quote:1. Burnt in the quarry
My problem with the bones is why were they in three+ places?
2. Moved from quarry to the fire pit to implicate SA
3. Moved from fire pit to trash to make it look like SA was disposing of evidence
Making a Murder - Netflix Original Series
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Last: 1 yr ago by Pluralizes Everythings
2. Moved from quarry to the fire pit to implicate SA
3. Moved from fire pit to trash to make it look like SA was disposing of evidence
Something I haven't seen mentioned are the two recorded phone calls to his girlfriend in prison while he was supposedly murdering/dismembering Theresa. I don't remember how long each call was, but they were fairly lengthy. Avery sounded completely normal as well. If I was in the process of mutilating a corpse, I'd probably say I have to go get dinner started or something.
I think they were both around 15 mins. long
quote:Dude that is sick.
If I was in the process of mutilating a corpse, I'd probably say I have to go get dinner started or something.
Yup.
Edit: what I said next didn't make much sense.
Edit: what I said next didn't make much sense.
Juror was Volunteer for the MSD
The juror who was the father of a member of Sheriff's department was also a volunteer.
The juror who was the father of a member of Sheriff's department was also a volunteer.
Second juror was the husband of the court clerk.
quote:I think proving tampering would be a pretty hard thing to do... unless there was a video of the threats or something... or maybe someone knows someone in the FBI to come up with a test to prove for tampering
If this juror goes public and can prove whatever they are saying, it would have to be retried I would think.
quote:quote:I think proving tampering would be a pretty hard thing to do... unless there was a video of the threats or something... or maybe someone knows someone in the FBI to come up with a test to prove for tampering
If this juror goes public and can prove whatever they are saying, it would have to be retried I would think.
If a couple more jurors come forward and corroborate, it may be enough.
As far as the change of venue, Avery's lawyer said the other night that due to the extensive news coverage of Kratz's dramatic "please don't listen if you're younger than 15" press conference, the entire state of Wisconsin was already exposed to Brendan's gruesome "confession". He said looking back he can't say he'd have done it differently - the media coverage was extremely prejudicial across the entire state.
They had it moved one county over, but it sounds as if it wasn't far enough away to avoid family connections to Manitowec sheriff's relatives.
They had it moved one county over, but it sounds as if it wasn't far enough away to avoid family connections to Manitowec sheriff's relatives.
quote:Jury pool was from Manitowec. Court and judge were a county over.
They had it moved one county over, but it sounds as if it wasn't far enough away to avoid family connections to Manitowec sheriff's relatives.
And a press conference like that shouldn't have been allowed. They effectively got Brendan's testimony into evidence without having to let him be cross examined.
Oh crap. That's right about the jury.
It doesn't matter if he did it or not. The point is that the SO, DA, and Court played dirty pool. If it can happen to SA, it can happen to you.
I haven't read brought his thread but this happens all over he country, dirty cops and dirty DA's. The cops in College Station were notorious for lying under oath and planting evidence while I was in college. They were as dirty as I have ever seen. I'm sure someone will come along and tell me just a few bad apples won't ruin the bunch and CS is full of cops with high integrity.
quote:
http://www.thefrisky.com/2016-01-06/the-most-garbage-people-in-making-a-murderer-ranked-in-order-of-their-loathsomeness/
I would bump Kachinsky to the top.
If the cops went all in on framing Avery, which I believe is hard not to see, why wouldn't they place some on the victim's blood in Avery's trailer/garage to back up their story? Not enough blood to transfer from the car to the trailer/garage? If so, why wouldn't they focus on thr setting of her blood as being the murder scence (especially if Avery's DNA was found under the hood)?
Where would they get her blood? They had Avery's blood in a locker.
I seem to remember there was her blood in the back of the RAV4. So why wasnt this the DA's main focus since it was actual solid evidence? Although it also leads me to believe that Avery's DNA under the hood was planted much like his blood from the vial (there needed to be some connection).
I think dried week-old blood is a lot tougher to plant than fresh blood in a syringe.
http://www.dallasobserver.com/news/shot-in-the-dark-6406021
Watching this made me think of my friend's dad. I grew up in this small town. Read the above story - it'll take 30 minutes or so.
TLDR - man accused of murdering cop in small town. Forensic evidence proves the cops brother (also a cop riding with the deceased cop at the time) killed the brother, i.e., 2 cops in car, 1 cop kills the other.
Found innocent.
Flash forward a bit, accused found in violation of parole, judge uses obscure law to apply punishment from the crime he was found innocent of in court, saying "Crime 2 wouldn't have happened without crime 1, therefore I can punish you under crime 1 sentencing guidelines".
Oh yeah - the cop who shot his brother then moved in with the dead brothers wife.
This was in North Texas near Sherman for those in the area.
Watching this made me think of my friend's dad. I grew up in this small town. Read the above story - it'll take 30 minutes or so.
TLDR - man accused of murdering cop in small town. Forensic evidence proves the cops brother (also a cop riding with the deceased cop at the time) killed the brother, i.e., 2 cops in car, 1 cop kills the other.
Found innocent.
Flash forward a bit, accused found in violation of parole, judge uses obscure law to apply punishment from the crime he was found innocent of in court, saying "Crime 2 wouldn't have happened without crime 1, therefore I can punish you under crime 1 sentencing guidelines".
Oh yeah - the cop who shot his brother then moved in with the dead brothers wife.
This was in North Texas near Sherman for those in the area.
quote:
If the cops went all in on framing Avery, which I believe is hard not to see, why wouldn't they place some on the victim's blood in Avery's trailer/garage to back up their story? Not enough blood to transfer from the car to the trailer/garage? If so, why wouldn't they focus on thr setting of her blood as being the murder scence (especially if Avery's DNA was found under the hood)?
Theresa was burnt so there wasn't any blood available, which is why the only place you saw Theresa's blood was the only place she was at, her vehicle.
I sat as a juror for a month on a murder trial. This particular murder was the killing of a young woman who witnessed and was going to testify in another muder trial. So to explain why she was killed the other case had to be explained/argued. It was fairly complicated as it involved several gangs. I can tell you without hesitating I would have had reasonable doubt in this case. Not that he was innocent per se, but that the investigators had screwed up so much as to doubt the validity of their entire case.
I would have hung the jury to at least get it retried. Then moved the hell out of that POS county.
I would have hung the jury to at least get it retried. Then moved the hell out of that POS county.
Talking about it with a friend last night and I couldn't remember if Gene Kusche had any real roll in the 2005 investigation. I remember him being fairly high up in the Sheriff's department, but don't remember them talking about any direct involvement that he had. Am I recalling that right?
This *******:
This *******:
Bad 8th Grade Art.
The guy should go back to meet reading.
The guy should go back to meet reading.
I think he he retired by then
Two things that I saw that lead me to believe both are innocent:
1) Colburn's tape where he reads the plate to the dispatch and confirms the make/model of the car made it completely clear to me that he found the car days before it was found on the lot. Both the recording and his reaction to the recording on the stand. 100% clear to me he was lying up there.
2) Complete lack of blood in the house or garage. There is zero chance even a forensics expert could get every drop of blood cleaned up from a multiple gun shot / stab wound victim in those two places are cluttered and messy as they were, nevertheless a kid who doesn't know the difference between a foot and a yard. Our dogs were playing rough one day and one got a small cut on their tongue. By the time we caught him and stop them from running around, blood was spattered EVERYWHERE. It took us forever to clean up and we found small spots of blood for weeks afterwards. That was from one small cut.
If the car wasn't on the lot and she wasn't killed on the lot, there is no case at all, much less a conviction beyond a reasonable doubt.
1) Colburn's tape where he reads the plate to the dispatch and confirms the make/model of the car made it completely clear to me that he found the car days before it was found on the lot. Both the recording and his reaction to the recording on the stand. 100% clear to me he was lying up there.
2) Complete lack of blood in the house or garage. There is zero chance even a forensics expert could get every drop of blood cleaned up from a multiple gun shot / stab wound victim in those two places are cluttered and messy as they were, nevertheless a kid who doesn't know the difference between a foot and a yard. Our dogs were playing rough one day and one got a small cut on their tongue. By the time we caught him and stop them from running around, blood was spattered EVERYWHERE. It took us forever to clean up and we found small spots of blood for weeks afterwards. That was from one small cut.
If the car wasn't on the lot and she wasn't killed on the lot, there is no case at all, much less a conviction beyond a reasonable doubt.
How do you explain the bones ending up in his fire pit?
quote:
How do you explain the bones ending up in his fire pit?
If I was the juror on the trial..that would have been the one major hold up to a not guilty verdict.
You can explain everything else, but not that.
Honestly, if I was the defense, I would have accused Bobby and his dad of the murder and that they planted the bones there to strengthen the case against Avery.
quote:
Honestly, if I was the defense, I would have accused Bobby and his dad of the murder and that they planted the bones there to strengthen the case against Avery.
They couldn't. They were forbidden from using any language that accused any other people of committing the crime during the trial.
Re: bones. She was incinerated elsewhere and then moved. Her bones were found in 3 locations and she was 'dug' out of the fire pit with shovels. A proper investigation of the position of the bones wasn't done, which means there was no way to tell if her body was burned in olace, which would lead to a logical arrangement in the pit, or dumped. Even the sifting process eliminated any evidence they had been moved because the marks would be the same. Perfect cover up and sloppy policework. Intentionally sloppy to coverup.
quote:I think Ken Kratz still wins the top spot. That press conference was just abhorrent.quote:
http://www.thefrisky.com/2016-01-06/the-most-garbage-people-in-making-a-murderer-ranked-in-order-of-their-loathsomeness/
I would bump Kachinsky to the top.
Kachinsky deserves a very, very close #2. I would disbar him if I could. He failed miserably at the fundamental purpose of an attorney. He should not be allowed to practice law.
quote:quote:
Honestly, if I was the defense, I would have accused Bobby and his dad of the murder and that they planted the bones there to strengthen the case against Avery.
They couldn't. They were forbidden from using any language that accused any other people of committing the crime during the trial.
Likely due to Wisconsin's controversial anti reasonable doubt law
he didn't throw a body into his own yard and light it on fire and sprinkle some bones in other places on the lot, that's for sure.
Either he did it and burned her in the quarry and someone else moved the bones, or someone else killed her and moved them there.
Either he did it and burned her in the quarry and someone else moved the bones, or someone else killed her and moved them there.
quote:I think it's conceivable that he thought burning her body at the quarry would do more to destroy it than it did. Then, he thought "well maybe if I burn it in a barrel with a bunch of other stuff it'll get way hotter".
he didn't throw a body into his own yard and light it on fire and sprinkle some bones in other places on the lot, that's for sure.
Either he did it and burned her in the quarry and someone else moved the bones, or someone else killed her and moved them there.
It doesn't pass the reasonable doubt test imo but it could have happened.
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