I can appreciate that. For me, my brain is "ravelled" enough between work and family. So, I would really have to enjoy a show to spend significant time after each episode reading fan theories and going down internet rabbit holes to figure out exactly what happened and when it happened.bobinator said:Trident 88 said:
However, I'll never pick it up and read it again because the work outweighed the reward.
I sort of think the work is the reward. To be honest any time my brain spends trying to unravel this show feels like a mental vacation from most of the dumb stuff going on in the world these days. I don't know if that makes sense, but I was thinking about that earlier today.
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dlance said:AgEng06 said:
Pretty sure it was the Glock that Ford made appear in his hand.
If so, one could hypothesize that it was more powerful than the park weapons (ie 10mm or something).
I haven't paid much specific attention to what caliber everything is in the show, but we've see P90's (5.7x28), beretta Neos (22lr), beretta px4 (Stubb's gun, not sure on caliber), glock 17 (9mm) and maybe other Glock models, F2000 (5.56 NATO), FN SCAR-L (5.56 NATO), HK G36C (5.56 NATO), IWI X95 (5.56 NATO), and KEL-TEC KSG (12 gauge). That's what I remember as far as modern weapons.
Now, during the season I know we've seen P90's, SCAR-L's, and Glocks used by the security forces during the season before the cavalry arrived and established the beach head. I don't remember if Bernard had a large frame Glock which we be either models 20 (10mm, the best millimeter) or 21 (45 ACP), or one of the small frames that are chambered in 9mm, 40 S&W, or .357 Sig. I'm excluding 45 GAP and 380 ACP.
Yeah it's a matter of taste, but I often gravitate to shows that's make me think. It's a completely different kind of mental exercise, but a fun one that's takes my mind off of other things, it's also uplifting and joyful in a weird sort of way to see someone who can bring something so complicated and unique to screen effectively. Like watching a magic trick and wondering how they did it. And it's done in a variety of ways - BCS does it through incredible detail in relatively simple plots. Westworld through mind bending timelines, other shows through crazy twists that you can see coming if paying enough attention etc.Trident 88 said:I can appreciate that. For me, my brain is "ravelled" enough between work and family. So, I would really have to enjoy a show to spend significant time after each episode reading fan theories and going down internet rabbit holes to figure out exactly what happened and when it happened.bobinator said:Trident 88 said:
However, I'll never pick it up and read it again because the work outweighed the reward.
I sort of think the work is the reward. To be honest any time my brain spends trying to unravel this show feels like a mental vacation from most of the dumb stuff going on in the world these days. I don't know if that makes sense, but I was thinking about that earlier today.
Others though just don't want to think or work when watching something, just a matter of where your head is at the time I guess.
So according to the Vanity Fair article the last scene with William and Emily is all real and is not taking place in a sim inside the Cradle or Forge. I just don't get that. So he made copies of everyone he interacted with from some point in time to see if he can be the guy that doesn't kill his own daughter? And that's the loop he is stuck in? And he's doing the loop as some host/hybrid?
The whole point of that scene was just to mess with the audience I think. A tease of something way in the future. For some reason despite my normal tendencies I'm not overly concerned with it's ramifications yet.
that was a good article
Another interesting quote regarding the last scene from Wiki:
Quote:
The post-credits scene involving William and Emily was originally scripted to occur near the middle of the episode, at around the same time Bernard left the Forge after killing Dolores. Director Frederick E.O. Toye said that they found having this scene in the middle of the episode would be too confusing to viewers as " there are such exhausting, mental exercises that you had to go through to get to it", and so they moved it to the post-credits slot
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That whole scene is a step too far in trying to purposely deceive and mind**** everyone.
Brian Earl Spilner said:
I guess that's possible, but I feel like it was heavily implied he was one of the balls.
Who do you think they could be?
Probably has to do with who signs on for S3.
It's just so hard for me to see him, even in Westworld, without seeing Liam McPoyle.
Anyone else have any picks for who the hosts are that Dolores snuck out of the park?
I'm convinced that Maeve and Angela are two of them, but otherwise I can't think of any hosts we know that well that are still in play other than Maeve's crew Hector/Armistice/etc.
I'm convinced that Maeve and Angela are two of them, but otherwise I can't think of any hosts we know that well that are still in play other than Maeve's crew Hector/Armistice/etc.
Her dad maybe
I think it's implied that she still has her dad's, and presumably the backup data from the 4 million guests.zgood10 said:
Her dad maybe
I think that one is possible, but I'm not sure it's likely. That last scene with him sure seemed like a goodbye scene, and his memory is completely scrambled now also.
Still, there are only so many people it even could be.
Still, there are only so many people it even could be.
I don't think that's implied at all, did I miss that?MGS said:
I think it's implied that she still has her dad's, and presumably the backup data from the 4 million guests.
Whoever is still under contract/the writer of the next episode wants. There's no plan for any of this show.
I think one (now in Charlotte shell) is Hector or the blonde tattooed chick. Muscle.
No idea who the others would be...
No idea who the others would be...
Some info from Joy on the last scene.
Quote:
But then when you see that post-credit vignette, it's really just a tease of what's to come. We kind of rounded out that story. And you're totally right about the end and this is a tease as to what's to come, because we see that one tiny bit where we thought he might be coming down an elevator. We see that pay off and we see again Katja Herbers [Emily] who he thinks, "Are you my daughter? What the fk is this?"
But he's in a very different timeline. The whole place looks destroyed, and then she explains that all of that stuff happened long ago. That was real. But now something has happened and the Man is now the subject or some iteration of the Man is now the subject of testing. The roles have become completely reversed.
And we get the feeling that, in the far-flung future, the Man has been somehow reconjured and brought into this world and he's being tested the same way the humans used to test the Hosts. And that is a storyline that one day we'll see more of.
Belton Ag said:
It's just so hard for me to see him, even in Westworld, without seeing Liam McPoyle.
Holy crap, that is some great work.
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What would be crazy is if the MIB, in the last scene, still wasnt a host, but 100% organic/cloned human. still would be testing for "fidelity", in the same way the humans test the hosts, but now the hosts testing the "humans".
In the distant future the host have taken over, and now they want to bring thier creators back to life....
Jurassic Westworld
Jurassic Westworld
I don't know if they could pull it off, but it would be a trip to have a season a thousand years in the future where robots bring humans back to life just to have fun killing them over and over.
I knew there would be a Moses parting the sea moment and freeing the slaves moment.
But thats what I like about the show, haha.Brian Earl Spilner said:
That whole scene is a step too far in trying to purposely deceive and mind**** everyone.
Pretty sure the post-credit scene is just the precursor to the Portal games.
William was the only real compelling thing for me this season. I liked his descent into madness.
At some point before season 1 he gets his profile. He sees it and it shakes him. I think he's disturbed by the revelation we got in the finale of humans not being complicated but rather simple. And his uncomplicated programming is that of a nut job prone to delusions.
His behavior in S2, once the robots can fight back, perhaps indicates his drive to disprove his profile. He says something to that effect in the post-credit scene.
Of course he just ends up fulfilling what the profile says. In the same way Delos' defining moment is his treatment of his son, William kills Emily in his delusion. He ends up making the same choice over and over (again proving his profile defined "programming") which is why he ends up at the forge to be tested for fidelity by Emily-bot in future simulations.
The episode is called "the passenger". William sought to prove his free will but he's just the passenger, a slave to his programming.
If that's actually what they were trying to communicate I think it's pretty compelling.
At some point before season 1 he gets his profile. He sees it and it shakes him. I think he's disturbed by the revelation we got in the finale of humans not being complicated but rather simple. And his uncomplicated programming is that of a nut job prone to delusions.
His behavior in S2, once the robots can fight back, perhaps indicates his drive to disprove his profile. He says something to that effect in the post-credit scene.
Of course he just ends up fulfilling what the profile says. In the same way Delos' defining moment is his treatment of his son, William kills Emily in his delusion. He ends up making the same choice over and over (again proving his profile defined "programming") which is why he ends up at the forge to be tested for fidelity by Emily-bot in future simulations.
The episode is called "the passenger". William sought to prove his free will but he's just the passenger, a slave to his programming.
If that's actually what they were trying to communicate I think it's pretty compelling.
I know this is probably obvious, but can someone give a brief explanation of exactly what the fidelity test is and how you pass it? Does a host pass by giving the exact same answer every time and acting the same way in a given situation?
And while you are at it, can someone kind of dumb down to me the whole concept of humans being simple and able to be defined essentially by one key moment as it pertains to being able to program them?
Does that mean before the poolside Logan chat and his subsequent suicide, that Delos' "one key moment" was something different? Doesn't that ultimately mean that they/we aren't simple programmed creatures because our one key moment and what drives us changes?
I may be missing that completely, but seems like they are trying to parallel the host's "cornerstone" and the human's "one key moment" as being basically the same, but it doesn't really seem like they are.
Does that mean before the poolside Logan chat and his subsequent suicide, that Delos' "one key moment" was something different? Doesn't that ultimately mean that they/we aren't simple programmed creatures because our one key moment and what drives us changes?
I may be missing that completely, but seems like they are trying to parallel the host's "cornerstone" and the human's "one key moment" as being basically the same, but it doesn't really seem like they are.
I took it to mean that his decision regarding Logan never changed despite all other variables in his loop.
So I think that moment represented who he was deep inside, not that the moment defined him.
So I think that moment represented who he was deep inside, not that the moment defined him.
I was just using the words of the show - AI Logan called it his defining moment (by my recollection) but I think we're basically saying the same thing.dave94 said:
I took it to mean that his decision regarding Logan never changed despite all other variables in his loop.
So I think that moment represented who he was deep inside, not that the moment defined him.
Yes there is a branch of philosophy that is directed towards man's inability to change his course. Given the same circumstances, one will continue to make the same decisions, no matter the history leading to that point.
Plus, wasn't it in this episode that someone stated his overall motivation was related to his son?
mavsfan4ever said:
I know this is probably obvious, but can someone give a brief explanation of exactly what the fidelity test is and how you pass it? Does a host pass by giving the exact same answer every time and acting the same way in a given situation?
And if this is the case, why do they want the hosts acting the exact same every time in a given situation? For safety?
Is fidelity a test to see if they are a good host or a test to see if a host is human like? I originally thought it was to see if they were human like but I guess it's a test to see if they are a good host?