Trump-Vance-Zelenskyy

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Teslag
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In reply to aTm2004 • 3:37p, 2/28/25
AG
aTm2004 said:
MouthBQ98 said:
The Ukrainian constitution requires elections be put on hold during wartime, apparently, as a wartime election would be of dubious legitimacy.

So, he has an incentive to continue the war?



Ya, the incentive is there's a foreign country on his soil killing his people
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Heineken-Ashi
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In reply to Ag1188 • 3:38p, 2/28/25
Ag1188 said:
strbrst777 said:
Z is a rude, ungrateful, disgusting jerk. The meeting was on TV.
Trump and JD "eyeliner" Vance want to take all of Ukraine's minerals WITHOUT giving a security guarantee. When did the Republican Party become led by communists? This is embarrassing. Absolute lowest life forms are leading that party and our country.
The gaslighting is on overdrive when people who support communists are calling the ones trying to end the war the communists.

I'm starting to believe all of you are on the USAID grift train.
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foxfire
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In reply to Hullabaloonatic • 3:40p, 2/28/25
Quote:
OF COURSE, a peace deal is the best thing BUT WHAT SECURITY GUARANTEES IS THE UNITED STATES WILLING TO COMMIT?
NONE... we have been bailing out Europe since April 1917. This 'Lafayette we are Here' crap has to stop. Europe has for almost 108 years depended on American treasure and blood. If they are unwilling to step up-shame on them.
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AggieShanks
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In reply to Gigem314 • 3:41p, 2/28/25
AG
He had a negotiation live on television to pressure Zelensky to make the deal because it means more for Trump's legacy to say he negotiated peace. Instead, Zelensky defended his country, called a buck a buck, and went home. Trump was already pulling support. He ran on that, so, nothing changed. Only thing it showed us was that Trump really isn't this strongman that can force peace. He's like any other president. A leader of one country with waning influence abroad.
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AgGrad99
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3:42p, 2/28/25
AG
'He's all dressed up today'

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El Gallo Blanco
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In reply to Ag1188 • 3:42p, 2/28/25
Ag1188 said:
strbrst777 said:
Z is a rude, ungrateful, disgusting jerk. The meeting was on TV.
Trump and JD "eyeliner" Vance want to take all of Ukraine's minerals WITHOUT giving a security guarantee. When did the Republican Party become led by communists? This is embarrassing. Absolute lowest life forms are leading that party and our country.
LOLOL

A modern liberal male feminist talking about "low life forms". Your best and brightest applaud drag shows for children, cannot begin to define what a woman is, think gay cartoon p0rn books belong in childrens school libraries, and think chopping the t*ts off of confused 13 yr old girls is "compassionate healthcare".

Thanks for the laugh.
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El Gallo Blanco
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In reply to AgGrad99 • 3:43p, 2/28/25
AgGrad99 said:
'He's all dressed up today'

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Gigem314
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In reply to rootube • 3:43p, 2/28/25
AG
rootube said:
Gigem314 said:
aggiehawg said:
WHOA! Is this being reported anywhere else?

They could always borrow Al Green...calling for impeachment is his specialty.


Zelenskyy has better approval ratings than Trump. I expect them to only go up after today.
Good for him. Hopefully the loss in support over here was worth it for his goals.
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Heineken-Ashi
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In reply to AggieShanks • 3:44p, 2/28/25
AggieShanks said:
He had a negotiation live on television to pressure Zelensky to make the deal because it means more for Trump's legacy to say he negotiated peace. Instead, Zelensky defended his country, called a buck a buck, and went home. Trump was already pulling support. He ran on that, so, nothing changed. Only thing it showed us was that Trump really isn't this strongman that can force peace. He's like any other president. A leader of one country with waning influence abroad.
Again, you libs LOVE to spike the ball before the play is over.

No way it backfires.
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AgGrad99
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In reply to AggieShanks • 3:44p, 2/28/25
AG
AggieShanks said:
He had a negotiation live on television to pressure Zelensky to make the deal because it means more for Trump's legacy to say he negotiated peace. Instead, Zelensky defended his country, called a buck a buck, and went home. Trump was already pulling support. He ran on that, so, nothing changed. Only thing it showed us was that Trump really isn't this strongman that can force peace. He's like any other president. A leader of one country with waning influence abroad.
I'd wait until the end to see how this plays out, before definitively judging the outcome. The world thinks Zelensky screwed up, his own party is calling for him to be impeached and he has absolutely zero leverage.

It's more likely he comes crawling back to sign the agreement, than not.
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SwigAg11
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In reply to AggieShanks • 3:44p, 2/28/25
AG
AggieShanks said:
He had a negotiation live on television to pressure Zelensky to make the deal because it means more for Trump's legacy to say he negotiated peace. Instead, Zelensky defended his country, called a buck a buck, and went home. Trump was already pulling support. He ran on that, so, nothing changed. Only thing it showed us was that Trump really isn't this strongman that can force peace. He's like any other president. A leader of one country with waning influence abroad.

Apparently if you watch the entire discussion, Trump kept reiterating that the US was willing to continue military aid.

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1876er
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In reply to Gigem314 • 3:44p, 2/28/25
AG
Gigem314 said:
rootube said:
Gigem314 said:
aggiehawg said:
WHOA! Is this being reported anywhere else?

They could always borrow Al Green...calling for impeachment is his specialty.


Zelenskyy has better approval ratings than Trump. I expect them to only go up after today.
Good for him. Hopefully the loss in support over here was worth it for his goals.
What support?

Trump and his buddies have all sided with Russia.
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richardag
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In reply to Heineken-Ashi • 3:44p, 2/28/25
Heineken-Ashi said:
chickencoupe16 said:
Trump was the best choice in the election and is right about a lot of things. He is absolutely wrong about this and in 20 years, most people will realize it.
What specifically is going to happen that will be evident in 20 years?
We will all be speaking Chinese?
Among the latter, under pretence of governing they have divided their nations into two classes, wolves and sheep.”
Thomas Jefferson, Letter to Edward Carrington, January 16, 1787
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Brother Shamus
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In reply to 45-70Ag • 3:44p, 2/28/25
45-70Ag said:


lol
And they've got zero capacity to help.


I think a speed bump has more impact on deterring advancing forces.
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Slicer97
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In reply to AggieShanks • 3:44p, 2/28/25
AG
AggieShanks said:
A leader of one country with waning influence abroad.
Gee, wonder how that happened?
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45-70Ag
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3:44p, 2/28/25
AG
Europe has given the United States the finger for the last almost 80 years. They have never fulfilled their obligations with nato for those who are members and taken advantage of the U.S. with tariffs.

We've bailed them out multiple times over eight decades in a variety of ways and for what? Europe can't defend itself outside of tweets of solidarity with a clown dressed like the idiots at the local gun range.

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Heineken-Ashi
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In reply to richardag • 3:45p, 2/28/25
richardag said:
Heineken-Ashi said:
chickencoupe16 said:
Trump was the best choice in the election and is right about a lot of things. He is absolutely wrong about this and in 20 years, most people will realize it.
What specifically is going to happen that will be evident in 20 years?
We will all be speaking Chinese?
Then it sounds like we to get our money out of Ukraine and start applying it to the real threat.
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rootube
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In reply to BlueSmoke • 3:46p, 2/28/25
AG
BlueSmoke said:
Zelensky seems wrapped in righteous indignation and the invasion he feels he is the center-point for the country. I do feel that he cares, but he's missing the bigger picture that there are no winners in this conflict. They can't expel Russia and even is Russia took Ukraine, they can't hold it. It would deplete the last of their forces, then it becomes Baghdad on a much bigger scale.

There's no winning this from either side.



What do you do if you are Zelenskyy?

After the fall of the Soviet Union your country gave up their nuclear weapons in exchange for security guarantees from the US and Russia as part of the Budapest memo to "Protect Ukraine's territorial integrity". Something that everyone naively thought would make the world safer.

Flash forward to 2014 and Russia takes Crimea and the Donbas which are part of Ukraine. The countries eventually sign the Minsk Agreement to stop the war in the Donbas. Russia breaks that agreement and continues to push forward in the Donbas eventually leading to the full scale invasion of Ukraine in '22. Surely you can appreciate how the Ukrainians would be skeptical of a deal with no security guarantees. You have to either naively believe that Russia has changed or make the calculation that you can improve your position with actual guarantees from Europe.
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ttu_85
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In reply to sam callahan • 3:46p, 2/28/25
sam callahan said:
Zelensky is an entitled grifting twerp.

And Putin is a power hungry enemy of his own people.

We have no business taking sides in this.
And :

Western Europe is oppressing its native populations.

Western Europe in the form of the EU is suppressing elections in Central Europe. Romania

Maybe we have no business being over that at all until we figure out how all this is going to shake out. The 80 year political realignment freak out was running a few years late but its here now.

Hang on to your butts.
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pdc093
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3:47p, 2/28/25
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Gigem314
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In reply to AggieShanks • 3:47p, 2/28/25
AG
AggieShanks said:
He had a negotiation live on television to pressure Zelensky to make the deal because it means more for Trump's legacy to say he negotiated peace. Instead, Zelensky defended his country, called a buck a buck, and went home. Trump was already pulling support. He ran on that, so, nothing changed. Only thing it showed us was that Trump really isn't this strongman that can force peace. He's like any other president. A leader of one country with waning influence abroad.
Trump did what he did not for his legacy, but because he thinks it's in America's better interests to pull support from what's becoming a never-ending mess that your boy Biden allowed to fester with no strategy or plan. Trump is looking out for his own country. If Zelensky thinks he's better off taking his ball and going home, so be it. More power to him. I'm sure he's got this.
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jkag89
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In reply to rootube • 3:47p, 2/28/25
rootube said:
buzzardb267 said:
Zelensky showed exactly who he is. He is no diplomat. He is a little guy held up as a hero which just feeds his Napoleonic complex. He couldn't stand no being a showman and trying to be "macho" and feeding his ego.


Zelenskyy has managed to keep his country in the fight with the second largest military in the world for three years. He's probably going to go down as the second greatest diplomat in history behind Winston Churchill. Trump on the other hand boasted he could end this war in 24 hours.
The second greatest diplomat in history behind Winston Churchill would have shown far more tact when dealing with one of the primary sources that is keeping his nation in the fight. More so if he really believes Trump is unhinged or Putin's puppet. He overplayed his hand trying to look good for his European buddies who are only going to go so far in helping him obtain Ukraine's goals in this fight.

I think the war in the Ukraine has shown the conventional Russian military has largely become a paper tiger since the fall of the USSR and that its favorite tactic has largely been shown to be ineffective in the age of modern warfare. If you are trying to sell the idea that Ukraine is the bulwark for the rest of Europe against mean old Russia, I'm not buying that considering how poorly it has faired in this war.

Please note, I do not favor Russia in this conflict. I favor a free and independent Ukraine. I would also hate to see the aggressor (Russia) get anything it looked for with their invasion but this conflict is three years old and is basically a stalemate. Is it possible that one side or the other can still get the upper hand here? Sure, but right now to me it seems like many are simply getting maimed and killed due to both sides trying to save face. This war is going to end through diplomacy not on the battlefield and the second greatest diplomat behind Churchill harmed his position by his actions today.
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newbie11
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In reply to Brother Shamus • 3:48p, 2/28/25
Brother Shamus said:
45-70Ag said:


lol
And they've got zero capacity to help.


I think a speed bump has more impact on deterring advancing forces.
Lol. Luxembourg…laughable.
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Gigem314
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In reply to Slicer97 • 3:48p, 2/28/25
AG
Slicer97 said:
AggieShanks said:
A leader of one country with waning influence abroad.
Gee, wonder how that happened?
Funny how they're quick to spin this as Trump failing and America having no influence...yet they were silent for 4 years as Russia and other countries took action as if they had no respect for how the U.S. would respond.

Oh but Trump's totally the reason we're in this. It's always Trump's fault.
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45-70Ag
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In reply to rootube • 3:49p, 2/28/25
AG
Still not an American problem. I'm as hawkish as anyone with the right reasons and not opposed to vaporizing our enemies with nuclear weapons.

But this clown show, this isn't our fight and Europe doesn't really give a damn either.
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Hullabaloonatic
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In reply to rootube • 3:49p, 2/28/25
rootube said:
BlueSmoke said:
Zelensky seems wrapped in righteous indignation and the invasion he feels he is the center-point for the country. I do feel that he cares, but he's missing the bigger picture that there are no winners in this conflict. They can't expel Russia and even is Russia took Ukraine, they can't hold it. It would deplete the last of their forces, then it becomes Baghdad on a much bigger scale.

There's no winning this from either side.



What do you do if you are Zelenskyy?

After the fall of the Soviet Union your country gave up their nuclear weapons in exchange for security guarantees from the US and Russia as part of the Budapest memo to "Protect Ukraine's territorial integrity". Something that everyone naively thought would make the world safer.

Flash forward to 2014 and Russia takes Crimea and the Donbas which are part of Ukraine. The countries eventually sign the Minsk Agreement to stop the war in the Donbas. Russia breaks that agreement and continues to push forward in the Donbas eventually leading to the full scale invasion of Ukraine in '22. Surely you can appreciate how the Ukrainians would be skeptical of a deal with no security guarantees. You have to either naively believe that Russia has changed or make the calculation that you can improve your position with actual guarantees from Europe.


This is something people here can't understand.

1. Why Zelensky can't just accept any peace deal
2. The US's own interests in stopping Russia and supporting a European ally.


Their brain stops functioning at "they should pay for it."
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rootube
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In reply to Bird Poo • 3:50p, 2/28/25
AG
Bird Poo said:
Biz Ag said:
Can you imagine Churchill or De Gaulle speaking to FDR like that?


If our offer was a minerals deal to recoup our investment with zero weapons or security guarantees. Yes.
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newbie11
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In reply to Gigem314 • 3:50p, 2/28/25
Gigem314 said:
AggieShanks said:
He had a negotiation live on television to pressure Zelensky to make the deal because it means more for Trump's legacy to say he negotiated peace. Instead, Zelensky defended his country, called a buck a buck, and went home. Trump was already pulling support. He ran on that, so, nothing changed. Only thing it showed us was that Trump really isn't this strongman that can force peace. He's like any other president. A leader of one country with waning influence abroad.
Trump did what he did not for his legacy, but because he thinks it's in America's better interests to pull support from what's becoming a never-ending mess that your boy Biden allowed to fester with no strategy or plan. Trump is looking out for his own country. If Zelensky thinks he's better off taking his ball and going home, so be it. More power to him. I'm sure he's got this.
I hope he takes his ball, goes home and goes this alone.
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aTm2004
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In reply to Teslag • 3:50p, 2/28/25
AG
Teslag said:
aTm2004 said:
MouthBQ98 said:
The Ukrainian constitution requires elections be put on hold during wartime, apparently, as a wartime election would be of dubious legitimacy.

So, he has an incentive to continue the war?



Ya, the incentive is there's a foreign country on his soil killing his people
You missed my point completely.

He has money and will have money in the future. What he will not have is power, so his incentive is to retain power. Because of that, IMO, any kind of compromise to end the war is off the table to him because he doesn't want to give that up, and is hiding behind his people and patriotism shield.

He's in a no-win situation and should know when to take a deal that helps end the war and killing of his people, but he won't for selfish reasons he'll never admit.

And if you think for a second I'm pro-Russia, I'm not. In fact, I couldn't care less about either of the 2 countries. If both of their leaders are gone tomorrow, I'd feel the exact same as I do now. I'm looking at it (his incentive) purely from a human nature point of view. The only drug power takes a backseat to is vagina.
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Gigem314
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In reply to 1876er • 3:52p, 2/28/25
AG
1876er said:
Gigem314 said:
rootube said:
Gigem314 said:
aggiehawg said:
WHOA! Is this being reported anywhere else?

They could always borrow Al Green...calling for impeachment is his specialty.


Zelenskyy has better approval ratings than Trump. I expect them to only go up after today.
Good for him. Hopefully the loss in support over here was worth it for his goals.
What support?

Trump and his buddies have all sided with Russia.
I'm amazed at the crazy things some of you choose to believe to appease your hatred for Trump.

It also tells me all I need to know about the argument when someone calls others 'Russian' for simply not wanting the U.S. to be involved in either side of this conflict.
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UntoldSpirit
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In reply to Hullabaloonatic • 3:53p, 2/28/25
AG
Hullabaloonatic said:

You can either have a world where you are the global hegemon and all your allies do what you say and are inextricably bound to your economy, or you can have a world where you demand Europe remilitarizes to "pay its way" only to discover it no longer feels obliged to follow your lead.

I would say this policy that you think is so brilliant isn't working today. They already feel little to no obligation to follow our lead. They formed the EU to compete with us and reduce our influence. They have attacked freedom of speech and embraced socialism. Yet they continue to take advantage of us by letting us invest in their protection. Doesn't make sense any more.
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GeorgiAg
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3:53p, 2/28/25
AG
Elect a clown, expect a circus.
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45-70Ag
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3:53p, 2/28/25
AG



Good end this crap today
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GAC06
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In reply to 45-70Ag • 3:53p, 2/28/25
AG
45-70Ag said:
Europe has given the United States the finger for the last almost 80 years. They have never fulfilled their obligations with nato for those who are members and taken advantage of the U.S. with tariffs.

We've bailed them out multiple times over eight decades in a variety of ways and for what? Europe can't defend itself outside of tweets of solidarity with a clown dressed like the idiots at the local gun range.



We're the only NATO country that's invoked article 5. They fought and died for us.
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Heineken-Ashi
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In reply to GeorgiAg • 3:54p, 2/28/25
GeorgiAg said:
Elect a clown, expect a circus.
Yes the circus Ukraine has become thanks to the guy you elected.
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