Good News: My wife has given me the okay to spend $500 on a new lens! Woohoo! Will most likely get a fast prime.

Bad News: I have to lose 30 pounds prior to the purchase!

Got Lightroom 2 for my birthday today! I've been trying it out for the past few weeks after reading Guitarsoup's PP workflow. L O V E this program.

quote:

---

Study this guy before you go:
Mark J. Rebilas
He is pretty much the king of motor sports photography. Really look at his stuff and try to think how he thinks. He sees light better than anyone and that is what makes him so great.

---

No kidding. Wish I had this guy's eye.





[This message has been edited by G Martin 87 (edited 3/14/2010 2:26p).]

[u]My dilemna wasn't getting much traction in it's own thread so I thought I'd try here too:[/u]

My G9 was having intermittent issues powering on and off and it recently froze with the lens extended and I can’t get it to power back on.

I called Canon and I was presented with several options:

1) Pay to ship it to them and they will give me a free estimate, repair if I choose, and send back to me. The minimum charge repair rate is $149 + $8 shipping. The warranty is good for 90 days on the repaired portion only. If the repair cost much exceeds the minimum I wouldn’t be interested and would be out the shipping cost. I don’t like that.

2) Exchange for refurbished SX10IS for $199 + $10 shipping + tax or ~$226 total and it doesn’t matter what’s wrong with my G9 for this. They mail me the “new” camera with a shipping label for the G9 and I just use the same box to send it back. I get to keep all accessories/batteries/etc that came with the G9. These would be useless with the SX10IS. 90 day full warranty with the SX10IS.

3) Exchange for refurbished G11 for $249 + $10 shipping + tax or ~$280 total and it doesn’t matter what’s wrong with my G9 for this. They mail me the “new” camera with a shipping label for the G9 and I just use the same box to send it back. I get to keep all accessories/batteries/etc that came with the G9. The batteries are compatible with the G11. 90 day full warranty with the G11.

4) Same type of deal as above but the base is $299 for the Rebel XT with 18-55mm kit lens. I’ve already ruled this out.

So, unless there is another option I’m unaware of, I’m going with one of the first 3 choices. Here is another kink: I don’t need another camera. This is my current lineup:

Canon PowerShot SD1100IS
Canon EOS 30D with 50mm f/1.8 lens
Sony HDR-CX500V

So I here are my questions:

a) If I decide to keep the repaired/exchanged camera, which option would you get and why?

b) If I decide to sell once fixed/exchanged, which option and why?

c) Am I missing a better avenue?

Have you considered a 3rd party repair facility? None of those options sounds so great to me, although I would probably go with 3) and inquire about getting/buying the box & documentation for the G11. Sorry to hear about this!

any recommendations on a fast wide angle prime?

i feel like i should just suck it up and buy canons 24mm 1.4L, but then again i also feel like i should just buy the sigma 20mm or 24mm 1.8 for 500 and buy the canon version later.

GS, saw your post in Metroplex about your wedding shooting/editing workflow.

Just curious if you edit the couple's pics more thoroughly after the wedding. Looking through your blog, it's clear that the rushed edits aren't as good as stuff you've posted on here before. I find it hard to believe you'd overlook something as important as wedding pictures, but it's a cool idea if the pics are meant for blogs only.

For those just joining this: here is the blog:
http://thomasandpenelope.com/blog/?p=43

What I do is have my wife select favorites while I shoot. She edits them and exports them into a slideshow during the reception. So we have a live slideshow during the reception of fully edited wedding pictures.

Then I take those edits, throw my wordmark on them, upload to facebook the night of the wedding and write a quick blog.

For this process, Lightroom is infinitely faster, but my wife's experience is more with photoshop. So she is still working, and as I edit this wedding, she will look over my shoulder for a lot of things so that her style of editing will more closely mirror my style of editing.

She edited about 120 pics during the wedding this week and ran them in the slideshow, and I kept 70 of those edits for the gallery and blogged about 25 of them.

But again, it is incredibly nerve-racking on her part. She is not just editing, but she is backing up all the pictures, selecting the good ones, editing and putting them in a slideshow. That's a lot of really important things to keep up with. When we left the wedding, every picture was in three places - the memory card, the external HD and the computer HD. That is vital to me.

But as far as I know, no other photographer offers this exact service I offer, which certainly makes me unique.



Post wedding, my workflow goes something like this:
Organize the pictures into folders. Folder for Bride getting ready, folder for groom getting ready, etc. Lots of folders. Then I import them into lightroom. Do edits/colors in lightroom. Export. I (or my wife) will touch up some pics in photoshop.

When we are done with that, we select our favorites that tell the story and design the album.

My friend Jessica decided that she wanted an album a year after her wedding, so Penelope just designed it for her.
Jessica's Wedding Album
This album will be 11" tall by 14" wide when closed, but will open up and be a flat panorama on every sheet with no seam.

We design everything in house (she designs) and we print them at forbeyon.com, which is located in Dallas.

So all the pictures you saw that my wife edited, will be completely re-edited again. I won't even look at her edits when I do mine.

Eventually, the plan is for her take over all editing and designing, and me to only shoot.

[This message has been edited by Guitarsoup (edited 3/30/2010 12:12a).]

Like I said, it's a novel idea, and one I've definitely not seen before. Again, a wedding is a once in a lifetime chance for these people, and the pictures will stay with them longer than the slideshow during their reception.

A client shouldn't have to worry that your wife is incredibly stressed trying to edit 120 pictures in the span of a few hours, they should be able to trust that their valuable moments will be treated with care.

I obviously don't know the ins and outs of exactly what or how you're doing, but it comes off like you're putting this unique idea ahead of quality, which is a dangerous and unprofessional game to play with wedding photography.

Like I said, for blogs and slideshows, awesome. For final edits, not so much.

[This message has been edited by Oglethorpedo (edited 3/30/2010 12:11a).]

We don't put speed over quality. I will personally edit the entire wedding, in addition to what she did for the slideshow. To call it unprofessional is a bit outrageous.

And while her edits weren't all how I wanted them edited, they certainly aren't poor quality.

My focus is to tell the story of the wedding, and I make sure that the final product is perfect. They will have a lifetime or more of looking at these, which is why I shy away from the ultra-trendy things like tilt-shift lenses, fisheyes and the like. I just don't see an entire set of engagement portraits shot with a tilt-shift standing the test of time.

[This message has been edited by Guitarsoup (edited 3/30/2010 8:53a).]

GS and others?

I am looking at getting the canon 70-200 lens. What is the difference between the 70-200 2.8L IS and 70-200 2.8L IS II? And is it really worth the extra cost? I am not a professional but I really think that I would get a lot of use out of this lens and I want to make the right choice.

I seriously doubt wedding guest or going to complain about the edit of the wedding pictures on the slide show and the bride and groom might be able to give them a passing glance at best.

The idea seems to be a great one and I would be shocked if you got any justified complaints.

quote:

---

I seriously doubt wedding guest or going to complain about the edit of the wedding pictures on the slide show and the bride and groom might be able to give them a passing glance at best.

The idea seems to be a great one and I would be shocked if you got any justified complaints.

---

You're missing the point. I said that the idea was great for the slideshows. My concern came from the lack of time spent processing each photo, if indeed either GS or his wife did not go back to those photos after the wedding to do extra processing.

I'm definitely not attacking the idea or calling GS unprofessional, but merely pointing out that the quality of the pics he showed from the blog are not up to the quality he has posted before, when he clearly had more time to edit.

I think one thing that you are overlooking (and something you couldn't have known) is the fact that when I consult with a bride, they are shown the actual slideshows that I run.

Here are 70 pics from Saturday:
http://www.thomasgcampbell.com/Weddings/laurenneil/Penelopes-Picks-NLT/

Here are 56 pics from a wedding at a Safari ranch last year:
http://www.thomasgcampbell.com/Weddings/Jessica-and-Wes/Jess-and-Wes-Penelopes-Picks/

Here are 60 pics from a wedding last year:
http://www.thomasgcampbell.com/Weddings/Ashley-and-John/Ashley-and-John-Penelopes/


I show brides a few things when we consult.

We show them the actual slideshows that we have run at a wedding.

We show them our custom-designed leather-bound panorama albums.

We show them our portfolio. Before we consult, we direct them where they can see entire weddings that we have shot and edited, because it is important not to just see the portfolio of a photographer. Any fool can get a couple good snaps at a wedding, but it is much harder to cover an entire wedding well.

So it isn't like they look at my portfolio (which does have slideshow edits in it) and then get a different product for the slideshow. We show them the actual slideshows we have used in the past.

I think a rational person understands that picking 50-100 pics out of 2-4000 pics over a ~5-6 hour time period, editing those pics fully and running a slideshow while keeping up with backing up the RAW files, keeping the used and unused CF cards and whatnot is going to produce a different product than when you have a month or two to sit at home and painstakingly go through each individual picture. Beside the point, it isn't like the edits are bad. What we produce in our slideshow on the fly is MUCH better than what the vast majority of wedding photographers produce weeks or months to edit.

quote:

---

go back to those photos after the wedding to do extra processing.

---

We don't go back to the slideshow pics. We completely ignore them. I do entirely new edits. Now, there are edits that I may copy. There are pictures that she may liked, that I may like another one entirely. I may over or underexpose something purposely because I am planning to use a specific effect on it later - but she doesn't know that.

It is all just part of the process. Because this is something that isn't really done anywhere else, it isn't like I can buy a book or read a forum and just follow instructions. You have to figure it all out as you go, and I think we have done a pretty damn good job of it.

Personally, I like how she edited the ring shot:

This cake is actually pretty much straight out of the camera:

Thanks for taking the time to explain and discuss, I wish you success with the creative niche you've carved yourself.

Don't let napalm/ogle troll you GS. Your work is great. And who cares as long as your customer is happy.

Good news. My wife's sister is having baby shower at Southfork Ranch and I will be taking pictures of the event. Good news because 1) the baby and 2) a reason to get more gear. I have this suspicion that the indoor lighting will not always be sufficient and feel now is a good time to get an flash.

First, which one? It seems there are 3 popular flashes for Canon dSLRs, right? According to Amazon:
Canon Speedlite 270EX for $150
Canon Speedlite 430EX II for $280
Canon Speedlite 580EX II for $422

I'm leaning toward the 430 on the basis that I don't want the cheapest but probably don't need the most expensive at this point. What are the differences between the 3 (or the top 2)? If I'm dropping $300 on a flash, I guess I'd rather drop an extra $100 if the 580 is that much better and worth it. I've never used one before and as with all things dSLR over the past 6 months for me, this will be a good learning experience. I definitely see myself continuing the hobby so I would like to have some room to grow. Would the 430 limit me in this regard?

quote:

---

RULE #1 DO NOT USE STROBES ON THE CAMERA
RULE #2 ALWAYS USE STROBES OFF THE CAMERA

---

GS, this quote confused me in the OP. Are you referring to the built-in flash on rule 1? Or do you also suggest not using flashes in the shoe mount at all? If that's what you mean then I can understand the advantage of having a flash on tripods/stands (pardon my lack of proper jargon) away from the camera for better lighting. But it isn't always practical, just ideal, right?

Two things come to mind when I think of using a flash, what else can I do/am I not aware of?
1) Using it in darker situations where faster shutter speed is needed and a fast lens with high ISO isn't enough.
2) Using it as fill light so I can properly expose the subject and bright background for example. Say you were taking a picture of people standing in the shade on the porch of a beach house with the ocean/sky/sand behind them. If you expose it properly for the people in the foreground, then the background is a solid white from being overexposed. Would the best solution be to expose it for the background (ocean/sky/sand) and then use a flash to fill in the foreground?

Also, how complicated are the settings on a Speedlite? Is there a pretty steep learning curve? I checked out the strobist blogspot but it seems to be mostly a lot of articles and really I need a "beginner's basics guide". About the only thing I know is that I can point the flash up and bounce it off the ceiling for more natural lighting. If you're outside I imagine this would have no effect, correct?

Any other advice about flashes would be greatly appreciated!

[This message has been edited by bq06 (edited 4/4/2010 1:34p).]

Get the 430. I've never used it, but for not professional applications, it should be fine.

If you use it on camera, point it backwards or to a wall, so the flash isn't directly hitting them. If it bounces off a wall, shirt or ceiling, you will get more pleasing light.

Get it off camera by using a radio transmitter like a pocket wizard, but this is more for portraits than a event like a bridal shower.

430 is fine for indoor professional applications if you know how to use it. Outdoor is pushing it.

Thanks for the tips. I've found a couple useful guides such as FLASH PHOTOGRAPHY 101 and The EOS Flash Bible

What about diffusers? I've read they're pointless outside when working with fill light.
-If bouncing is not an option, is the diffuser the second choice?
-If you are bouncing, should the diffuser be removed?
-Are all diffusers basically the same? e.g. this one or this one?

The only flash guides I recommend are strobist.com and speedlighting.com (which is geared towards Canon shooters.

I don't use any diffusers. I know David Hobby reviews a lot. I'd rather hold a reflector in a hand and bounce the flash off that than use a direct flash through a plastic diffuser. That's just me. You would probably do better just taping an index card to the back of the flash, aiming up and letting the reflection of the card light the subject.

But check out the diffusers that stroist.com recommends. David Hobby has forgotten more about small flashes than I will ever know.

Thanks, I'm checking out the Speedliting forums and have another question. What batteries do ya'll use/recommend for the flash? I've seen good things about Eneloops 2000mAh and Powerex 2700mAh (much more expensive). I already have several AA Energizer 2500mAh and a charger. Anyone know if it's safe to use my Energizer charger with the Eneloops?

I buy massive packs of Kirkland batteries from Costco.

I do have a quantum battery pack for an old 550EX.

So you've had better luck with disposable alkaline vs. rechargeables?

Yeah. I had duracell rechargables, but they never last as long as I would like. The throwaways are simple.

I use the Powerex 2700 rechargeables in my flashes. They work great, unless you have a really heavy duty use like shooting weddings. I got my last few sets at Naturescapes, and right now you can get a free set of batteries with the charger plus free standard shipping, which takes about 4 days. I have also gotten batteries from Thomas Distributing.

I started using eneloops about a year ago and I will never go back to standard batteries or other rechargeables. Before I used standard energizer rechargeables and they wouldn't last very long when using my flash or many of my electronic devices. I would recommend buying a pack for eneloops and seeing how you like them. The worst thing that happens is you wasted $4 dollars.

Rechargables with alkaline backups. NiMHs works great in my 430, provided I use my good charger overnight.

I actually use the AA rechargeables that came with my Canon point and shoot from years ago. They are NiMH, and they really do last a good while.

I was thinking about getting another set of rechargeables because I'm helping a photographer friend as her second shooter for a wedding at the end of the month, but maybe I'll just get some regular AAs instead.

quote:

---

. What batteries do ya'll use/recommend for the flash? I've seen good things about Eneloops 2000mAh and Powerex 2700mAh (much more expensive).

---

I have the Powerex 2500mAh and the charger with them and they work great in my Nikon SB-600 flash. I've left them in the flash for a month or longer and the fire up and work fine every time I use them.

Thanks for the battery recommendations.

GS, all I saw in the OP for panoramics was 19D. Is the other info buried somewhere in the 60 pages?

I found this on page 35 from about a year ago:

GS

quote:

---

Two different lenses of the same focal length, distance from the subject and aperture will have the same depth of field.

So put your camera on a tripod. Shoot a non-moving subject with your 85mm 1.2L II, your 85mm 1.8, your 70-200mm 2.8L and your 70-200mm 2.8L IS at 2.8 (the zooms should obviously be set at 85mm) and you will have the same depth of field.

Depth of field can be calculated and is a mathmatical equation. I've never done that, but you get to know what it will be like with certain things - especially if you shoot lots of macros.

---

Apparently I don't have a complete grasp of DoF as this didn't make entire sense to me. I understand that DoF is determined by the aperture and the wider it is, the thinner the DoF is (and vice versa). I don't understand how the focal length plays a role in it. You're saying an 85mm lens shooting at 1.2 and a 70-200mm (set to 85mm) at 2.8 will have the same DoF?

Three main parts to calculating DOF:

1. Focal Length. The longer the focal length, the shallower the DOF.
2. Distance to the subject. The closer the subject is to the lens, the shallower the DOF.
3. Aperture. More light gets let in, the shallower the DOF.

So this is my 150mm 2.8 Macro on my 5D mark II.




I am about 1' foot away from the rings. 150mm and 2.8 aperture set.
My depth of field is just millimeters deep.

An 85mm 1.2L can give you really shallow DOF. If you are 10 feet away, and shooting wide open, your DOF is just 1/3rd of a foot. So even though the aperture is smaller, the DOF is deeper than that macro shot.

But if you stand 10 feet away and shoot a 200mm 2.8 lens at a subject, your DOF will be about an inch. So at the same distance and smaller aperture, the DOF gets shallower because of the longer focal length.

quote:

---

I found this on page 35 from about a year ago:

GS

quote:

---

Two different lenses of the same focal length, distance from the subject and aperture will have the same depth of field.

So put your camera on a tripod. Shoot a non-moving subject with your 85mm 1.2L II, your 85mm 1.8, your 70-200mm 2.8L and your 70-200mm 2.8L IS at 2.8 (the zooms should obviously be set at 85mm) and you will have the same depth of field.

---

Apparently I don't have a complete grasp of DoF as this didn't make entire sense to me. I understand that DoF is determined by the aperture and the wider it is, the thinner the DoF is (and vice versa). I don't understand how the focal length plays a role in it. You're saying an 85mm lens shooting at 1.2 and a 70-200mm (set to 85mm) at 2.8 will have the same DoF?

---

I think you didn't quite catch all of what GS wrote in your quote. It probably wasn't real clear what he was trying to say, but he meant if all of those lenses are at the same f stop, distance, and focal length, the DOF will be the same.

quote:

---

Two different lenses of the same focal length, distance from the subject and aperture will have the same depth of field.

---

In his example I think he meant for each lens to be at f2.8, not at their respective max aperture.

Just got my 430EX II in the mail today and I am having a bit of trouble. I've read through the manual and understand most of it (without being able to experiment for myself) . My problem is when I try to use it on my camera it only randomly fires. I understand there is a recycle time, but I am using 4 brand new AA Duracells. What's more concerning is the pilot light is constantly lit red, even when it can't fire. I thought it should only light after it refreshes and is ready? It is constantly on and I can press it to test fire repeatedly OFF the camera and it works, but on the camera it test fires, stays lit, and then the button is unresponsive. It stays unresponsive for a while and then it allows me to test fire again. Is that how it is supposed to function? Aren't I supposed to know somehow when it's refreshed?

Looking through the camera I can see the flash icon at the bottom left a very small amount of the time. If I take one picture with the flash, the red light stays lit, but I the icon won't reappear for at least 30 seconds. Is that normal?