GEFTA is much more applicable and specific than the FLSA in this area.

And its a horse**** piece of legislation but it is the law.

I do not see where it prohibits work during the furlough, but given what I have read of the provisions I can imagine it probably has some screwball rule as such.

More reason to continue to cut the federal employees pool. And there should be no such thing as non-essential employees. If you are non-essential you should be nothing more than an at-will independent contractor.

Cull the fat. Particularly those who clamor for back pay AND overtime to make up for their paid time off whilst the Country suffered.

As if people need more reason to be disgusted with fat on the vine federal workers.

"Non-essential workers
A furlough means a pause in work, and they are not authorized to perform any job-related functions.
Performing any work during this time can violate the terms of the furlough and may result in penalties for the employer, such as fines or having to repay any wages received during the furlough."

I agree with much of what you said but I have to operate within the rules

Ag_SGT said:

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While I agree with your sentiment, legally speaking, what you propose would get me fired

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I keep saying I was not referring to you but you keep deflecting saying you would get fired. Did I misinterpret your initial comment saying people need to be prepared to pay overtime to government employees after the shutdown as being you are the example government employee that will demand overtime pay when you come back to work? I assumed you were not in that crowd and were calling out how bad of a legal and ethical practice that is.

It's not a demand, it's the law

Your point was about overtime. If getting back pay for time not working and demanding overtime pay on top to catch up, that is the issue. Your premise is the populace must be prepared to pay overtime whereas others are saying that is wrong and their back pay covers their time needed to catch up.

It boils down to being a service employee or being a me first government employee. Again, not directing this at you.

Seems the ethical answer to this is to let the work not done during the shutdown stay late so no overtime charges are made. That is the best fiscal solution though unfortunately I know that's not how government will work.

Ag_SGT said:

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It's not a demand, it's the law

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As much as most of us do not like it, it appears this is the law, particularly with 2019's GEFTA.

Tea Party said:

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Ag_SGT said:

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While I agree with your sentiment, legally speaking, what you propose would get me fired

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I keep saying I was not referring to you but you keep deflecting saying you would get fired. Did I misinterpret your initial comment saying people need to be prepared to pay overtime to government employees after the shutdown as being you are the example government employee that will demand overtime pay when you come back to work? I assumed you were not in that crowd and were calling out how bad of a legal and ethical practice that is.

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Can you please just stop. I don't know Ag SGT, but I was a FED employee during a shutdown. I can't site you policy exactly, but I do know that if you weren't deemed an essential employee, you were not allowed to work and it was a fireable offense. I suspect it was as much for liability purposes as anything else. That doesn't mean I support civil servants asking for/demanding/clamoring for overtime. It is just one of the facts bout how this works. As inefficient as the government is, it is more inefficient during a shutdown and restart. If you are furloughed, you can potentially be fired for performing job related tasks during that time.

I'm not playing a gotcha game, just understanding and clarifying his initial statement about overtime. His point was about overtime, framing it as an absolute that must be paid in significant quantities and will be required to catch up on the work.

That is incorrect and assumes the work delayed during the shutdown must be expedited when the government reopens. Some of it might, but I'd venture a significant majority of it does not since it was deemed non-essential which means his initial premise of us having to get ready to pay a lot of overtime is not as accurate as presented.

Will we end up paying way too much overtime? Most likely yes. But paying overtime to catch up non-essential missed work is illogical and to a point unethical since it comes at the tax payers expense.

Tea Party said:

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Your point was about overtime. If getting back pay for time not working and demanding overtime pay on top to catch up, that is the issue. Your premise is the populace must be prepared to pay overtime whereas others are saying that is wrong and their back pay covers their time needed to catch up.

It boils down to being a service employee or being a me first government employee. Again, not directing this at you.

Seems the ethical answer to this is to let the work not done during the shutdown stay late so no overtime charges are made. That is the best fiscal solution though unfortunately I know that's not how government will work.

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Take up overtime pay with the DNC. I am sure they will pay for it. ; )

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I'm not playing a gotcha game, just understanding and clarifying his initial statement about overtime. His point was about overtime, framing it as an absolute that must be paid in significant quantities and will be required to catch up on the work.

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In certain agencies, it will be absolutely necessary to make up for the time lost during the shutdown, my agency being one of them. Given the workload and annual demands we face, losing a month and a half places us significantly behind schedule, and overtime will be required to catch up. However, in some lower-grade positions, such as administrative support roles, overtime may not be necessary since their responsibilities are primarily day-to-day operational tasks.

Jon Stewart's meltdown over the Dems shutdown caving was epic and glorious....brought to you by "I can't F***ing Believe It"!!!!

Goes into a Schoolhouse Rock refresh lesson on how a bill becomes a law.

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And there should be no such thing as non-essential employees.

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I've served as both an essential and non-essential employee, and I'm guessing you may not fully realize how valuable our work is even for those considered "non-essential." As an employee of the U.S. Geological Survey, we provide the nation with critical, national-level GIS data that thousands of private-sector companies rely on daily. This is not a service the private sector could realistically replicate. In fact, millions of people use our maps and data every day, whether they realize it or not.

They said that about soace exploration too

It's been years since I have watched him. Such a shill for the left.

Completely leaves out it was the left holding us as hostages.

Agree.

Any chance y'all could start another thread for this never-ending nonsense? It's monopolized this thread for the entire day.

ETA: i know I'm a nobody on this board but it's tiring seeing there are updates to the shutdown thread and all the talk is about overtime pay.

Ag_SGT said:

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Quote:

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And there should be no such thing as non-essential employees.

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I've served as both an essential and non-essential employee, and I'm guessing you may not fully realize how valuable our work is even for those considered "non-essential." As an employee of the U.S. Geological Survey, we provide the nation with critical, national-level GIS data that thousands of private-sector companies rely on daily. This is not a service the private sector could realistically replicate. In fact, millions of people use our maps and data every day, whether they realize it or not.

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If it's valuable, private industry could definitely replicate it.

The R won battle but the massive WAR of Healthcare is running hot and its going to be a huge topic at Midterms.

Because people want daddy government to save them. There are thousands of open jobs that offer healthcare just in and around Texas. If people are worried about the cost then they should get one of those.

Bill survived a key hurdle vote…on track to pass in the House…

Burpelson said:

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The R won battle but the massive WAR of Healthcare is running hot and its going to be a huge topic at Midterms.

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A war to get us to NHS-style healthcare. Let's see how that is going:

https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c3w9y9dpv5qo

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Overall, government sources said no extra money is going into the NHS beyond what was agreed at the spending review this year an extra 29bn a year above inflation by 2028-29.

Health Secretary Wes Streeting told BBC Breakfast that patients and NHS staff had told him the health service had "too many layers of management, too many layers of bureaucracy".

"People want to see the front line prioritised, and that is exactly what we're doing," he said, adding he would tell NHS leaders "we're finally on the road to recovery" in his speech later on Wednesday.

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Yep. Took the Labour Party more than 77 years to actually attempt to get their NHS "finally on the road to recovery."

That road to recovery? It will fail, as socialism always does when its proponents speak of reforming a system designed to spread an equality of mediocrity across a society.

As Churchill said...



So it is in the United Kingdom with NHS. So it is here with the nationalized healthcare programs we have in this country.

seeing that the HOUSE will now vote at 1900 tonight to reopen the government

Huge victory for the GOP

do not @#$#@ this up Republican Congressmen!

that means you Marjorie Taylor Greene and Tom Massie!

LMCane said:

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seeing that the HOUSE will now vote at 1900 tonight to reopen the government

Huge victory for the GOP

do not @#$#@ this up Republican Congressmen!

that means you Marjorie Taylor Greene and Tom Massie!

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Hemp thing might kill it. Lots of folks will lose their shirts over it

SociallyConditionedAg said:

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Ag_SGT said:

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Quote:

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And there should be no such thing as non-essential employees.

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I've served as both an essential and non-essential employee, and I'm guessing you may not fully realize how valuable our work is even for those considered "non-essential." As an employee of the U.S. Geological Survey, we provide the nation with critical, national-level GIS data that thousands of private-sector companies rely on daily. This is not a service the private sector could realistically replicate. In fact, millions of people use our maps and data every day, whether they realize it or not.

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If it's valuable, private industry could definitely replicate it.

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And yet they haven't

LMCane said:

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seeing that the HOUSE will now vote at 1900 tonight to reopen the government

Huge victory for the GOP

do not @#$#@ this up Republican Congressmen!

that means you Marjorie Taylor Greene and Tom Massie!

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The government is shut down and the earliest they can get around to vote is 7pm tonight? I loathe politicians

Maroon Dawn said:

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LMCane said:

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seeing that the HOUSE will now vote at 1900 tonight to reopen the government

Huge victory for the GOP

do not @#$#@ this up Republican Congressmen!

that means you Marjorie Taylor Greene and Tom Massie!

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Hemp thing might kill it. Lots of folks will lose their shirts over it

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It's a pretty big deal. Many use Hemp products as a much cheaper alternative to prescription marijuana and/or pain meds. Talk about a huge ****-off to our vets.

Trump should lash out publicly and demand that **** be taken out. Especially after yesterday's veterans speech.

Ag_SGT said:

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Quote:

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And there should be no such thing as non-essential employees.

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I've served as both an essential and non-essential employee, and I'm guessing you may not fully realize how valuable our work is even for those considered "non-essential." As an employee of the U.S. Geological Survey, we provide the nation with critical, national-level GIS data that thousands of private-sector companies rely on daily. This is not a service the private sector could realistically replicate. In fact, millions of people use our maps and data every day, whether they realize it or not.

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This is true. Not only that, you (the organization) are always out there updating threat assessments and topographical settings. Also things like seismic monitoring at geologically unstable or potentially active regions. Kind of like NOAA, involved in many things, some far more impactful than others. And there is nothing trivial about mapping and taking soundings.

Gotta drag it out one more day to get maximum lobbying free meals and gifts in

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Health Secretary Wes Streeting told BBC Breakfast that patients and NHS staff had told him the health service had "too many layers of management, too many layers of bureaucracy".

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That could be said about every agency of government.

We need draconian cuts in our government.

Burpelson said:

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The R won battle but the massive WAR of Healthcare is running hot and its going to be a huge topic at Midterms.

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Is it? Most of the irresponsible poor trash on Obamacare probably already vote D

[Note to the board: a one-off comment about a hemp ban in the funding bill isn't an issue, but when it becomes a persistent derail from the OP we're going to clean it up. You're free to start a different thread on that topic -- Staff]

Ag_SGT said:

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SociallyConditionedAg said:

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Ag_SGT said:

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Quote:

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And there should be no such thing as non-essential employees.

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I've served as both an essential and non-essential employee, and I'm guessing you may not fully realize how valuable our work is even for those considered "non-essential." As an employee of the U.S. Geological Survey, we provide the nation with critical, national-level GIS data that thousands of private-sector companies rely on daily. This is not a service the private sector could realistically replicate. In fact, millions of people use our maps and data every day, whether they realize it or not.

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If it's valuable, private industry could definitely replicate it.

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And yet they haven't

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Why would they if the government gives it to them?

Aggie95 said:

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LMCane said:

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seeing that the HOUSE will now vote at 1900 tonight to reopen the government

Huge victory for the GOP

do not @#$#@ this up Republican Congressmen!

that means you Marjorie Taylor Greene and Tom Massie!

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The government is shut down and the earliest they can get around to vote is 7pm tonight? I loathe politicians

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the House was sent home weeks ago and have not been working for like a month-

now they all have to get back to DC with all the airport cancellations and chaos.

Ag with kids said:

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Ag_SGT said:

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SociallyConditionedAg said:

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Ag_SGT said:

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Quote:

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And there should be no such thing as non-essential employees.

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I've served as both an essential and non-essential employee, and I'm guessing you may not fully realize how valuable our work is even for those considered "non-essential." As an employee of the U.S. Geological Survey, we provide the nation with critical, national-level GIS data that thousands of private-sector companies rely on daily. This is not a service the private sector could realistically replicate. In fact, millions of people use our maps and data every day, whether they realize it or not.

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If it's valuable, private industry could definitely replicate it.

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And yet they haven't

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Why would they if the government gives it to them?

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The private sector doesn't have the resources nor the funding to provide national level coverage. The private sector does a great job generating localized data, but there is no profit for generating data and coverage at a national scale over highly rural communities and remote locations like Alaska.

Ag_SGT said:

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Ag with kids said:

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Ag_SGT said:

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SociallyConditionedAg said:

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Ag_SGT said:

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Quote:

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And there should be no such thing as non-essential employees.

---

I've served as both an essential and non-essential employee, and I'm guessing you may not fully realize how valuable our work is even for those considered "non-essential." As an employee of the U.S. Geological Survey, we provide the nation with critical, national-level GIS data that thousands of private-sector companies rely on daily. This is not a service the private sector could realistically replicate. In fact, millions of people use our maps and data every day, whether they realize it or not.

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If it's valuable, private industry could definitely replicate it.

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And yet they haven't

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Why would they if the government gives it to them?

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The private sector doesn't have the resources nor the funding to provide national level coverage. The private sector does a great job generating localized data, but there is no profit for generating data and coverage at a national scale over highly rural communities and remote locations like Alaska.

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So, no one is using any of that data?