Astros offseason thread
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Last: 6 yr ago by spadilly
Sometimes you draft Mark Appel over Kris Bryant. Sometimes Brady Aiken's elbow is one big red flag and you punt until the next year and get Alex Bregman. That's baseball. Doesn't seem to stop every pundit from giving draft grades as if any of this stuff can be predicted.
Hmmm...
Quote:
Astros' push to acquire Pirates RHP Gerrit Cole is picking up steam, sources tell MLB.com's Jesse Sanchez. Club have not confirmed.
Archer didn't perform that much better than Cole last year. In fact, Cole posted a 2.8bWAR while Archer posted a 1.2bWAR. I do get that Archer's deal is much more team friendly, but Cole is younger and their careers are honestly pretty similar. Both had really good years in 2015 and both have had okay years since.iBrad said:
I wouldn't trade Whitley for anyone right now. Tucker, perhaps, but not for two years of Cole, especially the 2017 version. Two years of Cole also doesn't really offset losing Keuchel, Morton, and Verlander. Archer makes the most sense from a trade standpoint.
I'd be fine giving up Tucker or Whitley (not both) along with some other guys to get Gerrit Cole. To have that kind of guy as your 3rd/4th starter is just ridiculous.
And do not forget all the talking heads who were berating the Astros for making Bregman an untouchable so that it prevented us from getting Sale.
From MLBTR
Quote:
It remains unclear just what kind of trade package would suffice to pry Cole free from the Bucs, who originally selected him with the first overall pick of the 2011 draft. Yahoo Sports' Jeff Passan has suggested (Twitter link) that Pittsburgh is holding out for a headliner such as Kyle Tucker or Forrest Whitley, while the 'Stros are understandably hoping to hold on to their two top-rated prospects. The sides are also said to have discussed young outfielder Derek Fisher.
Also of note is the fact that, per Sanchez, Cole "was Houston's top target last summer" when the organization was searching to bolster its rotation. It seems the prior interests has carried into the offseason. Of course, other organizations may also still be involved. At one point, the Yankees were said to be gaining momentum toward a deal for Cole, though that chatter evidently cooled down. Other organizations surely also have interest in the righty.
The talking heads and a lot of fans on here knew we needed pitching to win a WS. If it took Bregman to get it then so be it. It just happen to workout we didn't have to give up nearly as much and still landed more pitching. However, Verlander is a shorter term (well worth it) option. Cole & Archer would be a little longer term options even with Cole only under contract 2 more years.rosco511 said:
And do not forget all the talking heads who were berating the Astros for making Bregman an untouchable so that it prevented us from getting Sale.
WAR isn't everything, and the bbref WAR seems off. Fangraphs had Archer at 4.6 to Cole's 3.1. Archer also had a better xFIP and strikes out more guys than Cole. And he does it in the AL with the DH, and in the AL East against some potent offenses. And yeah, four years of control versus two is pretty big, too, especially with Keuchel and Morton hitting free agency next year and Verlander the year after that.
That should also make Cole cheaper, but with the Yankees also pursuing him, it's probably pushing up the price. I still wouldn't deal Whitley, though. He has too much upside, assuming there are no underlying medical issues that the Astros' doctors have uncovered.
That should also make Cole cheaper, but with the Yankees also pursuing him, it's probably pushing up the price. I still wouldn't deal Whitley, though. He has too much upside, assuming there are no underlying medical issues that the Astros' doctors have uncovered.
Cole isn't any more of a long term option than Verlander is. While the cost is significantly different they both have 2 more years left on their contracts.
Now maybe they think they can extend Cole and have him long term, but as it stands now neither are really a long term solution.
Now maybe they think they can extend Cole and have him long term, but as it stands now neither are really a long term solution.
ZERO chance we trade Whitley here. I would doubt we trade Tucker.
I would do Fisher, Martes, and someone else though.
I would do Fisher, Martes, and someone else though.
Quote:
Whitley is likely to be considered "untouchable" by the 'Stros, per Bill Brink of the Pittsburgh Post-Gazette (via Twitter), though it seems the two young outfielders could still be in play in discussions.
I think this lines up with Cole not being a long term answer. I don't see us dealing Whitley for 2 years of Cole.
Then in 2 years you left without Dallas, JV, Morton, Cole, and Whitley.
At that time pray to God Lance can stay healthy and pair Whitley with LMJ and build off those two for the foreseeable future. Extend Cole if he works out and there's your 1/2/3
Seems like we'd also include a pitcher from the big league roster, like McHugh or Musgrove.
I just dont really understand the Cole move honestly. My guess is it fizzles out because we wont give anything close to what they want.
I don't expect Verlander to pitch like he did the 2nd half of last year. He's older and will not be our ace in 2019.Ag_07 said:
Cole isn't any more of a long term option than Verlander is. While the cost is significantly different they both have 2 more years left on their contracts.
Now maybe they think they can extend Cole and have him long term, but as it stands now neither are really a long term solution.
Cole is in his prime and could be ace like if he can get back to his 2015 ways. We'd look to resign him if he played well. I don't think that is in the cards for Verlander, but I guess we will wait and see.
Please no Tucker. Do Martes, Fisher, McHugh.
It's about to go down...
Anxious to hear what we're going to give up for him..
If we know anything about Luhnow is that he's not going to overpay, I'll be curious to see what the package is
Dude is a stud. 27 years old. His similarity scores on baseball reference include: Strasburg, Cueto, Syndergaard, Darvish...
Relax
I trust luhnow
I trust luhnow
I really think that the Astros must see something in Cole in their video scouting. There must be something they think they can absolutely fix or improve.
Especially if we're giving up one of our top two prospects. Interested to see what the trade package looks like. I would guess it includes Tucker and someone from the big league roster (McHugh, Musgrove). Also likely another pitching prospect like J.B. Bukauskas or Cionel or Hector Perez, and maybe a J.D. Davis type.
If this goes through, I wonder if we some more dominos start falling.
Yelich/Realmuto want out of Miami. If we send Tucker in the deal I could see trying to grab Yelich. We also still need a catcher.
Yelich/Realmuto want out of Miami. If we send Tucker in the deal I could see trying to grab Yelich. We also still need a catcher.
Praying it's something built around Fisher, Martes, and some other prospects.
Chubbed up
2017 World Series Champions - Houston Astros
Done deal! Now we wait to see who we sent...
Hope we didn't sell the farm but goodness gracious our starting rotation is going to be filthy.
The guys about to be traded probably don't. From WS champ to Pittsburgh.
Wizard said:
goodness gracious our starting rotation is going to be filthy.
Dallas
JV
LMJ
Cole
Morton
Oh yeah...Plus every major contributor returning on offense and an improved BP
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