I just think this episode was about her trying to do what her dad would want over and over no matter what took place. Rise above it all. Losing the baby, Aegon being named King, her husband choking her. Otto telling them to follow them and accept Aegon as King. She kept persevering. And then Luke is murdered just being a messenger.
*** GoT: House of the Dragon ***
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Exactly.
And while Daemon put on the tough, war focused facade, there was a moment when they show him grieving alone on the beach (while Rhaenyra is wrapping the baby)
And while Daemon put on the tough, war focused facade, there was a moment when they show him grieving alone on the beach (while Rhaenyra is wrapping the baby)
Nah they already have 2 kids (Aegon and Viserys).Definitely Not A Cop said:M.C. Swag said:So what exactly changed though? Yes, obviously she had stress induced labor (that was what the show made it appear), but how would the episode have played any differently if Rhaenyra was never pregnant at all? or simply lost the child off screen? They never even gave the kid a name. Daemon never even acknowledged it. No one acknowledged it. It didn't change a single course of action for any of the characters.DannyDuberstein said:
Went too far with the birth scene, but it did have plot implications. The stress and shock caused by the Aegon news could be blamed for it. But she still kept a level head (pardon the pun).
It was gratuitous to the point of farcical when considered with the amount of birth scenes in this single season.
I thought they mentioned on the Kings deathbed that it was going to named Viserys. Probably some kind of symbolism in that.
Yes, but we've seen that she's tough, resilient, and steadfast already. I guess we just disagree that showing ANOTHER dead child was the necessary to make that character point (again).LB12Diamond said:
I just think this episode was about her trying to do what her dad would want over and over no matter what took place. Rise above it all. Losing the baby, Aegon being named King, her husband choking her. Otto telling them to follow them and accept Aegon as King. She kept persevering. And then Luke is murdered just being a messenger.
I mean there is:
- Eye Patch kid
- The Doctor
- Blonde Lady
- Not Blonde Lady
- Not Eye Patch kid
M.C. Swag said:Yes, but we've seen that she's tough, resilient, and steadfast already. I guess we just disagree that showing ANOTHER dead child was the necessary to make that character point (again).LB12Diamond said:
I just think this episode was about her trying to do what her dad would want over and over no matter what took place. Rise above it all. Losing the baby, Aegon being named King, her husband choking her. Otto telling them to follow them and accept Aegon as King. She kept persevering. And then Luke is murdered just being a messenger.
Well her mom told her child birth was the woman's war!
And again the miscarriage happened bc she found out of the betrayal. Just adding everything being tied back the Green council.
Now she's about to lead what her mom said was the man's war!
Is there tally on the total minutes we have seen child births vs the total minutes we have seen fighting (UG kid included) thru the whole season? Think we have seen more blood during the births than any of the fights outside of the Step Stones
Someone in the post-show said they were making the point that Rhaenyra was having to do that while the men were plotting strategy, so another angle for why she has resolved to go to war.M.C. Swag said:So what exactly changed though? Yes, obviously she had stress induced labor (that was what the show made it appear), but how would the episode have played any differently if Rhaenyra was never pregnant at all? or simply lost the child off screen? They never even gave the kid a name. Daemon never even acknowledged it. No one acknowledged it. It didn't change a single course of action for any of the characters.DannyDuberstein said:
Went too far with the birth scene, but it did have plot implications. The stress and shock caused by the Aegon news could be blamed for it. But she still kept a level head (pardon the pun).
It was gratuitous to the point of farcical when considered with the amount of birth scenes in this single season.
Got it guys. lol didn't mean to flood the thread with birth scene discussion. Just thought the whole thing was gratuitous and unnecessary. Looking forward to good ol fashioned sword and dragon fights next season!
the scenes suck, and Ive just resolved to skip through them. I get the information that it happened, but I don't gain any appreciation of the show wby watching their version of itM.C. Swag said:
Got it guys. lol didn't mean to flood the thread with birth scene discussion. Just thought the whole thing was gratuitous and unnecessary. Looking forward to good ol fashioned sword and dragon fights next season!
The dragged out discussions about the birthing scenes bother me more than the scenes themselves. We get it, people thought it was gross and unneccessary.
I think they showed Rhaenyra having the birth alone to prove that sometimes you have to do things yourself, instead of letting others do for you. It would have been easy for her to lay back and get drugged up and call the midwife, but she knew what was best for herself in the moment.
It also would have been easy to let Daemon and the Kingsguard plan the war for her and make all those moves, but she's the queen. She's the one who father chose. So she goes to the war chamber - and how bad-ass was the painted table all lit up? - and she's running the war effort.
It also would have been easy to let Daemon and the Kingsguard plan the war for her and make all those moves, but she's the queen. She's the one who father chose. So she goes to the war chamber - and how bad-ass was the painted table all lit up? - and she's running the war effort.
Life is better with a beagle
Matt Smith be like, I gotta bow down to another queen?
Life is better with a beagle
To get to Stroms End don't you have to fly right by King's landing? Winterfell seems like the easier missionBrian Earl Spilner said:
I thought the same, but I figured maybe it's because Storm's End was was the shortest flight from Dragonstone and she figured it would be the quickest and least dangerous flight?
HossAg said:
The dragged out discussions about the birthing scenes bother me more than the scenes themselves. We get it, people thought it was gross and unneccessary.
The worst part about the birthing scenes for me is people complaining about people complaining about it. We get it, people don't like people complaining it about it being gross and unnecessary.
I do think another point of the scene was that every pregnancy complication we have seen has resulted in the woman dying so far. Rhaenyra didn't.
Also glad that we got the Rhaenys explanation of why she didn't torch all the Hightowers when she got the chance.
Do we know if that was actually Aemond's eye, or some kind of special glass he puts in it?
Also glad that we got the Rhaenys explanation of why she didn't torch all the Hightowers when she got the chance.
Do we know if that was actually Aemond's eye, or some kind of special glass he puts in it?
Oh also, WHY TF DID RHAENYRA LET OTTO LEAVE?! lol
I understand not wanting to kill him, but that dude should have been shackled IMMEDIATELY as a political prisoner. If for no other reason than to take the biggest schemer off the board. Lol I was groaning in frustration when Rhaenyra said "Ill think about it" and just flew away. LIKE GIRL, ARREST THAT MAN.
I understand not wanting to kill him, but that dude should have been shackled IMMEDIATELY as a political prisoner. If for no other reason than to take the biggest schemer off the board. Lol I was groaning in frustration when Rhaenyra said "Ill think about it" and just flew away. LIKE GIRL, ARREST THAT MAN.
M.C. Swag said:Nah they already have 2 kids (Aegon and Viserys).Definitely Not A Cop said:M.C. Swag said:So what exactly changed though? Yes, obviously she had stress induced labor (that was what the show made it appear), but how would the episode have played any differently if Rhaenyra was never pregnant at all? or simply lost the child off screen? They never even gave the kid a name. Daemon never even acknowledged it. No one acknowledged it. It didn't change a single course of action for any of the characters.DannyDuberstein said:
Went too far with the birth scene, but it did have plot implications. The stress and shock caused by the Aegon news could be blamed for it. But she still kept a level head (pardon the pun).
It was gratuitous to the point of farcical when considered with the amount of birth scenes in this single season.
I thought they mentioned on the Kings deathbed that it was going to named Viserys. Probably some kind of symbolism in that.
Got ya. Have we seen either of them yet outside of being a newborn baby?
The Greens have a significant head start and the extreme upper-hand if war starts immediately. She knows they need time to circle the wagons. Imprisoning or killing Otto sparks it immediately
She's holding Viserys in this sceneDefinitely Not A Cop said:M.C. Swag said:Nah they already have 2 kids (Aegon and Viserys).Definitely Not A Cop said:M.C. Swag said:So what exactly changed though? Yes, obviously she had stress induced labor (that was what the show made it appear), but how would the episode have played any differently if Rhaenyra was never pregnant at all? or simply lost the child off screen? They never even gave the kid a name. Daemon never even acknowledged it. No one acknowledged it. It didn't change a single course of action for any of the characters.DannyDuberstein said:
Went too far with the birth scene, but it did have plot implications. The stress and shock caused by the Aegon news could be blamed for it. But she still kept a level head (pardon the pun).
It was gratuitous to the point of farcical when considered with the amount of birth scenes in this single season.
I thought they mentioned on the Kings deathbed that it was going to named Viserys. Probably some kind of symbolism in that.
Got ya. Have we seen either of them yet outside of being a newborn baby?
It looked like some kind of gem or something like that, not his eye.Definitely Not A Cop said:
I do think another point of the scene was that every pregnancy complication we have seen has resulted in the woman dying so far. Rhaenyra didn't.
Also glad that we got the Rhaenys explanation of why she didn't torch all the Hightowers when she got the chance.
Do we know if that was actually Aemond's eye, or some kind of special glass he puts in it?
For people that watch previews, I went back and watched it and it clearly shows Vhagar at a castle with storms going on.
Thats gotta ruin it for you a bit once you see Lucerys and his dragon flying into that exact setting, no?
Thats gotta ruin it for you a bit once you see Lucerys and his dragon flying into that exact setting, no?
This is why I never watch them.
Same, I see no point in watching the preview.Brian Earl Spilner said:
This is why I never watch them.
Gonna have to look into acquiring some version of that for home useThe Porkchop Express said:
It also would have been easy to let Daemon and the Kingsguard plan the war for her and make all those moves, but she's the queen. She's the one who father chose. So she goes to the war chamber - and how bad-ass was the painted table all lit up? - and she's running the war effort.
So three women with childbirth problems.
Aemma's choice was made by her husband. He chose the baby, and both died.
Laena didn't give that choice over to her husband. Instead, she chose to end it in front of her dragon.
Rhaenyra didn't want anyone's help. Whether that's because she was thinking about her father's choice vis-a-vis her mother, or because she didn't know if Daemon would try to save the child and risk her life, who knows.
Anyway, the point of that scene to me seemed to be Rhaenyra making her own choices, and ultimately choosing to be Queen. That's been a hang-up for her for a while now. She didn't want her father marrying her off, she didn't want to have children. But men - namely, her father - have been calling the shots, and she's been willing to due her duty. Maybe this was her choosing for herself to survive the childbirth when Laena and Aemma didn't, and to make the choice to due her duty as Queen rather than just leave it to the Daemons of the world.
Aemma's choice was made by her husband. He chose the baby, and both died.
Laena didn't give that choice over to her husband. Instead, she chose to end it in front of her dragon.
Rhaenyra didn't want anyone's help. Whether that's because she was thinking about her father's choice vis-a-vis her mother, or because she didn't know if Daemon would try to save the child and risk her life, who knows.
Anyway, the point of that scene to me seemed to be Rhaenyra making her own choices, and ultimately choosing to be Queen. That's been a hang-up for her for a while now. She didn't want her father marrying her off, she didn't want to have children. But men - namely, her father - have been calling the shots, and she's been willing to due her duty. Maybe this was her choosing for herself to survive the childbirth when Laena and Aemma didn't, and to make the choice to due her duty as Queen rather than just leave it to the Daemons of the world.
I think that explanation is carrying alot of water for the fact that even after the birth sequence Rhaenyra was heavily considering abdicating the throne for the sake of peace. If that sequence was supposed to convey her "choice" to be queen, then why was she still hesitant to fight for that claim?MW03 said:
So three women with childbirth problems.
Aemma's choice was made by her husband. He chose the baby, and both died.
Laena didn't give that choice over to her husband. Instead, she chose to end it in front of her dragon.
Rhaenyra didn't want anyone's help. Whether that's because she was thinking about her father's choice vis-a-vis her mother, or because she didn't know if Daemon would try to save the child and risk her life, who knows.
Anyway, the point of that scene to me seemed to be Rhaenyra making her own choices, and ultimately choosing to be Queen. That's been a hang-up for her for a while now. She didn't want her father marrying her off, she didn't want to have children. But men - namely, her father - have been calling the shots, and she's been willing to due her duty. Maybe this was her choosing for herself to survive the childbirth when Laena and Aemma didn't, and to make the choice to due her duty as Queen rather than just leave it to the Daemons of the world.
Like, her resolve was not hardened or shaped in any meaningful way until she found out Luke was dead (presumably).
And even IF I were to grant you and others the symbolic journey of seeing yet another child birth (#2 by Rhaenyra THIS SEASON) end in death, I still would contest the nature of its depiction being at all necessary to anything that happened in this plot. It was just too long, too visceral, too real for my stomach.
Yeah, when she said "get out", I took that to mean her priority was to get the baby out of her, alive or dead, and get back to the war.
This is the best map out there, because you move it so easily. It has no spoilers for House of the Dragon.option short side said:To get to Stroms End don't you have to fly right by King's landing? Winterfell seems like the easier missionBrian Earl Spilner said:
I thought the same, but I figured maybe it's because Storm's End was was the shortest flight from Dragonstone and she figured it would be the quickest and least dangerous flight?
https://quartermaester.info/
Storm's End is south of King's Landing, but much father east. It's an easy flight there from Dragonstone to Storm's End just hugging the coast without getting anywhere near KL.
To fly to Winterfell, you'd either have to fly over the Eyrie, which is probably freezing at any altitude, or you could fly to Maidenpool and follow the Green Fork of the river up to the King's road and take it straight up to WInterfell. But it's a much, much longer trip.
This map is absolutely outstanding to envision troop movements and battles that were fought in the original books, as well as to see how vital taking Harrenhahl would be for the Blacks.
Life is better with a beagle
Eh, not really. Straight line from Dragonstone to Storms End keeps you pretty far east of King's Landing. Dragonstone to Winterfell is a MUCH further trip.option short side said:To get to Stroms End don't you have to fly right by King's landing? Winterfell seems like the easier missionBrian Earl Spilner said:
I thought the same, but I figured maybe it's because Storm's End was was the shortest flight from Dragonstone and she figured it would be the quickest and least dangerous flight?
Well I think her goal was to serve the realm whether that meant war or keeping the peace. But she wanted to be the one to make the decision.
I just took it as her priority was no longer having another child but taking the throne.
I just took it as her priority was no longer having another child but taking the throne.
just rewatched
I forgot it started with Luke and his mom having a conversation and that she would be there to help him learn how to lead. Nice writing with how everything unfolded.
I forgot it started with Luke and his mom having a conversation and that she would be there to help him learn how to lead. Nice writing with how everything unfolded.
Outside of the child birth sequence that was a great episode last night. It's a shame we've got some waiting to do now for the next season. They've really laid some ground work for next season as well. The entire sequence where Rhaenyra is with her council assessing the situation was telling. They need allies for what's coming, dragons alone won't win this fight, and their involvement will destroy a large part of the realm. Rhaenyra was calm and calculated with the council, even with the meeting with Otto she was restrained, she had every excuse to lose it but she didn't.
Now it's the king's brother whose actions will incite the war. Makes a pretty compelling argument for calling the banners for any of their allies that were on the fence when they consider the actions of the crown. Aemond killed a boy who was only a messenger with the largest dragon in the realm. The visual of Vhagar in the background during the storm was incredible, a real wow kind of moment.
It's been a while since I read the book but when Daemon was talking about the unclaimed dragons nearby I'm curious where they go with that. The dragons do them no good without a rider. I think in the book when they needed to find riders for unclaimed dragons they started looking for Targaryan *******s all over the realm. They offered land and title to any that could successfully claim and ride a dragon in battle. But this also might have been well after this point, closer to the downfall of the family.
For anyone interested someone on Reddit made a dragon size comparison chart.
Now it's the king's brother whose actions will incite the war. Makes a pretty compelling argument for calling the banners for any of their allies that were on the fence when they consider the actions of the crown. Aemond killed a boy who was only a messenger with the largest dragon in the realm. The visual of Vhagar in the background during the storm was incredible, a real wow kind of moment.
It's been a while since I read the book but when Daemon was talking about the unclaimed dragons nearby I'm curious where they go with that. The dragons do them no good without a rider. I think in the book when they needed to find riders for unclaimed dragons they started looking for Targaryan *******s all over the realm. They offered land and title to any that could successfully claim and ride a dragon in battle. But this also might have been well after this point, closer to the downfall of the family.
For anyone interested someone on Reddit made a dragon size comparison chart.
again, the Hand was plotting a palace coup for months, all the big wigs were organizing it:redline248 said:
Pretty good episode. I honestly thought it was the finale...guess that is next week?
Otto is going to be pissed that someone beat him to killing the white worm. He was not a fan of her telling him how easy it would have been to kill Aegon.
Classic HBO moment with the dragon ripping through the floor. By the way, should the great sept even be built, yet?
and NO ONE THOUGHT TO PUT GUARDS IN FRONT OF THE DRAGON CAGES
brilliant strategy!
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