Burdizzo said:

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So can I use my voucher to send little Muhammed to the Allahu Akbar Pyrotechnic Charter School?

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Sure? Why not!

Minnesota public schools already trending that direction!

cevans_40 said:

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aTmAg said:

---

cevans_40 said:

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aTmAg said:

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cevans_40 said:

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aTmAg said:

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twk said:

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aTmAg said:

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Booma94 said:

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harge57 said:

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Antoninus said:

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simple question.

Let's completely do away with public schooling.

Do you want 10 million people in this state exercising the franchise, with no education whatsoever. Unable to read. Unable to write. Unable to even remotely understand the issues.

Do you want those people selecting the members of the legislator and executive branch?

if you answered "no," then even you acknowledge that education is, at least in part, a "public ghod."

---

That is what is coming out of the public schools today.

---

No it's not. Not even close. Every college and university in the state is filled with public school graduates. The number of failing schools is a fraction of the total, but voucher proponents like to latch on to those few schools like they are the rule, when they are very much the exception.

---

Rightly so. As a voucher program would allow kids doomed to those few school to leave and go to better schools. It's ridiculous that you want to basically impose on them a life sentence of poverty because they live closer to a crappy school.

---

If vouchers were limited to kids trapped in attendance zones of failing schools, or means tested for lower income (lower middle class and poor), then that might happen. But, if we do across the board vouchers, available to everyone, we are just going to see most of that money eaten up by private school tuition inflation.

---

First of all, that statement implies that you don't understand inflation. There is no such thing as "food inflation" or "tuition inflation". Inflation is an undue expansion of the money supply that usually increases ALL prices. It's NOT merely "prices going up".

Secondly, current private schools do not try to compete against "free" public schools. They, by definition, are getting undercut and therefore would go out of business. So they focus on rich clientele that can afford to pay taxes AND pay a tuition on top. They are competing with each other, not public schools.

But after a voucher system, that would change. Afterwards, the demand for inexpensive private education would go WAY up, and new private schools would pop up to fill the demand. They would need to compete just like grocery stores and auto dealers. Depending on if taxpayers can keep the surplus, schools will either charge the voucher amount or less. Just like what occurs everywhere else in the market.

---

Just like what easy subsidized loans has done for the cost of college tuition

---

Which is why pure privatization is the best of all worlds. Vouchers are merely an improvement over our current public system (which is a low bar).

---

Nope. Its a system that reduces accountability to the tax payer and therefore will be ripe with fraud.

---

Are you kidding? It INCREASES accountability. Is your grocery store fraudulent? No? How can that be? They don't have a "grocery store board" nor get money from the state?!? It's because people being able to shop elsewhere provides immediate and concrete consequences.


The things that are corrupt and fraudulent are the things that heavily involve government. Bernie Madoff defrauded people for decades thanks to the SEC. The original Ponzi lasted only a year thanks to the free market.

---

Ever heard of the FDA? USDA?

---

Yeah, and they are both a joke. Read Thomas Sowell on the topic. He exposes them thoroughly as being far worse than the free market.

Quote:

---

This system gives parents a check to spend money at whatever school they choose and provides little to no oversight or quality control of that education. You are depending on parents to self-report their crimes. Its fine with me as the day this passes, I will open a school that graduates/passes everyone and is nothing more than a babysitting service all the while I won't have to worry about any standardized tests. I will have plenty of demand for my service and plenty of government funds to keep my doors open.

---

Oh, you mean like modern public schools?

Worst case scenario, lazy ass parents would send their kids to the closest schools like right now. Yet most parents would send their kids to the best schools they can for the money. To pretend that vouchers would make it WORSE is hilarious.

Ghost of Andrew Eaton said:

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Burdizzo said:

---

Ghost of Andrew Eaton said:

---

I don't understand how people don't realize that more freedom is always better, no matter how much it costs.

With that being said, public schools now need to be unshackled from the standardize testing focus and those parents need to be able to decide what measures they will use to measure the instruction that their children are receiving, just like private school parents.

---

Without a standardized system, what determines if a school is succeeding or failing?

---

How do you know if a private school is failing or succeeding?

---

It costs a lot of money, and all my friends send their kids there. It must be good, right?

oldag941 said:

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I frequently ask which admins they would cut. Our district has about 2% of labor cost (total labor cost is 80% of budget) going to central admin. People would be VERY suprised at how many of these added roles in the last 30 years are a direct result, and requirement (either enumerated or just required by workload addition) of both state and federal layers of requirements, data collecting, reporting etc. Special ed, anything to do with federal funds, etc. Reduce the state and federal requirements and regulation and some of those jobs can go away.

---

But those are exactly part of the problem of the current system that WILL NOT change. It is part of the administrative creep that will inevitably happen in ANY government institution. That is built in, and why moving away from government schools is the only way to fix those issues.

oldag941 said:

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I frequently ask which admins they would cut. Our district has about 2% of labor cost (total labor cost is 80% of budget) going to central admin. People would be VERY suprised at how many of these added roles in the last 30 years are a direct result, and requirement (either enumerated or just required by workload addition) of both state and federal layers of requirements, data collecting, reporting etc. Special ed, anything to do with federal funds, etc. Reduce the state and federal requirements and regulation and some of those jobs can go away.

---

Yes, federal and state regulation is the primary source of the administrative bloat. It's not simply a money matter, and would require a rolling back of regulation, which is badly needed.

DD88 said:

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• Rep. Steve Allison (HD121 R-San Antonio) -> Abbott/Cruz endorse Marc LaHood [Michael Champion]
• Rep. Ernest Bailes (HD18 R-Shepherd) -> Abbott/Cruz/Patrick endorse Janis Holt [Stephen Missick]
• Rep. Keith Bell (HD4 R-Forney) Paxton endorses Joshua Feuerstein
• RUNOFF Rep. DeWayne Burns (HD58 R-Cleburne) -> Abbott/Cruz/Patrick endorse Helen Kerwin [Lyndon Laird]
• Rep. Travis Clardy (HD11 R-Nacogdoches) -> Abbot/Cruz/Patrick endorse Joanne Shofner
• Rep. Drew Darby (HD72 R-San Angelo) -> Abbott/Patrick endorse Stormy Bradley
• Rep. Jay Dean (HD7 R-Longview) Miller endorses Joe McDaniel [Bonnie Walters]
• Rep. Charlie Geren (HD99 R-Fort Worth) Paxton endorses Jack Reynolds
• RUNOFF Rep. Justin Holland (HD33 R-Rockwall) Paxton/Miller endorse Katrina Pierson [Dennis London]
• RUNOFF Rep. Kyle Kacal (HD12 R-College Station) -> Abbott endorses Trey Wharton, Patrick/Miller endorse Ben Bius
• Rep. Ken King (HD88 R-Canadian) Paxton/Miller endorse Karen Post
• RUNOFF Rep. John Kuempel (HD44 R-Seguin) Abbott/Cruz/Patrick endorse Alan Schoolcraft [David Friemarck, Greg Switzer]
• Rep. Stan Lambert (HD71 R-Abilene) Abbott/Cruz/Patrick endorse Liz Case [Charles Byrn]
• Rep. Andrew Murr (HD53 R-Junction) Cruz/Miller endorse Wes Virdell [Hatch Smith]
• Rep. Four Price (HD87 R-Amarillo) -> Abbott/Cruz/Patrick endorse Caroline Fairly
• Rep. John Raney (HD14 R-College Station) -> Abbott/Patrick endorse Paul Dyson
• Rep. Glenn Rogers (HD60 R-Graford) -> Abbott/Cruz/Patrick endorse Mike Olcott
• Rep. Hugh Shine (HD55 R-Temple) -> Abbott/Cruz endorse Hillary Hickland [David Ford]
• Rep. Reggie Smith (HD62 R-Sherman) Cruz/Miller endorse Shelley Luther
• RUNOFF Rep. Ed Thompson (HD29 R-Pearland) -> Abbott endorses Alex Kamkar [Jeffrey Barry]
• RUNOFF Rep. GaryVanDeaver (HD1 R-New Boston) -> Abbott/Miller endorse Chris Spencer [Dale Huls]

Of the 21 Reps voting against school vouchers:
6 Anti-voucher Incumbents lost
5 Anti-voucher incumbents are in runoffs
5 Anti-voucher Incumbents won
4 Pro-voucher endorsed candidates won where Incumbent didn't run
1 race with no incumbent in a runoff between pro-voucher candidates

---

The ultimate irony of this thread...all the anti voucher Reps getting labeled as RINOs while the challengers were heavily pushed by mega RINO Abbot and many times super RINO Trump.

Burdizzo said:

---

Ghost of Andrew Eaton said:

---

I don't understand how people don't realize that more freedom is always better, no matter how much it costs.

With that being said, public schools now need to be unshackled from the standardize testing focus and those parents need to be able to decide what measures they will use to measure the instruction that their children are receiving, just like private school parents.

---

Without a standardized system, what determines if a school is succeeding or failing?

---

What determines if the car, TV, cell phone, etc. you are about to buy is good? What about doctor, lawyer, child care, etc? Weird how people are able to figure this out in every other industry. Why do you guys think schools would be any different?

Antoninus said:

---

aTmAg said:

---

Everybody should pay for the government resources they consume. If one person pays $1 for a service that benefits him $100, while another pays $1000 for a service that benefits him than $500, then that is also redistribution

---

a very nice, concise summary of aanarchocapitalism. As I said, you consider anything left of an AnCap to be "socialism."

It is a mind-numbingly simplistic way of looking at the world.

---

Bromany, you need to get off your high horse because you're the one that's clearly backwards here, and your transparent narcissism is a pretty bad look in juxtaposition.

Public education at its core socialism. It was a massive win for the German socialists in the 19th century who were the real precursors of public education in the west.

Just because you like it doesn't mean it's not socialism.

Just because it's old and has popular support doesn't mean it's not socialism.

It's definitely, definitely socialism.

Now, the question is can we improve a popular socialistic policy with some free market mechanisms? The hard data on vouchers shows they absolutely can work if implemented correctly.

aTmAg said:

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angus55 said:

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BMX Bandit said:

---

look forward to the spin from posters that claim rural republicans don't want vouchers and are just too dimwitted to understand the ballot language

---

Looking forward to how you keep rural schools funded when one of your primary mechanisms is still Robin Hood. Secondly will these vouchers be accepted by private schools. I know some don't because they know strings will be stretched. But you don't hear that. You think the bureaucrats are going sit idly by?

---

Robin Hood is a socialist abomination. It should have never existed and is only supported by the economically ignorant.

---

Robinhood is actually the primary culprit here. I'm a Republican and I am against school vouchers, however, their appeal to voters is the end result of the long term damage that has been done by Robinhood. We live in a really great school district where people pay a ton in taxes. However, we are having to do layoffs and cut costs all over because our district doesn't get to keep it's money. We have to send it to the poverty pimps in Austin under the guise of "equity."

Phatbob said:

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cevans_40 said:

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Phatbob said:

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And you would go out of business really quick. Not sure what the issue is here. The market corrects for bad businesses that do not provide a viable product.

---

You are sadly mistaken. I would probably have to turn people away.

---

That's... what...? No, you can't just say you'd put crap out as an educational option and assume that people who, by the very nature of the market would be driven by people looking to educate their kids, would be just buy your services. That makes absolutely no sense.

It's like saying you could crap on a plate and have to turn people away from your restaurant.

---

Ok. Let me spell this out for you. There are about 25% of parents (very conservative estimate) who do not value education at all. Like actually despise the learning process and find it unnecessary. Its way too difficult for their child and they just want their kid to get a diploma so they can get a job. I would cater to those folks and they would be sure that their kid would get that diploma and be out of their hair during the day. I wouldn't call home and complain about discipline issues or attendance or punctuality or anything. Just let them sit and stare at their phones all day and watch YouTube to learn about whatever they were interested in.

See I started the year with 85 kids in my Algebra 2 classes. My class is so hard (it's really easy) that 16 have quit and went online (where they can just google search every answer). There are others that would likely do the same if another option that had some sort of social aspect existed. I will fill that role and my pocketbook at the same time.

Maroon Elephant said:

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aTmAg said:

---

angus55 said:

---

BMX Bandit said:

---

look forward to the spin from posters that claim rural republicans don't want vouchers and are just too dimwitted to understand the ballot language

---

Looking forward to how you keep rural schools funded when one of your primary mechanisms is still Robin Hood. Secondly will these vouchers be accepted by private schools. I know some don't because they know strings will be stretched. But you don't hear that. You think the bureaucrats are going sit idly by?

---

Robin Hood is a socialist abomination. It should have never existed and is only supported by the economically ignorant.

---

Robinhood is actually the primary culprit here. I'm a Republican and I am against school vouchers, however, their appeal to voters is the end result of the long term damage that has been done by Robinhood. We live in a really great school district where people pay a ton in taxes. However, we are having to do layoffs and cut costs all over because our district doesn't get to keep it's money. We have to send it to the poverty pimps in Austin under the guise of "equity."

---

This, I absolutely agree with.

Agthatbuilds said:

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Faustus said:

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BMX Bandit said:

---

Quote:

---

Looking forward to how you keep rural schools funded when one of your primary mechanisms is still Robin Hood.

---

nothing will change how good rural school are funded.

if they are good schools and people like them, why would there be a mass exodus of kids leaving?

and anyone whose school is supported by robin hood should be a little embarrassed.
. . .

---

Maybe it's my search skills, but I couldn't find a list of school districts receiving recapture funds through Robinhood - although maybe the state doesn't publish that since it could be construed as a shame list.

Here's the list of the 150+ school districts that were subject to recapture in 2021-22 and the amounts "recaptured" from them:

chrome-extension://efaidnbmnnnibpcajpcglclefindmkaj/https://www.txsc.org/wp-content/uploads/2022/08/2022-Total-Recapture-per-District-by-Amount.pdf

AISD at just under $800 million.
HISD at just over $300 million.
Highland Park ISD and Eanes ISD - both with only one high school - over $100 million each.

My kids will be off to college and out of private school in a couple of years, so the state needs to get on the ball.

---

Here you go

https://www.txsc.org/texas-school-finance-faqs/

---

Is every district that's not being recaptured from receiving funds? You're either paying or receiving? Because that graphic just shows the same districts in my list - the ones being recaptured from.

Agthatbuilds said:

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Yes, as a tax paying member of a district that is sending 72 million dollars back to Texas, I totally find no flaws that im personally paying higher taxes to fund school districts far away from my location.

It'd be nice to give the teachers a raise and I bet 72 million would cover it. But we need to raise the taxes to provide such a lift.

Frankly, I'm tired of the education racket. It's always more money. It's always more resources. More more more more. And the results get worse and worse and worse

---

I can't find a link but what you say is true. In Chicago a school teacher left the system, started her own school with just a few students. The students weren't even the same grade level. She had desks and books. Her students outperformed students in the public school system handily.
Public schools need to return to reading writing and arithmetic, standards of behavior and penalties for students that are disruptive. No automatic graduation, that is insane. Reductions in all unnecessary staff positions, let teachers teach, give teachers raises and reduce unnecessary bureaucracy.

BMX Bandit said:

---

Quote:

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Looking forward to how you keep rural schools funded when one of your primary mechanisms is still Robin Hood.

---

nothing will change how good rural school are funded.

if they are good schools and people like them, why would there be a mass exodus of kids leaving?

and anyone whose school is supported by robin hood should be a little embarrassed.

Quote:

---

Secondly will these vouchers be accepted by private schools. I know some don't because they know strings will be stretched. But you don't hear that. You think the bureaucrats are going sit idly by?

---

some will, some won't. that is not a reason not to pass the bill and let people choose where their money goes. I know you are big robin hood guy, but conservative texas republicans want to spend their money on their kids.

---

I agree with this. Though I'm cautiously optimistic that passing voucher legislation will result in the simplistic way its being described. I just hope my kids are included in the caps proposed for the first few years...because after that they're in college and this no longer benefits me.

Thanks for doing the work.

So, with the five who won, that puts "nay" vs "yay" right at nearly 50/50. The extra 5, if win their runoff, would give a small cushion for the "nay"s.

The question is, did any "yay"s lose to a "nay"? And of course, always possible for seats to flip in November.

Maroon Elephant said:

---

aTmAg said:

---

angus55 said:

---

BMX Bandit said:

---

look forward to the spin from posters that claim rural republicans don't want vouchers and are just too dimwitted to understand the ballot language

---

Looking forward to how you keep rural schools funded when one of your primary mechanisms is still Robin Hood. Secondly will these vouchers be accepted by private schools. I know some don't because they know strings will be stretched. But you don't hear that. You think the bureaucrats are going sit idly by?

---

Robin Hood is a socialist abomination. It should have never existed and is only supported by the economically ignorant.

---

Robinhood is actually the primary culprit here. I'm a Republican and I am against school vouchers, however, their appeal to voters is the end result of the long term damage that has been done by Robinhood. We live in a really great school district where people pay a ton in taxes. However, we are having to do layoffs and cut costs all over because our district doesn't get to keep it's money. We have to send it to the poverty pimps in Austin under the guise of "equity."

---

A big reason to support vouchers today, that didn't exist a decade ago is the overt wokeness. With vouchers, if you go into your kids school, and there is a bunch of woke crap all over the walls, you can easily nope your kid right out of there.

aTmAg said:

---

Burdizzo said:

---

Ghost of Andrew Eaton said:

---

I don't understand how people don't realize that more freedom is always better, no matter how much it costs.

With that being said, public schools now need to be unshackled from the standardize testing focus and those parents need to be able to decide what measures they will use to measure the instruction that their children are receiving, just like private school parents.

---

Without a standardized system, what determines if a school is succeeding or failing?

---

What determines if the car, TV, cell phone, etc. you are about to buy is good? What about doctor, lawyer, child care, etc? Weird how people are able to figure this out in every other industry. Why do you guys think schools would be any different?

---

All highly regulated

aTmAg said:

---

Burdizzo said:

---

Ghost of Andrew Eaton said:

---

I don't understand how people don't realize that more freedom is always better, no matter how much it costs.

With that being said, public schools now need to be unshackled from the standardize testing focus and those parents need to be able to decide what measures they will use to measure the instruction that their children are receiving, just like private school parents.

---

Without a standardized system, what determines if a school is succeeding or failing?

---

What determines if the car, TV, cell phone, etc. you are about to buy is good? What about doctor, lawyer, child care, etc? Weird how people are able to figure this out in every other industry. Why do you guys think schools would be any different?

---

Let me know where I can find an unbiased Consumer Reports for schools.

Maroon Elephant said:

---

aTmAg said:

---

angus55 said:

---

BMX Bandit said:

---

look forward to the spin from posters that claim rural republicans don't want vouchers and are just too dimwitted to understand the ballot language

---

Looking forward to how you keep rural schools funded when one of your primary mechanisms is still Robin Hood. Secondly will these vouchers be accepted by private schools. I know some don't because they know strings will be stretched. But you don't hear that. You think the bureaucrats are going sit idly by?

---

Robin Hood is a socialist abomination. It should have never existed and is only supported by the economically ignorant.

---

Robinhood is actually the primary culprit here. I'm a Republican and I am against school vouchers, however, their appeal to voters is the end result of the long term damage that has been done by Robinhood. We live in a really great school district where people pay a ton in taxes. However, we are having to do layoffs and cut costs all over because our district doesn't get to keep it's money. We have to send it to the poverty pimps in Austin under the guise of "equity."

---

"Robin Hood" was created because the legislature didn't want to levy a statewide property tax. School funding is a responsibility of the state under the constitution. So, if we abolished Robin Hood, we would probably have to reimpose a statewide property tax, or an income tax (sales tax is already pretty high) in order to make up the shortfall. That might be the way to go, but there is no logical tie to vouchers, unless you are arguing that vouchers are just Robin Hood on top of Robin Hood to allow folks living in the high value districts, with kids (but not those without, or businesses), to get some of their property tax money back.

TheCurl84 said:

---

I see unintended consequences with a voucher program. I hope I'm wrong.

---

I'm sure there will be some issues. The devil is in the details. One can almost guarantee there will be problems that need to be worked out.
Hope the system of vouchers can solve those problems as it places emphasis on education.

aTmAg said:

---

Antoninus said:

---

half the population would refuse to pay for, leaving us with an illiterate electorate

---

Pfft... hardly.

We would have less illiterate people than today.

---

Irony.

"FEWER illiterate people ..."

Silent For Too Long said:

---

Antoninus said:

---

aTmAg said:

---

Everybody should pay for the government resources they consume. If one person pays $1 for a service that benefits him $100, while another pays $1000 for a service that benefits him than $500, then that is also redistribution

---

a very nice, concise summary of aanarchocapitalism. As I said, you consider anything left of an AnCap to be "socialism."

It is a mind-numbingly simplistic way of looking at the world.

---

Bromany, you need to get off your high horse because you're the one that's clearly backwards here, and your transparent narcissism is a pretty bad look in juxtaposition.

Public education at its core socialism. It was a massive win for the German socialists in the 19th century who were the real precursors of public education in the west.

Just because you like it doesn't mean it's not socialism.

Just because it's old and has popular support doesn't mean it's not socialism.

It's definitely, definitely socialism.

Now, the question is can we improve a popular socialistic policy with some free market mechanisms? The hard data on vouchers shows they absolutely can work if implemented correctly.

---

Work for whom and based on what metric?

This sounds like what socialists say- the data shows socialism works when implemented correctly- it just hasn't ever been implemented "correctly"....

richardag said:

---

TheCurl84 said:

---

I see unintended consequences with a voucher program. I hope I'm wrong.

---

I'm sure there will be some issues. The devil is in the details. One can almost guarantee there will be problems that need to be worked out.
Hope the system of vouchers can solve those problems as it places emphasis on education.

---

Without standardized testing (which I hate), I don't see how you can have any form of real oversight.

Burdizzo said:

---

aTmAg said:

---

Burdizzo said:

---

Ghost of Andrew Eaton said:

---

I don't understand how people don't realize that more freedom is always better, no matter how much it costs.

With that being said, public schools now need to be unshackled from the standardize testing focus and those parents need to be able to decide what measures they will use to measure the instruction that their children are receiving, just like private school parents.

---

Without a standardized system, what determines if a school is succeeding or failing?

---

What determines if the car, TV, cell phone, etc. you are about to buy is good? What about doctor, lawyer, child care, etc? Weird how people are able to figure this out in every other industry. Why do you guys think schools would be any different?

---

Let me know where I can find an unbiased Consumer Reports for schools.

---

It doesn't exist today, because there is no point to it. People can't swap schools anyway. But notice that there are tons of reports on colleges? The same would happen in a school system where people can choose.

Antoninus said:

---

aTmAg said:

---

Antoninus said:

---

half the population would refuse to pay for, leaving us with an illiterate electorate

---

Pfft... hardly.

We would have less illiterate people than today.

---

Irony.

"FEWER illiterate people ..."

---

GOT EM!! Congrats!

I started to say illiteracy, but changed it.

Do you have a good point yet?

cevans_40 said:

---

richardag said:

---

TheCurl84 said:

---

I see unintended consequences with a voucher program. I hope I'm wrong.

---

I'm sure there will be some issues. The devil is in the details. One can almost guarantee there will be problems that need to be worked out.
Hope the system of vouchers can solve those problems as it places emphasis on education.

---

Without standardized testing (which I hate), I don't see how you can have any form of real oversight.

---

There is already standardized tests like the SAT that high schools can be compared with.

And there is every interest in the world for schools to prove to customers that they are good. So lower grade schools will administer standardized tests to their students to prove it.


Not to mention, it's pretty damned easy to look at your kids homework and tests, to see if the material is worth a damn.

aTmAg said:

---

Burdizzo said:

---

aTmAg said:

---

Burdizzo said:

---

Ghost of Andrew Eaton said:

---

I don't understand how people don't realize that more freedom is always better, no matter how much it costs.

With that being said, public schools now need to be unshackled from the standardize testing focus and those parents need to be able to decide what measures they will use to measure the instruction that their children are receiving, just like private school parents.

---

Without a standardized system, what determines if a school is succeeding or failing?

---

What determines if the car, TV, cell phone, etc. you are about to buy is good? What about doctor, lawyer, child care, etc? Weird how people are able to figure this out in every other industry. Why do you guys think schools would be any different?

---

Let me know where I can find an unbiased Consumer Reports for schools.

---

It doesn't exist today, because there is no point to it. People can't swap schools anyway. But notice that there are tons of reports on colleges? The same would happen in a school system where people can choose.

---

I always wonder how we get so many new kids coming to our school without moving when they can't swap schools

richardag said:

---

TheCurl84 said:

---

I see unintended consequences with a voucher program. I hope I'm wrong.

---

I'm sure there will be some issues. The devil is in the details. One can almost guarantee there will be problems that need to be worked out.
Hope the system of vouchers can solve those problems as it places emphasis on education.

---

I don't think it will end up emphasizing education at all. The unintended consequence would be that you will have schools/organizations that emphasize profit over education.

Booma94 said:

---

Agthatbuilds said:

---

That's not how this works broseph.

I can choose the type of truck or vehicle. I can choose the amount of which I drive it. The vehicle cannot pass bonds or taxes when it wants to upgrade its stereo system.

I can fire the truck and replace it at will.

Get out of here with that bull****

---

I'm pretty sure passing bonds is done in an election where the voters who are affected get to say yes or no. But maybe I don't understand how the process works.

---

Yes they get to vote, but non property owners get to vote also.

aTmAg said:

---

Maroon Elephant said:

---

aTmAg said:

---

angus55 said:

---

BMX Bandit said:

---

look forward to the spin from posters that claim rural republicans don't want vouchers and are just too dimwitted to understand the ballot language

---

Looking forward to how you keep rural schools funded when one of your primary mechanisms is still Robin Hood. Secondly will these vouchers be accepted by private schools. I know some don't because they know strings will be stretched. But you don't hear that. You think the bureaucrats are going sit idly by?

---

Robin Hood is a socialist abomination. It should have never existed and is only supported by the economically ignorant.

---

Robinhood is actually the primary culprit here. I'm a Republican and I am against school vouchers, however, their appeal to voters is the end result of the long term damage that has been done by Robinhood. We live in a really great school district where people pay a ton in taxes. However, we are having to do layoffs and cut costs all over because our district doesn't get to keep its money. We have to send it to the poverty pimps in Austin under the guise of "equity."

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A big reason to support vouchers today, that didn't exist a decade ago is the overt wokeness. With vouchers, if you go into your kids school, and there is a bunch of woke crap all over the walls, you can easily nope your kid right out of there.

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If you have an accessible school that you can afford that accepts your child. Which happens to be the exact situation today, without vouchers.


I hope you realize:
1. Not everyone will receive a voucher
2. A voucher alone won't cover all the costs to send your child to public school in most cases
3. A voucher isn't only "your" money that you're receiving back
4. You still have to have a private school accessible to you
5. Your child still has to be accepted to said school
6. Your child will have to pass a standardized test to remain in the voucher program

aTmAg said:

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cevans_40 said:

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richardag said:

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TheCurl84 said:

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I see unintended consequences with a voucher program. I hope I'm wrong.

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I'm sure there will be some issues. The devil is in the details. One can almost guarantee there will be problems that need to be worked out.
Hope the system of vouchers can solve those problems as it places emphasis on education.

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Without standardized testing (which I hate), I don't see how you can have any form of real oversight.

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There is already standardized tests like the SAT that high schools can be compared with.

And there is every interest in the world for schools to prove to customers that they are good. So lower grade schools will administer standardized tests to their students to prove it.


Not to mention, it's pretty damned easy to look at your kids homework and tests, to see if the material is worth a damn.

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Ok cool. Now do half of the population who doesn't care about their kids education.

Over 60% of our graduates don't even take the SAT or ACT.

Quote:

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Ok cool. Now do half of the population who doesn't care about their kids education.

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The system can't replace positive parent involvement

cevans_40 said:

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aTmAg said:

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cevans_40 said:

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richardag said:

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TheCurl84 said:

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I see unintended consequences with a voucher program. I hope I'm wrong.

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I'm sure there will be some issues. The devil is in the details. One can almost guarantee there will be problems that need to be worked out.
Hope the system of vouchers can solve those problems as it places emphasis on education.

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Without standardized testing (which I hate), I don't see how you can have any form of real oversight.

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There is already standardized tests like the SAT that high schools can be compared with.

And there is every interest in the world for schools to prove to customers that they are good. So lower grade schools will administer standardized tests to their students to prove it.


Not to mention, it's pretty damned easy to look at your kids homework and tests, to see if the material is worth a damn.

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Ok cool. Now do half of the population who doesn't care about their kids education.

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That makes no sense.

If people were happy with the results of a public school system, vouchers would never have a chance.

Many parents are not happy with the product, and have watched the system fail. Because we value a high-quality education, we are looking at other options. I don't have a dog in this fight anymore as both of my kids have graduated from college. I am supporting vouchers based on my personal experience as a parent with College Station ISD.

Private colleges have not put public universities out of business. Some public universities still provide value. Some public high schools will continue to do the same.

sam callahan said:

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Quote:

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Ok cool. Now do half of the population who doesn't care about their kids education.

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The system can't replace parent involvement

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You are correct. But it can force the kids to do a little bit in order to graduate. If you remove those standards, then it will only get worse.