*** WESTWORLD Season 1 (HBO) ***

359,426 Views | 2710 Replies | Last: 7 yr ago by Sazerac
bangobango
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redline248 said:

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Seems pretty obvious to me that Ford sent him to kill Elsie.
So Ford flat out lied to him about that? I got the impression he was telling the truth, and Bernard realized he killed her on his own.
I guess to each his own. Seemed to me that they were showing that Ford was lying to him about it. Not sure why Bernard would kill Elsie on his own.

Pretty sure we will learn Bernard has killed quiet a few people for Ford.
ce1994
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There was no reason for Ford to lie to Bernard but he did.

This is the thing that puzzles me and I hope they clear it up before the season ends. There is something that Ford does not know and he is using the man in black to find it. It puzzles me there is anything that Ford does not know.
redline248
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I'm trying to think of any other instances in which Ford just flat out lied. Why lie to Bernard if you're about to completely wipe his memory?
AlaskanAg99
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It reminds me of Lost. I'm also watching Vikings, and I find the storyline of Vikings superior.

AlL the heavy handed philosophy and moral crap and soul searching for what makes a human a human....yawn. All in a fake park with androids where life.and death doesn't matter. Double yawn.
H.E. Pennypacker
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I love the audacity and grandness and degree of difficulty of this show, but I'm not as in love with the writing and/or plot of this show like you guys are. The two repair techs are huge weak points IMO. They are both DUMB. At a certain point, why don't they turn on Maeve when she is back in the park and can't hurt them? Furthermore, why are they the only ones working on Maeve? And why are there no security cameras in the repair areas? Seems like the most logical place for corporate espionage etc.

And all the flashbacks/concurrent timelines are confusing and kind of a jumbled mess. I have the wherewithal to decipher them, but it's not well written spatially speaking.
claym711
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SpreadsheetAg said:

There's 3 timelines I think now
Been saying this for a while now.
redline248
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I have to fully agree the idiots stuck working with Maeve are a huge problem.
spanky
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H.E. Pennypacker said:

At a certain point, why don't they turn on Maeve when she is back in the park and can't hurt them?
Because they are idiots like you said. They would lose their jobs, and they are obviously underqualified and overpaid for the jobs they have. Stupid people will do stupid stuff.
Al Bula
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The lab techs storyline is cringe-worthy. Weak link in this show for sure.
OldArmy71
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Quote:

The two repair techs are huge weak points IMO. They are both DUMB.

This has been true for several episodes, but when Maeve starts going on and on about raising an entire army and the Asian guy STILL refuses to wipe her.....it just doesn't work for me.
jabberwalkie09
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So you're saying they're.... useful idiots?
Dro07
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I think emo Glenn believed that she was human in his mind and started to like her. Dude is weak and easily controlled not hard to imagine. I mean come on people are trying to marry robots right now
BigTimeAlum
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Yes, the Maeve storyline is ruining this for me. Remove that garbage and this show is amazing.
TCTTS
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Quote:

Im still confused on how Sepinwall didnt like this show. Its absolutely fantastic. The acting is off the walls. The story is so original and different from any TV show Ive ever seen. I feel like Westworld is the Bama of TV.
Quote:

I love the audacity and grandness and degree of difficulty of this show, but I'm not as in love with the writing and/or plot of this show like you guys are. The two repair techs are huge weak points IMO. They are both DUMB. At a certain point, why don't they turn on Maeve when she is back in the park and can't hurt them? Furthermore, why are they the only ones working on Maeve? And why are there no security cameras in the repair areas? Seems like the most logical place for corporate espionage etc.


And all the flashbacks/concurrent timelines are confusing and kind of a jumbled mess. I have the wherewithal to decipher them, but it's not well written spatially speaking.


I love following the show, but I have to say, I'm definitely more in the second camp overall. Yes, it's unlike anything else on TV, the acting is phenomenal, and the mystery of it all is incredibly fun... but honestly, there hasn't been a single moment that I thought was truly great TV in terms of dramatic writing or a single character I'm truly engaged in. For instance, I'm so incredibly curious as to the end result of William and Dolores' plight, but I haven't connected at all with their journey to get there. I just don't care about them the way I cared about, say, the Starks, Don and Peggy, Walter White, or the Taylors eight episodes into their respective runs. There's a fine line between "really intriguing mystery" and a truly empathetic narrative. And I don't mean for this to come across as a complaint, either. I absolutely love the way this show is seemingly designed exclusively for the reddit age; that it's almost more puzzle than story. That said, to defend the Sepinwalls of the world, there's something about it dramatically - especially compared to other "prestige" TV - that's just not clicking with some of us. Even Lost managed to have characters - from the very first episode - that we cared deeply about almost immediately, while ALSO balancing the mystery/message board fodder of it all fairly brilliantly. But with Lost, the message board aspect wasn't necessary. You could be perfectly content watching JUST the show. With Westworld, however, I cannot imagine truly enjoying this show without the week-to-week reddit/message board aspect of it all. It would still be interesting, no doubt, but there's just a hollowness and clumsiness overall that I can't shake.
AlaskanAg99
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It's a jumbled mess of a story line, poor writing with Hosts that seem to be shot up constantly, or spend time in diagnostics and not fulfilling their roles in the park with apparently tons of guests constantly there. What happens with continuity for other guests when main hosts are constantly being dragged out of the park for whatever reason?

Multiple storylines and this nonsense crap about 'Arnold' with such advanced AI programming they're running the show outside of the park.

All the infighting within the corporation about big huge new storylines to only be changed in a heartbeat. I doubt Apple operates this way.

I love sci-fi, and I love bad sci-fi, but this is getting complicated with 3 timelines, idiot support staff, and big plot holes. After all, they caught the 1 tech banging a Host in the chop shop, but apparently aren't watching the other 2 dolts cavort around with a naked woman. And apparently your user ID works in every department.
PooDoo
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One thing I've thought was implied with the William = MiB theory is that the quest with Dolores revealed the maze to him... but MiB said it was revealed after he killed Mauve.

Maybe Dolores goes into the maze without William knowing where she went... then after all these years he figures out the robot love of his life is in the center of this maze.
He can't contain his old boner and tells his wife who kills herself in disgust (or MiB offs her)... but we see MiB with Dolores after he kills Mauve.
So, maybe MiB is someone looking for William who went missing in the maze?

Sorry for the stream of consciousness post. I'm stuck in a waiting room wishing I was in a different timeline.
DannyDuberstein
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I at least partly agree with Alaskan. It feels a little bit cheap to jumble things up like they've appeared to. I don't think that necessarily makes for a great, innovative story.
AlaskanAg99
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It feels rushed. And I get it with big budget shows like this they need to get the ball rolling for future seasons.

I was highly interested in this show because I love most of the HBO programming, but I just don't care about most of the characters because they're robots.
Dro07
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Some shows just aren't for everyone I guess
BowSowy
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TCTTS said:

With Westworld, however, I cannot imagine truly enjoying this show without the week-to-week reddit/message board aspect of it all. It would still be interesting, no doubt, but there's just a hollowness and clumsiness overall that I can't shake.


Yeah, this is a problem with the show. My girlfriend generally likes to watch the shows I watch but she doesn't like this show because she doesn't care to keep up with all of the crazy theories. Without those, IHO, it's a show with an interesting premise that is not very interesting.
Joe Exotic
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Chalk me up as another one that is over the Maeve story line. It's just too far out there now.
TCTTS
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Yep. I really like the idea of it - a host becoming self-aware, manipulating staff, and attempting to break out of the park - but man, it really is cringeworthy in the way that it's executed.
3rdGen2015
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Man, this turned into a dislike thread very quickly. I for one absolutely love this show. But I also spend a lot of time thinking about it so I've been able to rationalize all of the "plot holes" that others have mentioned. I understand it isn't for everyone, but it's for me and that's all I care about.

So getting into the main reason for this post, I'm back to thinking that this show is all told from a single point in time. I think the entire William/Logan storyline is a vivid memory much like Maeve remembering/reliving her homesteader life.
DannyDuberstein
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Don't get me wrong - I don't necessarily dislike it. There are portions I really like. I really like Ford's character and the MiB and his journey are still interesting to me. It's just that there's also part of it that feels like a bad magic act combined with some androids I just don't really give much of a **** about.
TCTTS
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Exactly. I don't think anyone here outright dislikes it. I tried to be clear in my love for what the show is.
Complete Idiot
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I kind of get the one tech, he's tempted by the chance to play with the technology - he was already risking his job playing with the bird so they at least built minimal background to show how he might behave.

The other tech is very adamant it's all a bad idea, which is what our reaction would be so believable, but it makes no sense he wouldn't have escalated this to superiors by now. Still, to progress the host's story I think you have to have helping humans involved. It may have been better to use some group of "resistance" humans/employees who helped the hosts based on the belief they were a form of life and doing it on moral grounds.

To help make it more believable to me I could just choose to believe the original hosts have been trying this with techs since day one, but it took this many years to find the techs with the right combination of stupidity and smarts. ie highly unlikely and unbelievable to occur, but an infinite monkey theorem thing.
3rd and 2
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Benard is going to end up killing Ford and taking over the park. Book it.
ce1994
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It is dangerous for writers to make this into a scavenger hunt. HBO has dropped quite a bit of money into this project.
mhayden
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I can see why people don't think it's all that intriguing and/or it's getting slow or too muddled.

But I certainly wouldn't use "cringeworthy" in regards to it.
ce1994
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It is just hard to follow. Anthony Hopkins can make the same amount of money saying three-four lines so they are not going to build a bunch of dialogue around him. They are using what they have to work with. Those techs come cheap so give them a bunch of dialogue. It cheapens the show but for Hopkins to hang around working his ass off would take more money.

All of these story lines are related to Ford. Ford is doing something to make all this happen. Whatever that is is what I am trying to figure out. He is looking for something.
94brett
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Watch the show Banshee. You'll see plenty.
spanky
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Complete Idiot said:

The other tech is very adamant it's all a bad idea, which is what our reaction would be so believable, but it makes no sense he wouldn't have escalated this to superiors by now. Still, to progress the host's story I think you have to have helping humans involved. It may have been better to use some group of "resistance" humans/employees who helped the hosts based on the belief they were a form of life and doing it on moral grounds.
The other tech is running a pay for sex thing for other workers with the bots. No way will he go to management and put himself under the microscope.
TCTTS
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The "mean" tech guy is straight up cringeworthy. It's a ridiculous performance, one that I've seen countless people question. I literally cringe every time he's on screen. He's like a caricature of some '80s movie nerd villain, and his seething, unfounded hatred of his Asian colleague is just really weird and off-putting. It also makes absolutely no sense how he and his colleague are doing all this totally under the radar. Especially, as someone pointed out, since we know they're continually monitored. Never mind the glass room they're operating in with people constantly walking by. And I get the theory that Arnold is somehow fudging things here and there to allow this to happen, and I can absolutely buy that, but even if so, the way the writers are handling it is just so clumsy.
bangobango
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TCTTS said:

The "mean" tech guy is straight up cringeworthy. It's a ridiculous performance, one that I've seen countless people question. I literally cringe every time he's on screen. He's like a caricature of some '80s movie nerd villain, and his seething, unfounded hatred of his Asian colleague is just really weird and off-putting. It also makes absolutely no sense how he and his colleague are doing all this totally under the radar. Especially, as someone pointed out, since we know they're continually monitored. Never mind the glass room they're operating in with people constantly walking by. And I get the theory that Arnold is somehow fudging things here and there to allow this to happen, and I can absolutely buy that, but even if so, the way the writers are handling it is just so clumsy.
I don't see him as hating that guy. I see just the opposite, actually, that he really likes the guy, but he's just kind of an overall a-hole.
IronRed13
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He obviously sucked as a tech. Works at Domino's now

 
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