MaroonStain said:

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Who is the better candidate?

Dole
McCain
Mittens
Trump

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Trump is the least terrible of that group. There, take a W from me, team Trump.

aggiehawg said:

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Quote:

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If only there were a candidate in this very race who spurned Fauci. Anyone who says we don't know what others would have done is full of it. Because we saw it. Some of y'all put 2020 out of your brains because it cuts against Trump.

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What happens in Florida in winter is not the same as what happens in the northern states during winter, especially in densely populated areas. Which is why Trump talked to the governors all of the time. Governors and their state health authorities were monitoring what was happening in their own states.

The biggest mistake was trying to craft a one size fits all solution to very disparate situations across the country during winter and early spring.

But by the summer, the evidence was growing even though much of it was being censored, squelched, memory holed with doctors being attacked for speaking up at what they were seeing. Videos and podcasts were taken down from youtube. People were censored, shadow banned or just plain booted off of twitter.

If we were having difficulty getting accurate and contrarian information to the preferred narrative, what was Trump being told? What was Pence being told? Pence was in charge, wasn't he?

To use an old question, "What did the President know and when did he know it?"

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Considering I had enough information from podcasts and the internet in April to know enough, Trump has no excuses.

shack009 said:

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aggiehawg said:

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Quote:

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If only there were a candidate in this very race who spurned Fauci. Anyone who says we don't know what others would have done is full of it. Because we saw it. Some of y'all put 2020 out of your brains because it cuts against Trump.

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What happens in Florida in winter is not the same as what happens in the northern states during winter, especially in densely populated areas. Which is why Trump talked to the governors all of the time. Governors and their state health authorities were monitoring what was happening in their own states.

The biggest mistake was trying to craft a one size fits all solution to very disparate situations across the country during winter and early spring.

But by the summer, the evidence was growing even though much of it was being censored, squelched, memory holed with doctors being attacked for speaking up at what they were seeing. Videos and podcasts were taken down from youtube. People were censored, shadow banned or just plain booted off of twitter.

If we were having difficulty getting accurate and contrarian information to the preferred narrative, what was Trump being told? What was Pence being told? Pence was in charge, wasn't he?

To use an old question, "What did the President know and when did he know it?"

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Considering I had enough information from podcasts and the internet in April to know enough, Trump has no excuses.

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I bow to your superior intellect, research skills, and limitless time in which to do so.

Good thing you didn't have a country to run during that time period. Might have been a distraction.

J. Walter Weatherman said:

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Anyone who thinks DeSantis, who literally removed his surgeon general from a Covid briefing IN APRIL in the middle of a press conference for saying people would need to social distance for up to a year and that the virus was dangerous to young people (it's not), would have operated the same as Trump is just choosing to be embarrassingly, willfully ignorant of DeSantis record during Covid. And the only reason they downplay it is to ignore Trump's massive Covid failure because he's a coward.

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And they don't know DeSantis did that because they only care about being entertained.

J. Walter Weatherman said:

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Anyone who thinks DeSantis, who literally removed his surgeon general from a Covid briefing IN APRIL in the middle of a press conference for saying people would need to social distance for up to a year and that the virus was dangerous to young people (it's not), would have operated the same as Trump is just choosing to be embarrassingly, willfully ignorant of DeSantis record during Covid. And the only reason they downplay it is to ignore Trump's massive Covid failure because he's a coward.

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The anti DeSantis propaganda and trump goaltending is unreal. I think I saw the half truth above that not all restrictions were lifted in Florida until September. That may be technically true, but the state was basically open to normies in June.

My God you are blind to reality…

aggiehawg said:

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shack009 said:

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aggiehawg said:

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Quote:

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If only there were a candidate in this very race who spurned Fauci. Anyone who says we don't know what others would have done is full of it. Because we saw it. Some of y'all put 2020 out of your brains because it cuts against Trump.

---

What happens in Florida in winter is not the same as what happens in the northern states during winter, especially in densely populated areas. Which is why Trump talked to the governors all of the time. Governors and their state health authorities were monitoring what was happening in their own states.

The biggest mistake was trying to craft a one size fits all solution to very disparate situations across the country during winter and early spring.

But by the summer, the evidence was growing even though much of it was being censored, squelched, memory holed with doctors being attacked for speaking up at what they were seeing. Videos and podcasts were taken down from youtube. People were censored, shadow banned or just plain booted off of twitter.

If we were having difficulty getting accurate and contrarian information to the preferred narrative, what was Trump being told? What was Pence being told? Pence was in charge, wasn't he?

To use an old question, "What did the President know and when did he know it?"

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Considering I had enough information from podcasts and the internet in April to know enough, Trump has no excuses.

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I bow to your superior intellect, research skills, and limitless time in which to do so.

Good thing you didn't have a country to run during that time period. Might have been a distraction.

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I mean, DeSantis actually did the same thing too. His approach of who to give treatment to first and plan around specific populations like the elderly was based off the data from Italy and a couple of other European countries.

He was one of the only leaders actually citing the data from Italy when making his decisions.

Federal leaders said the dangers were almost equal across the board and reviewed to make policy based on population statistics.

aggiehawg said:

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shack009 said:

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aggiehawg said:

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Quote:

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If only there were a candidate in this very race who spurned Fauci. Anyone who says we don't know what others would have done is full of it. Because we saw it. Some of y'all put 2020 out of your brains because it cuts against Trump.

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What happens in Florida in winter is not the same as what happens in the northern states during winter, especially in densely populated areas. Which is why Trump talked to the governors all of the time. Governors and their state health authorities were monitoring what was happening in their own states.

The biggest mistake was trying to craft a one size fits all solution to very disparate situations across the country during winter and early spring.

But by the summer, the evidence was growing even though much of it was being censored, squelched, memory holed with doctors being attacked for speaking up at what they were seeing. Videos and podcasts were taken down from youtube. People were censored, shadow banned or just plain booted off of twitter.

If we were having difficulty getting accurate and contrarian information to the preferred narrative, what was Trump being told? What was Pence being told? Pence was in charge, wasn't he?

To use an old question, "What did the President know and when did he know it?"

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Considering I had enough information from podcasts and the internet in April to know enough, Trump has no excuses.

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I bow to your superior intellect, research skills, and limitless time in which to do so.

Good thing you didn't have a country to run during that time period. Might have been a distraction.

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I mean, is it too much to ask that the President know a single thing? I knew every statistic there was to know, and that information was completely useless to me. That information was most important to the President, and he couldn't tell you anything about it.

PA24 said:

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shack009 said:

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I'm sick of the goaltending for his COVID policy. The guy dropped the ball, plain and simple. He gets an F- for all of 2020, including nearly $3 trillion in spending.

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Exactly 4 years ago, Trump was headed for easy victory. Hard to believe but Nancy torn up his state of the union speak the same night Trump gave Rush the medal.

All was good, easy victory coming...Except...he was being impeached for the 2nd time by the democrats for Ukraine of all things. IF he had not complied with the CDC, he would have been ran out of town.

I remember the who state of Texas shut down, friends acting crazy with the mask, CNN showing mass graves, NO VENTILATORS!!!! Hospitals overworked, no ICU beds, GOD HELP US!!!!

PANDEMIC...Millions dying!


I also remember him refusing to wear the mask, Byrd and Facci claiming he was not doing enough. Trump recommended Hydroxychloroquin and the press went crazy.

The whole world shut down, no stopping it.


Selective memory by liberals and never Trumpers dude.

The COVID allowed the folks to pass new laws which in turn produced voter harvesting which caused 81,000,000 for Biden...

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Friggin nailed it…

shack009 said:

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J. Walter Weatherman said:

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Anyone who thinks DeSantis, who literally removed his surgeon general from a Covid briefing IN APRIL in the middle of a press conference for saying people would need to social distance for up to a year and that the virus was dangerous to young people (it's not), would have operated the same as Trump is just choosing to be embarrassingly, willfully ignorant of DeSantis record during Covid. And the only reason they downplay it is to ignore Trump's massive Covid failure because he's a coward.

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The anti DeSantis propaganda and trump goaltending is unreal. I think I saw the half truth above that not all restrictions were lifted in Florida until September. That may be technically true, but the state was basically open to normies in June.

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It's sad more than anything and just shows you people will believe whatever Trump tells them to believe without ever bothering to do any actual research on what happened. DeSantis was challenged by the media constantly for standing up to the restrictions, and because of the age of the population in his state it was a huge risk. But he correctly decided after the first 4-6 weeks that we couldn't let the cure be worse than the disease. Something Trump and Fauci never cared to pay attention to.

Trump and his followers are a lot alike. No idea what happened in 2020 and reserved to lying and pointing blame elsewhere for the failures of the man at the top.

shack009 said:

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Trump and his followers are a lot alike. No idea what happened in 2020 and reserved to lying and pointing blame elsewhere for the failures of the man at the top.

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Stop rewriting history. Your choice for President, Biden, is A-okay perfect on covid?

aggiehawg said:

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shack009 said:

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Trump and his followers are a lot alike. No idea what happened in 2020 and reserved to lying and pointing blame elsewhere for the failures of the man at the top.

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Stop rewriting history. Your choice for President, Biden, is A-okay perfect on covid?

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Here's a weird thought: just because I'm not for Trump, doesn't mean I'm for Biden.

FireAg said:

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My God you are blind to reality…

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Excuse me. Kindly go eff yourself.

It's not to much to ask our elected leader of the federal bureaucracy to actually lead it.

I was taught many years ago that if I'm attacking the wrong hill, to get off the hill asap, and attack the right hill.

Same thing here

It was clear that the policy prescriptions coming out of his administration were ineffective at best, harmful at worst. Whenever he realized that, as a leader, he should have made changes.

But either through incompetence or lack of political courage, he did nothing. Desantis made changes. Abbott made changes. other governors made changes. Trump did not. He did his warp speed. He did his ventilator production. But, in the real policy area, he did nothing

Therefore, what else am I to conclude? He should get a pass because it was a novel situation? He should get a pass because he had just been impeached? He should get a pass because the media would have given him more hell than usual?

No.

I'm not saying DeSantis should drop out now, at all. He could get traction in the next few primaries. But it's really not likely. The butt hurt and pearl clutching on F16 is going to be epic if the time comes that he has to drop out.

shack009 said:

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Trump and his followers are a lot alike. No idea what happened in 2020 and reserved to lying and pointing blame elsewhere for the failures of the man at the top.

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Sometimes it feels like listening to someone make excuses for how the players weren't executing for Jimbo. It wasn't his fault. I mean it's not like the President is in charge or makes decisions or anything.

I'm planning on voting for him should he be on the primary when it's our turn.

But, I kinda agree. What's the point of continuing on? Put that money to better use.

TexAgs91 said:

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I'm not saying DeSantis should drop out now, at all. He could get traction in the next few primaries. But it's really not likely. The butt hurt and pearl clutching on F16 is going to be epic if the time comes that he has to drop out.

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I have stayed earlier in this thread that I agree his chances are slim to none now. His only hope is that Haley underperforms the next couple. But Haley is staying in because she is in here to help trump and then be VP.

Agthatbuilds said:

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I'm planning on voting for him should he be on the primary when it's our turn.

But, I kinda agree. What's the point of continuing on? Put that money to better use.

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DeSantis isn't at that point yet.

Not yet. But, what difference does it make if it's today vs a month or two of second/third place finishes?

shack009 said:

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aggiehawg said:

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shack009 said:

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Trump and his followers are a lot alike. No idea what happened in 2020 and reserved to lying and pointing blame elsewhere for the failures of the man at the top.

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Stop rewriting history. Your choice for President, Biden, is A-okay perfect on covid?

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Here's a weird thought: just because I'm not for Trump, doesn't mean I'm for Biden.

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But your ARE rewriting history and being completely disingenuous to support your point…

A ton of people did their best with Covid, and those same people, in hindsight, absolutely could have done better…that goes for Trump and DeSantis…

But you can't just walk around here like DeSantis was God's gift to Covid response and ignore the actual facts…

Further, you completely ignore the fact that Trump was dealing with an entire nation, not a single state, and that nation was about equal blue/red, and DeSantis wasn't fresh of impeachment attempt #1 over a completely bogus charge…

You're making it sound like they were equals…the situations were completely different, and even still, FL had restrictions until September…that's fact…

Yes, many were lifted by June, but the federal lifts came less than a month later…

You can't just invent lies and expect people to not call BS…

FireAg said:

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shack009 said:

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aggiehawg said:

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shack009 said:

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Trump and his followers are a lot alike. No idea what happened in 2020 and reserved to lying and pointing blame elsewhere for the failures of the man at the top.

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Stop rewriting history. Your choice for President, Biden, is A-okay perfect on covid?

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Here's a weird thought: just because I'm not for Trump, doesn't mean I'm for Biden.

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But your ARE rewriting history and being completely disingenuous to support your point…

A ton of people did their best with Covid, and those same people, in hindsight, absolutely could have done better…that goes for Trump and DeSantis…

But you can't just walk around here like DeSantis was God's gift to Covid response and ignore the actual facts…

Further, you completely ignore the fact that Trump was dealing with an entire nation, not a single state, and that nation was about equal blue/red, and DeSantis wasn't fresh of impeachment attempt #1 over a completely bogus charge…

You're making it sound like they were equals…the situations were completely different, and even still, FL had restrictions until September…that's fact…

Yes, many were lifted by June, but the federal lifts came less than a month later…

You can't just invent lies and expect people to not call BS…

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You're right, they weren't equals. Trump was president and had unlimited power. He cowered and wilted when the moment got big. So I'm not going to pretend that he's a proven warrior or that he's fighting for me.

Because he isn't.

Should he get a pass because literally NO ONE knew any better either?

That's my point…no one knew…including DeSantis…

Completely false…you're writing your narrative devoid of fact…

He didn't cower…he listened to his expert…DeSantis would have done the same…

But then he ignored his expert letting him do his thing while Trump did his thing. It left everybody confused and not knowing who to follow.

You're missing the entire point.

I agree. At first, no one knew. But, we knew a lot relatively quickly thereafter. And we knew fauci was bad news.

But nothing ****ing changed. Desantis changed things. Abbott changed things. Others changed things

Trump didn't do ****, apparently out of cowardness, according to you.

FireAg said:

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Completely false…you're writing your narrative devoid of fact…

He didn't cower…he listened to his expert…DeSantis would have done the same…

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Except for the fact that he didn't.

Desantis fired his expert April 13 2020.

Trump did many great things during his presidency. The covid response was not one of them

TexAgs91 said:

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Ag with kids said:

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aggie93 said:

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TexAgs91 said:

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Agthatbuilds said:

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Is our goal to have a republican in the white house or elect Trump?

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Republicans haven't exactly shown great leadership over the past several years. With America dead since 11/3/2020 we don't have the luxury of being picky. Our goal is to resurrect America. I think DeSantis would do a better job, but Trump will at least try and will more than stop the bleeding.

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As it turns out that date was March 16, 2020. That was the day Trump decided to give in to Fauci and do "15 Days to Slow the Spread" and then effectively handed over his Presidency to him. I know I was a fool to trust Trump that he actually meant 15 Days myself and that he would have the strength to stick to it and I admit my error. I don't know that we will ever recover from that not because of the damage it did but because people still won't admit that Trump was wrong and weak to do it.

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MAGA can never admit Trump was wrong. It means admitting that THEY were wrong, too.

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Time for DeSantis fanatics to admit he definitely wouldn't win the general either.

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DeSantis might not. But he does not have the baggage of Trump and doesn't draw the visceral hate that Trump does.

Both of those are huge negatives in the general. And the reasons for the baggage and visceral hate are huge positives in the primary.

Bad combo IMO...

And the contrast of a young, stable candidate vs Biden would be huge and work in DeSantis' favor.

But, alas, the mob is speaking. Time to toss some more bread into the circus.

Tea Party said:

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Ag with kids said:

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aggie93 said:

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TexAgs91 said:

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Agthatbuilds said:

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Is our goal to have a republican in the white house or elect Trump?

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Republicans haven't exactly shown great leadership over the past several years. With America dead since 11/3/2020 we don't have the luxury of being picky. Our goal is to resurrect America. I think DeSantis would do a better job, but Trump will at least try and will more than stop the bleeding.

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As it turns out that date was March 16, 2020. That was the day Trump decided to give in to Fauci and do "15 Days to Slow the Spread" and then effectively handed over his Presidency to him. I know I was a fool to trust Trump that he actually meant 15 Days myself and that he would have the strength to stick to it and I admit my error. I don't know that we will ever recover from that not because of the damage it did but because people still won't admit that Trump was wrong and weak to do it.

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MAGA can never admit Trump was wrong. It means admitting that THEY were wrong, too.

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Trump was wrong. A lot of Trump voters have said so and wish Trump would have fired Fauci from the onset.

Any other false broad brush painting you would like to do today that will keep the right divided?

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Wish they'd post on here then.

What law did Trump pass to shut down the country?

Weren't shutdowns left up to state and local authorities based on the advice of the CDC?

shack009 said:

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stallion6 said:

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shack009 said:

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stallion6 said:

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shack009 said:

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stallion6 said:

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C@LAg said:

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Trump has been the Dems ***** for 8 years now. That is not going to stop any time soon.

1. No major legislation passed on his watch.

2. He spent $8TT that the dems gorged on, as did the Republicans. S much for him being "conservative".

3. He got used and abused by the Executive branch, who worked against him

4. The military hated him so much they actively worked against him

5. Republican leadership hated and still hates him and barely is willing to work with him. He is going to bring down the ticket in one or both houses.

6. DOJ has tied him up for pretty much the entire time.

7. He is bleeding millions in ongoing lawsuits that divide his time.

8. He has almost no useful or powerful allies. Anywhere.

The senile buffoon in the White House who cannot prepare cereal for himself is going to beat him in the general election. For a second time.

He is a dead candidate walking.

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The military did not hate Trump. Just Liberal, Woke Milley.

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The Milley that Trump appointed?

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Not sure what that has to do with the comment about the entire military. Maybe read before posting. The comment stated the "military" worked agains Trump. That is absolutely an incorrect generalization.

Milley turned out to be a traitor. Bad pick by Trump that he should have listened when others advised against it. You can see who Milley is not that he is retired. The Milley that is in Davos at the WEF with all the other corrupt leaders.

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Clockwork

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Learn to read. Justifying your reading comprehension challenge is actually "clockwork". I disagreed with the statement that the entire military turned on Trump. Having spent 26 years in the army, I can tell you that is not accurate. Your statement that "well Trump hired Milley" has absolutely nothing to do with the point that you grouped all of us with Milley. I take exception to that.

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Relax man. I'm not saying the military is against Trump. I understand that Trump has a ton of support among the non-bureaucrat-level service members.

Just pointing out another bad appointment by Trump, which was a daily occurrence in his presidency. And then when that guy turns out to be bad, he's a "traitor" to Trump. It's a tale as old as time.

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Trump sure hired a lot of traitors. Was that in the job description?

FireAg said:

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What law did Trump pass to shut down the country?

Weren't shutdowns left up to state and local authorities based on the advice of the CDC?

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That was the only good thing he did - let the states decide.

He held absolutely ZERO people accountable. He tried the good ole' plausible deniability route.

So he didn't close the country…the states decided to close…

The only law I find was an EO restricting travel into the US from persons originating in certain countries…

She he didn't close schools and shut down the nation for "two weeks to flatten the curve"…it was states doing that, at the recommendation, not requirement, of a federal agency…