Reopening Schools

216,513 Views | 2236 Replies | Last: 3 yr ago by AustinAg2K
SoTheySay
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S
While I don't disagree that last year was done in basically a panic, remote learning and homeschool are two different things in my book.

Most homeschool options have been around for years and have a proven track record.

Remote learning is new for the majority of the districts and from what I hear there has been little to no training for teachers - it's all supposed to covered when they go back in the fall. No thanks.
rojo_ag
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tysker said:



Again we are making all these arrangements and concessions for one person out of 400-500? This seems like a lot of deliberation, work, agita and hair-pulling for a fraction of a percent of a population that is scared or is vulnerable.
You still refuse to address that the leaders at every level still want to contain the virus. It isn't an issue regarding the virus' IFR. Even though a small number of those infected die, and children are less likely to have severe complications, the mitigation strategies are intended to lower the R0 from a 2.3 to below 1. You can argue that protecting a small number of people on a campus is not a justifiable reason to take extreme precautions. But, unless you convince our leaders that containment of the virus is not necessary, this is the reality.

Schools are notorious sites of infection spread, and faculty, staff, and students are not confined to the campus. The risk of community spread once schools reopen is a legitimate concern even though European schools have not seen a noticeable uptick since reopening . Many of these European countries also have control of the spread and can contain small outbreaks. In the U.S., we are still experiencing a substantial increase in cases.

Yes, in Texas, most districts are offering a choice between 100% on-line instruction and 100% face-to-face instruction. Parents of high risk students can choose to keep their children home. I predict that high risk teachers will be the distance learning teachers and may have the option to teach remotely. This will ensure the safety of many students and faculty. However, even in light of giving parents choice, efforts are going to be in place to minimize the spread on campuses. Nevertheless, regardless of any mitigation measures, people on campus are going to be infected and school closures are inevitable.
planoaggie123
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AG
I think they may (should) have a better system in place but what my wife (we) is (are) not as crazy about will be the mandated "in-your-seat at computer" times during the day all year long with the teacher. She will probably prefer, if the kids are home, to have greater flexibility in her day vs being tied down to the house from 8AM - 3PM or whatever the time is. Doing it independent we can create our own schedule that will work better for us and it might even include me doing some work with the kids in the evenings when I get home so its not just a 100% mom = teacher deal.

Nothing set in stone obviously and hopefully we are just in school but it will not be a guarantee by any means that we use the public education system if home learning is mandated.
Bonfired
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AG
Former co-worker now teaches in Alvin ISD and her principal shared that students/parents will have to apply for virtual learning and have met certain requirements (this is for HS). This is obviously fluid and subject to change, but this is part of their plan as of now:

* Have to supply their own technology, since it is a choice and not a mandate.
* Have to have shown a certain level of effort during the spring online learning (personal aside: not sure how "certain level of effort" will be quantified)
* Have to have passed all classes in the spring.

Plan right now is for virtual core/EOC classes to be synchronous. Kids would have to log in and "attend" at a certain time every day. Elective courses would be asynchronous.

In-person scheduling is still very much up in the air (Block has been put out there as an option. Eliminating transitions completely doesn't appear to be part of the plan.)
tysker
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rojo_ag said:

tysker said:



Again we are making all these arrangements and concessions for one person out of 400-500? This seems like a lot of deliberation, work, agita and hair-pulling for a fraction of a percent of a population that is scared or is vulnerable.
You still refuse to address that the leaders at every level still want to contain the virus. It isn't an issue regarding the virus' IFR. Even though a small number of those infected die, and children are less likely to have severe complications, the mitigation strategies are intended to lower the R0 from a 2.3 to below 1. You can argue that protecting a small number of people on a campus is not a justifiable reason to take extreme precautions. But, unless you convince our leaders that containment of the virus is not necessary, this is the reality.

Schools are notorious sites of infection spread, and faculty, staff, and students are not confined to the campus. The risk of community spread once schools reopen is a legitimate concern even though European schools have not seen a noticeable uptick since reopening . Many of these European countries also have control of the spread and can contain small outbreaks. In the U.S., we are still experiencing a substantial increase in cases.

Yes, in Texas, most districts are offering a choice between 100% on-line instruction and 100% face-to-face instruction. Parents of high risk students can choose to keep their children home. I predict that high risk teachers will be the distance learning teachers and may have the option to teach remotely. This will ensure the safety of many students and faculty. However, even in light of giving parents choice, efforts are going to be in place to minimize the spread on campuses. Nevertheless, regardless of any mitigation measures, people on campus are going to be infected and school closures are inevitable.
Oh I'm unfortunately aware of what the 'leaders' want. Containing the virus is more important than providing quality education* to children. But to that I have to ask, then what is the point or purpose of public school at all? In what way is 100% online education option any different than homeschooling or take classes via Khan Academy? If 100% online == 100% inschool, what is the point of all the extra teachers, buildings, staff, admins, etc. The system and it's leaders are trying to contain an unstoppable virus by amputating it's own extremities. Do the ends justify the means?


* assuming we provided quality education to begin with
rojo_ag
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My district released more guidance regarding Fall 2020 instruction. Although there are several areas they did not address, the district did provide more detail as to the complexion of instruction beginning in August.

1. Parent Choice: 100% on-line. 100% face-to-face. Parents are allowed to move students from either instructional mode throughout the year, but with the caveat that a student may not have the same teacher(s).

2. Instruction: On-line instruction and traditional instruction will use the same curriculum. At the secondary level, all students will move to different classrooms instead of being confined to one class. Grading system will not be modified like last year. Teachers may be assigned to teach on-line courses only or traditional classes only. On-line instruction will be conducted asynchronous, and although students will be encouraged to follow their schedule, they will not be required to "attend" specific classes at a designated time. Attendance for on-line instruction will be based on their daily progress on assignments.

3. Safety Precautions: Signage. . .and more signage. Self-screening before coming to school. Plexiglass shields installed in front office. Class sizes will be smaller, but how much smaller is TBD. Classrooms will not have partitions, but desks will be arranged to promote social distance as "instructionally possible." Faculty and staff will monitor areas to prevent crowding. Per Governor Abbott's EO, all students 10 and older will wear a mask while on campus. Elementary students under 10 may wear face coverings although they are not required. The district is also ordering face shields. Students on buses may not be appropriately socially distanced, but they will be required to wear a mask and keep their hands to themselves (ugh). Students will eat in the cafeteria.

4. Extracurricular Participation: Students receiving remote instruction will be permitted to participate in all extracurricular activities.

No information provided regarding school closure protocol, quarantining, PTO, contact tracing, passing periods, assemblies, locker rooms, visitors, and safety drills. The district is awaiting TEA guidance regarding some procedures.
culdeus
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It's ok everyone Melania is going to fix everything.
rojo_ag
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tysker said:


Do the ends justify the means?

With all respect to your question, I honestly don't know.

Sadly, on-line instruction at the elementary and middle school level is FUBARed. It is fatally flawed.


rojo_ag
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planoaggie123 said:

I think they may (should) have a better system in place but what my wife (we) is (are) not as crazy about will be the mandated "in-your-seat at computer" times during the day all year long with the teacher. She will probably prefer, if the kids are home, to have greater flexibility in her day vs being tied down to the house from 8AM - 3PM or whatever the time is. Doing it independent we can create our own schedule that will work better for us and it might even include me doing some work with the kids in the evenings when I get home so its not just a 100% mom = teacher deal.

Nothing set in stone obviously and hopefully we are just in school but it will not be a guarantee by any means that we use the public education system if home learning is mandated.
Plano,

Do you know if your district will conduct asynchronous or synchronous remote learning? It sounds like it will be synchronous.
culdeus
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rojo_ag said:

planoaggie123 said:

I think they may (should) have a better system in place but what my wife (we) is (are) not as crazy about will be the mandated "in-your-seat at computer" times during the day all year long with the teacher. She will probably prefer, if the kids are home, to have greater flexibility in her day vs being tied down to the house from 8AM - 3PM or whatever the time is. Doing it independent we can create our own schedule that will work better for us and it might even include me doing some work with the kids in the evenings when I get home so its not just a 100% mom = teacher deal.

Nothing set in stone obviously and hopefully we are just in school but it will not be a guarantee by any means that we use the public education system if home learning is mandated.
Plano,

Do you know if your district will conduct asynchronous or synchronous remote learning? It sounds like it will be synchronous.

I wouldn't be shocked if TEA offers a state wide Async learning system that is accepted at all districts.
planoaggie123
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AG
Actually they say "...virtual (remote) learning consisting of both synchronous (live) and asynchronous instruction."

I have to assume that the key parts of the day will be synchronous but there will be a small amount of learning in which remote students will go off and do their own activities.
Prexys Moon
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Quote:

4. Extracurricular Participation: Students receiving remote instruction will be permitted to participate in all extracurricular activities.
How is this fair? If mom doesn't feel safe/comfortable sending Johnny to school for school, how does she get to send him up there for band or sports?
Aust Ag
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Smokedraw01 said:

I hate to say it but I don't see how we reopen with in-class schooling. I ****ing hate to even type that because I didn't get into teaching to sit behind a computer.
I hear ya, I didn't get into outside sales to sit behind a computer all day for months like I've been doing either. But hopefully school starting back will get my company to let us back out in the field again.
rojo_ag
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You are most likely correct. In our district, core classes other than ELA will be using Edgenuity. It is on-line curriculum often used for credit recovery. I'm afraid that since remote learning will use Edgenuity, in person instruction will also use Edgenuity to maintain consistency.
rojo_ag
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Prexys Moon said:

Quote:

4. Extracurricular Participation: Students receiving remote instruction will be permitted to participate in all extracurricular activities.
How is this fair? If mom doesn't feel safe/comfortable sending Johnny to school for school, how does she get to send him up there for band or sports?
I agree. But. . .if students receiving on-line instruction weren't allowed to participate in extracurriculars, all hell would break loose. The weeping and gnashing of teeth would be so widespread that the admin building would implode. I'm afraid the community would go medieval on the superintendent.
Prexys Moon
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I get it...but the whole reason the parent is keeping them home is because they are scared of the virus.

I think somebody on this thread or another said their district was not permitting extracurriculars if you chose at home. Maybe Boerne?
88planoAg
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Beginning to see this on social media:

"If you are privileged enough to have the resources to have your k-12 student at home, you should do so to allow those less privileged students have the (assumed limited) space on campus"

Which imo is bs. My junior needs to be on campus and needs the electives/extracurriculars, regardless of at home resources.
Aust Ag
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Prexys Moon said:

Quote:

4. Extracurricular Participation: Students receiving remote instruction will be permitted to participate in all extracurricular activities.
How is this fair? If mom doesn't feel safe/comfortable sending Johnny to school for school, how does she get to send him up there for band or sports?
I agree. If you're scared for yours or Johnny's life, why would you send him up back up to school to hang around friends? Doesn't make sense.
planoaggie123
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Seems like selective fear to me.

Enough fear/concern to probably throw some mask-wearing tantrums on facebook but not really serious enough to hinder little one's sophmore year in band...
Keegan99
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AG

Anyone advocating for anything other than full time school should read this thread. Selected tweets. But it's a strong, strong, case.




















The entire thread:

https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1280491183639334921.html
rojo_ag
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Prexys Moon said:

I get it...but the whole reason the parent is keeping them home is because they are scared of the virus.

I think somebody on this thread or another said their district was not permitting extracurriculars if you chose at home. Maybe Boerne?
Yep. Boerne. I wonder if they backtrack. Unless we get this surge under control, it may be a moot point.
Prexys Moon
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planoaggie123 said:

Seems like selective fear to me.

Enough fear/concern to probably throw some mask-wearing tantrums on facebook but not really serious enough to hinder little one's sophmore year in band...
Yes. If you really believe this stuff, and are truly afraid for your kid, you're fine missing out on it all.

And I don't think there are that many true believers.

oldag941
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Ultimately they are giving you the choice. Someone will complain if not given the choice. Perhaps the extracurriculars are outside where the school instruction is not. So some parents will feel better letting their kids participate in track practice but not school in the building. Just guessing on this.
rojo_ag
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Hi Keegan. Nice of you to provide the facts! Will these findings influence public opinion and our response to the virus?

The countries that are analyzed in the charts have successfully contained widespread increase in cases before they reopened.schools. I know you know the surge in cases that is taking place in the U.S.
HowdyTexasAggies
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Boerne hasn't backtracked yet, but some people complaining about it on FB, as well as some complaining that going back in person is irresponsible "we need to contact all our reps and TEA".

These people that want both, will be the same ones to complain that precautions for extracurricular are not enough for them, and try to ruin it for everyone. I'm sure they will demand unreasonable measures that everyone must comply with to meet their satisfaction.

Regarding comment above about the district mentioning reasonable effort last spring. There were kids in our district that flat out blew off attending anything because they knew it wasn't going to count against them at all.
Keegan99
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Cases in the US are not "surging" when normalized for testing volume and screening criteria.

Moreover, do you have evidence that ability of an infected child to transmit is magically affected by the number of infected adults in their zip code?
Keegan99
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AG
Also, I'm reminded that Sweden kept schools open the entire time and, I believe, saw no associated outbreaks, thereby falsifying your "have to control it first" hypothesis.

If you have evidence that Swedish schools were a significant transmission source and had to be closed as a result, please share.
kjcAg
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Katy ISD released the results of their parent survey yesterday. Only 49% said they felt comfortable or somewhat comfortable with in person learning this fall.

So half the people in our district think their kids are at substantial risk from this? Do they do no research at all??
planoaggie123
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Honestly that seems pretty consistent from what I have seen/heard. Seems like its about a 50/50 split in a lot of places. Not sure if more urban or more rural areas have larger splits....
tysker
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Quote:

So half the people in our district think their kids are at substantial risk from this? Do they do no research at all??
To be fair their kids are at substantial risk for being exposed. Similar to the previous exposure risks to the flu, chicken pox, strep throat, pink eye, lice...
GAC06
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rojo_ag said:

Hi Keegan. Nice of you to provide the facts! Will these findings influence public opinion and our response to the virus?

The countries that are analyzed in the charts have successfully contained widespread increase in cases before they reopened.schools. I know you know the surge in cases that is taking place in the U.S.


Try addressing the actual facts he brought up instead of regurgitating the same fear porn over and over
tommyjohn
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CISD was 75% in favor of return to campus learning.

20k people responded out of 60k students
rojo_ag
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Keegan99 said:

Cases in the US are not "surging" when normalized for testing volume and screening criteria.

Moreover, do you have evidence that ability of an infected child to transmit is magically affected by the number of infected adults in their zip code?
You have to take into consideration the positivity rate and hospitalization rate. Much more effective in determining the rate of community spread. Austin: 127% increase in cases over last 2 weeks. 45% increase in testing.

Don't think spread is magical. Issue is not the facts, but how they are interpreted. The driving force in the decisions is not the politicized "truth," but predetermined guidance on how to contain a novel virus during a pandemic. Often this is not rooted in fact at all. It may be undeniably true that children do not spread the virus to adults. In addition, it may be true based on the evidence that we should allow the virus to run its natural course.

What evidence do you have that experts, leaders, and public are going to "magically" change their minds regarding mitigation measures?

This tread shouldn't turn into a F 16 debate. I'll be happy to join you on that board and we can argue "until the cows come home."
rojo_ag
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Here they come. Join me in Forum 16 for a healthy debate.
P.U.T.U
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rojo_ag said:

Hi Keegan. Nice of you to provide the facts! Will these findings influence public opinion and our response to the virus?

The countries that are analyzed in the charts have successfully contained widespread increase in cases before they reopened.schools. I know you know the surge in cases that is taking place in the U.S.
At least 22 countries have kept elementary aged kids in schools with zero having an outbreak. Yes the children can still get COVID but at a rate around 1,000 times less than adults. A lot of the studies say the highest risk for children is in the community with other adults. From what I have seen children with multiple preexisting conditions are the only ones that have past away. When I was doing some research in May there were 10 deaths in NY, 9 had at least 2 preexisting conditions and the other was not followed up on.
 
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