Very true, but that requires police work and not cowboying around with guns blazing
BREAKING: Several Houston police officers shot
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Last: 3 yr ago by Righteousgemstone
appears from warrant the house was not the one on Hardy
You must be new around here. Forum 16 is as much about nutjob conspiracies as it is about politics these days.Mission Velveta said:
It blows my mind that supposedly educated folks can watch a stupid video made by a known moron and read a single person's comments and run away with a conspiracy theory easily debunked if you simply read the house description in the search warrant. Even when they get shot, some people just want to bash police. Shaking my head, this is exactly the effect the union president was ranting about.
WES2006AG said:You must be new around here. Forum 16 is as much about nutjob conspiracies as it is about politics these days.Mission Velveta said:
It blows my mind that supposedly educated folks can watch a stupid video made by a known moron and read a single person's comments and run away with a conspiracy theory easily debunked if you simply read the house description in the search warrant. Even when they get shot, some people just want to bash police. Shaking my head, this is exactly the effect the union president was ranting about.
Great point! I am one of the above mentioned nutjob conspiracy theorists. I motion that a new forum for conspiracies be created. It could hold theories about the NCAA, NFL, NBA, MLB, the government, aliens, CIA, FBI, deep state, Q, etc.
8T2 said:
I've read a lot of warrants, and typed a bunch of warrants. That warrant ranks in the bottom 5 of all I have ever read. It may be dead last. And, to think it was written by an employee of the PD of the 4th largest city in the US is stunning.
Tuttle was the owner of the house. This detective couldn't be bothered to even look up HCAD to see who owned the house, look up his DL, show it to the CI in an attempt to ID the seller? Did he search the CI to make sure he did not have heroin on him before he went into the house? HPD can't afford a wire? Hell, I've worked cases where the CI turned on his phone's video recorder and recorded the transaction. Sure, the video didn't catch everything, but at least you could occasionally see the seller.
From reading the warrant, it is clear that they spent longer typing the warrant than investigating the case. 2 weeks? And they couldn't ID the seller? BS. Once that detective gets out of the hospital, he should be fired.
More than likely, this CI is probably some POS trying to work off his own case. There is a huge incentive for these people to set people up to make a case. They usually have to make some multiple of cases to get theirs dismissed. Often, it is something like 10 times the amount of dope they were arrested with. I have had numerous cases dismissed because the evidence from CIs was so weak.
Tuttle....Buttle...got to be chittin me, we ARE living in a whack dystopian world of the movie scene "Brazil"
cooked up by the mind of Terry Gilliam:
recurring daydream as a virtuous hero saving a beautiful damsel. Investigating case that led to the wrongful arrest and eventual death of Buttle instead of wanted terrorist Tuttle
Well, it is a well known fact that drug dealers invest their illegal profits in safe secure investment accounts, so the money from all of those black tar sales are likely in their e-Trade account.Kenneth_2003 said:
One other thing that hasn't been mentioned. HPD said they found a small assortment of shotguns, a .22 rifle, and a Remington 700 (hunting rifle). They've found some MJ, and a powder.
They did NOT say they found CASH. The CI supposedly purchased heroin and saw multiple baggies of more heroin the day before the raid. So in that time, you're telling me that all the dope was sold and the cash is *poof* gone!
FWIW, I do not buy the Hardy Street angle. This was your typical, run of the mill ****ty narcotics investigation by police officers who believe that they should never be questioned, even when they completely F it up and cause two people to die.Mission Velveta said:
It blows my mind that supposedly educated folks can watch a stupid video made by a known moron and read a single person's comments and run away with a conspiracy theory easily debunked if you simply read the house description in the search warrant. Even when they get shot, some people just want to bash police. Shaking my head, this is exactly the effect the union president was ranting about.
THAT is what the POS union president was ranting about.
8T2 said:FWIW, I do not buy the Hardy Street angle. This was your typical, run of the mill ****ty narcotics investigation by police officers who believe that they should never be questioned, even when they completely F it up and cause two people to die.Mission Velveta said:
It blows my mind that supposedly educated folks can watch a stupid video made by a known moron and read a single person's comments and run away with a conspiracy theory easily debunked if you simply read the house description in the search warrant. Even when they get shot, some people just want to bash police. Shaking my head, this is exactly the effect the union president was ranting about.
THAT is what the POS union president was ranting about.
That escalated quickly. Sounds like you have a personal beef with him
Maybe not as simple as the Hardy St mixup, but something is wrong. Where are all the bags of heroin? Did he just happen to be completely out at the time? Unlikely.
Not until a few days ago. But, yes. And I would be happy to tell him in person so that he could record my "numbers" correctly.BMX Bandit said:8T2 said:FWIW, I do not buy the Hardy Street angle. This was your typical, run of the mill ****ty narcotics investigation by police officers who believe that they should never be questioned, even when they completely F it up and cause two people to die.Mission Velveta said:
It blows my mind that supposedly educated folks can watch a stupid video made by a known moron and read a single person's comments and run away with a conspiracy theory easily debunked if you simply read the house description in the search warrant. Even when they get shot, some people just want to bash police. Shaking my head, this is exactly the effect the union president was ranting about.
THAT is what the POS union president was ranting about.
That escalated quickly. Sounds like you have a personal beef with him
To explain further, police unions have historically strongly defended bad police work. This union chief was quick to attack a group of people completely unrelated to this incident. But, sloppy police work certainly contributed to this tragedy. Instead of supporting better training for his union members, he shifted blame to others not at fault. That gets you the POS label in my book.
BMX Bandit said:8T2 said:FWIW, I do not buy the Hardy Street angle. This was your typical, run of the mill ****ty narcotics investigation by police officers who believe that they should never be questioned, even when they completely F it up and cause two people to die.Mission Velveta said:
It blows my mind that supposedly educated folks can watch a stupid video made by a known moron and read a single person's comments and run away with a conspiracy theory easily debunked if you simply read the house description in the search warrant. Even when they get shot, some people just want to bash police. Shaking my head, this is exactly the effect the union president was ranting about.
THAT is what the POS union president was ranting about.
That escalated quickly. Sounds like you have a personal beef with him
I'm about as back the blue as you can get but he got on his soap box about people targeting cops and all that after officers got shot during a no knock raid at a house where no drugs other than weed was found. No money was found. The supposed gun the CI claimed they had wasn't found (other guns were but this is Texas). Neither of the two had any sort of record other than the lady writtone bad check years ago. He even ranted about we're watching you people that question or complain about police.
His rant was completely unnecessary given the context.
It is one of those things so over the top that it makes me question the whole scenario. Just like the empire guy.
FriscoKid said:
Maybe not as simple as the Hardy St mixup, but something is wrong. Where are all the bags of heroin? Did he just happen to be completely out at the time? Unlikely.
No money found either
I think the cops got played by a CI looking to beat some charges, didn't do their job to confirm pretty much anything, and just murdered an old couple due to sloppiness. And conveniently recorded none of it.
I thought the timing was off also, but the people he was talking about should be called out more often
Isn't the new union president a NY liberal transplant? We already know that Acevedo is a flaming liberal. I think both will go out of their way to disarm honest citizens. And the fact that both are openly against paying firemen the same as police really bothers me.
Some of you are pathetic
Some of you are pathetic
I think the union guy jumped the gun but said something that needed to be said. I see that more of an "oops. well, don't stop him now, he's rolling" moment.
Old Tom Morris said:
I think the cops got played by a CI looking to beat some charges, didn't do their job to confirm pretty much anything, and just murdered an old couple in the middle of the night due to sloppiness. And conveniently recorded none of it.
The shooting started at 4:15PM.
Some of you are pathetic
Wasn't there also a mix-up/confusion about the number of people expected to be in the house? As if the CI gave solid details about the guns, amounts of cash, amounts of heroin, and number of thugs present? I recall local news reporting that multiple suspects were still unaccounted for.
Some of you are pathetic
Some of you are pathetic
Yeah, I knew it was late afternoon and don't know why I typed that. I guess like the union guy, I was rolling.
Do you ever post anything of value? You're becoming an Ervin Burell parrot.WES2006AG said:You must be new around here. Forum 16 is as much about nutjob conspiracies as it is about politics these days.Mission Velveta said:
It blows my mind that supposedly educated folks can watch a stupid video made by a known moron and read a single person's comments and run away with a conspiracy theory easily debunked if you simply read the house description in the search warrant. Even when they get shot, some people just want to bash police. Shaking my head, this is exactly the effect the union president was ranting about.
Kenneth_2003 said:
One other thing that hasn't been mentioned. HPD said they found a small assortment of shotguns, a .22 rifle, and a Remington 700 (hunting rifle). They've found some MJ, and a powder.
They did NOT say they found CASH. The CI supposedly purchased heroin and saw multiple baggies of more heroin the day before the raid. So in that time, you're telling me that all the dope was sold and the cash is *poof* gone!
I like how Acevedo specifically listed the deer rifle by the model to make it sound impressive to the uninformed. Why didn't he list the models of the shotguns? Does Wingmaster or Black Eagle not sound intimidating enough? Were they all duck/dove guns with 28" barrels and 3 shot plugs or over/unders? Or were they riot/defense style with 18" barrels and mag extensions?
It's kind of suspicious.
Some of you are pathetic
Family claiming they both had mental health issues, not exactly drug kingpin material.
2-3 shotguns, a .22 LR, and a Rem 700 (caliber unknown, but i'd fathom a guess in the 30-range), and a 357 revolver...
Nothing about that collection of firearms sets off alarm bells with me. Especially if he got a couple of em from his father or an uncle or whatever that has passed on. Wouldn't surprise me at all if there are some SN's that are significantly smaller than what's on the shelves today.
Nothing about that collection of firearms sets off alarm bells with me. Especially if he got a couple of em from his father or an uncle or whatever that has passed on. Wouldn't surprise me at all if there are some SN's that are significantly smaller than what's on the shelves today.
NOT ONE PERSON is "running away" with a conspiracy theory. Just discussing distant possibilities. To say this type of mixup is "impossible" is every bit as ridiculous as blindly running with the theory.Mission Velveta said:
It blows my mind that supposedly educated folks can watch a stupid video made by a known moron and read a single person's comments and run away with a conspiracy theory easily debunked if you simply read the house description in the search warrant. Even when they get shot, some people just want to bash police. Shaking my head, this is exactly the effect the union president was ranting about.
This whole thing stinks for some reason...I think most agree with that. This doesn't seem like they got the right guys. But maybe they sold all of their heroin in a matter of hours or were tipped off and found a way to hide it and all the cash they likely would have had as significant drug dealers.
Let's let it play out...but in the meantime, nothing at all wrong with discussing various angles (even far fetched ones) on an internet discussion board.
Also, the Hardy Street house with bars and surveillance looks shady AF (especially given that area), even if it is completely unrelated, which it probably is. If you just blindly showed the two homes to 100 Houstonians and asked them to guess which was involved in a major drug operation, I bet at least 85 would pick the Hardy Street house.
Acevedo addressed the conspiracy theories.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.khou.com/amp/article%3fsection=news&subsection=local&headline=chief-acevedo-no-truth-to-these-crazy-conspiracy-theories&contentId=285-1dde9f7c-bc91-44c3-8847-789b17dbbc39
Why?
Some of you are pathetic
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.khou.com/amp/article%3fsection=news&subsection=local&headline=chief-acevedo-no-truth-to-these-crazy-conspiracy-theories&contentId=285-1dde9f7c-bc91-44c3-8847-789b17dbbc39
Why?
Some of you are pathetic
Why wouldn't he?
If rumors can be shot down, he should do so.
If rumors can be shot down, he should do so.
BMX Bandit said:
Why wouldn't he?
If rumors can be shot down, he should do so.
He kind of shot them down. It sounds like they are admitting that something might not be right here.
I don't know, if something is so far fetched and implausible doesn't addressing only give it credibility?
Like when you were in MS and you teased someone that they were gay or screwed their sister, etc, etc. Acknowledging it hurt the accused's case...
Some of you are pathetic
Like when you were in MS and you teased someone that they were gay or screwed their sister, etc, etc. Acknowledging it hurt the accused's case...
Some of you are pathetic
and if he didn't address it, people would say "Acevedo isn't denying this!"
That only made it worse. 'Well we got the right house. But Damn you whiners, now we'll have to actually investigate. That union guy is an idiot too.'
I don't know what is going on with this one. Assuming they got the right house, the possibilities are:
1) By luck or pluck the perps sold all of their heroin in the 24 hours before the raid and put the money somewhere else.
2) The CI exaggerated about what drugs were present.
3) Related to (2) above, these two might have just been low level dealers. In other words, worth investigating, but not needing a no-knock warrant to close the case.
4) Less likely, but possible, the woman was mistaken about where her daughter shot up heroin and the CI completely made up stuff. Possible, but probably not likely.
At any rate, the raid can only be described as a screw up. It wasn't worth the lives of the perps and the wounding of four officers. I hope their review of the raid is honest and they learn from it.
1) By luck or pluck the perps sold all of their heroin in the 24 hours before the raid and put the money somewhere else.
2) The CI exaggerated about what drugs were present.
3) Related to (2) above, these two might have just been low level dealers. In other words, worth investigating, but not needing a no-knock warrant to close the case.
4) Less likely, but possible, the woman was mistaken about where her daughter shot up heroin and the CI completely made up stuff. Possible, but probably not likely.
At any rate, the raid can only be described as a screw up. It wasn't worth the lives of the perps and the wounding of four officers. I hope their review of the raid is honest and they learn from it.
True, but.
As others, more knowledgeable than me, have said the whole thing seems sketchy. The warrant, the CI, etc.
Also if the dealer was shooting a .357 how do you shoot 4 cops multiple times? I'm willing to bet half the injuries were from friendly fire.
Some of you are pathetic
As others, more knowledgeable than me, have said the whole thing seems sketchy. The warrant, the CI, etc.
Also if the dealer was shooting a .357 how do you shoot 4 cops multiple times? I'm willing to bet half the injuries were from friendly fire.
Some of you are pathetic
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