2020 is toast. Really the worst year ever

Bruce Almighty said:

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rojo_ag said:

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Dr. Escott interim Public Health official for Travis County stated that if schools in the county open 40 - 1300 students may die in TRAVIS county alone: 70% infection rate. IFR 0.03% to 1.02%

I feel this is irresponsible tabulation and reporting of the numbers, and I am a lib and have really thought Escott has been on top of this the entire way.

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This is absolutely ridiculous. Travis County hasn't even had 200 deaths total.

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And just look at the comments on the kxnn Facebook. Tons of morons eating that **** up. The media did an incredible job with this bull*****

Charpie said:

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What's good for Hidalgo Co isn't good for the rest of the state.

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Thats where I end up at. I wish TEA had provided a framework on what to do if there is an outbreak at a school instead mandating that all schools do the same. I really wish ISDs would allow individual schools to make their own decisions.

I wouldn't be opposed to having a large ISD designate a few campuses be in person and staff it with teachers and students that want to take in person classes. Then allow other teachers to teach remotely from home or their own individual classrooms by themselves.

tylercsbn9 said:

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Bruce Almighty said:

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rojo_ag said:

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Dr. Escott interim Public Health official for Travis County stated that if schools in the county open 40 - 1300 students may die in TRAVIS county alone: 70% infection rate. IFR 0.03% to 1.02%

I feel this is irresponsible tabulation and reporting of the numbers, and I am a lib and have really thought Escott has been on top of this the entire way.

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This is absolutely ridiculous. Travis County hasn't even had 200 deaths total.

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And just look at the comments on the kxnn Facebook. Tons of morons eating that **** up. The media did an incredible job with this bull*****

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I had a friend who I love dearly send me that article today to support why schools should stay completely closed.

Those numbers are beyond ridiculous, and it was irresponsible of anyone with the words "health authority" in their title to publish them.

I did a little searching on the CDC website just to prove to myself how ridiculous those numbers are:

Since the week of 2/1, 30 children age 14 and younger have died of coronavirus. That's out of 10604 total deaths in that age group.

Older teens are a little more difficult because they are lumped in an age range of 15-24, but, since 2/1, 149 people in this age group have died of coronavirus. That's out of 12957 deaths (an average of 590 a week!).

All total, there have been 179 deaths of people age 24 or younger, out of a total of 23561 deaths. That's 0.75% of deaths.

In comparison, the 2019-2020 flu season was the deadliest for children in 10 years. 170 pediatric deaths were reported through the week ending on April 18. The cumulative hospitalization rate for children ages four and under so far this season is 94.7 per 100,000 people.

https://www.advisory.com/daily-briefing/2020/04/28/flu-update

Flu season was from Oct 1, 2019 to April, 4, 2020.

About 4-5 children die every day from abuse. That statistic has held constant since the early 2000s. 600-700 children died from abuse between 2/1 and 6/30.

I'm getting frustrated with the idea that we have to go so far as to shut down schools to protect kids from coronavirus, yet kids are significantly more at-risk from dying from a lot of other things - and those risks are being ignored.

Why has even one death from coronavirus become more tragic and important to prevent than preventing deaths from other more prevalent causes?

I'm confident there are ways to protect at-risk teachers other than the complete shutdown of schools.

I'm so pissed. They should have opened schools for the kids who needed it. My daughter isn't neurotypical. We have gone through absolute pains to get her ready for Kindergarten. She regressed horribly with virtual learning in the Spring. Could not handle sitting in front of a computer for lessons. Screamed, cried during lessons, and broke several things trying to get away from her teachers on Zoom calls. These are teachers she knew. I don't know what I'm going to do. All I can feel right now is that her future is absolutely ruined, especially since we all know that this opens the door to completely wipe out the 2020-2021 school year.

****, give me my property taxes back and let me put that into an option that will actually let me serve my daughter properly.

Many people have continued working and adapted on the fly to COVID. I work for a large company and we have grown / adapted our responses as necessary. There is inherent risk every day I am in the office.

If you don't like the risk quit or find other ways to work that meet your risk tolerance. Millions of Americans have had to make that decision.

planoaggie123 said:

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Many people have continued working and adapted on the fly to COVID. I work for a large company and we have grown / adapted our responses as necessary. There is inherent risk every day I am in the office.

If you don't like the risk quit or find other ways to work that meet your risk tolerance. Millions of Americans have had to make that decision.

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On top of just coming off as a complete *** you overlook the complete mess that is the teacher shortage in the State. People aren't just signing up in record numbers to put up with today's crops of children for the pay they receive.

So you draw some hard ass line in the sand, lots of the older, senior teachers take you up on that, now how are you going to have your schools open completely?

Complete Idiot said:

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murphyag said:

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Complete Idiot said:

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Vernada said:

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GAC06 said:

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Lots of people have been going to work this entire time. What makes teachers special?

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I guess your work hasn't implemented any kind of new safety precautions or procedures?

Most places have a significantly different look now compared to 'pre-quarantine'.

I know, my workplace looks dramatically different than it did in February.

What kind of safety precautions are being offered to teachers? No one really knows yet. There's nothing clear. I certainly don't blame those teachers who don't like what they are seeing.

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Well, at daycares, summer camps, youth sports facilities, other places of business the standards seem to be - morning temp check, mask wearing, social distancing whenever possible, hand washing regimen, hand sanitizer, robust daily surface cleaning. What is there unique to schools or teachers that would deviate from what is being applied everywhere else? Certainly a physical class size may make social distancing to guidelines impossible, depending on children enrolled. What other considerations?

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I can't comment on all jobs above, but most summer day camps and sleepaway camps are usually staffed by teen and college aged counselors. The day camp groups are usually small and cabins don't generally have as many kids in them as a classroom would.

Daycares generally have staff that are in the younger age groups as well: age 18-30 seems pretty common from what I've noticed from our family's different daycare experiences starting 17 years ago. Daycares also have much smaller class sizes compared to public schools. Daycares have always been much more strict regarding sending sick kids home immediately. Parents aren't able to sneak their sick kids into daycare as easily and don't seem to try as often either. I think because they know the daycare will kick them out.

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I can't comment on all jobs above, but most summer day camps and sleepaway camps are usually staffed by teen and college aged counselors. - many yes, not all. A higher percentage skews young in camp staffing than compared to public school staffing, no doubt


The day camp groups are usually small and cabins don't generally have as many kids in them as a classroom would. - not sure what this is based on. My experience with my three kids is day camps can be 5-50 kids together in a group, or indoor space. Sleepover cabins range 8-40 a room. I do think sleeping for 10 hours with no mask would be riskier than 7 hours with masks and supervision, as far as spreading an illness.

Daycares generally have staff that are in the younger age groups as well: age 18-30 seems pretty common from what I've noticed from our family's different daycare experiences starting 17 years ago. - I do see a lot of semi retired/older ladies at facilities as well. And support staff such as food and janitorial would be typical of a public school in my experiences.

Daycares also have much smaller class sizes compared to public schools. - Depending on age group, I'd agree. I also think those ages are much more difficult as far as enforcing mask wearing, hygiene, and distancing. My kids are past those ages so I'm not sure how they've been pulling it off, kudos to those facilities that have been running this entire time.

Daycares have always been much more strict regarding sending sick kids home immediately. - I'd agree but also would expect zero tolerance in public schools given the situation. Historic behavior doesn't really apply to our current situation.


Parents aren't able to sneak their sick kids into daycare as easily and don't seem to try as often either. I think because they know the daycare will kick them out. - Hopefully there is more smart behavior in the current environment, but understand there will be exceptions - and kids maybe don't even show bad symptoms and could still spread it, there should be temp and visual screening upon school arrival.




Even with everything you noted, what is the "risk factor" or a daycare, summer camp, or adult workplace compared to a public school? What are we trying to prevent by keeping kids out of school, and to what end does keeping them out of school achieve that goal successfully? Do we consider quality education essential business, essential for our children? Can we provide education of equal quality, equally to all home environments, with remote schooling as compared to in school learning? How have other countries kept kids in school, or returned to school, during the pandemic? If things are not adequate to reopen now, when would they be? Do we need 100% agreement to reopen? Do we need 0% risk from illness? Where is the middle ground, and who will decide where it lands?

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Guys, it's literally this simple. Place of business with similar risks have figured out how to work in this environment and have been doing it since the beginning. Public schools can do the same. There will be risk involved, but it can be done. Put our mind to it, and do it.

From what I've been reading in this thread, it seems like most of you teachers wan to make this work. I applaud you guys, and thank you for caring about the educational future of our children.

I want y'all to be safe too. Do you know if your district/state leaders are reaching out to places who have some similar risk to ask them how've they've seemingly made it work thus far?

For the decision makers, in my opinion, it all comes down to this ridiculous notion floating around that kids are going to go to school. the virus is going to run like wildfire, and it will kill thousands including teachers and students. I appreciate the difficulty of the circumstances for which the decision makers are having to operate in, but it looks like there is no creativity, nor true desire to make this work with students in the classroom. Seems like a lot of CYA to me rather than real problem solving.

Sadly enough the answer to the question is "as best you can". Maybe treat things like an actual crisis or emergency where administrators and other functionaries roll up their sleeves and go to work. Put some much needed onus back on parents to have their kids straighten up and fly right. Cut the fluff and excess, of which school districts are rife with, and put that money back towards retaining and paying teachers.

Go to rice and beans, PBJ's, spaghetti, and inexpensive food for all the free lunches. There are many ways to make the financial incentive worth the risk for teachers, especially young ones, to work.

Look at what they were paying nurses in NY during the heat of the deal up there.

Canceling and delaying school in the US is going to be, based on the virus stats, a serious blow to ever recovering from this mess. Some tough and hard choices have to be made.

For Christ sakes, the Brits, Germans, and Japs had school during the height of WW2 bombing campaigns. Think about that compared to what is going on in the US, and especially Texas right now.

Im all for getting back to normalcy as quickly as possible and trust me I'm fully aware business have found a way to operate in this environment. I'm not a teacher just trying to have a conversation.

You are forcing people that are at higher risk to go back to in person teaching and you are most likely not providing any sort of additional resources given the current situation. I'm sure your company has provided ample supply of PPE or stocked up on hand sanitizer or wipes etc. I'm also positive the building which you work in has implemented certain protocols or cleaning procedures to deal with the pandemic. Underpaid teachers will be left holding the bag for all that stuff. I get it we need to get the kids back in there but it's not that simple.

This is my frustration with it:

Not one district has stepped up to be the innovator. Not one. Not in the liberal cities. Not in the conservative cities. Not in the rich cities. Not in the poor cities.

I would have been okay with a district that came out and said, "Look, school can't happen. We've done X since March. We built out this infrastructure. We've identified the vulnerable population and partnered them with teachers who are low-risk for extra support that is going to look like Y. We've got A, B, C plans in place to support each grade level separately. We've identified a schedule that can take us through May 2021 if needed and it starts on X date, with evaluation dates here, here, and here. This is the criteria we're looking for to go back."

Not one district did that. Not one. Instead they all sat around REEEing for six months and the best thing they can come up with so far is delaying in-person schooling for three weeks (longer in some ISDs). What gives me any confidence that they have a plan and know what the **** they are doing? No, they are just going to sit around staring at each other with their thumb up their asses playing chicken.

This was unforgivable in my book.

My gosh, that is so damm accurate. I will say that all the teachers I know have lots of opinions and ideas, but apparently the administrators are completely, and this goes for school boards too, completely risk adverse and have no sense of responsibility towards completing the task they signed up for in the face of serious adversity.

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For the decision makers, in my opinion, it all comes down to this ridiculous notion floating around that kids are going to go to school. the virus is going to run like wildfire, and it will kill thousands including teachers and students. I appreciate the difficulty of the circumstances for which the decision makers are having to operate in, but it looks like there is no creativity, nor true desire to make this work with students in the classroom. Seems like a lot of CYA to me rather than real problem solving.

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This is my fundamental problem with the decisions being made. If there were any shred of evidence that this were true, I'd be all for shutting down schools.

I'm an engineer/scientist/researcher. For nearly all of my 20+ year career, I've collected, analyzed, and evaluated data to draw conclusions.

There is absolutely zero evidence supporting the assertion that was put out by the Austin "Health Authority" today that 40-1370 students will die if schools reopen.

My biggest pet peeve is the misrepresentation/misuse of data, especially if it's done to provoke fear. And that's exactly what happening here.

Will some kids get coronavirus at school? Unquestionably yes. Will any kids who get it die? That's certainly a possibility.

The death rate for those 18 (actually 24, based on the way the CDC categorizes the data) and under is nowhere near that. How do you jump from <200 deaths in the entire country over 6+ months to thousands of deaths in a single county between the scheduled start of school and Labor Day (I won't even get into the absolutely arbitrary selection of that particular date)?

https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/nvss/vsrr/covid_weekly/index.htm#AgeAndSex

TXTransplant said:

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My biggest pet peeve is the misrepresentation/misuse of data, especially if it's done to provoke fear. And that's exactly what happening here.

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How data is collected, analyzed, interpreted and presented is crucial, and there are a lot of data-illiterate media and data-illiterate politicians driving the narrative train. It is maddening.

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On top of just coming off as a complete *** you overlook the complete mess that is the teacher shortage in the State. People aren't just signing up in record numbers to put up with today's crops of children for the pay they receive.

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Because even the good schools look like daycares and prisons already and it appears like it may get worse with these covid reforms? Instead of changing, the system doubles down on its effort of "safety" over "education."

There is not a teacher shortage in Texas. Not at all. This state has an abundance of teachers and people willing to teach. There may localized shortages in certain subject matters. If anything these new at home learning provisions seems to brought many retired, semi-retired teachers and career-changed teachers out from the woodwork offering to assist and enhance the experience for families and communities.

TXTransplant said:

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jopatura said:

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This is my frustration with it:

Not one district has stepped up to be the innovator. Not one. Not in the liberal cities. Not in the conservative cities. Not in the rich cities. Not in the poor cities.

I would have been okay with a district that came out and said, "Look, school can't happen. We've done X since March. We built out this infrastructure. We've identified the vulnerable population and partnered them with teachers who are low-risk for extra support that is going to look like Y. We've got A, B, C plans in place to support each grade level separately. We've identified a schedule that can take us through May 2021 if needed and it starts on X date, with evaluation dates here, here, and here. This is the criteria we're looking for to go back."

Not one district did that. Not one. Instead they all sat around REEEing for six months and the best thing they can come up with so far is delaying in-person schooling for three weeks (longer in some ISDs). What gives me any confidence that they have a plan and know what the **** they are doing? No, they are just going to sit around staring at each other with their thumb up their asses playing chicken.

This was unforgivable in my book.

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Along those same lines...

It's the Austin Public Health Authority pushing the delay to Sept 8. From the article linked in posts above...

" Escott told commissioners the September 8 date was selected to give health leaders "buffer time" to work with superintendents on a plan."

The Health Authority has had AT LEAST the last 6 weeks to get with superintendents on their plans! Everyone with half a brain knew there would be challenges with going back to school. If the Health Authority was so concerned, why didn't they hold discussions before now? Or ~gasp~ maybe even PROVIDE best-practice guidelines to TEA and the districts?

Instead, they let everyone develop their own plans, and now, despite not even really knowing what the plans are, they are saying the plans aren't good enough.

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School districts and their staff were expecting a lot more input and guidance from TEA. TEA deserves a lot of blame for current situation. Maybe all TEA staff should be required to be back in the office doing their jobs instead of hiding out at home until the end of December/early January 2021.

Player To Be Named Later said:

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tysker said:

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On top of just coming off as a complete *** you overlook the complete mess that is the teacher shortage in the State. People aren't just signing up in record numbers to put up with today's crops of children for the pay they receive.

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Because even the good schools look like daycares and prisons already and it appears like it may get worse with these covid reforms? Instead of changing, the system doubles down on its effort of "safety" over "education."

There is not a teacher shortage in Texas. Not at all. This state has an abundance of teachers and people willing to teach. There may localized shortages in certain subject matters. If anything these new at home learning provisions seems to brought many retired, semi-retired teachers and career-changed teachers out from the woodwork offering to assist and enhance the experience for families and communities.

Capitalism is a great thing

Those same people probably aren't signing up to step foot in a packed HS or MS this upcoming school year at those salaries.

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Salaries are just one aspect of any employment. I'm sure many teachers would work for less money if their teaching environment wasnt filled with state-imposed mandatory tests, unmanageable and disruptive kids, bumble**** parents and school boards more worried about their own reelection than actually backing up front-line teachers. It's a discussion for another place/time/thread but does the system want teachers to 'teach' or simply be a classroom manager?