Ol Jock 99 said:

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Watched it last night; need to watch again. I've only read the 1st book (finished it for the 2nd time this week), but watched the 84 movie a ton as a kid.

Initial thoughts:
-Obviously beautiful visuals. Zero issues there.
-Thought the casting was extremely well done. The diversification felt quite natural.
-Even at 2.5 hours, it felt rushed.
-While the actors themselves were great:
---They didn't make a big deal of Jessica being a BG. That was mentioned about a 11ty billion times in the book.
---I didn't like the underutilization of the mentats. Hawat was just the smart old guy, and Piter (did they even use his name?) was just a Hark lieutenant.
---I felt they used too much time explaining "the Harks are the baddies".
---Likewise, they used a LOT of time on "Vision Chani slowly walking".
---This was short, but the Jamis segments were confusing. Visions of friendly Jamis, and then real Jamis immediately fights. I think I get the point, just thought it odd. The fight itself was extremely well done.

One review I read (forget where...NPR maybe?) said that a fault of DV is that he makes beautiful, but soulless, movies. That pretty well sums it up for me.

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Excellent comments. I also was surprised with the lack of emphasis on the Mentat's. Hawat is such an instrumental part of the book, and lacked true appeal in this story. I would say Pitre (outside or dr Kynes being a different sex) was probably the worst casted role (and was too minor). The person I had in my head per did not manifest itself to the person on the screen. Also lack of BG background, no Fayd Harkonnen, no real good connectikn was made with the HK, spice, BG, and the ultimate goal. The viewer was made to think Peter was possibly some type of Messiah but that's as far is it really got. Even the Gom Jabbar was probably totally out of context for viewers not familiar with the book, so was seen as more of an action scene and somehow important into his Messiah determination process without really knowing how. I agree with the rushed statement, lots of other detail in the movie but would have felt totally disjointed without the backstory. My take is the same, a great movie for all audiences due to how it was executed, but felt like a movie also made
For the book fans without a real attempt to engage the non book readers to the sane level.

Completely agree with the two posts above. Like I said earlier in the thread....great looking movie but it lacks the character and political components that make the book a classic. DV missed the point of the book in his pursuit of visuals and atmosphere.

So Kynes… why is she the only one that bleeds clear liquid? She a cyborg or something?

Dro07 said:

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So Kynes… why is she the only one that bleeds clear liquid? She a cyborg or something?

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That was the water from her stillsuit.

Interesting… for some reason I thought Jamis bleed in his suit

Just watched it last night, am a huge fan of the books, at least until Chapterhouse when it got weird with the Duncan Idaho Gholas...

Overall, my opinion is that the book is just too detail-heavy for a movie to do it justice.

The visuals were fantastic, especially Caladan, Arrakis, the city, the ships, the various character-types (shout out to the Sardaukar!), Baron Harkonnen, the BG, thopters (loved those!!!), fighting with shields, most everything was on point visually.

Plotwise it was pretty weak and requires knowledge of the books to make any sense of it. They mentioned the navigators once but I felt that could use some more backstory. The dreams/visions we're definitely overdone and I could have used maybe two of them instead of the 20 or so it felt like. Honestly, there was probably 30 minutes of just dream/visions that did not clarify things in my opinion. Seemed to serve as time for Zendaya to justify her paycheck. Did not think the movie would end before they got to Sietch Tabr. Also, even though the shields looked good and they explained how to fight with them at the beginning, it seems like all the deaths afterwards were just normal movie deaths with the shield effects added.

They did a good job developing Duncan Idaho, not so much everyone else.

My favorite scene was when Leto died and took all of the Harkonnen henchmen with him, superbly shot IMO.

Is there another one already in the works to finish off the storyline?

One last random thought: didn't realize how much of a Pocahontas theme Dune is lol

I agree. Most of the time when they change a character for the movie I don't really like it, but she actually worked pretty well.

For me, one of the glaring plot points was that Jessica and Paul in the thopter asked her about the emperors plans and she said she couldn't say anything, but then when the Sardaukar attack her she says she only has one master, Shai Hulud. Maybe that's how the books were, I can't remember, but it just seemed odd.

Kynes being in on the double-cross never makes much sense, unless his/her bet was the Harks would just leave the Freman alone.

Actually, the only place im lost is when yall start using peoples names or the type of people they are ha

Sea Speed said:

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I wholeheartedly disagree that you needed knowledge to understand it. I understood it perfectly. Maybe that is because I know there is source material to look back on, but I really had no questions or thought it was confusing at all b

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Well I do have a bias having read the book several times, and I haven't spoken with anyone who's seen it as a a Dune virgin, so I may just be channeling the difference in scope of detail

Yea i definitely think book readers are going to think it is weak or there is too much left out or it doesn't explain everything how they wish it would, but going in blind i think it laid everything out fantastically. I want to see it again to have peoples names and such really click, but I think it was nails. I'm not a sci fi guy at all either. At all.

I'm glad to hear, honestly.

Watched the first half today. Decently enjoyable. Will watch the second half at some point.

I recently tried to watch the 1984 Dune and it gave me a migraine 30 min in.

I disagree on the DV assertion (beautiful but soulless movies), I really like Sicario and Blade Runner 2049 was my favorite movie of 2017. Maybe that's more a function of Roger Deakins than anything else.

Quote:

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If he had read the book he would know it's Dr Yueh and that Huey is a Disney duck.

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It's been a solid 20 years since I read the book.

Why dignify a traitor with proper spelling? especially one so naive.

You just stated, correctly in my opinion, that its a visual and auditory masterpiece, but is that all we expect from movies? Think how many people would typically be docking points from it for thin character development and rushing plot points if it wasn't from Villeneuve. I think because it is then a lot of people, at least on this thread, are more forgiving than they normally would be.

Assuming movie 2 ends at the end of the book, there will be less ground to cover, so more time to explore characters.

Champ Bailey said:

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FL_Ag1998 said:

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You just stated, correctly in my opinion, that its a visual and auditory masterpiece, but is that all we expect from movies? Think how many people would typically be docking points from it for thin character development and rushing plot points if it wasn't from Villeneuve. I think because it is then a lot of people, at least on this thread, are more forgiving than they normally would be.

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I don't see how one can say plot points were rushed. They happen just as fast as they do in the books. Unless they split it up into 3 books, then you could get the dinner scenes, mentats, and Duncan or Gurney playing the Baliset. But that's basically all that is missing from the first half the book. I thought character development was great.

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Sure, split it into 3 movies. Or drop some of the dream Chani scenes. Literally 15 more minutes to flesh out the Yeuh betrayal, mentats, and political machinations would have accomplished what I was looking for.

Oh well, I'm outnumbered obviously, at least amomg the TA fans. Its still a beautiful looking movie and decent enough.

100%

Don't worry, you're not alone in being outnumbered! I'm actually happy to see that many folks not familiar with the universe did not see any plot issues. Increases chances of a sequel!

I also think 15 minutes more on the Yueh treason would have been great, and WHY it was such a major stab in the back due to his conditioning and their absolute trust in him. The movie made it seem like the guy who provides the pills also controls the shields randomly lol. Also wished I had seen what happened to Thufir in Harkonnen control and that Feyd had existed to be an opponent similar in age to Paul.

FL_Ag1998 said:

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Champ Bailey said:

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FL_Ag1998 said:

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You just stated, correctly in my opinion, that its a visual and auditory masterpiece, but is that all we expect from movies? Think how many people would typically be docking points from it for thin character development and rushing plot points if it wasn't from Villeneuve. I think because it is then a lot of people, at least on this thread, are more forgiving than they normally would be.

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I don't see how one can say plot points were rushed. They happen just as fast as they do in the books. Unless they split it up into 3 books, then you could get the dinner scenes, mentats, and Duncan or Gurney playing the Baliset. But that's basically all that is missing from the first half the book. I thought character development was great.

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Sure, split it into 3 movies. Or drop some of the dream Chani scenes. Literally 15 more minutes to flesh out the Yeuh betrayal, mentats, and political machinations would have accomplished what I was looking for.

Oh well, I'm outnumbered obviously, at least amomg the TA fans. Its still a beautiful looking movie and decent enough.

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I'd also add a couple minutes to Dr Kynes and her transition to sympathizer. Wasn't really understood during the movie

is she the fairness judge or what not? wouldnt she have been a sympathizer because she is actually a fremen? it makes sense that she would want to see the end of the oppression of her people.

She's dead though.

There are a lot of details that could be fleshed out that provide more context for the world but are ultimately unnecessary for a movie central premise. The movie will not be the same as the book because the movie is a different medium with different limitations.

The scenes being discussed here, are IMO, completely unnecessary. Do they add context and more backstory on the motivations of a certain character? Sure. But so did the simple act of exposition in the movie where the doctor mentions that he's betraying the Duke due to his wife being held prisoner. Thats all we need to get that part of the story and when you're working in film thats all you need. No one is seriously questioning that this was an implausible situation right? So extra context here is superfluous because its not the main story that's being told.

Furthermore, I think BR2049 was a movie where DV added too much. While I love that movie, it is a tad bit bloated and it suffers for it. Compare the editing on Dune and that film and you'll see why Dune is a much better movie.

Bonzer103 said:

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FL_Ag1998 said:

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Champ Bailey said:

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FL_Ag1998 said:

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You just stated, correctly in my opinion, that its a visual and auditory masterpiece, but is that all we expect from movies? Think how many people would typically be docking points from it for thin character development and rushing plot points if it wasn't from Villeneuve. I think because it is then a lot of people, at least on this thread, are more forgiving than they normally would be.

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I don't see how one can say plot points were rushed. They happen just as fast as they do in the books. Unless they split it up into 3 books, then you could get the dinner scenes, mentats, and Duncan or Gurney playing the Baliset. But that's basically all that is missing from the first half the book. I thought character development was great.

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Sure, split it into 3 movies. Or drop some of the dream Chani scenes. Literally 15 more minutes to flesh out the Yeuh betrayal, mentats, and political machinations would have accomplished what I was looking for.

Oh well, I'm outnumbered obviously, at least amomg the TA fans. Its still a beautiful looking movie and decent enough.

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I'd also add a couple minutes to Dr Kynes and her transition to sympathizer. Wasn't really understood during the movie

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She's Fremen, her husband is fremen, and she doesn't want the Harkanin to return like all the other fremen. I thought this was really clear.

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She's Fremen, her husband is fremen, and she doesn't want the Harkanin to return like all the other fremen. I thought this was really clear.

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Then why did she aid the empire in double crossing the Atreides in favor of the Harks?