Manchester United 2022-23 Thread

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Dre_00
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9:56a, 3/12/23
I actually don't have a problem with the red. You come in studs over the top of the ball into the shin in the age of VAR and chances are it's going to end badly for you. Not the first time that has been called a red and won't be the last. Though I do think it's telling that even the Southampton players didn't seem to want to see him sent off.

What is absolutely farcical is the complete refusal to even check let alone award the blatant hand ball in the box. My Southampton defender clearly went to his knees and controlled that ball with his arm. Not even a sniff from VAR. Casemiro will miss:

Fulham (FA Cup)
@ Newcastle
Brentford
Everton

Not the toughest run of games but still some tricky fixtures in there.
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Mathguy64
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In reply to Dre_00 • 10:08a, 3/12/23
AG
That play is red in most leagues. I agree. But Marriner making that call after yesterday is comical. He didn't just ignore SFP yesterday he didn't even recognize a foul. And his VAR never says "hey go look you missed it". He missed a yellow in his second half that was a stamp on a foot and never called a foul then doubled down when the player stayed down injured and his team held the ball at midfield and refused to stop play. I mean it's their ball on a drop at midfield. He would have flat out failed an assessment for what he missed. And today he tells Taylor to go look. It's comically incompetent and inconsistent. What the EPL does with VAR is a joke.
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Mathguy64
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10:22a, 3/12/23
AG
AWB is playing with fire. He's making horrible passes to no one.
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Mathguy64
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10:25a, 3/12/23
AG
Ugh. Even the post hates us today.

Nope. Now the post loves us.
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Thunder18
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10:26a, 3/12/23
AG
Incredible save by Bazunu there. Tough break
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Mathguy64
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10:35a, 3/12/23
AG
I'll say this. ETH isn't bunkering for a point. Bringing Garnacho and Pellestri on is bold.
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Furlock Bones
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In reply to Mathguy64 • 10:37a, 3/12/23
AG
Mathguy64 said:
AWB is playing with fire. He's making horrible passes to no one.


I have never liked AWB. He's a try hard guy with no discernible skills.
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Mathguy64
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10:38a, 3/12/23
AG
That's a clean clear but a nasty scissor after. That's foul. A horrible tackle. And yet we get nothing.
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Thunder18
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10:41a, 3/12/23
AG
So frustrating
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Furlock Bones
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In reply to Mathguy64 • 10:43a, 3/12/23
AG
Mathguy64 said:
That's a clean clear but a nasty scissor after. That's foul. A horrible tackle. And yet we get nothing.


Years of Pep and especially Klopp crying that Man United got too many pens has turned the refs completely against us in the last 2 seasons. It's ridiculous.
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Mathguy64
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10:49a, 3/12/23
AG
Ward Prowse with a clear SPA tackle. Taylor just let's it go.
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Furlock Bones
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11:29a, 3/12/23
AG
We played like crap. But just a shocking day from the ref crew.
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Furlock Bones
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11:46a, 3/12/23
AG
And here's the result of one of the unpunished scissor tackles

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Mathguy64
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11:55a, 3/12/23
AG
Casemiro was sent off for a lesser tackle than what Dan Burn just committed for Newcastle. A two footed lunge at speed with contact and he gets up taunting the player he destroyed.

You be you PGMOL. You be you.
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Dre_00
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In reply to Furlock Bones • 1:16p, 3/12/23
I'm convinced that Bruno's gesticulations (which I feel have also bled into others in the team) doesn't help. No way that his griping doesn't eventually become counterproductive.

The weird thing about that Garnacho injury is...I'm old enough to remember when the league made a concerted effort to protect skill players by focusing on tackles that caused injury and were dangerous regardless of whether the defender got the ball or not. I'm not certain that Walker Peters' tackle justified a foul as part of me wonders what else he could have done but there was most definitely a time when the EPL looked at tackles like that and fell on the side of protecting the attacker at all costs. I'm not sure when they changed their mind about all of that but they clearly did.
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Mathguy64
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In reply to Dre_00 • 1:25p, 3/12/23
AG
That tackle is filthy. It's an intent to injure with the scissor and twist. In every other professional league it's a straight send off. In a Sunday men's game you will have a fight over that and most likely retaliation later. Taylor ignored it because "he got ball first" and if he calls it it is a PK. Marriner isn't calling it because, well Andre Marriner is drunk and he's gotten everything else wrong this weekend so he may as well not screw up his perfect record.

The EPL allows it because getting someone injured fits with the "we are the tough guys league and we play physical soccer" image they have of themselves. It's a miracle they don't lose half a dozen players a season to career ending knee injuries. One need only look at Donny Van De Beek as witness. That wasn't even called as a foul.
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Dre_00
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1:33p, 3/12/23
Man, this to me is the biggest injustice. It's so clear it hits his arm. The ball clearly changes direction twice when it hits Kotshcap and they only way that can happen is if it hits his arm. No excuse for VAR not reviewing and awarding that.

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Aston94
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1:58p, 3/12/23
AG
This reason I don't like VAR is the complete lack of consistency. If we are putting this in place to "get it right" then get it right…all the time. Instead it has become a subjective analysis by another official. It just needs to go away, I would prefer they add a referee to the field if needed and do away with VAR. or make it like basketball where the referee himself can use it when he isn't sure, but letting a guy sitting in an office way away from the match make these decisions is just not good for the game.
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wangus12
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In reply to Dre_00 • 2:03p, 3/12/23
AG
VAR in the PL has been apocalyptic this year. Way worse than years prior.

Arsenal could have had 4 different handball calls last week against Bournemouth and got nothing. Yalls today should have been one. The Burn tackle today.. they literally gave Brentford a goal in the draw with Arsenal because they didn't draw the lines on the screen and they came out and admitted it.

Give me whoever was in charge of the World Cup VAR. They ran a tight ****
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Dre_00
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In reply to wangus12 • 2:17a, 3/13/23
Yeah that Brentford no call was ridiculous. Literally the bare minimum requirement of VAR and they still couldn't clear it.
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Furlock Bones
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8:03a, 3/13/23
AG
Just in case anyone thinks United fans are bing overly sensitive about the ref yesterday.


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jeffk
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In reply to Furlock Bones • 8:59a, 3/13/23
AG
Furlock Bones said:
Years of Pep and especially Klopp crying that Man United got too many pens has turned the refs completely against us in the last 2 seasons. It's ridiculous.


I'm positive we aren't going to agree on what level of officiating United is fair or appropriate, but it's fascinating to look at the drop off in the numbers of penalties and red cards awarded to your club from the years prior the 2020-2021 season and since then. Just an absolutely amazing difference.

Penalties awarded to United (league average):
2018-19: 12 (5.2)
2019-20: 14 (4.6)
2020-21: 11 (6.1)
2021-22: 5 (5.1)
2022-23 current: 2 (3.1)
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Furlock Bones
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In reply to jeffk • 11:41a, 3/13/23
AG
It's not a joke. The pendulum has swung against us hard.
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gougler08
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In reply to Furlock Bones • 12:11p, 3/13/23
AG
Everything reverts to the mean eventually
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Showstopper
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12:23p, 3/13/23
AG
I had to get off the internet yesterday because I was hot, but here's what I didn't like about yesterday:

On the red card, I could see that going either way, but it was called a yellow. So what was on VAR that changed it from a yellow to a red? That he went over the top if the ball with spikes up? Isn't that why the yellow was shown on the first place? So it isn't that VAR is seeing something that wasn't seen on the field, it's substituting opinion, and the official going along with VAR. Personally, I think this was an over-correction by VAR for the officials letting the Chelsea-Leicester game get out of control on Saturday. But whatever.

But then the Bruno non-call in the box and the handball seem much clearer corrections, and not a peep on either? Really really really frustrating. It's basically two stolen points. And it's a basically a four team race for the third and fourth spots for Champions League. (Maybe Brighton too since they have a few games in hand). I like our position better than anyone else's, but it's not like anyone is in a position to just throw points out of the window. Really frustrating.
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texagbeliever
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In reply to jeffk • 12:25p, 3/13/23
Don't pens generally translate to the attacking players. Id be more interested in touches in the opponents box to penalties. An attempt to normalize the numbers a bit.
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jeffk
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In reply to texagbeliever • 12:53p, 3/13/23
AG
Yeah, there's a strong correlation between touches in the opponent's box and penalties received. This is an interesting read, but I didn't post it initially because it's written by a LFC media personality and it doesn't paint United in a real positive light. (Imagine that, right?)

https://tomkinstimes.com/2022/01/liverpool-shocking-penalty-and-var-facts-dont-fit-hysterical-media-narrative/
https://tomkinstimes.substack.com/p/facts-lfc-rank-10th-in-klopp-era

I'm sure someone else does similar breakdowns and such, but I read Tomkins semi-regularly, so that's what I pulled first.
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wangus12
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In reply to texagbeliever • 12:55p, 3/13/23
AG
Here is the Big 6 and Newcastle. Ordered from most Touches in Box to least.

Arsenal
  • Touches in Box = 926
  • Penalties Awarded = 2

Manchester City
  • Touches in Box = 909
  • Penalties Awarded = 6

Liverpool
  • Touches in Box = 814
  • Penalties Awarded = 1

Newcastle United
  • Touches in Box = 686
  • Penalties Awarded = 3

Manchester United
  • Touches in Box = 624
  • Penalties Awarded = 2

Tottenham
  • Touches in Box = 590
  • Penalties Awarded = 4

Chelsea
  • Touches in Box = 580
  • Penalties Awarded = 2

Brighton and West Ham have earned the most penalties this season with 7. Bournemouth have the least with 0.

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Mathguy64
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3:27p, 3/13/23
AG
United announced they will not appeal the red card to Casemiro. A 4 game suspension will take place.

The two reds this season are his only red cards as a professional in over 500 pro and international matches. Well done VAR.
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Dre_00
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6:33a, 3/14/23
A rumor out of Argentina that Garnacho's injury is worse than initially thought and he'll miss both of Argentina's games during the international break.

Would open the door for more Sancho playing time. And probably Pellistri.
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Dre_00
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9:49a, 3/15/23
Antony is ill and didn't make the gameday squad. Maybe see a start for Pellistri?
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Dre_00
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1:02p, 3/15/23
UEFA considering allowing teams with the same owner to compete in the UEFA competitions.

https://theathletic.com/4311634/2023/03/15/uefa-multi-club-ownership-manchester-united/?source=twitteruk

I guess that Ineos check cleared.
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Mathguy64
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1:23p, 3/16/23
AG
In the last 5 minutes Real Betis had started to CONCACAF things up a bit. We need to keep our heads above this.
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Mathguy64
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1:59p, 3/16/23
AG
Rashford misses from 6 yards out in open space but redeems himself with a laser beam rip from 25 yards out. What a strike.
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Thunder18
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2:00p, 3/16/23
AG
Rashford missed two easy chances in the box just to slag one in from outside the box a few minutes later
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