Here's how the recessed lighting came out. I used 14 4" Cree LEDs on a dimmer and the picture was taken with the lighting dimmed only a little bit. There's also a cat hiding in one of the two pictures if anyone wants to try and find it...

Today's plans are, call Habitat for pickup, run circuits for the dehumidifier and kitchen vent fan, and remove the light and fan in the family room. After that I may start doing drywall touch up in the kitchen.

looks good.

i see kitty in the bottom pic. if he's like ours, any open box is like the best toy on earth.

What are you going to do for flooring in the kitchen?

Carpet all around (j/k)?

Looks good. Will look into getting LED lights, since I have 6 can lights and hate the CFL ones that are currently installed.

~egon

If you're looking for 6 lights the best price you'll find will probably be on Amazon in a 6 pack. Gardenweb heavily favors the ones by Cree, and they put off a color that's about the same as halogen. Dimmer compatibility is still an issue if you plan on doing that. You'll find a list of supported bulbs posted by dimmer supplier and we went with Lutron Maestro C/L. It's capable of dimming the lights as low as you can get with incandescent without any trouble. The old kitchen only had two lights - the lighting alone turned this into a whole other room.

We're going with finish on site maple flooring. I'm not sure of the board width yet though... whatever works with a modern room. I also have no clue where to buy the stuff or what brand is good. I bought engineered online 4 years ago without any trouble though so I'll probably do the same with this.

Habitat is coming by Friday afternoon so I'll finally get the middle garage bay back. The old cabinets, appliances, crown molding, baseboards, and two "decorative" columns have been hanging out in there for way too long now. This means I have to hurry up and remove the rest of the baseboards, fake victorian doorway trim, and crown molding from the family room so they can have it all at the same time. I also just got confirmation that the whole house dehumidifier will arrive on Tuesday. Today is turning into a pretty good day

The cat likes the box the new circular saw came in more than any of the others so far. It hides inside and waits for the dog to walk by before springing into action. Guess I can't recycle that one for a while.

[This message has been edited by The Fife (edited 12/3/2013 12:31p).]

Does that diffuser being off-center not bother you?

Thanks, now I see it too. There are two registers and they're not in line with each other either. Up in the attic it's difficult to get close to the wall between the kitchen and family room because the old roof decking and shingles are still in place. I may or may not be able to move the things but it looks like I'll have a go at it before finishing the drywall on the ceiling.

Yesterday wasn't the most productive day; all I was able to get accomplished was putting in the new circuit for the vent fan and taking a chain saw to the joists I removed a couple of weeks ago so they'll be taken by large item pickup today. Today's plans are just removing more trim and pulling nails from it so Habitat can have everything on Friday, then wiring up a GFCI outlet for the dehumidifier.

Production has been on a break for the most part. We bought a new car for the wife about 3 weeks ago and someone rear ended it hard on Saturday so I've been dealing with that. At this point we don't know if it will be totaled or not and the wife is still sore with whiplash so there's plenty of stress going around.

About all I've been able to do is run more wiring for accessory lighting in the kitchen and try to neaten up a 4-gang box in the kitchen. We had more to give to Habitat than they had room for in the truck so they'll be by again sometime this week after I schedule another pickup.

Take care of yourself and your wife. Renovations will always wait. See my posts in the other thread on care for her head/neck.

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Habitat is coming by Friday afternoon so I'll finally get the middle garage bay back. The old cabinets, appliances, crown molding, baseboards, and two "decorative" columns have been hanging out in there for way too long now. This means I have to hurry up and remove the rest of the baseboards, fake victorian doorway trim, and crown molding from the family room so they can have it all at the same time.

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How long does it take for Habitat to pick up everything once you call them?

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Habitat is coming by Friday afternoon so I'll finally get the middle garage bay back. The old cabinets, appliances, crown molding, baseboards, and two "decorative" columns have been hanging out in there for way too long now. This means I have to hurry up and remove the rest of the baseboards, fake victorian doorway trim, and crown molding from the family room so they can have it all at the same time.

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How long does it take for Habitat to pick up everything once you call them?

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It depends, based on where you are. The one nearest here has people picking things up every day, and they stop by our area once or twice a week. In my case they're coming out Friday again because the wall cabinets I had were too long for the space they had available in their truck.

Renovations are on hold for the most part at the moment because of all the time spent dealing with the car stuff. The dehumidifier is coming in tomorrow and about the best I can do at this point is have a spot in the attic ready for it. The builder asked if I could leave a key so he and the lead framer could walk through and make sure he had an accurate estimate for time to complete the work so with any luck they'll be doing their thing next week.

[This message has been edited by The Fife (edited 12/11/2013 9:23a).]

The whole house dehumidifier is in now. Just in time for the driest time of year, but it beats trying to deal with the thing in summer. On a warm winter day I've seen indoor humidity levels climb up into the high 60s so I'm sure it'll get used soon.

It was really easy to install. Run an electrical circuit and put in a GFCI outlet, follow the directions for how to duct the thing in, build a platform and hook up a drain line. I still need to set it in a drip pan but plan on picking one up on my way home from work tomorrow. Those aren't carried by your nearest friendly big box. The hardest part was probably lugging the thing up the attic stairs - it weighs in at about 100lbs.

My next tasks are to finish up the cabinet layout (what cabinets do what), put in the ice maker valve, some of the peninsula electrical and plumbing work before the framers come just after Christmas to do the wall and ceiling work.

Quick question - does anyone know of an online tool for playing around with kitchen layouts? I've basically been using PowerPoint and it's getting much too tedious to try and see how different ideas work.

http://kitchenplanner.ikea.com/

I played around with the Ikea designer for a while but it had a hard time with the overall shape of the room and I wound up powering through with PPT.

Here's what I have for the layout for the kitchen. Hopefully it'll be the final one because there were a lot of changes after we started looking at the different zones for what actually goes on inside the kitchen.



The big change to the peninsula is that the warming drawer is gone, the microwave drawer moved and the sink has moved over. Storage was added and it's now about 6" larger than it was before.

On the other side of the room the cooktop has shifted over some and the long side of the countertop is now to its left. The warming drawer is to the right of the cooktop. Storage and access to what you use to cook now makes sense. I have plates and silverware on this side of the room but it would be easy to relocate it to an identical cabinet to the right of the sink.

I may have a final design. Any thoughts?

I like this layout much better! I have come out of lurkdom to share a few thoughts.

Have you taken a total inventory of what goes in your kitchen and considered any items you don't yet have but want, like a food processor? Tupperware, blender, mixing bowls, coffee mugs, prep utensils, griddle, waffle iron, crockpot...just a few things in our inventory that I don't see in your layout. You've got a nice size pantry so maybe you're planning to keep these things in there but that brings me to my other thoughts.

Have you considered basically mirroring the run between fridge and wall oven? Then you could have the upper next to the fridge sit on the counter and be an appliance garage, maybe a coffee maker in there and a can opener, or a blender, whatever floats your boat.

I think you will miss having a landing space for pantry items, either because you're digging through it to get that one item or because you're going through it and taking out several things at once. What about putting a cabinet and counter space in that area to the left of the pantry? Even better, a counter run on the right of the pantry along that header space. You could use that run as a bar area, too.

It's crazy how much thought goes into the details of the layout. I don't even want to think about how many hours I spent planning every detail of our new construction kitchen! I'm sure it will all be worth it to have an amazingly functional kitchen, for both of us. Good luck!

Once upon a time I had a small landing space to the left of the pantry but it looked out of place. The reason why I can't have anything under the header is because it's what you see straight ahead when you walk through the front door. I haven't talked about the pantry much but the solution we came up with was to have a small countertop inside the pantry to be used as a landing. The space underneath it can be split between drawers and shelves with a larger spot reserved for the dog food bag, and the space above the countertop is shelves 18" deep. I think that would be a good balance between being able to turn boxes sideways vs. the shelves being deep enough for things to get lost and having to dig around.

Appliances big and small... We were between a rock and a hard place with where to put the fridge and oven because if they were mirrored the refrigerator left side door would be too close to the wall and where it is now the right door goes into the landing at the entry hall when open all the way, but not by much. We've planned on most of the appliances living in the pantry (rarely used ones) or the 27" cabinet (used more often). We have all the normal appliances - crock pot, waffle iron, blender, mixer, hand mixer, espresso and coffee makers, and different chopping-shredding things that only the wife knows the name of. The new in box '50s/'60s toaster and blender get to hang out on the counter but that's all. The countertop turns the pantry into a mini-prep area so heavy things like the mixer might stay out on that. You did bring up a good point about a small prep sink in there, and it would be so easy to do because there's a bathroom sink on the other side of the wall...

We took your advice and inventoried the different kinds of cooking utensils that I also don't know the names for and they all fit in the base cabinets to the left of the cooktop. We're pretty set on those but there's a ton of space left over for whatever items we don't have yet. Silverware has been moved to the cabinet to the right of the sink to make it easier to put up after cleaning and smaller pyrex and corningware type baking and mixing things (that's a technical term) fit into the bottom four drawers of the cabinets to the left of the cooktop.

We have plans for a bar type area in the office. It's about 400 square feet and close by - you get there by entering the dining room and taking a left. So far we already know we want to have a beer/wine fridge and built in coffee maker in there. There's already a fireplace that will be redone and we'll break out a wall and put in tall windows and sliding glass door(s) to get to the back yard and pool (someday). It's all things that are of critical importance to anyone's office.

Oh I meant just mirroring what is between the fridge and wall oven, basically make the fridge side 2 cabinets wide and the oven side one wide. I do agree the fridge and oven are in the best place for your particular layout. Of course there's no such thing as a perfect layout, not even when you get to design the entire house from the ground up. Just a matter of how you use the space and what is most important.

It sounds like your pantry will be similar to ours. We've got drawers in the bottom, partial depth shelves up top with racks on the doors, and plan to keep the keurig, toaster, and can opener on the full depth shelf that forms the top drawers, amongst other things. But I'm thinking your kitchen will be done before ours. We are still working on framing, windows haven't even been ordered!

Fife:

You have inspired me. I have multiple projects I have been scared of due to lack of time owning my own business to plan and draft the ideas. I have never drafted in 3D before and looked up the program and played with it for an hour and starting on my redesign for my kitchen which my wife wants bad.

Thanks!

Thanks! Between here, houzz and gardenweb you have a limitless supply of advice and opinions. Houzz is better for making things look nice since it's more decorator and design oriented, and GW is better for making it functional.

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Oh I meant just mirroring what is between the fridge and wall oven, basically make the fridge side 2 cabinets wide and the oven side one wide. I do agree the fridge and oven are in the best place for your particular layout. Of course there's no such thing as a perfect layout, not even when you get to design the entire house from the ground up. Just a matter of how you use the space and what is most important.

It sounds like your pantry will be similar to ours. We've got drawers in the bottom, partial depth shelves up top with racks on the doors, and plan to keep the keurig, toaster, and can opener on the full depth shelf that forms the top drawers, amongst other things. But I'm thinking your kitchen will be done before ours. We are still working on framing, windows haven't even been ordered!

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OK I understand now. That was how things were in an earlier layout but because the warming drawer looks strange next to the oven I had to change to the way it is now.

The wife said no to putting a small sink in the pantry because the regular one is right nearby, so that one is out. I'm finishing clearing everything out of the family room and removing the ceiling in the family room this weekend. The framers are supposed to do their thing after Christmas so it's now or never. Pics to come when there's something to look at...

I'm still waiting on framers... there's a labor shortage around here and of course they're in Greenville for a while.

In the mean time I've decided to do the plumbing since it's one of the few things that isn't constrained by that wall still being there. The sink is moving 12-18" to the right but the drain will hopefully be ok where it currently is. My plans are to cut the existing copper hot/cold lines, have the T leading to the icemaker in the crawlspace and run PEX up into the peninsula for the dishwasher and sink. The icemaker box is already installed and the other three outlets will be capped off until cabinets are in.

There are also a couple of other changes in store. Right now the washer/dryer and hot water heater are in the garage, and the water lines run through a mini crawlspace underneath the dining room. I someday want to take this room 1 step down so it's at the level it originally was built at so the water lines have to go. To do that I'll need to run them up through the wall between the kitchen and dining room, over the dining room and back down into the garage. I haven't put up drywall between the kitchen and dining room yet so that part should be pretty easy.

The other change is that we'd like to add a hot water circulating pump on a timer set to run only when we're at home because it takes forever for hot water to get to the master bathroom (and forget about using it in the half bath). That will run next to the new hot/cold line going to the garage and tie into the cold line in front of the water heater. The plumbing runs in an "L" shape with short branches off the main line and it'll be simple to turn that into a loop.

Other than that, about the only other things I can do are patch up the drywall where I had to open up walls and a few areas where I cut too big a hole for a couple of can lights, have the short gas line to the cooktop added, and maybe replace the rest of the joists in the family room. I wanted to hold off on that so I could be sure the joists were even with each other on both sides of the wall, but I may be able to come up with something to help measure.

[This message has been edited by The Fife (edited 1/4/2014 6:09a).]

For the sake of keeping this current, plumbing is now roughed in. I'll probably throw in the dishwasher circuit next, then look into doing more joist work in the family room next.

For this evening though there's a bomber of Rogue Dead Guy Ale with my name on it.

Dead Guys

I'm replacing joists again in the family room. I can demo and replace about 3 per day and still have time to relax after dinner. It's pretty much the same old thing for now while I wait on framers to do their thing. I'm working on a plan for what to do if they miss another appointment. Right now that looks like going through another friend who's a builder (they may use the same framers though) or if I have to, how to shore the rafters and ceiling joists so I can do the work on my own. On with the pictures...

The subfloor here was bad enough for me to fall through it if I didn't watch my step. It took only ten years to get that way. Moisture can destroy your house in no time.


I added the pier(s) and support beam under the joists a year and a half ago and they're in great shape. That was loads of fun to do. I hand dug 2' x 2' x 1.5' holes for the footings with a garden trowel, filled buckets with dirt and wheeled them out on an old skateboard. Concrete to fill the holes went in the same way, and I cut and fitted 2x8s and pieces of 3/4" plywood for the beams and labeled them so I could get it all back together underneath the house. If I knew I would have the floor open later I would've waited and did it now.


Previous owners removed the insulation between the joists probably due to it being soaked so in the winter the floor gets cold. This week we got down into the teens so that made it even better. After I'm finished replacing subflooring and joists everywhere it needs to be done I'm having spray foam put in under the house and probably in the attic rafters while it's still open.


Aside from losing strength, here's why notching joists and hanging them on a ledger board is dumb. I'm not sure if someone's notch was too big or if they screwed up in more than one way. Either way the new lumber is going in with actual joist hangers.

I think you should keep the TV in the kitchen. Looks like a great addition.


For the spray foam, are you going to crawl under the house and spray the rafters with foam for floor insulation? Little confused on that aspect.

~egon

I like to think the tv belongs in the kitchen so someone can cook and use Wii Fit at the same convenient location. Both at the same time if she's talented.

The way it was described to me was that the spray foam insulation would be applied to the underside of the subfloor and possibly some on the joists. Obviously I have to be finished redoing joists and subfloor for that to happen, and it helps if I'm done playing around with the plumbing and electrical down there. For the garage it would be the same as any attic installation and go between the decking. I wouldn't be doing that on my own - I'm friends with a contractor and can only take so much quality time underneath the house before even I get tired of it.

[This message has been edited by The Fife (edited 1/9/2014 7:33a).]

Two questions

Did you know this house was in such bad shape when you bought it? If yes, you are either crazy or have a lot of spare time.

How much patience does your wife have? Looks like this has been going on for a long time. My wife would be considering filing for divorce after about a week and actually file it after a month. Guess it kind of goes back to the first question.

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Two questions

Did you know this house was in such bad shape when you bought it? If yes, you are either crazy or have a lot of spare time.

How much patience does your wife have? Looks like this has been going on for a long time. My wife would be considering filing for divorce after about a week and actually file it after a month. Guess it kind of goes back to the first question.

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Good questions... the first one is, no, none of it was disclosed or mentioned by the inspector on the report. I considered going after the sellers and their agent who is her father, but none of the parties have any assets. A judgement would have been worthless.

The second is, this was the house she wanted. I wanted one 20 years newer needing only cosmetic work that I would have finished long ago, but for whatever reason she didn't like it. Because of that, and because she's been involved with the design she's been incredibly understanding. She's more impatient with the missed appointments than anything else and has done a great job keeping her mind on where we're going, not where we were or how things are now.

Did you ever figure out why the moisture was collecting in the crawl space? I searched back through this thread (but not very well) and was trying to figure out if that ever got resolved. I know you did a lot of digging int he part you had open before.

Yes, it's sort of a universal problem. The dew point around here routinely gets to into the mid 70s which is about the ambient temperature underneath a house so condensation forms easily. Typically it's on surfaces that are cooled slightly due to the air conditioned living space - the joists and to a degree the insulation and subfloor which in turn grow mold and dry rot. Not having a vapor barrier and having a/c ducts in the crawlspace (especially those that leak) make it much worse since that allows additional sources of moisture and cooling. This was not so much a problem before air conditioning since the house would be warmer inside. In our case the parts of the crawlspace near southwest facing walls were relatively undamaged, probably because they were warmer so water did not condense.

Crawlspace ventilation does not help during humid parts of the year since air flowing in is near its dew point and has little drying ability. The solution is to make sure drainage is good and to encapsulate the crawlspace - apply a vapor barrier at least 10mil, seal the vents and install a dehumidifier. It worked wonders at our place. Quotes are high ($10K) so I bought the materials and did it. The problem affects homes new and old - building codes requiring vents have only recently changed after studies started being done within the last 10 years or so.

Other than where I'm working now, only a full bath and bedroom #4 need this kind of work. I'll also open up the master bathroom someday but that's to beef things up so I can install stone. It's really not that bad... I look at this as an opportunity to make the place stronger instead of being upset about it.

edit: the digging was part of strengthening the place. A lot of the floor joists were near or beyond their SYP span table limit or had too much deflection for the type of flooring we wanted to use, so the digging was for footings for the piers and beams that I added. It feels great now and it's silent when people walk around. And one footing is for a column that's going in when the wall goes away. A point load was discovered near the middle of the span so there really wasn't any other option.

[This message has been edited by The Fife (edited 1/9/2014 5:44p).]

Major update: The framers came by today - looks like work will start on Monday/Tuesday. My task this weekend is to get the ceiling drywall and insulation out in order to speed things up. Once the wall is gone and the family room ceiling raised it's full speed ahead.

Glad they finally showed up.

We have a big week coming up. The framers are going to start working on tuesday so I need to have everything ready by then. That means it's time for the ceiling in the family room to go. It really wasn't that bad, only time consuming.



At the low end it's about 8 1/2 feet


At the high end it'll be just under 11 feet


There's a 16 foot LVL running through the middle of the room that will be staying. I'll have to find a way to make it look nice.


It's still kind of hard to visualize how it will look with the ceiling joists in place bit they won't be around for long.

What's your budget for all of this?