Dak was going to walk, no trade, no comp picks.
******* Cowboys Official Season Thread 2024 *******
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Last: 11 hrs ago by EastSideAg2002
DannyDuberstein said:
Dak hasn't been a running qb since his foot zigged while the rest of his leg zagged.
He's not a "running QB", but his mobility is still a huge part of his game. He makes a lot of throws guys like Cousins, Tua, Carr, etc. can't make because he can escape and move around the pocket. Hes also much stronger than most mobile QBs, which is why he's one of the very few guys that can escape sacks with brute strength like he did against Seattle and New York last year. Lamar Jackson is an elite runner but when a defender has him, he's going down.
It's why the Cousins comparisons have always been so awful. Aside from the fact that prime Dak is a better passer full stop than prime Cousins, Dak makes 3-4 completions a game that are either throwaways or sacks for Cousins.
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It's just really difficult being a cowboys fan when everyone outside of the fan base, and he'll even some fans inside the fan base, just constantly make your team the butt of jokes.
It's not even the Stephen As of the world, it's the other fans, and while I can block most of it out it does wear on a person.
It also doesn't help when your teams Owner/President/GM/Immortal says we're going "All in" and we dont do **** all except extend who we need to and draft.
For once I want the cowboys to actually be a team other fanbases fear to play and respect rather than constantly try being the joke
It's not even the Stephen As of the world, it's the other fans, and while I can block most of it out it does wear on a person.
It also doesn't help when your teams Owner/President/GM/Immortal says we're going "All in" and we dont do **** all except extend who we need to and draft.
For once I want the cowboys to actually be a team other fanbases fear to play and respect rather than constantly try being the joke
Someone please make the game thread. Don't want to clutter this one with in game talk .
I guess that's just something that never enters my mind as a consideration. Absolutely none of my enjoyment of sports is derived from what other people think about them. I literally couldn't care less when a fan of another college or pro team talks ***** It has no impact on me at all.
And at the end of the day, with a few exceptions, most of those fanbases have experienced less success than the Cowboys in recent years.
And at the end of the day, with a few exceptions, most of those fanbases have experienced less success than the Cowboys in recent years.
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gigem1223 said:Hill08 said:
Let me be the first to congratulate Dallas on not making the playoffs for the next three years. Laughable contract
How does this make a lick of sense? And how does it even get stars? Dak Prescott may have his struggles in the postseason but one thing you can't argue is he gets his team to the playoffs consistently. He's 36-15 in his last 3 regular seasons.
I think people see this as "sign him" " don't sign him". That's never been my point. I am not signing an above average qb that kind of money.
Hill08 said:gigem1223 said:Hill08 said:
Let me be the first to congratulate Dallas on not making the playoffs for the next three years. Laughable contract
How does this make a lick of sense? And how does it even get stars? Dak Prescott may have his struggles in the postseason but one thing you can't argue is he gets his team to the playoffs consistently. He's 36-15 in his last 3 regular seasons.
I think people see this as "sign him" " don't sign him". That's never been my point. I am not signing an above average qb that kind of money.
It's so flagrantly dishonest to frame Dak as an "above average QB" at this point that it immediately declares an individual trying to do so as a bad faith actor.
Across the last 3 seasons on the aggregate, Dak has been a top-5 QB by most metrics. Even if you want to discount most of the wins and stats, even the most negative person cannot coherently argue he is outside the top 8. And last year he arguably the best QB in football and a leading MVP candidate for two thirds of the year. That means Dak is, at worst, in the top 25% of NFL starting QBs. And that doesn't really reflect his value because it's not a steady drop off as you go down the list, outside the top half of the league the drop in QB play is exponential. Cooper Rush is the BEST CASE SCENARIO for the first two years after letting Dak walk.
He is not "above average" by any reasonable definition. He ranges from a very good to elite NFL starting QB.
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Its not my sole reason for wanting the Cowboys to succeed and like I said most of the time I can move past it but just once I'd like to be able to talk proudly about my teamInfection_Ag11 said:
I guess that's just something that never enters my mind as a consideration. Absolutely none of my enjoyment of sports is derived from what other people think about them. I literally couldn't care less when a fan of another college or pro team talks ***** It has no impact on me at all.
And at the end of the day, with a few exceptions, most of those fanbases have experienced less success than the Cowboys in recent years.
He was gonna get that money or more elsewhere next spring. So it actually was a "sign him for that or see him leave" decision
DannyDuberstein said:
He was gonna get that money or more elsewhere next spring. So it actually was a "sign him for that or see him leave" decision
Dak would have been the biggest free agent in NFL history had he hit the market. The bidding war would have been outrageous and someone would have paid him $70 million a year. QBs of his caliber in their prime years just don't hit free agency, because nobody is stupid enough to let that happen. A team like Vegas or New York or Denver would move heaven and earth to have a Dak Prescott next year.
No material on this site is intended to be a substitute for professional medical advice, diagnosis or treatment. See full Medical Disclaimer.
I think there is a valid argument to be made for being above average IF you isolate his play against the top tams in the league each year. It's not stellar. Very good to great quarterbacks excel when they play against the best. Including stats against the whipping boys at the bottom of the league skews the stats in his favor. To me, that doesn't justify top 5 money.
Micah is going to be the one to trade. We'll see how Zimmer uses him, but if he has yet again nothing left in the tank by January, you have to trade him vs extend him. You may have to trade him regardless, but out of the 3 big contract questions, he has always been the one who makes the most sense to part with
Infection_Ag11 said:
Again Dak could not be traded, he had a no trade clause
My apologies. Cowboys painted themselves in a corner.
What does this look like from a salary cap perspective when you include the upcoming Parsons contract?
turf guy ag said:
I think there is a valid argument to be made for being above average IF you isolate his play against the top tams in the league each year. It's not stellar. Very good to great quarterbacks excel when they play against the best.
That's just not true, almost all good QBs having losing records and relatively deflated stats against teams with winning records. Since he came into the league, Dak's QBR against teams that finished the year above .500 is 6th and his winning percentage is 5th. He actually has a well above average winning percentage against winning teams relative to all non-Mahomes, non-Lamar Jackson QBs. Just as one example, he is MUCH better against winning teams than Joe Burrow.
This is another one of those football myths that a lot of people believe. The reality is beating good teams is hard and most QBs struggle to do it. Most good QBs have a lot of less than stellar games against good teams, that's why they are good. Think about how many times Dallas made good QBs look bad over the last three years. Even Allen and Mahomes in wins had very poor games against them. Hurts has had multiple awful games. Burrow had an awful game. Good defenses make good QBs look bad a lot.
No material on this site is intended to be a substitute for professional medical advice, diagnosis or treatment. See full Medical Disclaimer.
turf guy ag said:
I think there is a valid argument to be made for being above average IF you isolate his play against the top tams in the league each year. It's not stellar. Very good to great quarterbacks excel when they play against the best. Including stats against the whipping boys at the bottom of the league skews the stats in his favor. To me, that doesn't justify top 5 money.
Actually, anyone not named Mahomes, this is not correct.
Every QB in the league has their numbers go down because, you know, there's a reason those teams are good.
Macarthur said:turf guy ag said:
I think there is a valid argument to be made for being above average IF you isolate his play against the top tams in the league each year. It's not stellar. Very good to great quarterbacks excel when they play against the best. Including stats against the whipping boys at the bottom of the league skews the stats in his favor. To me, that doesn't justify top 5 money.
Actually, anyone not named Mahomes, this is not correct.
Every QB in the league has their numbers go down because, you know, there's a reason those teams are good.
The fan brain good team/bad team dichotomy has always been fascinating to me. Everyone recognizes a good to great team across time, but when they make any individual team look bad most will ascribe it to the losing team being bad as opposed to the winning team being good.
Today will be a great example, whoever wins (Dallas or Cleveland) the narrative will be the losing team won't live up to expectations. If Dak or Watson plays poorly, it will be because they suck not because the defenses in this game are expected to be really good.
Also, Mahomes numbers go down against good teams too. And not all that much less than other good QBs. The big difference is winning percentage against those teams. And the reality is he has been extremely fortunate especially in the playoffs, with four playoff wins and 2 SB wins being the direct result of incredibly fortunate end of game calls/bounces. Which is why the goal is to keep making the playoffs until the bounces go your way. Mahomes is about 4 plays away from only having 1 ring
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What you're saying is to deny the fact that their season records over his tenure with the exception of a couple of years when they got bounced early in the playoffs, is barely above .500 and that this doesn't point to quarterback play against tough opponents. Look at the stats for each of those losses and it's clear he doesn't produce consistently against top teams. It's not a myth when you compare him to other quarterbacks of championship caliber.
The current structure of the nfl is what has created the market for dak and others around his level. Overpay or start over and roll the dice on someone over performing or living up to their hype.
The current structure of the nfl is what has created the market for dak and others around his level. Overpay or start over and roll the dice on someone over performing or living up to their hype.
Quote:
What you're saying is to deny the fact that their season records over his tenure with the exception of a couple of years when they got bounced early in the playoffs, is barely above .500 and that this doesn't point to quarterback play against tough opponents.
I don't have any idea what you're trying to say here, you need to reword this thought whatever it is.
Quote:
Look at the stats for each of those losses and it's clear he doesn't produce consistently against top teams. It's not a myth when you compare him to other quarterbacks of championship caliber.
It absolutely is a myth, and one that is relatively easy to disprove.
Dak is 28-34 against teams above .500 in his career. Only Mahomes, Rodgers, Wilson and Jackson are better among active QBs. To paint a more clear picture, he has beaten more teams above .500 than Stafford (8-68 in his career), Lawrence, Burrow, Cousins and Tua COMBINED. His career QBR against such teams is 59.6, again better than all but a small handful of active QBs.
This idea that Dak can't win a superbowl but Stafford can is just preposterous.
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Where is the game thread?
I get the argument you're making but the stats you just posted are what I'm assessing Dak to be. He's in the second tier of quarterbacks in the league, not worth (talent wise, in my opinion) first tier money. It's league FOMO.
Top tier quarterbacks play at championship levels against the best, especially when the league is structured in favor of offenses. Dak hasn't done that to warrant the exorbitant price tag that he commands.
In Dak's defense, I will say that he could be that level at a place that has a more serious culture and drive for winning.
Top tier quarterbacks play at championship levels against the best, especially when the league is structured in favor of offenses. Dak hasn't done that to warrant the exorbitant price tag that he commands.
In Dak's defense, I will say that he could be that level at a place that has a more serious culture and drive for winning.
No need to argue with infection. He will literally just keep posting until no one is willing to reply. Cool bro, you're right, Dak is a top 5-8 regular season qb. Who gives a ****
zgolfz85 said:
No need to argue with infection. He will literally just keep posting until no one is willing to reply. Cool bro, you're right, Dak is a top 5-8 regular season qb. Who gives a ****
100% spot on…
The dude is one of the textbook reasons why they invented the "ignore" feature…
Your life will be better if you use it on him…trust me…
zgolfz85 said:
No need to argue with infection. He will literally just keep posting until no one is willing to reply. Cool bro, you're right, Dak is a top 5-8 regular season qb. Who gives a ****
Do what's the point of posting at all then? The fact that your biggest criticism is that I'm willing to support an argument better and to a greater extent than most is…strange to say the least. Especially when I'm not the one that keeps bringing up Dak. I'm responding to objectively inaccurate statements about it.
No material on this site is intended to be a substitute for professional medical advice, diagnosis or treatment. See full Medical Disclaimer.
FireAg said:zgolfz85 said:
No need to argue with infection. He will literally just keep posting until no one is willing to reply. Cool bro, you're right, Dak is a top 5-8 regular season qb. Who gives a ****
100% spot on…
The dude is one of the textbook reasons why they invented the "ignore" feature…
Your life will be better if you use it on him…trust me…
Dude, half the people on varsity have you on ignore. I'm one of the few people that even engages with you there anymore.
No material on this site is intended to be a substitute for professional medical advice, diagnosis or treatment. See full Medical Disclaimer.
Dak is good; he just got a large contract…
Other than when they won and dominated, hes barely above 500.turf guy ag said:
What you're saying is to deny the fact that their season records over his tenure with the exception of a couple of years when they got bounced early in the playoffs, is barely above .500 and that this doesn't point to quarterback play against tough opponents. Look at the stats for each of those losses and it's clear he doesn't produce consistently against top teams. It's not a myth when you compare him to other quarterbacks of championship caliber.
The current structure of the nfl is what has created the market for dak and others around his level. Overpay or start over and roll the dice on someone over performing or living up to their hype.
Read back what you wrote, good god.
There are 1-3 QBs who are clearly better than him, and there is no way for us to get them on the Cowboys.
Is there anyone here that thinks dak will get us a ring? I think you'd be nuts to suggest as much. Were we mostly trapped by delaying his extension so long? Yes. Will we win a ship while he's here. No. I hate to be gloomy Gus, but today was a culmination of Jerry being Jerry and once again not extending when it would've been a lot cheaper. Now we're in cap hell and will be largely reliant upon continually mastering the draft.
We can absolutely win a super bowl with him as qb. Thats different from him winning it.
PatAg said:
We can absolutely win a super bowl with him as qb. Thats different from him winning it.
Haha fair enough
My luck will be Dak signing this deal and then having a season ending injury in game 1 today…
zgolfz85 said:
Is there anyone here that thinks dak will get us a ring? I think you'd be nuts to suggest as much. Were we mostly trapped by delaying his extension so long? Yes. Will we win a ship while he's here. No. I hate to be gloomy Gus, but today was a culmination of Jerry being Jerry and once again not extending when it would've been a lot cheaper. Now we're in cap hell and will be largely reliant upon continually mastering the draft.
Again, your argument is Dak can't do what Stafford, Flacco, Kaepernick, Newton, Foles, Purdy, Garappolo, Ryan, Wilson, Eli Manning x2 and Peyton Manning with a nonfunctional throwing shoulder have done just in the last 17 years alone. That is an indefensible, completely insane position to hold.
No material on this site is intended to be a substitute for professional medical advice, diagnosis or treatment. See full Medical Disclaimer.
On the contrary, I think you're absolutely nuts to think Dak isn't good enough to win a championship, just cuz it hasn't happened yet. He's one of the 6-7 best in the league any way you slice it.
The dude doesn't have it between the ears. It's like chasing a bad stock. I won't chase that stock of dak champ hope ever again
zgolfz85 said:
The dude doesn't have it between the ears. It's like chasing a bad stock. I won't chase that stock of dak champ hope ever again
We were all beat down by the GB loss, but now that we have some distance from that we can be a little more rational. Dak absolutely can be the starting QB on a Super Bowl team.
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