After Snovid and looking ahead to hurricane season, looking to get a portable generator and have the house wired with a generator plug-in. At a minimum we'd like to run some lights, 2 fridges, microwave, TV, computer, wifi router, charge phones and ipads, and 2 gas furnaces or a portable AC, depending on weather. Options we're considering are: 1) Westinghouse WGen7500DF - like that it can run off propane as an option and is 6750 running watts on propane; concerned about reliability and noise. 2) Honda EU7000 - steep price however like that it's quiet, but worried it won't give us quite the power we need during an outage that could last a few days as it's only 5500W sustained, plus only runs on gas. Which would you choose? Or any other recommendations for 10,000W and below that are dual-fuel, reliable, and not the loudest of the bunch?

Pretty much anything that's not an inverter will be loud, and it looks like the Honda 7000 is the most powerful of those, and with wanting to run electronics, it would probably be best to go with one of those.

There's always the option of getting a higher wattage dual fuel screamer to run the big things and a smaller inverter (Honda/Yamaha/Predator/etc) to run the electronics when you need them.

Last week was my first time to really run my generator hard. Generac GP5500.
With 5,500 running watts and a gas heater we did just fine. Only thing I had to closely monitor was our electric range. We used one burner at a time, which sucked with 10 people at the house for a few days. I probably could have used two but my wife is not very good at remembering we are on generator power and didn't want to risk her turning something else on that draws a lot of power.
I have a gas range being delivered tomorrow. We wanted one anyway and this was the push to go ahead and make the purchase.

I'll have to monitor usage more in the summer (2 small window units + freezers/fridges working harder).

Would prefer something a little bigger than what I currently have, but picked it up right before Harvey hit and it's all that was available.

What made all the difference in the world was already being set up to back feed power through the electric panel and having familiarity with the process. I just got this set up a few months ago and already had everything labeled. I had put marks next to the specific breakers to turn on when on generator power (which was most of them). Nobody wants to be trying to figure out which breakers are for what when it's 20 degrees outside.

If you're paying Honda prices, might as well step up to a larger permanent home system.

I can't vouch for their reliability, but here are slightly larger or equivalent inverter options than the Westinghouse. I doubt any in this range can handle the startup demand of an outdoor condenser unit though.

Champion Power Equipment 100520 8750-Watt DH Series Open Frame Inverter, Electric Start https://www.amazon.com/dp/B083V8VNGL/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_glt_fabc_BRDP8KZ8A7AR23B4A5C0

8,750/7,000-Watt Dual Fuel Digital Inverter Generator with 50 Amp RV Outlet, USB Port and 4 GFCI 120-Volt Outlets
https://www.homedepot.com/p/312402800

Or run two Predator 3500s in parallel.

Was actually just looking at that Champion 8750 inverter generator, an interesting option for sure. I'm guessing it can't compete with the Honda as far as noise levels, but I like that it's 7700W running and also the inverter would be nice to have.

https://westinghouseoutdoorpower.com/collections/generators/products/wgen12000df-generator-dual-fuel

It may be overkill, and the fuel burn is going to be a PITA, but it advertises that it's electronics safe.

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Safely powers sensitive electronics such as laptop computers, cell phones, and more with less than 5% THD

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For those of you wiring your large portable gens to your panel with an interlock switch, what are you doing with the NG bond on the generator? Are you disconnecting the bond or switching/disconnecting the neutral in the lighting panel?

Kenneth_2003 said:

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https://westinghouseoutdoorpower.com/collections/generators/products/wgen12000df-generator-dual-fuel

It may be overkill, and the fuel burn is going to be a PITA, but it advertises that it's electronics safe.

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Safely powers sensitive electronics such as laptop computers, cell phones, and more with less than 5% THD

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I looked into that one, but it doesn't seem to be available anywhere that I looked.

Pretty sure I'm going with their smaller unit and then buying a Predator 3500 Inverter Generator. That's 2 generators for at least $600 cheaper investment than just the 1 Westinghouse. Gives me more options as far as taking just the Predator camping, tailgating, etc.

https://www.amazon.com/Westinghouse-WGen9500DF-Generator-9500-Watts-Gas-Powered-Electric/dp/B07Q1DLKBG

TopFlightReject said:

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For those of you wiring your large portable gens to your panel with an interlock switch, what are you doing with the NG bond on the generator? Are you disconnecting the bond or switching/disconnecting the neutral in the lighting panel?

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NM, wrong discussion

For those that plan to use generators with over 5% THD, what are your plans?

The only suggestion I've seen is to have a whole home surge plus individual surge protectors.

What equipment doesn't have "sensitive electronics" in it that you plan to power?
Lights, space heater, window AC, oven?

What about your fridge, many washer/dryers, thermostats, most newer AC's? all have circuit boards. Are they not considered "sensitive"?

Not saying this is wrong to do, just thinking through all of this.

Currently, my plan is to buy a $1,000 Westinghouse 9500DF to run the big stuff and also buy a Predator 3500 inverter generator to run smaller items. For under $2,000 that's two generators that I can load up and take with me to different locations for specific needs.

I'm thinking along the same lines as you are. I'm really interested in the Firman Tri-fuel generator, but the THD has me concerned. I talked to their tech support today, and they said it has a THD between 11-14. I have a whole home surge protector, and power strips for all electronics. I'm wondering if that's enough to protect my sensitive electronics.

Damn, I am learning a lot in these threads! Never thought I would learn so much about generators. I have a 3500 running W but I am in the market to upsize and use via interlock.

What is the difference between a generator and an inverter generator you guys are talking about?

I'm also curious to hear y'all's' solutions on THD. Obviously I would need a power computers and mobile phones but as someone pointed out above, all appliances contain sensitive electronics

Non inverter just create AC power and puts it to where you need it. Depending on quality of generator, determine how clean the wave is. Inverter generators, create AC power, converts to DC thru electric boards, then convert back to AC in a much cleaner wave. Thats the basics. As for what distortion your electronics will tolerate, thats up for debate, super sensitive say less than 5% THD, but i've also ran computers and TV's with gens that are 9-12%.

Edit to add, Inverter Gens also usually have a throttle control, so the engine only runs as hard/fast as needed to create the amount of power needed, where most non inverter just run full bore the whole time, but there are exceptions to that also. That is mostly why most inverter gens are much less noisy.

Thanks!

https://electrical-engineering-portal.com/essential-basics-of-total-harmonic-distortion-thd

Adding to what was said above. From what I can tell if you get a inverter generator it will be quieter, more fuel efficient, and cost more per kW. Largest inverter I've found is a 7kW Honda.

If you get a cheap conventional generator, power quality is likely going to be an issue. The more expensive conventional generators seem to have TDH and voltage distortion listed in their specs.

Filters are designed to level out voltage spikes and lags,, they dont address the Harmonic Distortion (abnormal wave form). The best way to cleanup harmonic distortion is by using an inline double conversion UPS on your sensitive equipment. These convert the incoming AC to DC, then back to AC using an inverter so the actual utility power never gets to your device. Downside is they are more expensive.

Here's and article that does a good job of explaining the different types of UPS units: https://www.qpsolutions.net/2019/11/line-interactive-vs-double-conversion-ups-which-ones-best/

Would definitely pick up a smaller UPS or 2 for our electronics.

Another thing I've wondered is how much of a PITA it would be to wire a larger generator into the box with an Interlock to power our bigger draw items but eventually also wire in a smaller inverter generator like a Predator 3500 to run electronics.

I'm guessing that's getting in the realm of overly complicated to have 2 different generators wired to the home. But it would be nice to have the smaller inverter generator to take with us on trips vs the larger/heavier generator.

But I guess with a couple of UPS devices to plug TVs into, etc, we really wouldn't have the need for the 2nd Generator.

Any ups is better than no ups in a lot of cases but the $100 - 150 units typically found on people's computers will not help with HD.

You can run multiple gensets but the panels they run must be isolated from one another. Retrofitting a home for this would likely be cost prohibitive because you're going to want circuits in various rooms to have "cleaner" power.

I really don't watch much TV, etc on a good day and TV, etc wouldn't be high on my priority list during a true charlie foxtrot. But a couple of good UPS devices to charge phones/computer would be handy. I didn't know it, but we already have one that the wi-fi router/antenna plugs into.

So I imagine during an outage, that the generator would be charging / running these UPS devices just the same as they are currently through Main power? So if I bought them now and ran devices through them with main power, we wouldn't have to do anything differently when switched from Main to Gen at the breaker box?

Somewhat correct.

For devices that use power adapters - like cell phone, tablets, laptops, etc. You dont need to worry too much about HD. Yes, too much HD can destroy the power adapter for these but it would not be reasonable to spend $7-800 on a dual conversion UPS to save a $20 phone charger.

Your bigger issue is television, sound systems, and even appliances that have computer boards in them (fridge with touch screen display, etc).

Also understand the HD is usually not an immediate death sentence except with really bad power and very sensitive equipment. Instead what you're looking at is lessened life and running like crap while connected to a high THD power source.

Imagine if you disconnected the fuel hose from the tank to carburetor on your lawn mower. Then you used a squirt bottle to spray fuel into the air intake as you mow the grass. The engine will still run, but instead of a nice smooth flow of fuel its not getting random spurts of flooding, too lean, etc. You'll get the grass mowed but its going to take a lot of extra work. Do this enough times and your mower will give out.

Well, sounds like we really only have 2 televisions that I'd even worry about. So I'd probably get a decent UPS and roll the dice on them or not run them.

We don't have a bunch of fancy stuff here.

Learning a lot as well. I know there are generators that run on gas and propane, but are there any inverter generators that run on propane?

Yes there are. For example https://www.homedepot.com/p/Sportsman-8-750-7-000-Watt-Dual-Fuel-Digital-Inverter-Generator-with-50-Amp-RV-Outlet-USB-Port-and-4-GFCI-120-Volt-Outlets-GEN85KIDF/312402800

I'm cheap and going down the rabbit hole of portable generators with inverters built in. In Houston, outside of the winter storm the big concern is only wind events from a hurricane or a random tornado and the transmission service being down.

If going the portable generator route and dealing with outages you have to decide what you want to power. For us the two immediate concerns are the fridge and the garage freezer. If power will be out, you can bet grocery stores will be a nightmare and there's no point in allowing your frozen foods to rot.

They're relatively low draw, but you have to start adding up watts to figure out what you need. After that, it's a matter of what else you want running. The AC during the hot summer would be next, but they draw a lot of power and they also take nearly double to get the compressor's running. This generally is outside the watt/amps of an inverter portable. HOWEVER, from these threads I discovered you can add a capacitor to your ac compressor which will lighten the startup load (called an easy start), and will be based on the tonnage of your AC, god forbid you have more than one. So those would be our main 3 items we'd want to run on a portable.

After that it's just the cost of fuel on hand and wiring the generator into the house and determining if there's any spare 'room' at everything running at max, to power any other circuits in the home.

If you want everything and no change in lifestyle, you really need a home system like a generac. But they are expensive, may not be used and they stay with the house. Portable, you can use it for other items, but have to keep fuel on hand and do monthly maintenance and probably go outside to start them/add fuel etc...

With the Honda's, you can also put them in parallel and double your capacity on the same circuits and power more, or turn one off to save gas if you don't need the power. For us, it's a matter of what can we not live without, and that's quite a few things that can have much cheaper alternatives (candles, camping lights etc...). We have nat gas for cooking, plus propane camping stuff as well. It's all just tradeoffs if you're trying to do it on a budget.

The other item I'm toying with is running a 2nd very simple circuit through the house. Use a smaller generator to power it that would fire up the living room entertainment and have an outlet in the bedroom. Yes, you'd have to unplug, replug into a different outlet to run it, but it would be completely independent of the house and very DIY, more so if you have a 1 story house like we do. Then have a solar power plant run it.

Pretty much how it's gone for me.

I have a Honda 2000 and Champion 9000 dual fuel.

Only issues I have are when I let the battery go down on the Champion, the pull start won't work (even when warmed up), and never been able to get the propane to work.

I think I lucked into it, but this champion open frame is supposed to be one of their few non-inverters with <5% THD. Pure luck on that though as I didn't realize when I bought several years ago.

aTm2004 said:

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If you want everything and no change in lifestyle, you really need a home system like a generac. But they are expensive, may not be used and they stay with the house. Portable, you can use it for other items, but have to keep fuel on hand and do monthly maintenance and probably go outside to start them/add fuel etc...

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Maybe I'm missing something, but what kind of monthly maintenance would you have to do? If it's a generator that you're using primarily as backup in case of emergency, you could drain the fuel in the tanks, run it dry, then start it a couple more times until it won't start to ensure all the fuel is out of the carb. Then, change the oil. Outside of maybe an annual oil change, the only thing I could think of is maybe a battery tender if it has a battery.

Maybe it's just me, but it seems the biggest issues people have with generators - or gas engines that rarely get used in general - is they won't start and/or run rough, and the most common problem is the fuel that has sat. Why not eliminate that problem? I loaned my BIL my Honda 2000, which I drained the fuel out of after we didn't need it for Harvey, and it started up with a few pulls and ran perfect for him.

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I did the same. Tank was dry, didn't use it for a few years, didn't even change the oil. Add gas, fired right up.

Problem is most people who can't bear the thought of everything not working or being inconvenienced in any fashion won't follow any steps.

Jethro95 said:

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Make sure you can light your gas range with an aim a flame or long match. There are some models out there that won't light without electricity due to their design.

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We had that with our Thermador. Found that the middle two burners will light with a external flame, but the two outside burner sets won't. Don't know why this is the case, but could not get the left two or the right two burners to light with an outside flame when the power was out last week.