jwhaby said:

---

Phatbob said:

---

texagbeliever said:

---

Phatbob said:

---

texagbeliever said:

---

Phatbob said:

---

texagbeliever said:

---

jwhaby said:

---

I hope so. They just seem so broken by Trump that I'm not sure they're rational enough to do what needs to be done.

---

The question to ask yourself is, how many of those have you met in person. I'm going to guess not so many. Only people who have that mindset seem to know tons of people with that mindset. Likely because people know to respond to those posters in real life with what they want to hear because otherwise they will bite their head off if they say anything less extreme back.

---

You keep building this world in your head that doesn't exist. There are plenty of people who Trump has turned off so much, they won't vote for him. I know more of those than I know Trump diehards (and I know some who will hold their noses, too). Regular folks who range from somewhat conservative to very conservative, who normally would vote for just about any Republican candidate. Key words being "just about" and unfortunately Trump falls into that narrow exception.

You can justify it in your head all you want, but that doesn't mean it matches reality. There is a part of the conservative base that Trump and the diehard Trump supporters turn off, completely. That, just like all the other baggage that comes along with the man, is not something you can get rid of. It's just part of the package. Your mistake is discounting that and just assuming only the benefits of a narcissistic windbag will show up on election day and every day thereafter and none of the repercussions you don't like.

---

This is example A.

---

So you're saying we don't exist? I'm curious that you seem to think I must live in this bubble, when the reality of the last several years doesn't back you up.

---

RAGGGEEEE!!!!!

Let me help you out: "Not so Many": meaning a sum that is likely not 0 but is not numerous in a significant number.
"don't exist": meaning zero.

You created a more extreme statement then what i said. In order to frame me as being ridiculous. It is getting tiresome.

---

Well, you do you, I guess. You've built this, more than a strawman, a fantasy in your head of people who see this differently. That's fine, a lot of people seem to think that way, especially about politics. But you have to admit there is a range of reasons why people do or don't vote for whomever they are going to. Some are reasonable (to you and I), some aren't. Trump brings a lot of baggage with him, which is a lot of negatives for a variety of reasons.

Acknowledging that fact is not rage, it's being realistic. As a normal human being, my job is not to be Trumps marketing director nor is it to just treat reality as if it needs to be spun in any certain light.

---

This is funny. Realistic is understanding that Trump will be the Republican candidate and he's better than Biden. Most Desantis supporters will vote for him because he's the lesser of two evils. The ones that won't vote for him either don't value Republican principles more than Democratic principles, or their "reality" is shaped by their feelings. I've found over my life that it's never good to follow people who make decisions based on feelings.

---

And yet you vote with MAGA...

dmart90 said:

---

TexAgs91 said:

---

BigRobSA said:

---

Boo

We deserve the two moronic, dementia-addled liberals then.

Third party it is. This country is filled with abject morons. Trump? Biden? This country is ****ed.

---

Splitting the GOP vote is a vote for Biden or whatever commie takes over. You may not like it but it's irrefutable basic math.

---

What a load of horse s***!

---

Not horse****, fact. Splitting the GOP votes is what got us Bill Clinton for 8 years. Without a third party running against Bush 1, Clinton would never have won in the first place.

I'm gonna go out on a limb and say that this was about putting the death nail in Haley's campaign more than anything.

The one thing that every other primary candidate has been in lockstep on is that it can't be Haley. Now that DeSantis isn't splitting the vote anymore, it won't be.

If that's worth 4 more years of Biden, I don't know.

Crazy the "never back down" guy backed down. So much for principle.

UAS Ag said:

---

jwhaby said:

---

Phatbob said:

---

texagbeliever said:

---

Phatbob said:

---

texagbeliever said:

---

Phatbob said:

---

texagbeliever said:

---

jwhaby said:

---

I hope so. They just seem so broken by Trump that I'm not sure they're rational enough to do what needs to be done.

---

The question to ask yourself is, how many of those have you met in person. I'm going to guess not so many. Only people who have that mindset seem to know tons of people with that mindset. Likely because people know to respond to those posters in real life with what they want to hear because otherwise they will bite their head off if they say anything less extreme back.

---

You keep building this world in your head that doesn't exist. There are plenty of people who Trump has turned off so much, they won't vote for him. I know more of those than I know Trump diehards (and I know some who will hold their noses, too). Regular folks who range from somewhat conservative to very conservative, who normally would vote for just about any Republican candidate. Key words being "just about" and unfortunately Trump falls into that narrow exception.

You can justify it in your head all you want, but that doesn't mean it matches reality. There is a part of the conservative base that Trump and the diehard Trump supporters turn off, completely. That, just like all the other baggage that comes along with the man, is not something you can get rid of. It's just part of the package. Your mistake is discounting that and just assuming only the benefits of a narcissistic windbag will show up on election day and every day thereafter and none of the repercussions you don't like.

---

This is example A.

---

So you're saying we don't exist? I'm curious that you seem to think I must live in this bubble, when the reality of the last several years doesn't back you up.

---

RAGGGEEEE!!!!!

Let me help you out: "Not so Many": meaning a sum that is likely not 0 but is not numerous in a significant number.
"don't exist": meaning zero.

You created a more extreme statement then what i said. In order to frame me as being ridiculous. It is getting tiresome.

---

Well, you do you, I guess. You've built this, more than a strawman, a fantasy in your head of people who see this differently. That's fine, a lot of people seem to think that way, especially about politics. But you have to admit there is a range of reasons why people do or don't vote for whomever they are going to. Some are reasonable (to you and I), some aren't. Trump brings a lot of baggage with him, which is a lot of negatives for a variety of reasons.

Acknowledging that fact is not rage, it's being realistic. As a normal human being, my job is not to be Trumps marketing director nor is it to just treat reality as if it needs to be spun in any certain light.

---

This is funny. Realistic is understanding that Trump will be the Republican candidate and he's better than Biden. Most Desantis supporters will vote for him because he's the lesser of two evils. The ones that won't vote for him either don't value Republican principles more than Democratic principles, or their "reality" is shaped by their feelings. I've found over my life that it's never good to follow people who make decisions based on feelings.

---

And yet you vote with MAGA...

---

What are the choices?! Trump is going to be the nominee. It's either him or Biden that has a realistic chance of winning. I'm not going to throw my vote away on some third-party candidate to cling to some kind of moral high ground. Desantis isn't an option. What does it take to make people understand this?

Impossibly high standards?

Major spending and heavy handed bureaucratic overreach during covid are high standards?

Border policy- great
International policy, minus tariffs- great


But we cannot honestly consider Trumps covid response as a non factor. It led to massive spending, inflation, job loss and higher levels of excess deaths.

Agthatbuilds said:

---

Impossibly high standards?

Major spending and heavy handed bureaucratic overreach during covid are high standards?

Border policy- great
International policy, minus tariffs- great


But we cannot honestly consider Trumps covid response as a non factor. It led to massive spending, inflation, job loss and higher levels of excess deaths.

---

You listed three areas. Two are good (foreign policy and border) and one was terrible (COVID). What does the scorecard look like under Democrat rule. All three are terrible. This is what you will be getting if you throw your vote away or abstain…and please don't tell me how good Desantis would have been. He's not an option and you have to get over it. You can only affect things going forward. No amount of wishing is going to make Desantis the candidate. You can either choose the geriatric, egotistical maniac that has "some" conservative policies, or the geriatric potato that has zero conservative policies. It shouldn't be this hard, yet here we are. Make the best next choice you can and stop thinking about what could have been. It's a waste of time and energy.

That one thing was a rather big thing that had far more effect on us than the other two listed, to be fair.

I'm still undecided but leaning towards voting trump a 3rd time, simply because the democrats are awful.

Won't matter though. Trump is winning my state regardless. I'm not the vote that needs to be courted

bobbranco said:

---

You happen to agree with this guy.

---

Well, Trump had a business relationship with Soros.

jwhaby said:

---

Waffledynamics said:

---

jwhaby said:

---

Phatbob said:

---

texagbeliever said:

---

Phatbob said:

---

texagbeliever said:

---

Phatbob said:

---

texagbeliever said:

---

jwhaby said:

---

I hope so. They just seem so broken by Trump that I'm not sure they're rational enough to do what needs to be done.

---

The question to ask yourself is, how many of those have you met in person. I'm going to guess not so many. Only people who have that mindset seem to know tons of people with that mindset. Likely because people know to respond to those posters in real life with what they want to hear because otherwise they will bite their head off if they say anything less extreme back.

---

You keep building this world in your head that doesn't exist. There are plenty of people who Trump has turned off so much, they won't vote for him. I know more of those than I know Trump diehards (and I know some who will hold their noses, too). Regular folks who range from somewhat conservative to very conservative, who normally would vote for just about any Republican candidate. Key words being "just about" and unfortunately Trump falls into that narrow exception.

You can justify it in your head all you want, but that doesn't mean it matches reality. There is a part of the conservative base that Trump and the diehard Trump supporters turn off, completely. That, just like all the other baggage that comes along with the man, is not something you can get rid of. It's just part of the package. Your mistake is discounting that and just assuming only the benefits of a narcissistic windbag will show up on election day and every day thereafter and none of the repercussions you don't like.

---

This is example A.

---

So you're saying we don't exist? I'm curious that you seem to think I must live in this bubble, when the reality of the last several years doesn't back you up.

---

RAGGGEEEE!!!!!

Let me help you out: "Not so Many": meaning a sum that is likely not 0 but is not numerous in a significant number.
"don't exist": meaning zero.

You created a more extreme statement then what i said. In order to frame me as being ridiculous. It is getting tiresome.

---

Well, you do you, I guess. You've built this, more than a strawman, a fantasy in your head of people who see this differently. That's fine, a lot of people seem to think that way, especially about politics. But you have to admit there is a range of reasons why people do or don't vote for whomever they are going to. Some are reasonable (to you and I), some aren't. Trump brings a lot of baggage with him, which is a lot of negatives for a variety of reasons.

Acknowledging that fact is not rage, it's being realistic. As a normal human being, my job is not to be Trumps marketing director nor is it to just treat reality as if it needs to be spun in any certain light.

---

This is funny. Realistic is understanding that Trump will be the Republican candidate and he's better than Biden. Most Desantis supporters will vote for him because he's the lesser of two evils. The ones that won't vote for him either don't value Republican principles more than Democratic principles, or their "reality" is shaped by their feelings. I've found over my life that it's never good to follow people who make decisions based on feelings.

---

Dr. Irony just jumped off a ****ing building.

---

Got it. I see that you're one of those that doesn't think Trump is conservative or Republican…or at least not enough for you and your impossibly high standards. You cherry pick certain failures and ignore any positives to put him on the same level as Biden. If you can't see that there's a difference between Trump and Biden (at least on policy, which is what matters to most people) then I don't know what to tell you. It's a self-fulfilling prophecy. One way or another you will get Democratic rule…at least in your mind. Congratulations I guess.

---

Look, you have your issues that Trump hits the right chord for you. For others he doesn't. I may not see the issues the same way you guys do, and that is what it is. Trump is better than Biden when it comes to some issues, obviously, but what he is better on are the transient issues that have an ebb and flow to them already, and what he is bad at are the things that are permanent. I will never vote for anyone who wants to expand the federal government, as Trump has shown willingness to do. That in and of itself causes more long term irreversible damage to our country than any issue of the day that I happen to agree with Trump on (because it will NEVER go away), and that is why he won't get my vote.

The way I see it, and it's fine if any or all of you disagree, we are more likely to cause less damage long term to the country as opposing the left by telling a Dem president no than we are letting Trump institutionalize more of our lives into the federal government just because we got our guy in. So you can calling it "emotional" or "unreasonable high standards" doesn't change the fact that Trump doesn't meet the standards of not f'ing us over forever, just in a different way.

ETA: still not voting for Biden, so lets get that out of the way.

Looks like RFK for me

Phatbob said:

---

jwhaby said:

---

Waffledynamics said:

---

jwhaby said:

---

Phatbob said:

---

texagbeliever said:

---

Phatbob said:

---

texagbeliever said:

---

Phatbob said:

---

texagbeliever said:

---

jwhaby said:

---

I hope so. They just seem so broken by Trump that I'm not sure they're rational enough to do what needs to be done.

---

The question to ask yourself is, how many of those have you met in person. I'm going to guess not so many. Only people who have that mindset seem to know tons of people with that mindset. Likely because people know to respond to those posters in real life with what they want to hear because otherwise they will bite their head off if they say anything less extreme back.

---

You keep building this world in your head that doesn't exist. There are plenty of people who Trump has turned off so much, they won't vote for him. I know more of those than I know Trump diehards (and I know some who will hold their noses, too). Regular folks who range from somewhat conservative to very conservative, who normally would vote for just about any Republican candidate. Key words being "just about" and unfortunately Trump falls into that narrow exception.

You can justify it in your head all you want, but that doesn't mean it matches reality. There is a part of the conservative base that Trump and the diehard Trump supporters turn off, completely. That, just like all the other baggage that comes along with the man, is not something you can get rid of. It's just part of the package. Your mistake is discounting that and just assuming only the benefits of a narcissistic windbag will show up on election day and every day thereafter and none of the repercussions you don't like.

---

This is example A.

---

So you're saying we don't exist? I'm curious that you seem to think I must live in this bubble, when the reality of the last several years doesn't back you up.

---

RAGGGEEEE!!!!!

Let me help you out: "Not so Many": meaning a sum that is likely not 0 but is not numerous in a significant number.
"don't exist": meaning zero.

You created a more extreme statement then what i said. In order to frame me as being ridiculous. It is getting tiresome.

---

Well, you do you, I guess. You've built this, more than a strawman, a fantasy in your head of people who see this differently. That's fine, a lot of people seem to think that way, especially about politics. But you have to admit there is a range of reasons why people do or don't vote for whomever they are going to. Some are reasonable (to you and I), some aren't. Trump brings a lot of baggage with him, which is a lot of negatives for a variety of reasons.

Acknowledging that fact is not rage, it's being realistic. As a normal human being, my job is not to be Trumps marketing director nor is it to just treat reality as if it needs to be spun in any certain light.

---

This is funny. Realistic is understanding that Trump will be the Republican candidate and he's better than Biden. Most Desantis supporters will vote for him because he's the lesser of two evils. The ones that won't vote for him either don't value Republican principles more than Democratic principles, or their "reality" is shaped by their feelings. I've found over my life that it's never good to follow people who make decisions based on feelings.

---

Dr. Irony just jumped off a ****ing building.

---

Got it. I see that you're one of those that doesn't think Trump is conservative or Republican…or at least not enough for you and your impossibly high standards. You cherry pick certain failures and ignore any positives to put him on the same level as Biden. If you can't see that there's a difference between Trump and Biden (at least on policy, which is what matters to most people) then I don't know what to tell you. It's a self-fulfilling prophecy. One way or another you will get Democratic rule…at least in your mind. Congratulations I guess.

---

Look, you have your issues that Trump hits the right chord for you. For others he doesn't. I may not see the issues the same way you guys do, and that is what it is. Trump is better than Biden when it comes to some issues, obviously, but what he is better on are the transient issues that have an ebb and flow to them already, and what he is bad at are the things that are permanent. I will never vote for anyone who wants to expand the federal government, as Trump has shown willingness to do. That in and of itself causes more long term irreversible damage to our country than any issue of the day that I happen to agree with Trump on (because it will NEVER go away), and that is why he won't get my vote.

The way I see it, and it's fine if any or all of you disagree, we are more likely to cause less damage long term to the country as opposing the left by telling a Dem president no than we are letting Trump institutionalize more of our lives into the federal government just because we got our guy in. So you can calling it "emotional" or "unreasonable high standards" doesn't change the fact that Trump doesn't meet the standards of not f'ing us over forever, just in a different way.

ETA: still not voting for Biden, so lets get that out of the way.

---

I first want to thank you for your well-reasoned and polite response. I should probably take your lead and be a little more diplomatic and congenial in my interactions on this board.

Now I understand your perspective. It's not that you can't stomach voting for Trump because you dislike his character or personality, it's because you think that he will expand government (at least spending). This is a reasonable take after he turned on the printing presses during COVID.

My hope is that he was duped by his supposedly non-partisan advisors (Fauci, etc.) that gave him bad information. I truly believe Trump's response was intended to help people with a catastrophe that was out of his control. If the pandemic was so deadly that the government had to shut down businesses and quarantine people, he probably felt that the government should support those people monetarily in their time of need. This isn't a bad sentiment. I just think he got some bad information because he trusted the wrong people and they took advantage of the situation. I'm sure he would like to have a mulligan on how he handled things, but such is life.

Given how he cut taxes and rolled back a lot of federal regulations, I don't get the sense that Trump is for expanded government. I could be wrong. What I do know is that Democrats certainly want expanded government and higher spending and that's exactly what we will get if Biden wins.

There is a chance that if Trump wins, he ends up having very liberal policies that would set a bad precedent going forward, but that doesn't seem likely. Even if so, it doesn't mean that the next Republican president has to govern the same way.

I'm afraid that if Biden wins, Democrats will entrench and isolate themselves with the help of the swamp and Republicans/Conservatives won't have a seat at the table for a very long time…maybe until the Democrats ruin society and the economy. I guess I'm just not prepared to live through that if I can help it.

Maybe my strategy is more about smaller immediate wins and the chance for improvement rather than complete disaster and destruction and a government that needs to be rebuilt from the ashes.

What's really crazy is that Republican donors spent $200 million on two primaries to be humiliated and ultimately have the closest competitor to Trump choose to abort his campaign.

Wow! Torbush style!

So do we still have posters who thought the Republican "debates" were important?

GMaster0 said:

---

What's really crazy is that Republican donors spent $200 million on two primaries to be humiliated and ultimately have the closest competitor to Trump choose to abort his campaign.

Wow! Torbush style!

---

And you're voting for Biden, right?

Man. What should be the easiest election in decades and the GOP just unequivocally botches it. Clown show.

jwhaby said:

---

Phatbob said:

---

jwhaby said:

---

Waffledynamics said:

---

jwhaby said:

---

Phatbob said:

---

texagbeliever said:

---

Phatbob said:

---

texagbeliever said:

---

Phatbob said:

---

texagbeliever said:

---

jwhaby said:

---

I hope so. They just seem so broken by Trump that I'm not sure they're rational enough to do what needs to be done.

---

The question to ask yourself is, how many of those have you met in person. I'm going to guess not so many. Only people who have that mindset seem to know tons of people with that mindset. Likely because people know to respond to those posters in real life with what they want to hear because otherwise they will bite their head off if they say anything less extreme back.

---

You keep building this world in your head that doesn't exist. There are plenty of people who Trump has turned off so much, they won't vote for him. I know more of those than I know Trump diehards (and I know some who will hold their noses, too). Regular folks who range from somewhat conservative to very conservative, who normally would vote for just about any Republican candidate. Key words being "just about" and unfortunately Trump falls into that narrow exception.

You can justify it in your head all you want, but that doesn't mean it matches reality. There is a part of the conservative base that Trump and the diehard Trump supporters turn off, completely. That, just like all the other baggage that comes along with the man, is not something you can get rid of. It's just part of the package. Your mistake is discounting that and just assuming only the benefits of a narcissistic windbag will show up on election day and every day thereafter and none of the repercussions you don't like.

---

This is example A.

---

So you're saying we don't exist? I'm curious that you seem to think I must live in this bubble, when the reality of the last several years doesn't back you up.

---

RAGGGEEEE!!!!!

Let me help you out: "Not so Many": meaning a sum that is likely not 0 but is not numerous in a significant number.
"don't exist": meaning zero.

You created a more extreme statement then what i said. In order to frame me as being ridiculous. It is getting tiresome.

---

Well, you do you, I guess. You've built this, more than a strawman, a fantasy in your head of people who see this differently. That's fine, a lot of people seem to think that way, especially about politics. But you have to admit there is a range of reasons why people do or don't vote for whomever they are going to. Some are reasonable (to you and I), some aren't. Trump brings a lot of baggage with him, which is a lot of negatives for a variety of reasons.

Acknowledging that fact is not rage, it's being realistic. As a normal human being, my job is not to be Trumps marketing director nor is it to just treat reality as if it needs to be spun in any certain light.

---

This is funny. Realistic is understanding that Trump will be the Republican candidate and he's better than Biden. Most Desantis supporters will vote for him because he's the lesser of two evils. The ones that won't vote for him either don't value Republican principles more than Democratic principles, or their "reality" is shaped by their feelings. I've found over my life that it's never good to follow people who make decisions based on feelings.

---

Dr. Irony just jumped off a ****ing building.

---

Got it. I see that you're one of those that doesn't think Trump is conservative or Republican…or at least not enough for you and your impossibly high standards. You cherry pick certain failures and ignore any positives to put him on the same level as Biden. If you can't see that there's a difference between Trump and Biden (at least on policy, which is what matters to most people) then I don't know what to tell you. It's a self-fulfilling prophecy. One way or another you will get Democratic rule…at least in your mind. Congratulations I guess.

---

Look, you have your issues that Trump hits the right chord for you. For others he doesn't. I may not see the issues the same way you guys do, and that is what it is. Trump is better than Biden when it comes to some issues, obviously, but what he is better on are the transient issues that have an ebb and flow to them already, and what he is bad at are the things that are permanent. I will never vote for anyone who wants to expand the federal government, as Trump has shown willingness to do. That in and of itself causes more long term irreversible damage to our country than any issue of the day that I happen to agree with Trump on (because it will NEVER go away), and that is why he won't get my vote.

The way I see it, and it's fine if any or all of you disagree, we are more likely to cause less damage long term to the country as opposing the left by telling a Dem president no than we are letting Trump institutionalize more of our lives into the federal government just because we got our guy in. So you can calling it "emotional" or "unreasonable high standards" doesn't change the fact that Trump doesn't meet the standards of not f'ing us over forever, just in a different way.

ETA: still not voting for Biden, so lets get that out of the way.

---

I first want to thank you for your well-reasoned and polite response. I should probably take your lead and be a little more diplomatic and congenial in my interactions on this board.

Now I understand your perspective. It's not that you can't stomach voting for Trump because you dislike his character or personality, it's because you think that he will expand government (at least spending). This is a reasonable take after he turned on the printing presses during COVID.

My hope is that he was duped by his supposedly non-partisan advisors (Fauci, etc.) that gave him bad information. I truly believe Trump's response was intended to help people with a catastrophe that was out of his control. If the pandemic was so deadly that the government had to shut down businesses and quarantine people, he probably felt that the government should support those people monetarily in their time of need. This isn't a bad sentiment. I just think he got some bad information because he trusted the wrong people and they took advantage of the situation. I'm sure he would like to have a mulligan on how he handled things, but such is life.

Given how he cut taxes and rolled back a lot of federal regulations, I don't get the sense that Trump is for expanded government. I could be wrong. What I do know is that Democrats certainly want expanded government and higher spending and that's exactly what we will get if Biden wins.

There is a chance that if Trump wins, he ends up having very liberal policies that would set a bad precedent going forward, but that doesn't seem likely. Even if so, it doesn't mean that the next Republican president has to govern the same way.

I'm afraid that if Biden wins, Democrats will entrench and isolate themselves with the help of the swamp and Republicans/Conservatives won't have a seat at the table for a very long time…maybe until the Democrats ruin society and the economy. I guess I'm just not prepared to live through that if I can help it.

Maybe my strategy is more about smaller immediate wins and the chance for improvement rather than complete disaster and destruction and a government that needs to be rebuilt from the ashes.

---

My concern is that Trump will do this for them. He's already put forth the idea of nationalizing higher education (in a small way, but we all know what that turns into), he's already come out in the not too distant past in favor of single payer healthcare (that is closer than any of us want to admit), and I won't get into the abortion thing again. We turn those things federal and it's never coming back, ever, and who would be around to stop it? Us? We're too busy slapping ourselves on the back for not being Democrats. Ironically enough, our saving grace may be Trump hatred on the left to oppose Trump just for being alive might be enough to keep those things from happening, but I don't know that we're that lucky.

We take risks all the time with the people we put into office, but I see Trump as a sub-prime mortgage level risk.

Maroon Dawn said:

---

Dems win

They got the best candidate of the race and get to run against their preferred opponent who will bomb with independents after they now ratchet up the legal attacks to 100 and cruise to easy victory

I'm tired of defending this inept party that only seems to want to be the token resistance minority party

---

well stated.

I am coming more and more around to the belief that the people like Gaetz and MTG and idiot Boebert are more than fine with losing national elections

as that increases their own power within the caucus.

Not to be too argumentative, but I think your comments on Trump's stance regarding education and healthcare may be a bit hyperbolic. Trump didn't say that he wanted to nationalize higher education, he just wants to provide a federally run alternative (George Washington had the same idea). For the record, I don't agree with him as anything that is run by the government (state or national) has the ability to be corrupted by the party in power. A federal university run by Republicans sounds good to a conservative like me…until Democrats take control and corrupt that university like they have so many others already. I personally think that Trump is just lashing out (not a great trait) at higher education institutions because they're indoctrinating students with leftist ideology and creating "communists" and "jihadists". Maybe you don't think there's an issue with higher education in which case you don't see the need for any change.

On the healthcare side, it does appear that Trump has done an about face. He's made some comments in the past that praised countries that practiced universal healthcare and stated that he "wanted to take care of everybody", but since 2018 he's been staunchly against it. Maybe he had a change of heart after he saw the disaster that was Obamacare…or maybe he's just a wolf in sheep's clothing. Nobody can say for sure, but as of right now his policy is to reject the single payer, universal model.

To be fair, I don't keep up with all the policy preferences of all the presidential candidates, so I could be mistaken. This is just what a quick internet search on the subjects is showing me. Also, from a common sense standpoint, I don't think his core base of MAGA Republicans would be so wild about him if he was truly supporting universal healthcare and socialized education. It just doesn't make sense to me.

Just curious. If Trump somehow manages to win the general election, will you say it was a miracle, or will you concede that you were wrong…or both? You may be right, but the polling is pretty tight.

Well the good news is that I will have a lot more time on my hands not distracted by politics this year. Get more done. Cause I don't give a f now. I'll bypass the primary, who cares. I will show up in Nov and vote for Trump.

And he will lose and the GOP completely whiffed on its chance to send a real conservative that actually gets sh** done to the White House.

Hope you Trump faithful can pull it off but you're up against a machine that can't be stopped because literally about 75% of the country hates the guy. See, that's the biggest way they get away with cheating. Not enough people care because they hate him. Pretty simple.

Muy said:

---

So do we still have posters who thought the Republican "debates" were important?

---

Yes. Trump wimped out by not attending. I refuse to buy this bag of BS. Debates, if properly moderated are a great way to see how grounded a person is to what they really believe and how fast on their feet they are.

Prepared statements and ads are practiced BS.

Urban Ag said:

---

Well the good news is that I will have a lot more time on my hands not distracted by politics this year. Get more done. Cause I don't give a f now. I'll bypass the primary, who cares. I will show up in Nov and vote for Trump.

And he will lose and the GOP completely whiffed on its chance to send a real conservative that actually gets sh** done to the White House.

Hope you Trump faithful can pull it off but you're up against a machine that can't be stopped because literally about 75% of the country hates the guy. See, that's the biggest way they get away with cheating. Not enough people care because they hate him. Pretty simple.

---

I'm not the best at math, but if 75% of the country hates Trump, how is it that he's going to win the Republican primary by a pretty wide margin? I don't follow.

jwhaby said:

---

Urban Ag said:

---

Well the good news is that I will have a lot more time on my hands not distracted by politics this year. Get more done. Cause I don't give a f now. I'll bypass the primary, who cares. I will show up in Nov and vote for Trump.

And he will lose and the GOP completely whiffed on its chance to send a real conservative that actually gets sh** done to the White House.

Hope you Trump faithful can pull it off but you're up against a machine that can't be stopped because literally about 75% of the country hates the guy. See, that's the biggest way they get away with cheating. Not enough people care because they hate him. Pretty simple.

---

I'm not the best at math, but if 75% of the country hates Trump, how is it that he's going to win the Republican primary by a pretty wide margin? I don't follow.

---

Most of the people that hate trump don't vote.

The challenge is that they will get votes counted for them despite not voting

jwhaby said:

---

Urban Ag said:

---

Well the good news is that I will have a lot more time on my hands not distracted by politics this year. Get more done. Cause I don't give a f now. I'll bypass the primary, who cares. I will show up in Nov and vote for Trump.

And he will lose and the GOP completely whiffed on its chance to send a real conservative that actually gets sh** done to the White House.

Hope you Trump faithful can pull it off but you're up against a machine that can't be stopped because literally about 75% of the country hates the guy. See, that's the biggest way they get away with cheating. Not enough people care because they hate him. Pretty simple.

---

I'm not the best at math, but if 75% of the country hates Trump, how is it that he's going to win the Republican primary by a pretty wide margin? I don't follow.

---

Over 50% of the country, easy, thinks he a complete POS.

The other less than 50% (of voters) that may cast a ballot for him - half at best like him. At best. The other half will hold their nose or have some form of Stockholm Syndrome. When the cheating starts again, and it will, those people won't expend the energy or attention to stand up for a guy they didn't want to vote for in the first place.

Basic human nature always wins.

jwhaby said:

---

Not to be too argumentative, but I think your comments on Trump's stance regarding education and healthcare may be a bit hyperbolic. Trump didn't say that he wanted to nationalize higher education, he just wants to provide a federally run alternative (George Washington had the same idea). For the record, I don't agree with him as anything that is run by the government (state or national) has the ability to be corrupted by the party in power. A federal university run by Republicans sounds good to a conservative like me…until Democrats take control and corrupt that university like they have so many others already. I personally think that Trump is just lashing out (not a great trait) at higher education institutions because they're indoctrinating students with leftist ideology and creating "communists" and "jihadists". Maybe you don't think there's an issue with higher education in which case you don't see the need for any change.

On the healthcare side, it does appear that Trump has done an about face. He's made some comments in the past that praised countries that practiced universal healthcare and stated that he "wanted to take care of everybody", but since 2018 he's been staunchly against it. Maybe he had a change of heart after he saw the disaster that was Obamacare…or maybe he's just a wolf in sheep's clothing. Nobody can say for sure, but as of right now his policy is to reject the single payer, universal model.

To be fair, I don't keep up with all the policy preferences of all the presidential candidates, so I could be mistaken. This is just what a quick internet search on the subjects is showing me. Also, from a common sense standpoint, I don't think his core base of MAGA Republicans would be so wild about him if he was truly supporting universal healthcare and socialized education. It just doesn't make sense to me.

---

Anyone as a conservative proposing a federally run alternative to a state issue is not proposing a conservative position.

The funny thing about the second part I bolded is that DeSantis actually made policy against educators in Florida that wanted to indoctrinate kids with leftist ideology around LBGTQ and CRT. The problem is, most Trump supporters are to concerned about getting revenge for Trump for a perceived stolen election and saying "F'em Dems" to actually look at what DeSantis has done.

Of course we think there is an issue with higher education and see a need for change. That's why we wanted the guy who actually took action against it to be the president rather than a guy who's solution includes the expansion of the federal government that will inevitably be overrun by Dems and be a bigger issue for Rs in 10 years than you could even imagine.

And I gave $100 to the DeSantis campaign last Friday.

Trump says a lot of stuff off the cuff. He's just spitballing ideas that he should keep to himself, or maybe he's just pandering to his base.

From our conversation it appears that nothing Trump has done or potentially could do will ever satisfy you. You've clearly made up your mind. I guess time will tell. Let's see how this plays out in November. Have a good one.

So.

I have business relationships with some absolutely horrible people.

If you want to spend your money hire me. I don't really care and will work with most anyone.

Tex100 said:

---

And I gave $100 to the DeSantis campaign last Friday.

---

You also donate to support a University sports team that just paid a coach $75MM NOT to coach for them anymore. So maybe you are cursed lol. (all lighthearted)

jwhaby said:

---

Trump says a lot of stuff off the cuff. He's just spitballing ideas that he should keep to himself, or maybe he's just pandering to his base.

From our conversation it appears that nothing Trump has done or potentially could do will ever satisfy you. You've clearly made up your mind. I guess time will tell. Let's see how this plays out in November. Have a good one.

---

You know nothing about me.

I was pleasantly surprised at how the first 3 years of Trump's presidency went. I liked a lot of the policy that he made and thought he governed fairly well despite a lot of what he said.

Then COVID happened. That would have been hard for any leader. It sucked, and I think initially, Trump handled everything about as well as he could have for the first 3 months or so. After that, he let things run way, way too far. He became more concerned about being re-elected than what was best for America by not replacing Fauci. He spent like crazy and started us down this terrible road of inflation (prices still haven't recovered and probably won't). He pushed for not following protocol for experimental vaccines when he had statistics he could have used to make decisions. Now those pharmas are even more powerful with less accountability than when they started.

During the run up to 2020, he made absolutely critical errors in his campaign. He didn't keep his mouth shut. He didn't let Biden take himself out. He just had to insult "Old Uncle Joe." He had Biden on record saying he wanted to eliminate the oil and coal industries in the USA and he still made it about him.

Despite that, and the fact there are a lot of things I don't like about him personally, I looked at the first 3 years and voted for Trump in 2020, hopeful he would win and pass similar policy.

The 2020 election happens, and he comes out and claims election fraud the night of and claims it was stolen without any support. No, "hey, we're going to look into this because there are some really weird things that happened." Just a claim with no facts at all. Really undermined himself.

Since then, all he did in 2022 was endorse candidates and saw almost all of them lose. He's become toxic sludge for the GOP.

All the while, there is a guy in Florida who fights the media just as hard as Trump, has more self-control, enacts the exact conservative policy most in the GOP say they want, and has much, much less baggage. He aligns the GOP in Florida to increase his win margin by +10 in 2022 from 2018 and absolutely crushes in Miami-Dade. He takes as purple swing state and makes it bright red. He has his flaws for certain, but he's essentially the guy the GOP always says they want.

You say Trump couldn't do anything that would change my mind. It's not that. It's that there is a hammer running Florida right now.

It appears to me the GOP has chosen revenge over shrewdness.

I will most likely vote Trump at the polls this year because I'd rather a R be in the presidency to at least have some check and balance at the federal level.

But you are right in one thing: you will not change my mind that DeSantis is a much better presidential candidate than Donald Trump.

A whole lot of this going on.

bobbranco said:

---

A whole lot of this going on.

---

Maye so. In your opinion. Not as much as you think.

A lot of people feel this is the current state of the GOP with Trump.




For better or worse, we'll find out who is right in November.

Beat40 said:

---

bobbranco said:

---

A whole lot of this going on.

---

Maye so. In your opinion. Not as much as you think.

A lot of people feel this is the current state of the GOP with Trump.




For better or worse, we'll find out who is right in November.

---

The GOP doesn't support Trump, the people (a.k.a. the voters) do.

Beat40 said:

---

jwhaby said:

---

Trump says a lot of stuff off the cuff. He's just spitballing ideas that he should keep to himself, or maybe he's just pandering to his base.

From our conversation it appears that nothing Trump has done or potentially could do will ever satisfy you. You've clearly made up your mind. I guess time will tell. Let's see how this plays out in November. Have a good one.

---

You know nothing about me.

I was pleasantly surprised at how the first 3 years of Trump's presidency went. I liked a lot of the policy that he made and thought he governed fairly well despite a lot of what he said.

Then COVID happened. That would have been hard for any leader. It sucked, and I think initially, Trump handled everything about as well as he could have for the first 3 months or so. After that, he let things run way, way too far. He became more concerned about being re-elected than what was best for America by not replacing Fauci. He spent like crazy and started us down this terrible road of inflation (prices still haven't recovered and probably won't). He pushed for not following protocol for experimental vaccines when he had statistics he could have used to make decisions. Now those pharmas are even more powerful with less accountability than when they started.

During the run up to 2020, he made absolutely critical errors in his campaign. He didn't keep his mouth shut. He didn't let Biden take himself out. He just had to insult "Old Uncle Joe." He had Biden on record saying he wanted to eliminate the oil and coal industries in the USA and he still made it about him.

Despite that, and the fact there are a lot of things I don't like about him personally, I looked at the first 3 years and voted for Trump in 2020, hopeful he would win and pass similar policy.

The 2020 election happens, and he comes out and claims election fraud the night of and claims it was stolen without any support. No, "hey, we're going to look into this because there are some really weird things that happened." Just a claim with no facts at all. Really undermined himself.

Since then, all he did in 2022 was endorse candidates and saw almost all of them lose. He's become toxic sludge for the GOP.

All the while, there is a guy in Florida who fights the media just as hard as Trump, has more self-control, enacts the exact conservative policy most in the GOP say they want, and has much, much less baggage. He aligns the GOP in Florida to increase his win margin by +10 in 2022 from 2018 and absolutely crushes in Miami-Dade. He takes as purple swing state and makes it bright red. He has his flaws for certain, but he's essentially the guy the GOP always says they want.

You say Trump couldn't do anything that would change my mind. It's not that. It's that there is a hammer running Florida right now.

It appears to me the GOP has chosen revenge over shrewdness.

I will most likely vote Trump at the polls this year because I'd rather a R be in the presidency to at least have some check and balance at the federal level.

But you are right in one thing: you will not change my mind that DeSantis is a much better presidential candidate than Donald Trump.

---

I'm not trying to convince you that Trump is a better candidate than Desantis. That would be a waste of time because Desantis isn't running for president. I'm trying to convince people that Trump (while flawed, and not the first choice of most on this board) is a better choice than Biden. There are a lot of people convinced that there is no difference between Biden and Trump, so they will either abstain from voting or vote for a third-party candidate. Akin to "I'm upset that my preferred candidate isn't on the ballot, so I'm taking my ball and going home because everyone else is stupid." They're throwing away their votes to prove a point to the GOP, or take the moral high ground, or stop the expansion of the federal government, or to facilitate the burning down of the current system so that a better one can be created. I'm really not sure anymore because the reasons get wilder and more varied by the day. All of the reasons above don't make any logical sense unless you view them through an emotional lense, which is how some people make decisions unfortunately. People can wish all they want, but Desantis isn't going to be the Republican nominee. Once they've come to grips with that (Ron already has, ironically), the only real choices they have are to abstain, vote third-party (which only helps Biden), or hold their nose and vote for Trump and hope that not only does he win, but that he follows through with solid conservative policy.