Oh I completely agree with you regarding non-readers, I'm saying that all of us, with knowledge of book 5 events, should realize it's most likely ramsay toying with theon.

For the nonreaders it'll be an awesome (and probably gruesome) reveal

I think it is going to be hilarious when some reader goes to the Non Spoiler thread dropping heavy hints on what is going to happen because of the books and then the show does something different. You know it's coming because the show writers already clearly are toying with readers. This week they had the "Mereneese Knot" line. Before they had Talisa get right next to the Crag and say she doesn't want to go in with no explanation and it turned out to be nothing.

The show is becoming its own story adapted from the book. At first that angered me but now I am just enjoying it as a variation on the larger tale. It kind of cracks me up reading the Westeros reviews of the episodes when they get their panties in such a wad on every minor change. It's going to happen. Go with it and enjoy it, the books simply cannot be retold as they are written. I don't like them all but only when it hurts the story (for instance that Drogo scene at the HOTU was just an obvious push to get the beefcake actor back in the show and came at the expense of any of the prophecies being told, especially the "Child of 3".

Still, there have been benefits. The added LF and Varys scenes which couldn't happen in the book because neither is a POV. The Arya and Tywin scenes. This year with the Theon storyline.

Just enjoy the show and don't drop hints to the Non Readers. I really hope that folks can not drop anything on the RW to come, that's easily the most shocked and emotional I have ever gotten reading a book.

For me, I would rank Ned's death and Jamie losing his hand as bigger shocks than the Red Wedding. That just had a build up coming to it for a long time.

I think Arya's "death" at the RW was what shocked me the most. Probably because I was already at an emotional low from reading the RW, and that just sunk me even deeper.

I really hope that they follow the book in that regard (and save the "arya's actually alive" reveal for episode 10). It'd be a perfect ending for the episode too - just have arya be the focus of the scene, have her turn to face the hound, he swings his axe, and the screen goes dark.

Mass pandemonium will ensue.

Speaking of sad deaths, the next episode is called ”and now his watch is ended”. I hope they nail the emotion of the old bear dying. That was one of the most impactful for me in the books, he was so likeable, and the actor is great

Kampfers, that is exactly how I hope they do it too

What's the significance of the Mereense Knot? I read the books but it's been awhile and I don't remember.

I believe it is in reference to the plot knot GRRM wrote himself into with Danny's storyline in Mereen. Essentially what delayed the completion of ADWD.

I thought it was a clever line by the show writers.

Speaking of spoilers - we were having a GoT discussion at lunch today and I am the only one at the table who has read the books. And this jack a from my company started asking everyone at the table "You know what happens to Robb, right?"

I was furious with him for giving that big a hint away to people who have no idea, but I tried to downplay it. Afterwards he bragged to me that he hasn't seen or read them, but read the series synopsis on Wikipedia.

What a jackwagon.

he bragged about reading a wikipedia synopsis? Lol wow

Haha, I know. This guy has a reputation for being pretty weird. But I just don't get the enjoyment of spoiling something for the fun of it - especially when he had to go out of his way to wikipedia to do so!

Yo Elliot P. Campbell, we were called out as spoilers on the other thread. Not sure what you wrote though.

Bunch of freaking jack-holes over there.

Makes me want to go over there and start making up crap so they think it's spoilers

On a different topic, I was just thinking today about all the religion stuff in the books. So far (as well as I can remember) Martin has only shown the red god to allow any "powers" to the followers. Unless you count Bran and Jojen's seeing as powers granted from the old gods. The warlocks in Qarth exhibited some sort of magic, but haven't been tied to any religion.

No followers of the seven gods of westeros have shown any type of power, correct? Do yall think that is meaningful?

Do the maesters follow the seven?

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Do the maesters follow the seven?

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Generally, yes, but it's the Septons that are holy.

Bran can see everything through trees, I feel like that is a clear sign of power from the old gods, especially after the interaction with the children.

I can't remember if Damphair only drinks salt water, but that could be a sign of the drowned god power.

The many faced god allows people to completely change their face, etc.

I can't remember the seven showing any powers.

Next week's episode looks like it will be loaded. Taking all the slaves, battle at craster's, hound v. thoros.

Majority of the maesters don't believe in any magic or supernatural stuff anyway. I think the only one that has been the exception is the one that left Oldtown to go find Dany (and Qyburn if you count him).

While magic is generally looked down upon, they do have a chain link (valyrian steel) devoted to its study. It's at the very least acceptable enough to be institutionalized.

right, but Luwin told Bran it was a big fat waste of time and only a small percent of them even get that link

The depth and complexity of all the religions is fascinating when you think of all the time and effort Martin has put into it.

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hound v. thoros

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Thought that the Hound fought against Beric Dondarrion

Yep. Is beric not going to be in the show. I loved that storyline and all od the riverlands stuff. The old lady, etc.

[This message has been edited by Greeze06 (edited 4/15/2013 8:25p).]

he was in season 1 (Ned sends him to bring the Mountain to justice for raiding in the riverlands)and pretty sure they showed a glimpse of him on the preview for next week's episode

Beric Dondarrion will be in the upcoming episode.

looking forward to Beric - saw the fire sword!

Yes Beric will be on the show but played by a different character.

Ah, I thought it looked like he was fighting Thoros in the preview, I just assumed they had changed it to consolidate characters.

At what point of the books, will this season end? Do you think the red wedding will be the season finale?

No it will be episode 9. They can't end on that note, they have to end with something compelling.

My guess is that the move the SoS epilogue up to the end of episode 10 and show Lady Stoneheart killing the s*** out of some Freys.

I doubt they move up Lady Stoneheart, though anything is possible. I've seen it suggested they do an added scene with Beric giving her a kiss and dying and then Cat's eyes opening as a final scene. The battle at Castle Black is possible for sure. I don't know how far they will take Dany's storyline. It seems certain the Bear Pit will be this season but it is hard to tell how far the other storylines go. The Red Viper has not been cast and it seems unlikely they have the Purple Wedding right after the RW and that ties up quite a few characters storylines, essentially everyone in Kings Landing.

Definitely no Purple Wedding, have to bring the Dornish and their animosity for the Tyrells before that happens

Beric is supposed to be played by Richard Dormer.

IMDB claims he is in episodes 3 to 10.

Maybe show spoilers but here's the wiki entry for the episodes...the last two haven't been released but the last episode is titled Mhysa (Mother) so obviously Dany freeing the Yunkai slaves. The titles usually have double meanings though so I could see Stoneheart as well happening.

24 "And Now His Watch is Ended"[85] April 21, 2013
The Night’s Watch takes stock; Varys meets his better; Arya is taken to the commander of the Brotherhood; Daenerys makes an exchange.

25 "Kissed by Fire"[86] April 28, 2013
The Hound is judged by the gods; Jaime is judged; Jon proves himself; Robb is betrayed; Tyrion learns the cost of weddings.

26 "The Climb" May 5, 2013
Tywin plans strategic unions for the Lannisters. Melisandre pays a visit to the Riverlands. Robb weighs a compromise to repair his alliance with House Frey. Roose Bolton decides what to do with Jaime Lannister. Jon, Ygritte and the Wildlings face a daunting climb.

27 "The Bear and the Maiden Fair"[88] (formerly "Autumn Storms" and "Chains") May 12, 2013
Dany exchanges gifts with a slave lord outside of Yunkai. As Sansa frets about her prospects, Shae chafes at Tyrion's new situation. Tywin counsels the king, and Melisandre reveals a secret to Gendry. Brienne faces a formidable foe in Harrenhal.

28 "Second Sons" May 19, 2013
King's Landing hosts a wedding, and Tyrion and Sansa spend the night together. Dany meets the Titan's *******. Davos demands proof from Melisandre. Sam and Gilly meet an older gentleman.