise to then fall without it. This cautious-then-meet/work-woth approach is absolutely within character for the entire show.
There are 2 class of employee under Gus: The "civilians" (such as the employees at his stores) and the "shady" guys (Mike, Gale, Victor, etc.). The civilians have no clue of his illegal activities. The shady ones clearly do.

In real life, the excavation work he wants done would require expertise that probably cannot be found in shady circles. That is way more complicated than digging a tunnel under the border. He would have to hire a legit engineering firm to do that, and they would want no part of it if they knew it was for something illegal. So he would have to make up a story for them that at least gives them plausible deniability.
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Old Tom Morris
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8:26a, 9/6/18
Apparently he's found an illegit engineer that can handle it. No legits are sporting a hood to their site visit.
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Old Tom Morris
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8:35a, 9/6/18
And underground drug labs are not uncommon in Europe or Mexico. The writers didn't just magically make up the underground lab concept. Some are crude, some less so. And who knows what hasn't been discovered.
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Robert C. Christian
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In reply to Old Tom Morris • 8:42a, 9/6/18
AG
Old Tom Morris said:
And underground drug labs are not uncommon in Europe or Mexico. The writers didn't just magically make up the underground lab concept.
Also not uncommon in the US.

Most famous example: The Tennessee Pot Cave
More Recently: Arlington TX

Actually, these are both grow operations. I would assume this applies to meth labs as well?
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aTmAg
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8:53a, 9/6/18
AG
Digging a hole in the middle of a field or under a deck is not complicated. Doing it under a pre-existing building with multiple-tons of equipment on top is a different matter.


In fact I have no idea how they are going to do it in secret anyway. That is a crap-ton of concrete. Surely people will notice all the trucks in the middle of the night?
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91_Aggie
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In reply to aTmAg • 9:57a, 9/6/18
AG
aTmAg said:
Digging a hole in the middle of a field or under a deck is not complicated. Doing it under a pre-existing building with multiple-tons of equipment on top is a different matter.


In fact I have no idea how they are going to do it in secret anyway. That is a crap-ton of concrete. Surely people will notice all the trucks in the middle of the night?
you mean the "laundry" trucks that will go in and out? And mixing on-site?
You seem to be a know-it-all with very little imagination.
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Old Tom Morris
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10:20a, 9/6/18
You seem to be missing a critical difference - we aren't saying it's the smartest, most careful thing to show his face. We're simply saying that this is how his character operated throughout the series. It was dumb to bring Jesse in. It was dumb to try to kill Hector personally. Those things got him killed. He was cautious. But not perfectly cautious. He got his hands dirty in running his business. That was his character.

And you're right, it is an extremely complicated project. All the more reason for him to feel like he needs direct involvement.
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