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I know no one like these characters in any way.

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no way

how old are you?

I've never understood why, for some people, enjoyability has to = likeability. Some of the best characters are those who totally suck at life. I'm not saying any of the four girls on the show fall under the "best" category, but watching wholly "enjoyable" people can sometimes be just as grating, simply because "enjoyable" doesn't always make for the best drama.

Yes, I like to be entertained by enjoyable characters as much as the next guy. But, ultimately, we don't watch this stuff to see characters be good at life and succeed over and over. We watch characters to see them fail over and over in order to succeed in the end. I doubt these four will ever get their sh*t completely together, but it'll be that much more satisfying when/if they finally do come close.

[This message has been edited by TCTTS (edited 1/17/2014 1:48a).]

TCTTS

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but they are very much real people

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Sadly, I think that's why I may "relate" to the show so much. I know far too many people exactly like the ones on this show. I make it a point to try and avoid them, but sometimes it can't be helped. In that way, it very much feels like a show that's accurately chronicling a very specific portion of this generation, for better or worse. And doing so very, very well.

[This message has been edited by TCTTS (edited 1/16/2014 7:51p).]

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And that is why I have a hard time. I know no one like these characters in any way.

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This is the big disconnect between my enjoyment(?) and a couple of my good friends (males) who typically have similar taste in TV shows, movies, books. (I like everyone else dislike a lot of the characters but I also think that's kind of the point. Showing how unstable and ridiculous they are).

I know several people, one being an Ex GF, like the characters in the show, albeit the real life "Girls" are a bit more subdued. I've found myself on multiple occasions just laughing to myself and shaking my head because the similarities are spot on. I’ve described this to my friends as the TV show is the “turned up to 11” version of some of the single, 20 something year old girls I know in real life.

I would have to dig up the article but it was discussing how one of the most surprising viewing sections of the show were middle age men with 20-something daughters. It discussed them watching as a means to figuring out what the hell is going on in those irrational minds (spoiler alert.... You'll never figure it out).

I think the ability to relate can certainly affect one person’s enjoyment verses the other. Not knowing “Girls” like Hannah or Sosh may impact how you feel about the show the same way a person in Toronto wouldn’t enjoy FNL* as much as the small town Texan. So the show is representative of real people, which to me makes it good. In a similar way The Wire* or Mad Men* is good. The actors/writing makes you believe the individuals could be real people.

*I am in NO WAY imply that Girls is on par with The Wire, Mad Men, or FNL. Simple making a parallel. Extract the theory; not the direct comparison.

And I cannot believe I just wrote all that about Girls. Even just that is a testament to the show ability to cause a reaction, which is ultimately the point, imo. Ok, I;m done. I’m putting myself in internet timeout.

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Even just that is a testament to the show ability to cause a reaction

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and though I think the show is well-done, IMO it's the subject matter and that it's absolutely representative of a not insignificant portion of our society which is provoking the reaction

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only complaint i have is the exhibitionism of the main (and ugliest) character.

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This is the only thing she is really trolling with, and every time people get up in arms, she wins. Don't know why people still think this is a big deal at this point.

So, it might also be generational. I was a dumb 20 something woman at one point, but I didn't know any of my fellow Gen X'ers who had that sense of narcissistic entitlement. Taking money from my parents was abhorrent to me. My friends who lived at home after college did it to save money as they got established, with the INTENT to move out and be on their own. So maybe it's the millenial thing that makes it hard to relate for many of us.

I have no problem with a not-size 2 woman being naked and open about her body. But on Girls, it is so CLEARLY done as a troll and in non-genuine ways. The naked ping-pong with Patrick Wilson for example. Lena likes to harp on people objecting to the idea Patrick Wilson would have sex with her because of her body. That wasn't it - hot people have sex with not-hot people all the time. Her *personality* was what was so objectionable; she did nothing smart or charming or funny or endearing. THAT was what made me not buy that scene and roll my eyes.

I haven't watched the new season yet. I don't like ANY of the characters (really don't get the Adam love on this thread - he's a total creep and a loser), even for them to get a comeuppance.

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We watch characters to see them fail over and over in order to succeed in the end. I doubt these four will ever get their sh*t completely together, but it'll be that much more satisfying when/if they finally do come close.

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I agree with this. But even when characters are self-destructive or ruining their lives, ala Don Draper, they have *something* that makes you root for them to ultimately succeed. I haven't found that quality in any of the characters in Girls.

[This message has been edited by Clarke95 (edited 1/17/2014 11:34a).]

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how old are you?

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34, although my friends are all pretty much my age or much older.


And it's not that I don't enjoy repulsive characters. Pretty much all the anti-hero of great shows fall into that. Tony Soprano was a horrible human being, but I rooted for him and enjoyed him.

I've found myself lolling at this show a little more each time. I'm in Houston which is FAR removed from the typical women NYC attracts but you still meet these types of self absorbed chicks from time to time. The dumb cute ones are a good for a lay but too stupid for much else. Better to pass them along and seek chicks out there that are not as clueless and self absorbed.

Rule 1 on EXgf

It continues to fascinate me how people will analyze this show by defending and contrasting their own lifestyles with the fictional characters. Is it a female thing or something else? It's been this way since the pilot.

And yeah I guess the main reason I like the show is because I see myself as a male version of Hannah #sarcasm #thingsnoonewouldeversay

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It continues to fascinate me how people will analyze this show by defending and contrasting their own lifestyles with the fictional characters.

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Id say this is how almost everyone watches almost everything.

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It continues to fascinate me how people will analyze this show by defending and contrasting their own lifestyles with the fictional characters.

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Id say this is how almost everyone watches almost everything.

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yeah but it's the way that ALL commentary about this show seems to focus on this issue that's so interesting. The data about the middle aged dads with daughters watching the show in high numbers for example is a measurable sign that something's going on. What is it about this show that forces us to examine ourselves so much and form an opinion or watch the show based on that contrast.

Yeah, it may go back to that whole entitlement / nepotism thing. Not only are the girls on the show obviously, misguidedly entitled, but many people seem to believe that the actresses themselves are as well. In real life, all four girls have marginally famous to famous parents. So there's that added, meta layer of the show itself contributing to the whole misguided entitlement thing. As if the only reason the show exists is because it was "given" to these unproven talents.

I actually think Dunham is extremely talented, if not also somewhat misguidedly entitled. She's definitely annoying, but her writing/directing/editing/producing talent can't be denied. Even if some want to try, which just adds to the controversy.

Either way, I'm not saying that explains everything, but it might be an aspect of it.

[This message has been edited by TCTTS (edited 1/17/2014 12:55p).]

Also, as previously mentioned, I think it's as simple as it doing a REALLY good job of accurately capturing at least a significant portion of this generation. I know some can't relate, but these characters are, unfortunately very real.

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but these characters are, unfortunately very real.

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Are they really though? To me, a young Gen Xer, I am guessing that traits are real, but they are magnified into comedy. But that is what I struggle with. I just can't fathom anyone can be as awful as some of them or as dumb as others. It's got to be like all other comedies, where they take realistic traits and magnify them....right?

Of course they're magnified somewhat, but that's exactly what makes the show entertaining. But they're not as far off as you might think. At first I thought it was only a big-city, LA-NY thing. But even thinking of people I know in Texas, I can name quite a few that are so much like these characters.

Maybe the difference is that this cast represents the traits of a lot of different people many of us can relate to. In other words, I don't know anyone who is as wholly horrible as Jessa, but I know probably five different people who might share various traits of hers. Does that make sense? It's as if the traits of a generation are stuffed into FOUR people, thereby making them feel like exaggerations. Maybe?

[This message has been edited by TCTTS (edited 1/17/2014 1:11p).]

Yeah, that I can see and was thinking. I get a few of these traits in others, but no one near as horrible. But, part is likely who I associate with. Since college every friend I've made has been 10-25 years older than me. I really don't associate with anyone younger except my wife and friends from way back. Even work I'm consistently the youngest in almost every job I've had.

I do hope dads of 20somethings are watching this show so they get a small glimpse into how f cking retarded girls are at that age. Unless they are able to support themselves, about all they are good for is a lay.

+ Fortunately a lot of girls in my area are self sufficient so they are not the drag on society that chicks from NY or LA are.

+ Unfortunately the feminist movement has empowered young women to think they are equal to men when nothing could be further from the truth.

skipping over that last comment....

But how are so many of you focused on how messed up the women are on this show, and absolving Adam? He is a COMPLETE and utter loser, no job with no redeemable qualities. Is it because he humiliates Hannah with how crappy he treats her? He is neither attractive nor successful, and also mooches off his grandmother if I remember correctly.

Adam was super annoying in the past. Now I don't mind him because I think he sees how awful Hannah's friends are and even recognizes her horrible qualities. The first episode he mentioned how he never wants to have her friends over again, so I can empathize with him. He's also at times funny.

Sometimes you have to just pick the best turd available. In this case it's Adam.

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Sometimes you have to just pick the best turd available. In this case it's Adam.

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Even though Ray rises above all.

Yeah, Ray just isn't around much.

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but these characters are, unfortunately very real.

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Are they really though? To me, a young Gen Xer, I am guessing that traits are real, but they are magnified into comedy. But that is what I struggle with. I just can't fathom anyone can be as awful as some of them or as dumb as others. It's got to be like all other comedies, where they take realistic traits and magnify them....right?

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Um, yeah... they are definitely real. In Dallas I know several girls that are just like them. Only instead of Bohemian hipster, they're snobby chic. Really similar to Marnie actually.

Hypothetical: does anyone think if Lena Dunham were 48 vs. 28 and just the creator and lead writer of the show and not the lead actress, would people quit trying to identify so harshly with the characters in a personal way? The heart of the show is a satirical viewpoint on the post-grad/young adult experience... and I think the show captures that quite well. I'm not saying Girls isn't clearly personal for Dunham either, just that when I watch it, I don't think she's looking for empathy from her audience most of the time which seems to be what everyone is wanting to grant the characters to give the show any credit.

I often wonder if the reason so many people loathe the characters so much... because maybe they see a bit more of younger version of themselves in the mirror when they watch it than they care to admit. And before attacking on that note, no... I'm not accusing anybody of the #1 sin the characters commit according to this discussion (mooching off of their parents), but more speaking to the follies and mistakes all of the characters have made and how they've handled those. My thought is the disdain for a lot of the characters comes from an odd relationship to them by all that have passed that age... and remembering being 'pantsed' by life and how much you recall being embarrassed about it if that makes sense. That's why a lot of the stories and actions of the characters make you cringe. The genius of it is since Dunham isn't far removed from that age, its vivid in her writing. The wide spread audience the show has and keeps is due in part to the odd relate-ability of it to anybody at that age or older.

Tonight's episode felt shorter than usual for whatever reason, but on the plus side, it was easily one of the funniest in a while.

Also...

Tonight's episode was hilarious.

I can't believe I just saw the bush of the little girl from Uncle Buck.

And the tooth??? That was one of the WTF moments of the show to me.

Overall I liked the episode though. Ray vs Hannah's boss was great. Marnie is pretty pathetic but Jesus she is beautiful.

TCTTS, what does GWB have to do with anything? Did I miss something?

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TCTTS, what does GWB have to do with anything? Did I miss something?

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I can't believe I saw bush

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CASE CLOSED. You and TC said the same joke. He used img.

Read the first line on your post and you will get the GWB pic reference

lol. I'm a dumb arse

That girl has a very masculine look as a grown up.

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I can't believe I just saw the bush of the little girl from Uncle Buck.

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You just blew my mind. Had no idea that was the same girl (though, obvious now).

[This message has been edited by TCTTS (edited 1/20/2014 1:31p).]

Sepinwall:

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A review of tonight's "Girls" coming up just as soon as I explain the logic of the queue to you...

"Sleepless in Seattle."
"Field of Dreams."
"Freaky Friday" (the Shelley Long version).
"Uncle Buck."
"Now and Then."

These are among the films featuring the young Gaby Hoffmann that have been forever ruined for me (and other filmgoers of a certain age) by the conclusion to "She Said OK," which features an adult Hoffmann as Adam's sister Caroline, bottomless and very hairy, staring blankly at Hannah before shattering a drinking glass in her fist.

So thanks, "Girls." Thanks so much. I will no longer be able to watch Ray Kinsella introducing his dad to his family before they have a catch without thinking of this. If anybody needs me, I'll be soaking a portion of my DVD collection in acid.
Read more at http://m.hitfix.com/whats-alan-watching/review-girls-she-said-ok-hannah-and-his-sister#35lOe4xobIh8DrXC.99

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