***** Official 2017 Astros Off Season Thread *****

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irish pete ag06
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In reply to Farmer1906 • 8:25p, 12/3/16
AG
aggie1906 said:
Lets slow the hype train. We have a line up full of solid bats, but outside of Altuve non are great at this point. Beltran is the closest thing and I don't think he matches 2016. We need Bregman to be like the non slumping one. We need Correa to take that next step. We need Gurriel to be more Cuban league. And Gattis to be catcher Gattis not DH Gattis.
That lineup is insanely good. Maybe Altuve is the only truly "great" hitter on there capable of putting up MVP type numbers, but when you can roll out a lineup that features 1-2 guys that are in the 130-150 wRC+ range, then a few guys in the 110-130 range, then virtually every other spot in your lineup is at least league average (100 wRC+), that's a great lineup.

This lineup will easily finish top 5. I would be willing to wager top 3 if there are no major injuries.
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Ag_07
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In reply to Farmer1906 • 8:28p, 12/3/16
AG
What exactly makes you so skeptical on Beltran?

He improved in 2015 and then again in 2016 and showed only a slight drop when he was moved to Texas. He's only had one season since 2012 in which he didn't play over 130 games.

And don't say age because he was 39.5 when he put up his 2016 numbers and will be 40 when he starts 2017
6 months of offseason time is nothing.

And how many teams have multiple GREAT bats in the lineup like Altuve? Seems most have lots of solid bats with a couple of great ones mixed in.
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irish pete ag06
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8:40p, 12/3/16
AG
To expand on my previous post...



Outside of Valbuena, those guy accounted for below average offense altogether. The guys basically replacing them all were above average offensively. A combined 87 wRC+ goes to a combined 111 wRC+. Those guys could literally all regress and still be better offensively than those guys that are now gone.

There will several lineups this year that will have a guy batting 9 hole that would have been our 5th or 6th best hitter last year (I'm thinking Aoki will bat 9 hole a lot)
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Farmer1906
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In reply to Ag_07 • 9:25p, 12/3/16
AG
Ag_07 said:
What exactly makes you so skeptical on Beltran?

He improved in 2015 and then again in 2016 and showed only a slight drop when he was moved to Texas. He's only had one season since 2012 in which he didn't play over 130 games.

And don't say age because he was 39.5 when he put up his 2016 numbers and will be 40 when he starts 2017
6 months of offseason time is nothing.

And how many teams have multiple GREAT bats in the lineup like Altuve? Seems most have lots of solid bats with a couple of great ones mixed in.
He's 40 years old! To expect him to decline is madness. Better younger healthier players have fallen off faster. Time waits for no one.

I'm not saying we have to have a line up full of Altuves, but most good hitting teams have a duo of high end hitters. Boston had Papi & Betts. Cubs has Bryant & Rizzo. Jays had(?) Donaldson & Encarnacion. I think we need someone else to step up and be Altuve's robin. We have plenty of guys who could, but we need them to actually do it.
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Farmer1906
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In reply to irish pete ag06 • 9:28p, 12/3/16
AG


This makes me so happy. Our lack of weaknesses will be so enjoyable.
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Nuke LaLoosh
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5:46a, 12/4/16
AG
I still don't trust our pitching staff, and I'd rather make a deal now than at the deadline. Oh well - we will see how it plays out.
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Farmer1906
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8:53a, 12/4/16
AG
Quote:
In addition to the previously reported Chris Sale, the Astros have interest in Rays ace Chris Archer, per Fanrag's Jon Heyman. There's skepticism around the game that the Rays would trade Archer, though. The right-hander is under team control through 2021 at eminently affordable rates.
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k20dub
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10:03a, 12/4/16
AG
Via MLB trade rumors:

The Astros are willing to listen to offers for catcher/designated Evan Gattis and right-hander Collin McHugh, per Cafardo. Gattis, who has two years of team control left and will make $5.2MM in 2017, has perhaps become movable with the Astros having added catcher Brian McCann and DH/outfielder Carlos Beltran this offseason. The Astros don't seem as well off in their rotation, even after signing Charlie Morton, and the 29-year-old McHugh led the team in innings pitched (184 1/3) this past season and posted decent numbers (4.34 ERA, 8.63 K/9, 2.63 BB/9). MLBTR contributor Matt Swartz projects a $4.6MM salary in 2017 for McHugh, who will make his first of three trips through arbitration
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Mr.Bond
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10:12a, 12/4/16
AG
Don't trade the lumberjack!!!!
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Sq16Aggie2006
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10:22a, 12/4/16
Why the hell would we buy McCann just to trade Gattis? Platooning Gattis between Catcher and DH with Beltran and McCann makes too much sense.
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irish pete ag06
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In reply to Sq16Aggie2006 • 10:34a, 12/4/16
AG
Sq16Aggie2006 said:
Why the hell would we buy McCann just to trade Gattis? Platooning Gattis between Catcher and DH with Beltran and McCann makes too much sense.


Willing to listen is not the same as a trade being imminent.

Maybe they are trying to sell high if they don't think Gattis can recreate those numbers. It would be selling low on McHugh in my opinion. All his peripherals suggest he was better than last year'a results.
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Sq16Aggie2006
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In reply to irish pete ag06 • 10:35a, 12/4/16
irish pete ag06 said:
Sq16Aggie2006 said:
Why the hell would we buy McCann just to trade Gattis? Platooning Gattis between Catcher and DH with Beltran and McCann makes too much sense.


Willing to listen is not the same as a trade being imminent.

Maybe they are trying to sell high if they don't think Gattis can recreate those numbers. It would be selling low on McHugh in my opinion. All his peripherals suggest he was better than last year'a results.


Yeah the McHugh thing is weird, I think it would damage an already ramshackle rotation, and his peripherals make him a great deal at the 4.6 arbitration number
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Farmer1906
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10:36a, 12/4/16
AG
As long as all 3 play 90% of the time between C, DH, 1B, & LF then it makes sense to pay 38M for the 3 next year.

If they don't have that in the plans then I could see trading one away.

The only reason it makes sense to trade McHugh is if he's in a package for a high end starter. At this point he's our #3 and can eat up innings.
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Ag_07
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10:41a, 12/4/16
AG
Needing help in the rotation but dealing McHugh makes no sense to me. He's a decent #3 option in the rotation.
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iBrad
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10:55a, 12/4/16
AG
I think listening to offers helps teams feel out the market a little better. And sometimes, a deal comes along that's too good to pass up.

Also, could a Gattis and/or McHugh trade land any prospects that could potentially be flipped to help finalize a trade for a Sale or Archer type of rotation piece? Could they be part of three-team deal?

I'd be upset if we didn't have an active front office exploring all avenues to help improve the team.
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Sea Gull
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In reply to Ag_07 • 1:06p, 12/4/16
AG
Ag_07 said:
Needing help in the rotation but dealing McHugh makes no sense to me. He's a decent #3 option in the rotation.


Maybe they think McHugh is due to get hurt lol. They've had a pretty good record of trading folks before they get hurt...
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Farmer1906
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1:13p, 12/4/16
AG

Quote:
After agreeing to sign outfielder/designated hitter Carlos Beltran on Saturday, Astros owner Jim Crane told Mark Berman of FOX 26 that the team will go into the winter meetings seeking pitching, but it's unlikely to make any "big moves" (Twitter link). That would seem to rule out a Sale acquisition for Houston.
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Nuke LaLoosh
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5:50p, 12/4/16
AG
Trading mchugh makes no sense. If we don't have an ace, we need as many warm bodies to throw at SP as we can get.

Btw, everything about Green Bay was fantastic besides the sorry ass Texans.
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Farmer1906
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In reply to Nuke LaLoosh • 5:52p, 12/4/16
AG
Nuke LaLoosh said:
Trading mchugh makes no sense. If we don't have an ace, we need as many warm bodies to throw at SP as we can get.

Btw, everything about Green Bay was fantastic besides the sorry ass Texans.
Weather?
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gougler08
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In reply to Farmer1906 • 5:54p, 12/4/16
AG
aggie1906 said:
Nuke LaLoosh said:
Trading mchugh makes no sense. If we don't have an ace, we need as many warm bodies to throw at SP as we can get.

Btw, everything about Green Bay was fantastic besides the sorry ass Texans.
Weather?


Still snowing up here but I'm glad it's like this, makes it feel like a true Lambeau game
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Farmer1906
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5:54p, 12/4/16
AG

Quote:
The Yankees are close to a deal with left fielder Matt Holliday, WFAN's Sweeny Murti reports
With the Astros signing Beltran, Yankees signing Holliday, and Sox backing off of Edwin (as of few days ago) does it look like he'll be staying in Canada? Maybe his price is going down.
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Ag_07
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In reply to Farmer1906 • 6:28p, 12/4/16
AG
Probably. Think clubs are tired of waiting around. His people wanted to go to the winter meetings to start a big biding war and everyone said 'F that I'll just sign this guy'. Think they overplayed it and missed out.

And it also seems the CWS won't be trading Sale. We're out, Texas says it's out, and ATL doesn't want to give up Swanson. They're going to realize if they want to move him they won't ask for an entire farm system.
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irish pete ag06
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In reply to Ag_07 • 6:31p, 12/4/16
AG
Ag_07 said:
Probably. Think clubs are tired of waiting around. His people wanted to go to the winter meetings to start a big biding war and everyone said 'F that I'll just sign this guy'. Think they overplayed it and missed out.

And it also seems the CWS won't be trading Sale. We're out, Texas says it's out, and ATL doesn't want to give up Swanson. They're going to realize if they want to move him they won't ask for an entire farm system.


Well... that may also mean we get back in on Sale if the price goes down.
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Ag_07
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In reply to irish pete ag06 • 6:39p, 12/4/16
AG
I get the sense they don't really want to move him. I think they're telling teams what they want and if someone bites and gives it to them then good and if not then no biggie.
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3B Paul 97
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In reply to Ag_07 • 6:55p, 12/4/16
AG
Ag_07 said:
Probably. Think clubs are tired of waiting around. His people wanted to go to the winter meetings to start a big biding war and everyone said 'F that I'll just sign this guy'. Think they overplayed it and missed out.

And it also seems the CWS won't be trading Sale. We're out, Texas says it's out, and ATL doesn't want to give up Swanson. They're going to realize if they want to move him they won't ask for an entire farm system.


So maybe he will go on Sale?
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irish pete ag06
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In reply to Ag_07 • 6:58p, 12/4/16
AG
Ag_07 said:
I get the sense they don't really want to move him. I think they're telling teams what they want and if someone bites and gives it to them then good and if not then no biggie.


I wouldn't if I was them. I'd see how the season starts then wait till the deadline and evaluate where I am. The 1-2 punch they have in that rotation, you never know... plus you can then use desperation more to hopefully pry away more value.
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7:19p, 12/4/16
Quote:
They continue to "pay really close attention" to the Rays' starters, sources say.

http://www.foxsports.com/mlb/story/winter-meetings-mlb-rumors-cba-ken-rosenthal-chicago-cubs-houston-astros-oakland-athletics-120416
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Farmer1906
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7:27p, 12/4/16
AG
Who else could it be besides Archer? I would think Snell is untouchable while Smyly & Odorizzi are just guys.
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k20dub
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7:40p, 12/4/16
AG
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Farmer1906
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In reply to k20dub • 7:46p, 12/4/16
AG
k20dub said:
That means McCann & Gattis full time platoon. No way we pay >20 M for that kind of production. Gattis is packing his things if that happens. Maybe that is why that earlier rumor was mentioned.

Holy Moly we could be the best offense in baseball with a 1-6 of Altuve, Encarnacion, Correa, Beltran, & Springer. All had >.810 OPS last year. That's not even counting Bregs or Gurriel taking the next step.
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Nuke LaLoosh
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In reply to Farmer1906 • 7:47p, 12/4/16
AG
aggie1906 said:
Nuke LaLoosh said:
Trading mchugh makes no sense. If we don't have an ace, we need as many warm bodies to throw at SP as we can get.

Btw, everything about Green Bay was fantastic besides the sorry ass Texans.
Weather?


Yeah it was absolutely miserable, but you've gotta hope for a snow game if you go to Lambeau right?
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Deluxe
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In reply to k20dub • 8:22p, 12/4/16
AG
k20dub said:


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diehard03
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9:48p, 12/4/16
Quote:
I wouldn't if I was them. I'd see how the season starts then wait till the deadline and evaluate where I am. The 1-2 punch they have in that rotation, you never know... plus you can then use desperation more to hopefully pry away more value.

Their excuse for not doing it last year was they said the off season would net them more.
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PETE2019
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9:51p, 12/4/16
AG
Thoughts on signing Tyson Ross? Aside from being hurt last year, he's had a decent career with an ERA under 3.5 for 2013-15 and was an all-star in 14
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Farmer1906
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11:24p, 12/4/16
AG


Please don't go to Arlington.
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