Redstone said:

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All that's needed is to protect children from people like you.

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Wrong.

What's needed is very stringent laws protecting children and adolescents from treatments under the false, demonic guise of "treatment."

And, fortunately, there is strong support for such laws.

Let's remember Matthew 18:6 when drafting them.

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Nope. We really just need to protect children from you, and those like you. Your contempt for trans children makes you a grave threat to them.

Fortunately, such a law that you're suggesting, where politicians make medical decisions instead of doctors/patients/guardians, failed in Texas. Fortunately, every major medical association opposes such laws, because they actually understand medicine and science. They aren't basing their practices/beliefs on bigots who hide behind non-affirming parental perceptions.

You do know that trans children exist, right? I was a trans child. Then I became a trans adult. But yeah, keep pretending you aren't a real threat to these kids. Part of me wishes you had a child, or grandchild, that was trans if for no reason other than it may help you to develop a shred of compassion. But then I realize that any trans child related to you would not be safe with you, so I couldn't wish that on any kid.

And what does a "trans child" have to do with sexualization? Goodness, you're a ****ing idiot when it comes to this subject. Being trans has nothing at all to do with sex or sexuality.

[That is over the line. -Staff]

Nobody said chromosomes are changed. This just highlights your ignorance on the subject. You willfully shut out any opposing view, which results in you being functionally brain-dead on the subject.

It's like the jackass on twitter who tried to cite his high school biology class. It's funny, but when enough morons get power, they pose a real threat to trans kids. My guess is that you are very pro-conversion therapy. Well, I know you are, because what you advocate is essentially conversion therapy for trans kids.

Okay, I'm done dealing with Redstone and his grotesque bigotry and ignorance. It's pointless, as he chooses to remain willfully ignorant of any perspective that he didn't learn in junior high biology. I have far more important things to do, which tonight involves having a zoom call with a trans kid to counsel and encourage them as they are about to start puberty blockers.

Redstone, much like the Shrier's and Rowling's of the world, have hardened their hearts to the point that their bigotry has consumed them. I'll move and just chuckle from a distance any time he "revives" this thread in which his arguments have been thoroughly refuted time and time again.

Your perspective in a nutshell: "Suffering and suicide are fine as long as you do it in the gender we think you are."

I love that he thinks that junior high biology is all he needs to understand highly complex issues such as gender dysphoria, gender identity, etc.

But hey, if talking to a kid at the request of their parents makes me "evil" to those who don't wish to understand beyond a junior high grade level, then so be it. I'll use my experience and knowledge to help this kid as much as I can. See, unlike Abigail Shrier, I believe actually talking to the trans kid is helpful in understanding. But ol' Abby prefers just to run to anti-trans websites instead of talking to trans people.

Sapper Redux said:

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You perspective in a nutshell: "Suffering and suicide are fine as long as you do it in the gender we think you are."

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Suffering is part of being a Christian. We don't get to choose our suffering but we engage with it differently than you do. It's not always something to be avoided. Red Dreher interviewed a lot of communist dissidents for his latest book, live not by lies. Sometimes our suffering offers us an opportunity to serve God. Thus the answer is not always, 'do this medical procedure', or 'confess whatever they want so you can continue your normal life'. It could also be don't abort this baby. Comfort in this life often comes at the expense of the next.

diehard03 said:

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You perspective in a nutshell: "Suffering and suicide are fine as long as you do it in the gender we think you are."

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The lack of empathy notwithstanding, it's also incorrect to say "My standard of suffering is what all decisions should be measured on, regardless of consequences, no questions asked!"

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In this case, these are decisions being made at several levels after discussions with mental health professionals and with medical professionals, for the safety, health, and wellbeing of the individual. The opponents seem far less concerned with the wellbeing of the individual than with the wellbeing of their theology and umwelt.

AGC said:

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Sapper Redux said:

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You perspective in a nutshell: "Suffering and suicide are fine as long as you do it in the gender we think you are."

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Suffering is part of being a Christian. We don't get to choose our suffering but we engage with it differently than you do. It's not always something to be avoided. Red Dreher interviewed a lot of communist dissidents for his latest book, live not by lies. Sometimes our suffering offers us an opportunity to serve God. Thus the answer is not always, 'do this medical procedure', or 'confess whatever they want so you can continue your normal life'. It could also be font short this baby. Comfort in this life often comes at the expense of the next.

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I trust you understand how vapid and harmful this sounds to someone who doesn't share your focus on a hoped-for afterlife at the expense of the health of someone living and suffering now?

diehard03 said:

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You perspective in a nutshell: "Suffering and suicide are fine as long as you do it in the gender we think you are."

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The lack of empathy notwithstanding, it's also incorrect to say "My standard of suffering is what all decisions should be measured on, regardless of consequences, no questions asked!"

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I can agree with this. This is why trans people, especially trans kids, undergo therapy as well so they can better understand who they are and make the right decision for them. But, it's really a decision to be made by the individual and their medical team. I know a trans woman who just got word that due to preexisting health risks, she won't be able to medically transition. Which is why these are decisions to be made by the individual and their medical team. Not politicians or people who boast of only needing a junior high grade level understanding.

Trans people aren't saying "no questions asked". The problem isn't the questions. The problem is the lack of questions. Heck, on this thread alone, how many times have I been called satanic or evil. On this board, how many times have I had my faith condemned. We actually welcome sincere questions because we want people to understand. But we also develop a pretty good sixth sense when it comes to detecting when the question is sincere or not because we deal with these condemnations of our existence every damn day. It's like with my parents. I know they don't agree with my transition to some degree, but it's been frustrating because they also don't want to talk about it. There's no desire to grow in understanding. That's my frustration with people like Redstone, AGC, aggietony, etc. They have no desire to grow in understanding. They attack. They demean. They lie. So yeah, I get pissed off when my existence is up to debate for them. They instead rely on information that conforms to their preconceived notions, which is how you end up w/ Abigail Shrier's work being so popular in the church. It's not because it's a sound work. It's not. It's because they agree with what she's saying. But when you point out that what she's saying is harmful, and that it's based not on anything but parental perceptions of parents who were solely sourced from anti-trans websites, they don't care. They simply ignore it and move on.

So, it's not the questions that are the problems. It's the lack of sincerity. It's the lack of empathy. It's that they aren't honest in their approach.

That said, I am back at my computer. What was it exactly that you were asking about? I can tell that you are sincere, so I do want to address whatever questions you may have.

Sapper Redux said:

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AGC said:

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Sapper Redux said:

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You perspective in a nutshell: "Suffering and suicide are fine as long as you do it in the gender we think you are."

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Suffering is part of being a Christian. We don't get to choose our suffering but we engage with it differently than you do. It's not always something to be avoided. Red Dreher interviewed a lot of communist dissidents for his latest book, live not by lies. Sometimes our suffering offers us an opportunity to serve God. Thus the answer is not always, 'do this medical procedure', or 'confess whatever they want so you can continue your normal life'. It could also be font short this baby. Comfort in this life often comes at the expense of the next.

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I trust you understand how vapid and harmful this sounds to someone who doesn't share your focus on a hoped-for afterlife at the expense of the health of someone living and suffering now?

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Neither suffering nor empathy is a weapon to bludgeon others into submission. If that's how you use them then you misunderstand them.

AGC said:

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Sapper Redux said:

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AGC said:

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Sapper Redux said:

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You perspective in a nutshell: "Suffering and suicide are fine as long as you do it in the gender we think you are."

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Suffering is part of being a Christian. We don't get to choose our suffering but we engage with it differently than you do. It's not always something to be avoided. Red Dreher interviewed a lot of communist dissidents for his latest book, live not by lies. Sometimes our suffering offers us an opportunity to serve God. Thus the answer is not always, 'do this medical procedure', or 'confess whatever they want so you can continue your normal life'. It could also be font short this baby. Comfort in this life often comes at the expense of the next.

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I trust you understand how vapid and harmful this sounds to someone who doesn't share your focus on a hoped-for afterlife at the expense of the health of someone living and suffering now?

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Neither suffering nor empathy is a weapon to bludgeon others into submission. If that's how you use them then you misunderstand them.

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Neither is your religion. Your theology should not be dictating to an individual that they should suffer so you feel better.

Sapper Redux said:

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AGC said:

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Sapper Redux said:

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You perspective in a nutshell: "Suffering and suicide are fine as long as you do it in the gender we think you are."

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Suffering is part of being a Christian. We don't get to choose our suffering but we engage with it differently than you do. It's not always something to be avoided. Red Dreher interviewed a lot of communist dissidents for his latest book, live not by lies. Sometimes our suffering offers us an opportunity to serve God. Thus the answer is not always, 'do this medical procedure', or 'confess whatever they want so you can continue your normal life'. It could also be font short this baby. Comfort in this life often comes at the expense of the next.

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I trust you understand how vapid and harmful this sounds to someone who doesn't share your focus on a hoped-for afterlife at the expense of the health of someone living and suffering now?

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Suffering for thee, but not for me. Yes, I will gladly suffer for my faith. But the Lord has provided us the intellect to alleviate so much suffering. That's a good thing. Kids with cancer are cured. HIV is no longer a death sentence. We can now address this suffering that trans people have had to live with for millenia, and all of a sudden the line is "but Christians should suffer". Which is ironic, because most of these same people do not believe I can be a Christian as an out trans woman.

I'm sure if, God forbid, AGC's wife developed breast cancer, AGC wouldn't tell them "welp, sorry babe, but suffering is part of being a Christian". No! They'd attack that suffering aggressively. They'd attack it with every fiber of their being. But people like him want those who suffer in ways they don't care to even try to understand to "grin and bear it". I was suffering, and like a cancer patient going through chemotherapy, I used the tools that our God-given intellect has provided to alleviate it.

Empathy isn't a tool for decision making. It requires you to allign with a person on soley social and emotional causes and negates reason. It most oftern drives tribalism at the expense of justice.

Sully Dog said:

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Empathy isn't a tool for decision making. It requires you to allign with a person on soley social and emotional causes and negates reason. It most oftern drives tribalism at the expense of justice.

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This makes zero sense. Empathy can absolutely drive reason. The lack of it leads to atrocity and dehumanizing those you don't like.

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That empathy allows you to side with a false narrative that he was killed because of racism

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Is everything locked into right wing grievance politics for you?

Pathetic.

Sapper Redux said:

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That empathy allows you to side with a false narrative that he was killed because of racism

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Is everything locked into right wing grievance politics for you?

Pathetic.

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Nope. It's just an obvious and timely example of how empathy can be misused and bring you to the wrong conclusions. I noticed you didn't attack the first of my two examples. So obviously not everything is grievence politics. Maybe your own politics is shading your thoughts on the issue.
Show me where what I wrote is wrong.

Nevermind. It's always pointless with you. I'm asking, as your sister-in-Christ, to simply no longer respond to me on here. The conversations are never fruitful, as you cannot resist insults and misuse of scripture, and you think I do the same (or some 4th wave nonsense that's now your go-to).

File5 said:

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PacifistAg said:

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Sapper Redux said:

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AGC said:

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Sapper Redux said:

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You perspective in a nutshell: "Suffering and suicide are fine as long as you do it in the gender we think you are."

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Suffering is part of being a Christian. We don't get to choose our suffering but we engage with it differently than you do. It's not always something to be avoided. Red Dreher interviewed a lot of communist dissidents for his latest book, live not by lies. Sometimes our suffering offers us an opportunity to serve God. Thus the answer is not always, 'do this medical procedure', or 'confess whatever they want so you can continue your normal life'. It could also be font short this baby. Comfort in this life often comes at the expense of the next.

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I trust you understand how vapid and harmful this sounds to someone who doesn't share your focus on a hoped-for afterlife at the expense of the health of someone living and suffering now?

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Suffering for thee, but not for me. Yes, I will gladly suffer for my faith. But the Lord has provided us the intellect to alleviate so much suffering. That's a good thing. Kids with cancer are cured. HIV is no longer a death sentence. We can now address this suffering that trans people have had to live with for millenia, and all of a sudden the line is "but Christians should suffer". Which is ironic, because most of these same people do not believe I can be a Christian as an out trans woman.

I'm sure if, God forbid, AGC's wife developed breast cancer, AGC wouldn't tell them "welp, sorry babe, but suffering is part of being a Christian". No! They'd attack that suffering aggressively. They'd attack it with every fiber of their being. But people like him want those who suffer in ways they don't care to even try to understand to "grin and bear it". I was suffering, and like a cancer patient going through chemotherapy, I used the tools that our God-given intellect has provided to alleviate it.

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So what's wrong with treating those with gender dysphoria with therapy or other non-dysphoria-affirming treatments? Just like those other diseases you mentioned, this too can be treated in a way that does not affirm a delusion that you are born the wrong sex.

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I treated it with therapy. Therapy led to transition. Transition worked. I'm sorry I found a treatment that worked. But you can't say "treat it with therapy", then dismiss the recognized path of that therapy. You can't have it both ways there.