I'm not debating whether those previous finals should or should not have asterisks, i'm saying this one deserves one also....i'm not sure why I'm getting attacked here
NBA Finals
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Last: 4 yr ago by Saint Pablo
The asterisk take is an extremely lazy (and stupid) one.
Why? Because i would want to see both teams play at full strength?
CrottyKid said:
If I was the Warriors, I would tank next season. Just everyone take the year off.
I would definitely do some stringent load management with Steph & Draymond. 5 straight years of going to the finals is taxing.
yes. And the NBA was f'ing boring ever since Durant laced them up for a 72 win team. Hate to see him hurt, but made the finals worth watching.rsf0626 said:
KD played for 13 minutes the entire series, how can you say Toronto dominated the series when the best player on earth never even stepped on the court for the opponent?. I have no doubt the warriors would have won this series if he didnt get injured
Agree that Durant being out made the Finals more interesting. Warriors minus Durant vs. Toronto was a compelling fight.Aston04 said:yes. And the NBA was f'ing boring ever since Durant laced them up for a 72 win team. Hate to see him hurt, but made the finals worth watching.rsf0626 said:
KD played for 13 minutes the entire series, how can you say Toronto dominated the series when the best player on earth never even stepped on the court for the opponent?. I have no doubt the warriors would have won this series if he didnt get injured
Klay being out too though turned it back into 'boring'. Game 7s in theory are awesome but with Klay also out, probably best Toronto went ahead and won last night to save everybody the time talking about what would probably have been an easy win for Raptors on Sunday.
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Makes what LeBron did even more impressive.Bunk Moreland said:CrottyKid said:
If I was the Warriors, I would tank next season. Just everyone take the year off.
I would definitely do some stringent load management with Steph & Draymond. 5 straight years of going to the finals is taxing.
yep
Asterisks next to championships is really dumb Raptors won it fair and square who gives a **** about injuries.
Which just shines more light on how freakish Lebron james is. 8 straight years of that amount of basketball and to still play at the level he did.
Guess I should have read further before my statement
Guess I should have read further before my statement
All Patrick McCaw does is win championships!
A three-peat in his 3 year career.
He has to the highest ratio of championships to minutes played of any player that's played more than a season.
A three-peat in his 3 year career.
He has to the highest ratio of championships to minutes played of any player that's played more than a season.
Toptierag2018 said:
Toronto just screwed over team USA for the olympics. No KD, no Klay, many other probably sit out too.
KD and Klay made the 20-man roster cut list by Popovich earlier this week already along with Curry and Kawhi.
No, because as a poster on the previous page pointed out, you could put an asterisk on every championship over the past several years if you wanted to. No one is putting an asterisk on the Warriors championship last year despite them trailing 3-2 when Chris Paul got hurt.
LeBron did do a complete new roster swap at the midway point (after 4 straight finals - going from Miami back to Cleveland) to keep that streak going.Head Ninja In Charge said:Makes what LeBron did even more impressive.Bunk Moreland said:CrottyKid said:
If I was the Warriors, I would tank next season. Just everyone take the year off.
I would definitely do some stringent load management with Steph & Draymond. 5 straight years of going to the finals is taxing.
I just wish the injuries hadn't been so serious (Achilles and ACL tear) where it impacted the entire next season as well. Durant is almost certainly out for the entire 2019-2020 season and they are now reporting that it is possibly that Klay Thompson will miss the entire next season as well (earliest expected back for Klay is maybe after next All Star break).Truvada_for_prep said:
Asterisks next to championships is really dumb Raptors won it fair and square who gives a **** about injuries.
And particularly in Durant's case, he may never be the same player again.
Anyways, the seriousness of the injuries just really suck. Those are 2 of the 15 best players on the planet getting shelved for a long time and we'll see what they look like when they finish rehabbing. If it had just been pulled hammies and sprained ankles and such, well okay then. Good fortune to Toronto and that's the breaks. But those were some bad injuries on the injury level scale.
Pumpkinhead said:LeBron did do a complete new roster swap at the midway point (after 4 straight finals - going from Miami back to Cleveland) to keep that streak going.Head Ninja In Charge said:Makes what LeBron did even more impressive.Bunk Moreland said:CrottyKid said:
If I was the Warriors, I would tank next season. Just everyone take the year off.
I would definitely do some stringent load management with Steph & Draymond. 5 straight years of going to the finals is taxing.
Which makes it more impressive.
LeBron had the East totally cowed. When he left Miami, he simultaneously dismantled the team that had won the East the previous 4 years and then quickly recreated his own new (and younger) All-Star team in Cleveland with Kyrie and Love. Giannis was still using his training wheels and Toronto didn't have 'IT'.Bunk Moreland said:Pumpkinhead said:LeBron did do a complete new roster swap at the midway point (after 4 straight finals - going from Miami back to Cleveland) to keep that streak going.Head Ninja In Charge said:Makes what LeBron did even more impressive.Bunk Moreland said:CrottyKid said:
If I was the Warriors, I would tank next season. Just everyone take the year off.
I would definitely do some stringent load management with Steph & Draymond. 5 straight years of going to the finals is taxing.
Which makes it more impressive.
Would have been interesting hypothetically to see what would have happened if the Kawhi trade over to Toronto had happened one year earlier and Kawhi vs. LeBron an Eastern Conference Finals. That last Cavs team of LeBron's before he went to LA was definitely the worst of his Cav's teams in that second go around in Cleveland.
**** the Warriors. If you need 5 superstars to all be healthy to have a chance to win, maybe you aren't all that. It's like the kid who picks the boss character in fighting games and thinks he's hot stuff when he beats everyone.
oh you mad mad. Thought they played a hell of a series.
Exactly. At the end of the game last night they still had two all stars, Cousins who was dominating the boards, Iggy who was hot, and a supporting cast no worse than any other team's 5-8 players. And they could barely operate on offense. Maybe an entire season of that exact crew playing together and gelling would help, but they still had equal talent on the court. We just found out that its really not equal because Curry without Klay is not the same as Curry with Klay.Broba Fett said:
**** the Warriors. If you need 5 superstars to all be healthy to have a chance to win, maybe you aren't all that. It's like the kid who picks the boss character in fighting games and thinks he's hot stuff when he beats everyone.
Curry would have no MVP's without the other great player distracting a defense.
My friend just sent me this. The story is the Raptors GM pushed and hit a sheriff deputy while trying to get on the court. The sheriff asked for his credential to get on the court after they won. The Oakland police is going to file a report.
https://bleacherreport.com/articles/2841068-police-investigate-allegation-raptors-masai-ujiri-hit-sheriffs-deputy-on-video
https://bleacherreport.com/articles/2841068-police-investigate-allegation-raptors-masai-ujiri-hit-sheriffs-deputy-on-video
mazag08 said:Exactly. At the end of the game last night they still had two all stars, Cousins who was dominating the boards, Iggy who was hot, and a supporting cast no worse than any other team's 5-8 players. And they could barely operate on offense. Maybe an entire season of that exact crew playing together and gelling would help, but they still had equal talent on the court. We just found out that its really not equal because Curry without Klay is not the same as Curry with Klay.Broba Fett said:
**** the Warriors. If you need 5 superstars to all be healthy to have a chance to win, maybe you aren't all that. It's like the kid who picks the boss character in fighting games and thinks he's hot stuff when he beats everyone.
Curry would have no MVP's without the other great player distracting a defense.
I hate the Warriors but to say Toronto and Golden State had equal talent in this series is crazy.The Cousins coming off a torn achilles and bad knee injury? The dude looked stiff as a board and would not even have played one meaningful minute if KD and Klay were healthy the entire series. The end of the road is near for Iggy as well.
For most or all of this series, Toronto was more talented than Golden State and at times it wasn't even close.
Siakim >>> Iggy or Cousins
Kahwi > Steph
Lowry >>> Quinn Cook or Livingston
Gasol push Draymond or Looney
plus Ibaka and Van Vleet off the bench and the series went about the way it should have...Toronto in 5 or 6.
Fair enough, GS with just Curry and Green as theirs stars are not as good as Kyle Lowry and Marc Gasol. I completely agree.Aggie95 said:mazag08 said:Exactly. At the end of the game last night they still had two all stars, Cousins who was dominating the boards, Iggy who was hot, and a supporting cast no worse than any other team's 5-8 players. And they could barely operate on offense. Maybe an entire season of that exact crew playing together and gelling would help, but they still had equal talent on the court. We just found out that its really not equal because Curry without Klay is not the same as Curry with Klay.Broba Fett said:
**** the Warriors. If you need 5 superstars to all be healthy to have a chance to win, maybe you aren't all that. It's like the kid who picks the boss character in fighting games and thinks he's hot stuff when he beats everyone.
Curry would have no MVP's without the other great player distracting a defense.
I hate the Warriors but to say Toronto and Golden State had equal talent in this series is crazy.The Cousins coming off a torn achilles and bad knee injury? The dude looked stiff as a board and would not even have played one meaningful minute if KD and Klay were healthy the entire series. The end of the road is near for Iggy as well.
For most or all of this series, Toronto was more talented than Golden State and at times it wasn't even close.
Siakim >>> Iggy or Cousins
Kahwi > Steph
Lowry >>> Quinn Cook or Livingston
Gasol push Draymond or Looney
plus Ibaka and Van Vleet off the bench and the series went about the way it should have...Toronto in 5 or 6.
Can't really see what happened in that video, it looks like it caught more of the aftermath. How would that moron not know to let the Raps GM on the court??Sports-Ag said:
My friend just sent me this. The story is the Raptors GM pushed and hit a sheriff deputy while trying to get on the court. The sheriff asked for his credential to get on the court after they won. The Oakland police is going to file a report.
https://bleacherreport.com/articles/2841068-police-investigate-allegation-raptors-masai-ujiri-hit-sheriffs-deputy-on-video
mazag08 said:Fair enough, GS with just Curry and Green as theirs stars are not as good as Kyle Lowry and Marc Gasol. I completely agree.Aggie95 said:mazag08 said:Exactly. At the end of the game last night they still had two all stars, Cousins who was dominating the boards, Iggy who was hot, and a supporting cast no worse than any other team's 5-8 players. And they could barely operate on offense. Maybe an entire season of that exact crew playing together and gelling would help, but they still had equal talent on the court. We just found out that its really not equal because Curry without Klay is not the same as Curry with Klay.Broba Fett said:
**** the Warriors. If you need 5 superstars to all be healthy to have a chance to win, maybe you aren't all that. It's like the kid who picks the boss character in fighting games and thinks he's hot stuff when he beats everyone.
Curry would have no MVP's without the other great player distracting a defense.
I hate the Warriors but to say Toronto and Golden State had equal talent in this series is crazy.The Cousins coming off a torn achilles and bad knee injury? The dude looked stiff as a board and would not even have played one meaningful minute if KD and Klay were healthy the entire series. The end of the road is near for Iggy as well.
For most or all of this series, Toronto was more talented than Golden State and at times it wasn't even close.
Siakim >>> Iggy or Cousins
Kahwi > Steph
Lowry >>> Quinn Cook or Livingston
Gasol push Draymond or Looney
plus Ibaka and Van Vleet off the bench and the series went about the way it should have...Toronto in 5 or 6.
I disagree. GS with just Curry and Draymond would beat Toronto without Kawhi. Curry was good, not really good last night. Needed him to be game3 Curry.
Sports-Ag said:
My friend just sent me this. The story is the Raptors GM pushed and hit a sheriff deputy while trying to get on the court. The sheriff asked for his credential to get on the court after they won. The Oakland police is going to file a report.
https://bleacherreport.com/articles/2841068-police-investigate-allegation-raptors-masai-ujiri-hit-sheriffs-deputy-on-video
I have a hard time believing he didnt know who he was. He was sitting right next to the players, & I don't belive the coaching staff is wearing badges either. Not defending Ujiri, but if the sheriff was upset as a fan, it would probably be best to invistigate as much possible.
I saw that Lowry was surprised he wasnt on the floor with the team, & had to pull him out.
Yeah I told my friend the video caught the aftermath and not how it started.
You're saying Looney, Livingston, Jerebko, Bogut, and Quin Cook are equal to Gasol, D Green, Van Fleet, and Ibaka??
Toronto had probably the most complete roster of any team in the NBA and easily had the most quality depth. There's a reason why they had the second best record in the league with their superstar sitting out 22 games.
The fact that you keep talking about Boogie Cousins as an 'All Star' quality player, as though he was the same Cousins of a year and a half ago before his achilles tear (and torn quad), just invalidates these kinds of arguments. If Boogie had been on Toronto's roster, he wouldn't have made their top-7 players. Yes, he was a big body who occasionally did a couple of decent things, but clearly couldn't move very well in terms of guarding anybody, had zero lift and looked like he couldn't jump over a phone booth, and had conditioning problems. He wasn't an 'All-Star' in terms of ability. I bet the Warriors would have gladly traded Boogie to Toronto for Marc Gasol.
GSW had essentially 3-high end players going into the game last night: Curry, Klay, and Green plus a 34-year old Iggy who can still be pretty decent.
After that, they had a Livingston who looks ready for retirement, Boogie (described above), an injured Kevon Looney, Quin Cook, Andrew Bogut who was playing in the Austrialian league a few months ago, McKinnie, Jordan Bell,
They were a top-heavy team that once you got past their top-5 guys (Durant, Green, Curry, Klay, Iggy) then things got really dicey. That was to be expected. They were blowing most of the $$$ cap-space on those top guys. Had they all been healthy, they'd probably won the finals. When they lost 2 of those top-5 guys...and in particular 2 of the 3 guys who were the 'shooters' for spacing...well, you saw what happened.
GSW had essentially 3-high end players going into the game last night: Curry, Klay, and Green plus a 34-year old Iggy who can still be pretty decent.
After that, they had a Livingston who looks ready for retirement, Boogie (described above), an injured Kevon Looney, Quin Cook, Andrew Bogut who was playing in the Austrialian league a few months ago, McKinnie, Jordan Bell,
They were a top-heavy team that once you got past their top-5 guys (Durant, Green, Curry, Klay, Iggy) then things got really dicey. That was to be expected. They were blowing most of the $$$ cap-space on those top guys. Had they all been healthy, they'd probably won the finals. When they lost 2 of those top-5 guys...and in particular 2 of the 3 guys who were the 'shooters' for spacing...well, you saw what happened.
Pumpkinhead said:
The fact that you keep talking about Boogie Cousins as an 'All Star' quality player, as though he was the same Cousins of 2 years ago before his achilles tear (and torn quad), just invalidates all these kinds of arguments. If Boogie had been on Toronto's roster, he wouldn't have made their top-7 players. Yes, he was a big body who occasionally did a couple of decent things, but clearly couldn't move very well in terms of guarding anybody, had zero lift and looked like he couldn't jump over a phone booth, and had conditioning problems. He wasn't an 'All-Star' in terms of ability. I bet the Warriors would have gladly traded Boogie to Toronto for Marc Gasol.
You're right. The Warriors with just Curry and Green aren't very good. That's become very obvious.
Once again, Curry is not as valuable unless paired with someone else to do the heavy lifting (defense, decoy, illegal screens). When it's just him and Mr technical, they can't really compete.
Curry is a piggybacker.
Great, 'piggybacker' describes the majority of great teams and players out there in NBA history. But I guess we can pretend that players like Magic, Bird, Jordan, LeBron, Duncan, Shaq, Kobe, Wade, etc. didn't typically have other great teammates like Pippen, Rodman, McHale, Worthy, Scott, Shaq, Kobe, Robinson, Manu, Parker, Kawhi, Wade etc.mazag08 said:Pumpkinhead said:
The fact that you keep talking about Boogie Cousins as an 'All Star' quality player, as though he was the same Cousins of 2 years ago before his achilles tear (and torn quad), just invalidates all these kinds of arguments. If Boogie had been on Toronto's roster, he wouldn't have made their top-7 players. Yes, he was a big body who occasionally did a couple of decent things, but clearly couldn't move very well in terms of guarding anybody, had zero lift and looked like he couldn't jump over a phone booth, and had conditioning problems. He wasn't an 'All-Star' in terms of ability. I bet the Warriors would have gladly traded Boogie to Toronto for Marc Gasol.
You're right. The Warriors with just Curry and Green aren't very good. That's become very obvious.
Once again, Curry is not as valuable unless paired with someone else to do the heavy lifting (defense, decoy, illegal screens). When it's just him and Mr technical, they can't really compete.
Curry is a piggybacker.
Bagging on Steph Curry is silly IMO. Sounds like some kind of hot take you'd see on that lame 'First Take' show. Curry is a transcendent player whose shooting ability literally was a big factor on the way the NBA game is played. Is he a perfect player? No. He is not an elite defender (though he is not awful either, he tries hard and is usually is in the right spot defensively), and is not a physically athletic freak who can consistently finish at the rim. But he is still an awesome player who will probably be considered a Top-20 All-Time guy once his career is finished.
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