Oh. Sorry if I misunderstood. All good.
GoFundMe for Karmelo Anthony
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Last: 15 days ago by aggiehawg
aggiehawg said:Apologies as I really don't mean to offend but who really GAF? The law certainly does not.Quote:
All he is trying to say is a high school kid would be alive today if he would have just let a rival school kid chill in their team tent and if he had just kept his hands to himself. These two kids would be reaching their dreams today, if that 17 year old would have known pushing another kid out of their tent would get him killed. I'm sure both of them learned a lot.
This kid won't be executed because he is too young. But he's going to serve some serious time until he's in his 40s, is my guess.
And by that point, he will most likely be a complete drain on society. A convicted felon, he will struggle to get and keep any kind of job, much less one where he can support himself unless he is lucky enough to have family who own a business. He will likely be hardened due to his time in prison. Statistics say he has a 30% chance of staying out of prison for the next 3 years.
I was being sarcastic, Hawg is on top of it!A Net Full of Jello said:ShaggySLC said:All he is trying to say is a high school kid would be alive today if he would have just let a rival school kid chill in their team tent and if he had just kept his hands to himself. These two kids would be reaching their dreams today, if that 17 year old would have known pushing another kid out of their tent would get him killed. I'm sure both of them learned a lot.aggiehawg said:But read what I said again.VaterAg said:aggiehawg said:
Again. Not even close to self defense. Anyone defending this murderer is idiotic and know nothing about the law of self defense. Much less that asserting self defense, it is an admission that the defendant murdered a person but it was a justifiable homicide. So if he does that, he has already confessed to murder.
Burden shifts to the defendant to prove self defense, BTW. It is an affirmative defense. That shifts the burden of proof.
I'm definitely not defending the stabber or stating his self-defense claim is reasonable. I don't think it will fly, based on what I've seen in the police report. And personally, I do hope he is held accountable for his actions.
Asserting self defense, is an ADMISSION of guilt. "Yeah I killed him, BUT..."
For this guy, in Texas of all places, is very problematical. Analyze this for a moment. The presumption of innocence is gone. Zip, nada. No presumption of innocence at all. Burden on the state is nil.
Burden on the defense is now beyond a reasonable doubt to prove self defense.
Completely different legal animal in criminal law in most states.
Hey man, that girl wouldn't have been raped if she had worn looser clothes and gone home before midnight. I'm sure she learned a lot.
Look, bud. All I'm saying is that guy wouldn't have been robbed if he hadn't been out running early in the morning in the dark. I'm sure he learned a lot.
My mistake. It's late. Well, late for me anyway. My apologies.
You're good, this one gets the emotions up having a teenage son. Scary to think this is what high school is now. Track meets were the best back in the day.A Net Full of Jello said:
My mistake. It's late. Well, late for me anyway. My apologies.
Wrong again. Not the standard in self defense cases.Quote:
Second, if you do use deadly force, you better be 100% sure self-defense applies and is appropriate as you will have to deal with your choice and consequences the rest of your life.
One can be mistaken but only need a reasonable basis to believe life or serious bodily injury is imminent.
They can be mistaken but if the circumstances would lead to that reasonable belief (a jury question) it is becomes a justifiable homicide.
aggiehawg said:
Again. Not even close to self defense. Anyone defending this murderer is idiotic and know nothing about the law of self defense. Much less that asserting self defense, it is an admission that the defendant murdered a person but it was a justifiable homicide. So if he does that, he has already confessed to murder.
Burden shifts to the defendant to prove self defense, BTW. It is an affirmative defense. That shifts the burden of proof.
First, when there is a resultant death, claiming self-defense is not a confession of murder. It is a confession of killing someone.
Second, the burden of proof is with the State of Texas to prove beyond a reasonable doubt that Anthony was not justified to use deadly force to defend himself as set out in Sec. 9.32 of the Texas Penal Code. The burden does not shift to Anthony to prove he was justified. He only has to produce some evidence to support that claim.
And before anyone thinks I am defending Anthony here, as so many have said on this thread multiple times, there is nothing in the facts as we know them (and really nothing in reasonably possibility) that supports self defense as justification here.
I'm Gipper
It's going to be pretty hard to prove self-defense when you cannot be the instigator in a self defense claim. Prosecution will point out he brought a knife to the track meet which I think is a crime just by itself. Then, he was sitting under the tent of of an opposing team. As soon as they pointed out he needed to go join his team, his first action was to reach into his bag where the knife was - not at all proportional. Then, he is the one who made the threat by saying "touch me and see what happens." Austin touched him. Then he said "hit me and see what happens." Austin pushed him and Karmelo stabbed him. Karmelo both instigated, antagonized, and escalated the situation. Hopefully his defense attorney points all of this out to him and that self defense will not hold water to a jury in Collin County. Karmelo deserves his day in court; it would be wise for him to just take a plea deal.
Again, Anthony does not have to prove self-defense.
If evidence of self defense is produced (a low threashold) the prosecution has to prove beyond a reasonable doubt that the stabbing was not justified.
So change your first sentence to "Its going to be easy for the prosecution to prove this was not justified" and I agree 100%!
I'm Gipper
If evidence of self defense is produced (a low threashold) the prosecution has to prove beyond a reasonable doubt that the stabbing was not justified.
So change your first sentence to "Its going to be easy for the prosecution to prove this was not justified" and I agree 100%!
I'm Gipper
There is video. When it comes out, there are going to be a lot of fools who jumped to irrational conclusions. I have my ideas what angle that would be and Im sure others have their own....
my prediction is the ones that are crying out for blocking "misinformation" are dead ass ****ing wrong and have no idea how to defend what actually occurred. They have committed the same error in misjudgment that they thought was guided by some sort of white-savior complex that never materialized because....well, reality.
These same people have been proven to be easily misled or duped, but will NEVER admit that they were wrong.
SAD !
Jeszcze Polska nie zginela
He may be right about the video and I hope that's the case. But he, nor any of us, really have any idea how good the video is.BadMoonRisin said:
There is video. When it comes out, there are going to be a lot of fools who jumped to irrational conclusions. I have my ideas what angle that would be and Im sure others have their own....
my prediction is the ones that are crying out for blocking "misinformation" are dead ass ****ing wrong and have no idea how to defend what actually occurred. They have committed the same error in misjudgment that they thought was guided by some sort of white-savior complex that never materialized because....well, reality.
These same people have been proven to be easily misled or duped, but will NEVER admit that they were wrong.
SAD !
There's also the concept of imperfect self-defense which is complicated. Someone may think they are acting rationally in self-defense but are flawed in some way. Could mitigate from murder but would still be a form of manslaughter.
VaterAg said:DannyDuberstein said:
You registered to post that drivel?
No one posted that because we aren't psychopaths ready to stab someone if they touch us. The killer also went from 0 to 100. The victim had no chance to deescalate. It didn't escalate until he was dead
Long time lurker, first time poster! As I mentioned, there are lessons to be learned on both sides. Do you honestly think the deceased would handled the situation the exact same way if he had a chance at a do-over?
Please go back to lurking!
ShaggySLC said:All he is trying to say is a high school kid would be alive today if he would have just let a rival school kid chill in their team tent and if he had just kept his hands to himself. These two kids would be reaching their dreams today, if that 17 year old would have known pushing another kid out of their tent would get him killed. I'm sure both of them learned a lot.aggiehawg said:But read what I said again.VaterAg said:aggiehawg said:
Again. Not even close to self defense. Anyone defending this murderer is idiotic and know nothing about the law of self defense. Much less that asserting self defense, it is an admission that the defendant murdered a person but it was a justifiable homicide. So if he does that, he has already confessed to murder.
Burden shifts to the defendant to prove self defense, BTW. It is an affirmative defense. That shifts the burden of proof.
I'm definitely not defending the stabber or stating his self-defense claim is reasonable. I don't think it will fly, based on what I've seen in the police report. And personally, I do hope he is held accountable for his actions.
Asserting self defense, is an ADMISSION of guilt. "Yeah I killed him, BUT..."
For this guy, in Texas of all places, is very problematical. Analyze this for a moment. The presumption of innocence is gone. Zip, nada. No presumption of innocence at all. Burden on the state is nil.
Burden on the defense is now beyond a reasonable doubt to prove self defense.
Completely different legal animal in criminal law in most states.
Anthony was headed to prison regardless. He was determined to kill someone. That day or in the future.
AtticusMatlock said:
There's also the concept of imperfect self-defense which is complicated. Someone may think they are acting rationally in self-defense but are flawed in some way. Could mitigate from murder but would still be a form of manslaughter.
Uhhh, no it wouldn't! It's not manslaughter under any Texas definition!
The mitigation you refer to is about sudden passion, which knocks the murder down to a 2nd degree felony.
I'm Gipper
Why is the DA not seeking life in prison?
Am I dreaming his go fund me was turned off?
It was.
It's now on GiveSendGo.
It's now on GiveSendGo.
Well that's disappointing. At one point GSG was the more conservative/Christian crowd funding site.Logos Stick said:
It was.
It's now on SendGiveGo.
Texas law does not allow for it here.
Murder is a first degree felony. "99 years" is the maximum punishment.
I'm Gipper
Murder is a first degree felony. "99 years" is the maximum punishment.
I'm Gipper
No, imperfect self-defense is a thing. Difficult to pull off in Texas but it's a possibility. Here's a self-defense expert attorney breaking it down.
https://www.youtube.com/live/wQ4NIF_TICc?si=77LU6FSatvqBeIAU
https://www.youtube.com/live/wQ4NIF_TICc?si=77LU6FSatvqBeIAU
Manslaughter is the reckless killing of someone. Anthony did not act recklessly.
Tom Fox gave a great example a few pages back. Throwing the knife in the air, resulting in its stabbing someone is an example of acting recklessly.
Purposely stabbing them in the chest is not!
I watched the first 20 or so minutes of the video. And Branca essentially admits its not a defense available in Texas. He cites one case from the 50s saying its how Anthony "may" be able to try it, which is likely no longer good law. Branca does not see this as a viable defense at all.
You cannot recklessly act in self defense.
I'm Gipper
Logos Stick said:VaterAg said:DannyDuberstein said:
You registered to post that drivel?
No one posted that because we aren't psychopaths ready to stab someone if they touch us. The killer also went from 0 to 100. The victim had no chance to deescalate. It didn't escalate until he was dead
Long time lurker, first time poster! As I mentioned, there are lessons to be learned on both sides. Do you honestly think the deceased would handled the situation the exact same way if he had a chance at a do-over?
Please go back to lurking!
Why? Why does it bother you when someone points out that it maybe it isn't a great idea to preemptively put your hands on someone you don't know because they didn't obey your command when enforcing some arbitrary rule?
And for the record, I do agree that Anthony's response was disproportionate. He will certainly face serious consequences for his actions.
I have witnessed it tried some variation of that argument here in Texas in 3 separate Murder trials as punishment mitigation. It never worked. This guy is from the Northeast where it at least has a chance of being successful. The doctrine is different in most other states. Not here.AtticusMatlock said:
No, imperfect self-defense is a thing. Difficult to pull off in Texas but it's a possibility. Here's a self-defense expert attorney breaking it down.
https://www.youtube.com/live/wQ4NIF_TICc?si=77LU6FSatvqBeIAU
Here is provides for a defense if the defendant starts the fight but the decedent escalates to deadly force and now the defendant finds himself in a situation where a deadly force is a proportional response had they not been the primary aggressor and now use deadly force.
There are zero facts that Austin was using deadly force against this turd. In other states you can be mistaken that deadly force is necessary for imperfect self defense, BUT NOT IN TEXAS.
His only argument is for jury nullification. This case is won or lost in void dire.
He should be shooting for a favorable plea deal.
How are the liberal white women of the county?
In hindsight, it clearly wasn't a good idea to put hands on someone. But no rational person could have foreseen getting stabbed in the heart over it.
*if Austin even did touch the murderer first.
*if Austin even did touch the murderer first.
I'm sure every kid under that tent learned its best to just cross the street to avoid getting called a white supremacist for FB hunting pictures after you've been murdered.VaterAg said:Logos Stick said:VaterAg said:DannyDuberstein said:
You registered to post that drivel?
No one posted that because we aren't psychopaths ready to stab someone if they touch us. The killer also went from 0 to 100. The victim had no chance to deescalate. It didn't escalate until he was dead
Long time lurker, first time poster! As I mentioned, there are lessons to be learned on both sides. Do you honestly think the deceased would handled the situation the exact same way if he had a chance at a do-over?
Please go back to lurking!
Why? Why does it bother you when someone points out that it maybe it isn't a great idea to preemptively put your hands on someone you don't know because they didn't obey your command when enforcing some arbitrary rule?
And for the record, I do agree that Anthony's response was disproportionate. He will certainly face serious consequences for his actions.
Ellis Wyatt said:
In hindsight, it clearly wasn't a good idea to put hands on someone. But no rational person could have foreseen getting stabbed in the heart over it.
*if Austin even did touch the murderer first.
Yup, agree completely. I'd really like to see the video if one exists. Luckily, I know the moment if/when it comes out it will be shared here on TA so there is almost no chance I will miss it.
ShaggySLC said:I'm sure every kid under that tent learned its best to just cross the street to avoid getting called a white supremacist for FB hunting pictures after you've been murdered.VaterAg said:Logos Stick said:VaterAg said:DannyDuberstein said:
You registered to post that drivel?
No one posted that because we aren't psychopaths ready to stab someone if they touch us. The killer also went from 0 to 100. The victim had no chance to deescalate. It didn't escalate until he was dead
Long time lurker, first time poster! As I mentioned, there are lessons to be learned on both sides. Do you honestly think the deceased would handled the situation the exact same way if he had a chance at a do-over?
Please go back to lurking!
Why? Why does it bother you when someone points out that it maybe it isn't a great idea to preemptively put your hands on someone you don't know because they didn't obey your command when enforcing some arbitrary rule?
And for the record, I do agree that Anthony's response was disproportionate. He will certainly face serious consequences for his actions.
It's a bit of a stretch to equate "don't put your hands on someone preemptively over something stupid" and "Let's avoid anyone who doesn't look like me because they will label me as a racist".
Your point about the internet written in ink though, is completely valid. May as well assume if anything you post can be taken out of context, it will be.
ShaggySLC said:All he is trying to say is a high school kid would be alive today if he would have just let a rival school kid chill in their team tent and if he had just kept his hands to himself. These two kids would be reaching their dreams today, if that 17 year old would have known pushing another kid out of their tent would get him killed. I'm sure both of them learned a lot.aggiehawg said:But read what I said again.VaterAg said:aggiehawg said:
Again. Not even close to self defense. Anyone defending this murderer is idiotic and know nothing about the law of self defense. Much less that asserting self defense, it is an admission that the defendant murdered a person but it was a justifiable homicide. So if he does that, he has already confessed to murder.
Burden shifts to the defendant to prove self defense, BTW. It is an affirmative defense. That shifts the burden of proof.
I'm definitely not defending the stabber or stating his self-defense claim is reasonable. I don't think it will fly, based on what I've seen in the police report. And personally, I do hope he is held accountable for his actions.
Asserting self defense, is an ADMISSION of guilt. "Yeah I killed him, BUT..."
For this guy, in Texas of all places, is very problematical. Analyze this for a moment. The presumption of innocence is gone. Zip, nada. No presumption of innocence at all. Burden on the state is nil.
Burden on the defense is now beyond a reasonable doubt to prove self defense.
Completely different legal animal in criminal law in most states.
Should you have bought that Rolex that your girlfriend Rhonda stole?
VaterAg said:Ellis Wyatt said:
In hindsight, it clearly wasn't a good idea to put hands on someone. But no rational person could have foreseen getting stabbed in the heart over it.
*if Austin even did touch the murderer first.
Yup, agree completely. I'd really like to see the video if one exists. Luckily, I know the moment if/when it comes out it will be shared here on TA so there is almost no chance I will miss it.
Do you know how many fights happen in hs all across the country that doesn't result in murder? Your logic is garbage
Was a time when men fought with their fists then laughed about it after it was over
bobbranco said:ShaggySLC said:All he is trying to say is a high school kid would be alive today if he would have just let a rival school kid chill in their team tent and if he had just kept his hands to himself. These two kids would be reaching their dreams today, if that 17 year old would have known pushing another kid out of their tent would get him killed. I'm sure both of them learned a lot.aggiehawg said:But read what I said again.VaterAg said:aggiehawg said:
Again. Not even close to self defense. Anyone defending this murderer is idiotic and know nothing about the law of self defense. Much less that asserting self defense, it is an admission that the defendant murdered a person but it was a justifiable homicide. So if he does that, he has already confessed to murder.
Burden shifts to the defendant to prove self defense, BTW. It is an affirmative defense. That shifts the burden of proof.
I'm definitely not defending the stabber or stating his self-defense claim is reasonable. I don't think it will fly, based on what I've seen in the police report. And personally, I do hope he is held accountable for his actions.
Asserting self defense, is an ADMISSION of guilt. "Yeah I killed him, BUT..."
For this guy, in Texas of all places, is very problematical. Analyze this for a moment. The presumption of innocence is gone. Zip, nada. No presumption of innocence at all. Burden on the state is nil.
Burden on the defense is now beyond a reasonable doubt to prove self defense.
Completely different legal animal in criminal law in most states.
Should you have bought that Rolex that your girlfriend Rhonda stole?
Yeah im sure melon was on his way to harvard lmao
HoustonAg9999 said:VaterAg said:Ellis Wyatt said:
In hindsight, it clearly wasn't a good idea to put hands on someone. But no rational person could have foreseen getting stabbed in the heart over it.
*if Austin even did touch the murderer first.
Yup, agree completely. I'd really like to see the video if one exists. Luckily, I know the moment if/when it comes out it will be shared here on TA so there is almost no chance I will miss it.
Do you know how many fights happen in hs all across the country that doesn't result in murder? Your logic is garbage
Was a time when men fought with their fists then laughed about it after it was over
Okay, I know how you feel about my logic. How do you feel about my grammar though?
HoustonAg9999 said:VaterAg said:Ellis Wyatt said:
In hindsight, it clearly wasn't a good idea to put hands on someone. But no rational person could have foreseen getting stabbed in the heart over it.
*if Austin even did touch the murderer first.
Yup, agree completely. I'd really like to see the video if one exists. Luckily, I know the moment if/when it comes out it will be shared here on TA so there is almost no chance I will miss it.
Do you know how many fights happen in hs all across the country that doesn't result in murder? Your logic is garbage
Was a time when men fought with their fists then laughed about it after it was over
Seriously, this person is laughably disconnected from what has been going on in school between teenager since, well, forever
As I mentioned before, "move", "make me", then a shove has to take place thousands of time per day in our schools.
HoustonAg9999 said:
Was a time when men fought with their fists then laughed about it after it was over
The world was a better place when we handled things like this.
Then we started letting a bunch of emasculated leftists decide how we should behave.
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