Kind of weird article. I absolutely think missing the WC helped usher out the old guard of players and coaches and bring in younger players and a new coach (even if his hiring wasn't quite the "reset" it could have been). That said, Sarachan wasn't some sort of visionary who should get credit for the talent we currently have in the system. Really a scarecrow with a soccer ball for a head could have identified and called in some of these young guys to USMNT camps. He's not a dunce, but he's not some talent scouting savant either.
***Official USMNT-WCQ Octagonal Thread***
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Last: 2 yr ago by cruzdoggie
Honest question: can clubs offload a player who's under contract against their will? I always thought transfers only happened if the player agreed to terms with the new club.jeffk said:oh no said:
that sucks. was Mallorca his choice or did Schalke send him there?
It was a sale, but I'm not sure if Hoppe had a say or not. Nothing I've read mentions his feelings about the move.
I'd imagine there was a relegation clause in Hoppe's contract with Schalke so he was probably going to take a big pay cut if he would've otherwise preferred to stay with them. So I bet his hands were kinda tied… stay and lose salary or go to whoever will take you and pay you closer to what you want. Sucks that it's not working out.
but also, who wouldn't want to live in Mallorca with all the beaches and beautiful women? He was probably excited- top tier league and an amazing destination- he might not have thought very hard about the language barrier.deadbq03 said:Honest question: can clubs offload a player who's under contract against their will? I always thought transfers only happened if the player agreed to terms with the new club.jeffk said:oh no said:
that sucks. was Mallorca his choice or did Schalke send him there?
It was a sale, but I'm not sure if Hoppe had a say or not. Nothing I've read mentions his feelings about the move.
I'd imagine there was a relegation clause in Hoppe's contract with Schalke so he was probably going to take a big pay cut if he would've otherwise preferred to stay with them. So I bet his hands were kinda tied… stay and lose salary or go to whoever will take you and pay you closer to what you want. Sucks that it's not working out.
Hoppe is a great player with a great future ahead of him if he continues his development. I hope he either busts his ass to learn the language and not be an outsider on the team --- or he gets sold to a club where the language won't be an issue. I wonder if a dutch or another german or if he can swing it- an english club might be better for him.
Interesting nugget I heard on SBI Soccer podcast that club teams share their data with national teams. That's an input into the roster selection even if a player isn't getting lots of game time. Musah is an example that isn't getting game time but based on his training data, he's good to go from a physical perspective.
"And liberals, being liberals, will double down on failure." - dedgod
Very good point. At the risk of judging a book by its cover, he seems like the kind of guy who'd be vulnerable to the trap of having too much fun.
Hope he settles in soon.
Hope he settles in soon.
I wouldn't suggest he's not focused or he's having too much fun. I'm just suggesting that, at the time of the sale, the idea of Mallorca was really exciting and beautiful, making considerations such as the language barrier not seem as important at the time. He's really young, hadn't even been in Germany that long, and already sold to an island off the coast of Spain. Probably seemed exciting for a minute then got really tough.
Definitely agree that it removed any pressure, whoever the head coach would be, to keep any incumbents around. I just feel like most of those players would have forced their way into the lineups, and I think 4-5 players would have made the 2018 WC roster (had we qualified)Dre_00 said:
There are parts of the argument in the article that perhaps overstated but I do think that missing the WC made it easier to make changes and to do it more quickly.
Arena wasn't going to makewhole sale changes to the roster and to the pool during 2018 qualification. That's understandable. I think it's probable he wouldn't have done at the WC either. And even after the WC, teams don't usually just scrap their roster and refill the pool with a bunch of youth. Altidore just turned 32. I think it's highly probable that he would have a much larger role in this team today if the US had made the 2018 WC. Unless there was just a massive flameout in Russia, I think you could say the exact same thing about players like Darlington Nagbe, Omar Gonzalez, Bobby Wood, Matt Besler...all of them started against T&T in 2018 and none of which are old by soccer standards.
Because at the end of the day, national team managers who experience a modicum of success with a certain team and a certain formation are unlikely to scrap all of that overnight when they have like 2 games a year that they are judged on...unless they are given the room to do so. Missing the WC made it much easier to give managers the room to do so.
Now, is Sarachan special in how he handled the roster change or did he just execute what any manager would've done in a similar circumstance? I don't know but whether it was his ability or his luck of being in the right place at the right time, I do think he played a role in accelerating the process.
That's a good point. I had forgotten that his loan was ending at the end of the MLS season and not the end of the European season. I would rather have him spend more time in Germany as well.
Oh Canada
https://twitter.com/JacobPacheco6/status/1460554213440819203?t=uJ4LEUFMiuxyfKlttm5tAg&s=19
My sure why my Twitter posts don't embed anymore?!?!
https://twitter.com/JacobPacheco6/status/1460554213440819203?t=uJ4LEUFMiuxyfKlttm5tAg&s=19
My sure why my Twitter posts don't embed anymore?!?!
I's dumb. Never mind.
Just need to remove the ? and everything after it for embedding to work.
GOOD MORNING, CANADA! ❄🥶
— Jacob Pacheco (@JacobPacheco6) November 16, 2021
This is the scene just a FEW HOURS ago at Commonwealth Stadium in Edmonton, Alberta!
Canada 🇨🇦 plays Mexico 🇲🇽 here at 9pm ET!
It'll continue snowing till about 11am local time.
Kick-off will feel like -17°C!
Canadian Winters🧊❄ #CANMNT #WCQ pic.twitter.com/P9O8dJ915c
"And liberals, being liberals, will double down on failure." - dedgod
Thank you!
ICETECA
ICETECA
Looks like it' should be the Packers vs Cowboys instead of LLL Tri vs Canucks.
"And liberals, being liberals, will double down on failure." - dedgod
those damn hosers are going to end up being the top qualifying team in concacaf.
To be honest, the game shouldn't be played in this condition and Snow Classico shouldn't have happened either.
Hell even Helsinki is warmer than the tundra that's Edmonton for today's WCQ match.
Hell even Helsinki is warmer than the tundra that's Edmonton for today's WCQ match.
"And liberals, being liberals, will double down on failure." - dedgod
I get you. I'm the one jumping to conclusions and suggesting it!oh no said:
I wouldn't suggest he's not focused or he's having too much fun. I'm just suggesting that, at the time of the sale, the idea of Mallorca was really exciting and beautiful, making considerations such as the language barrier not seem as important at the time. He's really young, hadn't even been in Germany that long, and already sold to an island off the coast of Spain. Probably seemed exciting for a minute then got really tough.
As much as it's an unsubstantiated leap, I do think it's plausible that the reason he might not be settling in is because the nightlife is too good and folks are used to speaking (British) English to tourists, so he can get by without learning the language.
I cant think of a better day than a USA win over Jamaica and then watch Ochoa freeze his chiclets off
Maybe, but they have roach matches vs Panama, Honduras, El Salvador and Costa Rica left.oh no said:
those damn hosers are going to end up being the top qualifying team in concacaf.
"And liberals, being liberals, will double down on failure." - dedgod
-17C is approximately 1 degrees Fahrenheit. ...over 30 degrees below freezing. They're going to have some hypothermia cases in the stands.
Live look at the subs on the bench:
Live look at the subs on the bench:
What this picture doesn't show is how windy it is. Game time forecast is - 7 C, wind chill of -14 C. (That's 7 American degrees.) Wind gusts from the north of more than 30 km/h. More than 50,000 fans expected. This game will definitely have a name.
— Chris Jones (@EnswellJones) November 16, 2021
The question for me, then, is why ESPN put USA-Mexico on ESPN2, and why they’d disrespect the USMNT so much that virtually no pregame appeared on ESPN2. That’s a disgrace, far more so than anything Memo Ochoa said. https://t.co/WDNzQydI9E
— Grant Wahl (@GrantWahl) November 16, 2021
Grant has become such a beating. I don't disagree with him, I think these networks are screwing up by not committing to putting these games out on channels that EVERYONE gets.
It's just interesting that he works for CBS Sports, and the game tonight is on Paramount +...but he is complaining about ESPN putting the game on ESPN 2.
Yeah, I don't know that you need decades of experience or some keen intuition to see young American players on the rosters of Schalke, PSG, etc. and think that they deserve a shot.jeffk said:
That said, Sarachan wasn't some sort of visionary who should get credit for the talent we currently have in the system. Really a scarecrow with a soccer ball for a head could have identified and called in some of these young guys to USMNT camps. He's not a dunce, but he's not some talent scouting savant either.
Maybe because Disney/ABC/ESPN has the home matches and has the opportunity to promote and showcase the US national team of the world's biggest sport, and they don't. ... meanwhile, the concacaf away matches are not controlled by American media?PatAg said:The question for me, then, is why ESPN put USA-Mexico on ESPN2, and why they’d disrespect the USMNT so much that virtually no pregame appeared on ESPN2. That’s a disgrace, far more so than anything Memo Ochoa said. https://t.co/WDNzQydI9E
— Grant Wahl (@GrantWahl) November 16, 2021
Grant has become such a beating. I don't disagree with him, I think these networks are screwing up by not committing to putting these games out on channels that EVERYONE gets.
It's just interesting that he works for CBS Sports, and the game tonight is on Paramount +...but he is complaining about ESPN putting the game on ESPN 2.
akm91 said:
To be honest, the game shouldn't be played in this condition and Snow Classico shouldn't have happened either.
Hell even Helsinki is warmer than the tundra that's Edmonton for today's WCQ match.
Meh. Home field. It's not like the Caribbean and CA teams teams don't let the grass grow to 2 inches thick and soak the field to make mud pits in the goal areas.
And it's not like Mexico doesn't have a built in home advantage playing at altitude in the smog where it's hard to breath and the piss missiles fly farther because of lower air density.
I've been to Edmonton once and it was -12 F and windy...****ing coldest I've ever been
You might be confused (or maybe I am).oh no said:Maybe because Disney/ABC/ESPN has the home matches and has the opportunity to promote and showcase the US national team of the world's biggest sport, and they don't. ... meanwhile, the concacaf away matches are not controlled by American media?PatAg said:The question for me, then, is why ESPN put USA-Mexico on ESPN2, and why they’d disrespect the USMNT so much that virtually no pregame appeared on ESPN2. That’s a disgrace, far more so than anything Memo Ochoa said. https://t.co/WDNzQydI9E
— Grant Wahl (@GrantWahl) November 16, 2021
Grant has become such a beating. I don't disagree with him, I think these networks are screwing up by not committing to putting these games out on channels that EVERYONE gets.
It's just interesting that he works for CBS Sports, and the game tonight is on Paramount +...but he is complaining about ESPN putting the game on ESPN 2.
Paramount Plus has the rights to air the away matches right now, that's how we are watching it.
edit to bold what I said
fans arriving at the game be like
I was seriously angry that Espn decided to run the USF Cincy football match all the way to game time.
The biggest game very cycle and there was exactly zero lead in. They can do three hours worth of CFB every Saturday morning, a half hour lead in for a regular season NBA game etc, but can't even do five minutes for this.
It was disgraceful.
The biggest game very cycle and there was exactly zero lead in. They can do three hours worth of CFB every Saturday morning, a half hour lead in for a regular season NBA game etc, but can't even do five minutes for this.
It was disgraceful.
I guess because I have not cut the chord and still have a Comcast/Xfinity sub that includes NBC and CBS, I automatically get access to Peacock and Paramount+, so I've not had an issue with English Premier League, Champions League, and all of these Concacaf matches.
I do not pay extra for ESPN+, and I do get angry when I see a hotdog eating contest, a cornhole tournament, bass fishing, or a spelling bee on one of the 5 or so ESPN channels I pay for, yet can't watch any of the Spanish, German, or Italian soccer. The biggest most popular sport in the world and they won't promote it or help grow it in the USA - they want the extra revenue so soccer fans need to pay even more for all of that content.
..back to the post about Grant Wahl, CBS guy who is complaining about ESPN broadcast of home matches while his own company has all the concacaf matches "behind a paywall", I guess I was under the impression that all these away matches, and all of the matches in the octagonal that do not involve USA, were being broadcast in local countries by some local network, and CBS/Paramount had made some subcontract deals to use their streams in the US. CBS might not be alllowed to put any of those nonUSMNT matches or USMNT away matches on their big CBS network or CBS sports. ???? i could be way off here.
I do not pay extra for ESPN+, and I do get angry when I see a hotdog eating contest, a cornhole tournament, bass fishing, or a spelling bee on one of the 5 or so ESPN channels I pay for, yet can't watch any of the Spanish, German, or Italian soccer. The biggest most popular sport in the world and they won't promote it or help grow it in the USA - they want the extra revenue so soccer fans need to pay even more for all of that content.
..back to the post about Grant Wahl, CBS guy who is complaining about ESPN broadcast of home matches while his own company has all the concacaf matches "behind a paywall", I guess I was under the impression that all these away matches, and all of the matches in the octagonal that do not involve USA, were being broadcast in local countries by some local network, and CBS/Paramount had made some subcontract deals to use their streams in the US. CBS might not be alllowed to put any of those nonUSMNT matches or USMNT away matches on their big CBS network or CBS sports. ???? i could be way off here.
There was a ticker saying pregame was on ESPN +.oragator said:
I was seriously angry that Espn decided to run the USF Cincy football match all the way to game time.
The biggest game very cycle and there was exactly zero lead in. They can do three hours worth of CFB every Saturday morning, a half hour lead in for a regular season NBA game etc, but can't even do five minutes for this.
It was disgraceful.
Ojo, la superficie de juego está tapada por una lona. No todo lo blanco es nieve. pic.twitter.com/SNxdAq0I3Q
— ANDRES CANTOR (@AndresCantorGOL) November 16, 2021
El Tri is now El Ski. Suck it chumps.
oh no said:Ojo, la superficie de juego está tapada por una lona. No todo lo blanco es nieve. pic.twitter.com/SNxdAq0I3Q
— ANDRES CANTOR (@AndresCantorGOL) November 16, 2021
If this works for Canada, we should schedule thd next home game against Mexico in Alaska.
I feel like if you cut the cord you need to be prepared to spend a bit extra to get what you want, especially if you're already getting the two primary soccer platforms for free.
ESPN+ is like 5 bucks a month for almost every match in MLS, La Liga, and Bundesliga along with tons of international games. That's a steal.
ESPN+ is like 5 bucks a month for almost every match in MLS, La Liga, and Bundesliga along with tons of international games. That's a steal.
They set the USF Cincy game in a three hour window - show me the last college football game that finished in under three hours without one of the service academies being involved?
.And the fact that they threw it behind a paywall to boot is even more insulting.
.And the fact that they threw it behind a paywall to boot is even more insulting.
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