*** SW: The Last Jedi - FULL SPOILERS BE IN HERE ***

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Beat40
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12:45p, 1/3/18
I know I posted this in the other Star Wars thread, but I think this is more TLJ specific.

I watched Star Wars two nights ago and had a thought. When Vader strikes down Obi-wan, does he really strike him down or does Obi-wan just become one with the force?

We see Obi-wan's cloak fall to the ground the same as we see Luke's cloak fall to the ground after he become one with the force.

Just an observation I had in all of this talk of Rian Johnson completely disregarding the OT. Maybe he always viewed that scene with Vader and Obi-wan as Obi-wan becoming one with the force rather than being struck down. Maybe he also interpreted Yoda doing the same. In this line of thinking, it makes complete sense for Luke to go out as the other great jedi masters.

It was really cool to hear Obi-wan explain the force to Luke and then remember how Luke explained it to Rey. Also very cool to hear Obi-wan tell Luke to reach out with his feelings when he puts on the helmet and then get almost the exact same line when Luke tells Rey to reach out.

I'm going to watch ESB either tonight or tomorrow night. Will be cool to see how ESB and TLJ are connected. I think they are more connected than people are willing to acknowledge.
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fig96
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In reply to cbr • 12:45p, 1/3/18
AG
cbr said:
You must have missed my prior posts... the effort to push sjw bull**** was intrusive, but the RESULT was actually a mockery of that agenda. All the sj heroes in the movies absolutely sucked and failed, leaving the white guy in charge, LOL.

Thus, this was only a minor annoyance in an otherwise bad movie. I just harped on your post because you were belittling other people for making the same point. They are right, IMO so I jumped in.

My point is they shouldnt be peddling political agendas in movies to this extent.
So if it was all white guys and someone said they wished there was more diversity, would you say that you understood their point of view and that would be nice or tell them to stop being sensitive and get over it?

Also, you'd appear a lot more level and reasonable if you didn't use every derogatory liberal name you can think of in your posts.
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redline248
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In reply to The Collective • 12:46p, 1/3/18
AG
Quote:
Thoughts?
I think I'm not wasting 23 mins on that
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Zombie Jon Snow
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In reply to Brian Earl Spilner • 12:48p, 1/3/18
AG
Brian Earl Spilner said:
From a certain point of view, sure.

From my point of view, your reaction to this so-called liberal agenda being pushed on you is both ridiculous and sad.

You have every right to hate the movie, though, so have at it. I don't know how you'll make it through another year attending movies though. You may want to give them up altogether, considering all the female-led movies we got last year.

And more coming.......

I have to admit I'm excited though about Oceans 8........

my daughter is (likely) in it. she had a part as a runway model in the main scene of the movie (the heist). shot for 10 days at the Met in NYC and got to meet most of the stars at one time or another. No speaking lines but she should be visible unless they just cut everything but it's the main scene. She had close proximity to Sandra Bullock and Sarah Paulson in particular in some scenes and also Anne Hathaway some.



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Urban Ag
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In reply to DannyDuberstein • 12:50p, 1/3/18
AG
DannyDuberstein said:
I'm not all caught up in the SJW stuff, but I do think it's pretty obvious it is a high priority for Disney to interject into this film. You can see it in decisions they made both with the film and external to the film. Did it ruin the film for me? No. But I do think it greased the skids to some of the bigger mistakes they made with this film that kept it from being great.
Agreed. They're trying to do to much to the detriment of the overall film. It's unneeded. And honestly, if they're trying to push an agenda (come on, it's Disney) I don't think they are even doing a very effective job. The casino planet was just too unneeded, and frankly dumb, to have any impact. The diversity of the human characters is a total non issue for me. My issue is that they suck. They're undeveloped, uninteresting, and don't connect with the audience. The girl power theme did go a little over the top. But that said, if they had more intriguing characters few would be complaining. the Laura Dern character comes out of nowhere with no back story, looks ridiculous, emasculates Poe, presides over a ridiculous plan while unnecessarily shielding everyone from her true intent. Just dumb.

Rogue One had a very diverse cast (as far as the R1 team is concerned) and it worked (in my opinion). Not because they were diverse but because they were great characters.
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bangobango
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1:00p, 1/3/18
AG
This is forty minutes long, and it is probably 30+ minutes before he even talks about The Last Jedi, but this is a really, really in depth look at why I think The Last Jedi failed with many long time Star Wars fans, and really what is wrong with the way Disney is treating the series in all the new movies. Collville does a much more tactful job of explaining why so many people feel like this movie is "destroying" their childhood.

Like Collville, I agree that The Last Jedi is an "enjoyable" movie, but it failed miserably with the refrigerator test for me.

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TexasAggie_02
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1:18p, 1/3/18
AG
lol, at 35 mins he says he liked the idea of the old "Republic, any republic. I'd sure like to live in one..."

um, you do, buddy.
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Beat40
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In reply to bangobango • 1:20p, 1/3/18
bangobango said:
This is forty minutes long, and it is probably 30+ minutes before he even talks about The Last Jedi, but this is a really, really in depth look at why I think The Last Jedi failed with many long time Star Wars fans, and really what is wrong with the way Disney is treating the series in all the new movies. Collville does a much more tactful job of explaining why so many people feel like this movie is "destroying" their childhood.

Like Collville, I agree that The Last Jedi is an "enjoyable" movie, but it failed miserably with the refrigerator test for me.

The part in bold - I get this. Personally, I think most people who feel this movie destroyed their childhood is because they went into the movie with expectations about what Luke had to do. Anything less than a grand light saber dual was not going to be acceptable.
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cbr
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In reply to fig96 • 1:24p, 1/3/18
AG
fig96 said:
cbr said:
You must have missed my prior posts... the effort to push sjw bull**** was intrusive, but the RESULT was actually a mockery of that agenda. All the sj heroes in the movies absolutely sucked and failed, leaving the white guy in charge, LOL.

Thus, this was only a minor annoyance in an otherwise bad movie. I just harped on your post because you were belittling other people for making the same point. They are right, IMO so I jumped in.

My point is they shouldnt be peddling political agendas in movies to this extent.
So if it was all white guys and someone said they wished there was more diversity, would you say that you understood their point of view and that would be nice or tell them to stop being sensitive and get over it?

Also, you'd appear a lot more level and reasonable if you didn't use every derogatory liberal name you can think of in your posts.
im not trying to 'appear' level headed or reasonable. i am level and reasonable for my clients, friends and family.... this is a message board and i dont bother worrying about how someone will take it, i just speak bluntly.

frankly, i am not even what most people would call a 'conservative', politically...

to answer your question, i would not tell them to stop being sensitive and get over it. that is sort of the point.

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fig96
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In reply to cbr • 1:31p, 1/3/18
AG
cbr said:
fig96 said:
cbr said:
You must have missed my prior posts... the effort to push sjw bull**** was intrusive, but the RESULT was actually a mockery of that agenda. All the sj heroes in the movies absolutely sucked and failed, leaving the white guy in charge, LOL.

Thus, this was only a minor annoyance in an otherwise bad movie. I just harped on your post because you were belittling other people for making the same point. They are right, IMO so I jumped in.

My point is they shouldnt be peddling political agendas in movies to this extent.
So if it was all white guys and someone said they wished there was more diversity, would you say that you understood their point of view and that would be nice or tell them to stop being sensitive and get over it?

Also, you'd appear a lot more level and reasonable if you didn't use every derogatory liberal name you can think of in your posts.
im not trying to 'appear' level headed or reasonable. i am level and reasonable for my clients, friends and family.... this is a message board and i dont bother worrying about how someone will take it, i just speak bluntly.

frankly, i am not even what most people would call a 'conservative', politically...

to answer your question, i would not tell them to stop being sensitive and get over it. that is sort of the point.
You miss the point about terminology. It's not about "appearing" any certain way, it's about being able to engage in reasonable discussion. When I, and I imagine others, see you fire off "SJW yadda yadda" I proceed to discount anything else you say. If the point is discussion you're failing.

And then what is the point? That you understand why people would want more representation in these films? Because that sure isn't the tone of your comments.
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VanZandt92
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In reply to bangobango • 1:31p, 1/3/18
bangobango said:
This is forty minutes long, and it is probably 30+ minutes before he even talks about The Last Jedi, but this is a really, really in depth look at why I think The Last Jedi failed with many long time Star Wars fans, and really what is wrong with the way Disney is treating the series in all the new movies. Collville does a much more tactful job of explaining why so many people feel like this movie is "destroying" their childhood.

Like Collville, I agree that The Last Jedi is an "enjoyable" movie, but it failed miserably with the refrigerator test for me.

Look at this dudes office. Damn I'd love to have time to play some role playing games.
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bangobango
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In reply to VanZandt92 • 1:41p, 1/3/18
AG
VanZandt92 said:

Look at this dudes office. Damn I'd love to have time to play some role playing games.
He is a game designer and author. He knows a **** ton about table top games and geek culture in general.
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VanZandt92
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In reply to Brian Earl Spilner • 1:43p, 1/3/18
Brian Earl Spilner said:
Nothing is sadder to me than people who get their jimmies rustled by "lib" agendas in film.

Why do you care?

Their plot was a weak point in the film, I agree, but calling it out as a liberal thing is just so dumb. You guys need to learn to separate entertainment from your own personal political views.
Yep. This was my thinking. I saw a few things coming that one could consider agenda, but that can be expected and I didn't find it a problem. There are entire books devoted to Disney movie morals, believe it or not. I'm interested in seeing how ESPN and Disney have trended over the years, but the Star Wars component didn't bother me. As far as it being aimed at Trump, I think that is projection. I didn't see it.
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cbr
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In reply to fig96 • 1:44p, 1/3/18
AG
there is a huge - in fact infinite - difference between heroic characters of other races and genders, who do things ethically, and right, and win....

versus snotty *****es signalling every leftist 'bernie sanders rally' look and behavioral type, that take up screen time dressing down white male characters in condescending fashion, being two faced and smug about it, but ultimately losing confidence of their subordinates, and causing their deaths in a big ass-sucking plot turn, and leaving the guy that was *****ed out in charge.

i love a good strong female lead. a good strong lead of other races doesnt even register with me, i just enjoy the story. but this crap was annoying and hilarious at the same time, in an off-putting way.
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fig96
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In reply to cbr • 1:46p, 1/3/18
AG
cbr said:
there is a huge - in fact infinite - difference between heroic characters of other races and genders, who do things ethically, and right, and win....

versus snotty *****es signalling every leftist 'bernie sanders rally' look and behavioral type, that take up screen time dressing down white male characters in condescending fashion, being two faced and smug about it, but ultimately losing confidence of their subordinates, and causing their deaths in a big ass-sucking plot turn, and leaving the guy that was *****ed out in charge.

i love a good strong female lead. a good strong lead of other races doesnt even register with me, i just enjoy the story. but this crap was annoying and hilarious at the same time, in an off-putting way.
Discussion not possible, roger that.
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VanZandt92
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In reply to bangobango • 1:47p, 1/3/18
bangobango said:
This is forty minutes long, and it is probably 30+ minutes before he even talks about The Last Jedi, but this is a really, really in depth look at why I think The Last Jedi failed with many long time Star Wars fans, and really what is wrong with the way Disney is treating the series in all the new movies. Collville does a much more tactful job of explaining why so many people feel like this movie is "destroying" their childhood.

Like Collville, I agree that The Last Jedi is an "enjoyable" movie, but it failed miserably with the refrigerator test for me.

I cannot get this to play. Anybody else having problems? Looks like maybe the hospital I work at has it blocked duno.
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cbr
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In reply to fig96 • 2:04p, 1/3/18
AG
i guess that is the ultimate definition of triggered. off to your safe space!
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fig96
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In reply to cbr • 2:10p, 1/3/18
AG
cbr said:
i guess that is the ultimate definition of triggered. off to your safe space!
Or it's recognition that "snotty *****es signalling every leftist 'bernie sanders rally' look and behavioral type" makes it obvious you don't have a desire to actually discuss anything.

I'd wager your repeated use of condescending terminology says more about you than it does about me.
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Flashdiaz
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2:10p, 1/3/18
AG
so, if there was some big hidden agenda to teach Poe a lesson, what's the agenda in having him in charge at the end of the movie? Wouldn't they want a female in charge again at then end?
Also, why not reveal Phasma was a female, because she's evil?

trying to follow along here.


this thread sucks now.
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redline248
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2:13p, 1/3/18
AG
You know, it's interesting you bring up Poe being in charge. Leia is still the general (and I know we know Carrie is gone). So, with there only being about a dozen resistance members escaping Crait, why wouldn't the creator of the resistance, and the highest ranking member not still be in charge? Guess she just decided to retire on the spot?
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cbr
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In reply to fig96 • 2:16p, 1/3/18
AG
its the same condescending tone the movie took... get my point?
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Liquid Wrench
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2:20p, 1/3/18
Does it even matter who's in charge of the resistance now? We're gonna have to wait a while for those three little slave children on Casino World to be ready to sacrifice themselves. I guess maybe the force can teach them how to pilot anything at any age.
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TexasAggie_02
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In reply to redline248 • 2:23p, 1/3/18
AG
redline248 said:
You know, it's interesting you bring up Poe being in charge. Leia is still the general (and I know we know Carrie is gone). So, with there only being about a dozen resistance members escaping Crait, why wouldn't the creator of the resistance, and the highest ranking member not still be in charge? Guess she just decided to retire on the spot?
towards the end when they were trying to figure out how to get out of the mine, they all look at Leia, and she gestures to Poe and says something to the effect of "we'll follow you" (don't remember the exact wording)
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redline248
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In reply to TexasAggie_02 • 2:26p, 1/3/18
AG
I know what happened (she said "why are you looking at me."), I'm asking why would he really be in charge after that? He's a few hours from being demoted in rank, and starting a mutiny...but everyone is going to follow him and not keep going to Leia, now?
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Flashdiaz
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In reply to redline248 • 2:30p, 1/3/18
AG
redline248 said:
I know what happened (she said "why are you looking at me."), I'm asking why would he really be in charge after that? He's a few hours from being demoted in rank, and starting a mutiny...but everyone is going to follow him and not keep going to Leia, now?
they did turn to Leia, she said to follow him. Not much to choose from at this point.
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VanZandt92
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2:30p, 1/3/18
Man Colville's video is like 44 minutes long. Don't know if I can listen that long. Dude can talk.
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Brian Earl Spilner
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2:31p, 1/3/18
AG
I thought that was a cool little moment at the end. And oddly appropriate, considering the circumstances.

We may not have lost Leia, but we saw the moment she deferred to Poe and essentially handed him the Resistance.
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fig96
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In reply to cbr • 2:35p, 1/3/18
AG
cbr said:
its the same condescending tone the movie took... get my point?
I didn't notice any difference in tone from your regular posts, so no.
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Beat40
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2:49p, 1/3/18
Well, this thread has taken a turn for the worst.
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Beat40
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In reply to Brian Earl Spilner • 2:51p, 1/3/18
Brian Earl Spilner said:
I thought that was a cool little moment at the end. And oddly appropriate, considering the circumstances.

We may not have lost Leia, but we saw the moment she deferred to Poe and essentially handed him the Resistance.
I enjoyed that she gave him the resistance. I think Poe is going to have a significant role in Episode 9 and will have his legacy cemented as a badass. I just get this feeling.
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Bunk Moreland
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In reply to Flashdiaz • 2:52p, 1/3/18
Flashdiaz said:
redline248 said:
I know what happened (she said "why are you looking at me."), I'm asking why would he really be in charge after that? He's a few hours from being demoted in rank, and starting a mutiny...but everyone is going to follow him and not keep going to Leia, now?
they did turn to Leia, she said to follow him. Not much to choose from at this point.

Yeah...I mean leadership neutered Poe, made him out to be a dumb fool, then at the end said "go follow that guy."

Why would the resistance ever question him as their leader?
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The Collective
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3:03p, 1/3/18
AG
Leia slapped Poe. Makes me think they have a mother / son type of relationship. It might have been interesting to develop that more and create some conflict with Kylo.
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The Collective
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In reply to Bunk Moreland • 3:04p, 1/3/18
AG
Fortunately, most people who saw that are dead. So no big deal, right?
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Brian Earl Spilner
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4:17p, 1/3/18
AG
I'm looking forward to a Poe and Kylo reunion.

"I see you decided to get rid of that thing. Now we actually understand what the hell you're saying. Your mom says hi."
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TCTTS
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In reply to The Collective • 4:23p, 1/3/18
AG
CJS4715 said:
Thoughts?
Thought that actually made some great points. A little weirdly edited/presented, but he gives a good argument.
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