Kendall set that up. That's not how Logan operates. He would setup her up to fail in some other way.

It's a show that's literally about lying and deceit. That's all these characters do. Also, Logan could have very easily just told someone to disrupt the town hall without being the one to choose the song/method. I'm not saying I believe it, I'm just saying that's how I read it in the moment.

Pretty please?

I had no intention of discussion it further. Just calling out your hypocrisy, that's all.

are any of you guys listening to the prestige tv podcast on the ringer? sean fennessey and joanna robinson do a pretty good recap of the latest episode on wednesdays and joanna interviews a cast member. so far, she's talked to brian cox, alan ruck and sarah snook.

pretty interesting listen.

I still need to listen to this week's episode, but the first two were great. They have the best analysis by far.

jackie childs said:

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are any of you guys listening to the prestige tv podcast on the ringer? sean fennessey and joanna robinson do a pretty good recap of the latest episode on wednesdays and joanna interviews a cast member. so far, she's talked to brian cox, alan ruck and sarah snook.

pretty interesting listen.

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I like Joanna Robinson's takes, but Sean Fennessey doesn't do it for me on this one. I do like their recap though overall. Due to Andy Greenwald's continued presence I can't bring myself to listen to The Watch.

Question: How does Greg still work for Waystar? Isn't everyone aware that he provided Ken with the incriminating papers? Or does only Tom know? I know Greg told Tom he wasn't "necessarily" involved, as a means to try and remain neutral, but I'm still a bit confused on this plot point, because wouldn't Greg spending the entire day after the press conference with Ken be reason enough to raise suspicion or for Logan to fire him? And wasn't it Gerri/Tom who sent the lawyer to represent Greg, thus Waystar knows he's involved somehow?

This makes no sense whatsoever to me.

Anagrammatic Nudist said:

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This show isn't about sneaky red herrings and other nonsense mysteries. Why are folks trying to turn it into this?

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Bingo. However I do still stick to Tom having sent the donuts. (Though at this point I doubt it's ever mentioned again.)

You can't just fire someone on suspicions alone. They'd need a legal reason to do so.

TCTTS said:

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Question: How does Greg still work for Waystar? Isn't everyone aware that he provided Ken with the incriminating papers? Or does only Tom know? I know Greg told Tom he wasn't "necessarily" involved, as a means to try and remain neutral, but I'm still a bit confused on this plot point, because wouldn't Greg spending the entire day after the press conference with Ken be reason enough to raise suspicion or for Logan to fire him? And wasn't it Gerri/Tom who sent the lawyer to represent Greg, thus Waystar knows he's involved somehow?

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I really have no ****ing clue what is going on in this show.

Other than a ****ton of F bombs.

But I like it.

BowSowy said:

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TCTTS said:

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Question: How does Greg still work for Waystar? Isn't everyone aware that he provided Ken with the incriminating papers? Or does only Tom know? I know Greg told Tom he wasn't "necessarily" involved, as a means to try and remain neutral, but I'm still a bit confused on this plot point, because wouldn't Greg spending the entire day after the press conference with Ken be reason enough to raise suspicion or for Logan to fire him? And wasn't it Gerri/Tom who sent the lawyer to represent Greg, thus Waystar knows he's involved somehow?

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I'll chalk that up to the same reason they can't fire Ken. Firing a whistleblower in the midst of an investigation really doesn't look good.

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I never really thought of Greg as a whistleblower, but yeah, he is, and this makes total sense. I guess I just figured Logan would have found a way to freeze his credentials/access or whatever, seeing as Greg is basically Team Kendall, and that's what he did to Ken. After so many scenes of him being with Ken, I was just surprised to see Greg still working at Waystar. It caught me off guard. It makes sense from a corporate standpoint, it's just not what I was expecting.

Brian Earl Spilner said:

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This makes no sense whatsoever to me.

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My post makes no sense to you, or you share my confusion?

The theory itself.

Logan would be cutting off his nose to spite his face. Not to mention the choice of song, seeing the stuff in Ken's office, and him actually saying he needs them to go buy stuff.

I think you're getting way too clever and it's just not that kind of show.

The donuts thing is actually pretty reasonable if you see that original post I made. And the show never really showed us what happened there.

Sorry, I assumed you were responding to my post directly above, not the one from earlier.

That said, I read what you posted and have watched that final sequence twice since then, and don't at all think it implicates Tom in any way. The way they describe that sequence, and the way it's actually cut, don't really match up.

TCTTS said:

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BowSowy said:

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TCTTS said:

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Question: How does Greg still work for Waystar? Isn't everyone aware that he provided Ken with the incriminating papers? Or does only Tom know? I know Greg told Tom he wasn't "necessarily" involved, as a means to try and remain neutral, but I'm still a bit confused on this plot point, because wouldn't Greg spending the entire day after the press conference with Ken be reason enough to raise suspicion or for Logan to fire him? And wasn't it Gerri/Tom who sent the lawyer to represent Greg, thus Waystar knows he's involved somehow?

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I'll chalk that up to the same reason they can't fire Ken. Firing a whistleblower in the midst of an investigation really doesn't look good.

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I never really thought of Greg as a whistleblower, but yeah, he is, and this makes total sense. I guess I just figured Logan would have found a way to freeze his credentials/access or whatever, seeing as Greg is basically Team Kendall, and that's what he did to Ken. After so many scenes of him being with Ken, I was just surprised to see Greg still working at Waystar. It caught me off guard. It makes sense from a corporate standpoint, it's just not what I was expecting.

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This is a good question.

Not firing a whistleblower (or potential whistleblower) makes sense in the real world. but we've seen Logan do whatever he wants with little regard for the law or corporate governance before, so I think if Logan truly believed Greg was working to bring him down, he'd fire him, cut off access, etc.

Plus we don't know what (if anything) Tom is telling Logan. If you're Tom and you directed an employee under your supervision to shred a bunch of incriminating files, it would make sense to try and keep him close and not just can him. not to mention even though Greg appears to be Team Kendall, he is still calling Tom with information too (like Ken's coming to the office).

i guess the bottom line is that I think both sides think Greg is "in play", so neither would do anything to jeopardize that...although kendall not buying him the watch was an odd/bad decision.

If Logan suspects Greg, strategically he absolutely wouldn't cut him off. Keep your enemies close. At this point Greg doesn't have additional access to anything the FBI doesn't, so may as well keep him in the fold and try to manipulate him as needed. All firing him would do is cement him going to Team Kendall.

jackie childs said:

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TCTTS said:

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BowSowy said:

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TCTTS said:

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Question: How does Greg still work for Waystar? Isn't everyone aware that he provided Ken with the incriminating papers? Or does only Tom know? I know Greg told Tom he wasn't "necessarily" involved, as a means to try and remain neutral, but I'm still a bit confused on this plot point, because wouldn't Greg spending the entire day after the press conference with Ken be reason enough to raise suspicion or for Logan to fire him? And wasn't it Gerri/Tom who sent the lawyer to represent Greg, thus Waystar knows he's involved somehow?

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I'll chalk that up to the same reason they can't fire Ken. Firing a whistleblower in the midst of an investigation really doesn't look good.

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I never really thought of Greg as a whistleblower, but yeah, he is, and this makes total sense. I guess I just figured Logan would have found a way to freeze his credentials/access or whatever, seeing as Greg is basically Team Kendall, and that's what he did to Ken. After so many scenes of him being with Ken, I was just surprised to see Greg still working at Waystar. It caught me off guard. It makes sense from a corporate standpoint, it's just not what I was expecting.

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This is a good question.

Not firing a whistleblower (or potential whistleblower) makes sense in the real world. but we've seen Logan do whatever he wants with little regard for the law or corporate governance before, so I think if Logan truly believed Greg was working to bring him down, he'd fire him, cut off access, etc.

Plus we don't know what (if anything) Tom is telling Logan. If you're Tom and you directed an employee under your supervision to shred a bunch of incriminating files, it would make sense to try and keep him close and not just can him. not to mention even though Greg appears to be Team Kendall, he is still calling Tom with information too (like Ken's coming to the office).

i guess the bottom line is that I think both sides think Greg is "in play", so neither would do anything to jeopardize that...although kendall not buying him the watch was an odd/bad decision.

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I think part of the reason is that no one takes Greg seriously. They don't realize they should care what he is doing. Which is going to make whatever his eventual (completely accidental) play so devastating.

so i waited until season 3 started to do my re-watch of the first two seasons. some interesting things thus far...

1. i forgot what a raging a-hole Connor is during the Roy gala event. it was weird compared to how we see him now and, honestly, even a couple of episodes later in season 1.

2. right after the vote of no-confidence fails, Logan leaks stories about Kendall relapsing and it causes issues with Rava. that's not surprising, but what was is that at Connor's ranch, Shiv talks about her dad leaking stories about Kendall as thought it's the worst thing ever. funny to see her just two seasons later doing the same thing her daddy did.

Good catch.

So they've gone and made Shiv completely unlikable and unredeemable huh? She has been for a while but it's next level now. She might be my least favorite person on the show.

Brian Earl Spilner said:

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So they've gone and made Shiv completely unlikable and unredeemable huh? She has been for a while but it's next level now. She might be my least favorite person on the show.

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I was so happy to see everyone ice her out. I genuinely don't know how this plays out. I thought it was interesting to see Connor use leverage for the first time, and I'm curious if that was coincidental with Greg going over to the Waystar side.

I bet "Nero and Sporus" has been googled a few times this morning.

Brian Earl Spilner said:

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So they've gone and made Shiv completely unlikable and unredeemable huh? She has been for a while but it's next level now. She might be my least favorite person on the show.

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mine too.

i mean, they're all terrible in their own way. but shiv has done some absolutely terrible stuff and still thinks she's God's gift to Waystar. it is somewhat rewarding to see her getting so little respect, Connor calling her out for "playing post office" and then Logan telling her to stand down.

i guess we'll see how she reacts to that over the coming weeks.

jackie childs said:

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Brian Earl Spilner said:

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So they've gone and made Shiv completely unlikable and unredeemable huh? She has been for a while but it's next level now. She might be my least favorite person on the show.

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mine too.

i mean, they're all terrible in their own way. but shiv has done some absolutely terrible stuff and still thinks she's God's gift to Waystar. it is somewhat rewarding to see her getting so little respect, Connor calling her out for "playing post office" and then Logan telling her to stand down.

i guess we'll see how she reacts to that over the coming weeks.

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She has certainly put herself into an unenviable position. I don't think she's anymore unlikable or unredeemable as anyone else on the show, but for the first couple of seasons her attempt to hold herself above the bull**** has made her break bad seem especially rough. Whatever happens a complete piece of **** is going to "win."

IMO she's the most unrealistic character arc on the show. I get that much of the show involves the kids making the same mistakes time and time again, but Shiv was supposedly too smart to fall for all her Dad's bull**** and instead decided to carve her own path... Then she jumps at the chance the first time Logan dangles the CEO title.

Then she finds out it was bull***** OK. Lesson learned (even though she claimed she had already learned it).

Nope. Here we are again with her thinking her father is being upfront with her.