***** USMNT vs The Netherlands WC R16 Game Thread (12/3) *****

67,020 Views | 1293 Replies | Last: 1 yr ago by aggiephoenix02
KCup17
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AG
The way I see it is 2 fold. Firstly the optics on this are horrible. This should have stayed in house not aired out by GGG even if it was "explicitly off the record". Secondly, Gio needs to grow the hell up. There are the Paul Arriolas and Malick Tillmans of this cycle that would bust a gut practice and scrimmage just to be on this team at the WC. The most un-American thing you can do for this team is not show heart or effort. Have some perspective. Hope he learns from this.

Stepping off my soap box.
aggiephoenix02
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Well said…
MookieBlaylock
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Pahdz said:

So basically when I posted that Reyna is a diva and being a brat and got scolded here...I was right?

I hate to be right but seems I was on the right track.


Like father like son

aggiephoenix02
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MookieBlaylock said:

Pahdz said:

So basically when I posted that Reyna is a diva and being a brat and got scolded here...I was right?

I hate to be right but seems I was on the right track.


Like father like son


I never cared for Claudio…
OregonAggie
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aggiephoenix02 said:

MookieBlaylock said:

Pahdz said:

So basically when I posted that Reyna is a diva and being a brat and got scolded here...I was right?

I hate to be right but seems I was on the right track.


Like father like son


I never cared for Claudio…


What was it about him that you didn't like? Just curious.

I thought the dude was pretty good player but not necessarily phenomenal.
Rudyjax
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aggiephoenix02
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OregonAggie said:

aggiephoenix02 said:

MookieBlaylock said:

Pahdz said:

So basically when I posted that Reyna is a diva and being a brat and got scolded here...I was right?

I hate to be right but seems I was on the right track.


Like father like son


I never cared for Claudio…


What was it about him that you didn't like? Just curious.

I thought the dude was pretty good player but not necessarily phenomenal.
I thought the same, pretty good, but not phenomenal. He wasn't very charismatic, I never understood his leadership style other than being tenured, as compared to someone like Bocanegra and Bradley and Donovan and Dempsey and so many other captains.

Much like his son, there was just something about him that rubbed me the wrong way. Maybe his body language, or his lack of passion on and off the field. He seemed like he felt entitled to some extent. Idk…

Edit: Perhaps not entitled, but definitely aloof and arrogant.
AG@RICE
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I liked Claudio (and still like Gio). Very talented and hard-working player. He was also one of the best players in a world cup, possibly the greatest performance by an American. Most importantly, he maintained team chemistry. The previous US captain ****ed his teammates wife and basically ruined all team chemistry.
TRM
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You agree with these takes?
birdman
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I'm not that bothered by Berhalter bringing it to public attention. It would have trickled out eventually anyway. His teammates would have blabbed to their club teammates.

Sampson did a bunch of things wrong 20+ years ago. Keeping quiet about John Harkes was one of them. He didn't have to go into explicit details but should have addressed it publicly. Because it was a mystery, that was entire focus. It was a huge distraction on a team that didn't need extra distractions. He could have made a "conduct unbecoming of an officer" type statement and move on.

Gio acted like a prima donna. And it escalated. His behavior didn't mean he might not start. It got to the point where they were going to send him home? What a knucklehead.

Claudio Reyna was never a bad teammate. He worked hard and played selflessly. When a teammate didn't play to those basic expectations, he called them out. Sounds like Tyler Adams was doing the same thing to Gio Reyna.

When the cameras showed a sulking Claudio in the stands, he wasn't pissed at Berhalter. He was angry with his idiot son.
Pahdz
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Kinda how I view it. That other tweet comparing him to Kobe and MJ is a giant stretch.
Pahdz
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Those guys mentioned never lacked effort. If Gio wasn't working hard then that's on him.
aggiephoenix02
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https://isiphotos.photoshelter.com/image/I0000C_QR6.ljGZ4
birdman
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And the answer to that question is YES.

Kobe Bryant was easy to coach. Michael Jordan was easy to coach. They wanted to win and were willing to work hard. They didn't get mad at teammates because they couldn't play to their level. (few could). But if a teammate was dogging it, they buried them.

Gio is not MJ. Gio is the bench warmer that Jordan would run off the team because he didn't suffer fools. If you weren't doing everything in your power to win, find the door.
TRM
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birdman said:

And the answer to that question is YES.

Kobe Bryant was easy to coach. Michael Jordan was easy to coach. They wanted to win and were willing to work hard. They didn't get mad at teammates because they couldn't play to their level. (few could). But if a teammate was dogging it, they buried them.

Gio is not MJ. Gio is the bench warmer that Jordan would run off the team because he didn't suffer fools. If you weren't doing everything in your power to win, find the door.
Maybe young, immature Gio viewed Ggg as the fool...
TXAggie2011
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Gio is a good player, who seemed to get even better every time he was left on the bench, if you know what I mean. He's no Kobe Bryant or Michael Jordan of American soccer
aggiephoenix02
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Of course he did, he's a dumbass, spoiled, entitled child…
aggiephoenix02
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All of this Gio/Gregg nonsense is a cloud over another successful World Cup.

We got out of our group again, kept our unbeaten World Cup streak against England, got our young future world beaters valuable experience ahead of 2026. And now all anyone is talking about is Gio freakin' Reyna…
KCup17
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It might be because he is/will be a pivotal piece in the 2026 WC. He has the potential to be World Class. The downfall of this team at the WC was lack of quality service and that final pass. Both of which he provides.
aggiephoenix02
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He's a jerk that hasn't done jack. He's young and has time to change, but I'd bet on him being a pain in the ass until he's done with the USMNT…
TRM
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aggiephoenix02 said:

Of course he did, he's a dumbass, spoiled, entitled child…
What 20 yr old isn't a dumbass? I don't know spoiled or entitled is the right word, but he's basically been on his own since 16 or 17 living abroad - probably, cockiness is a better word. I do wonder about his aloofness and how the loss of older brother as a child effected him and if he feels like he's playing for 2 people instead of 1.

Anyway, it's the manager's job to set expectations and attitudes. Reyna isn't the only player Berhalter has had a feud with.
KCup17
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AG
Do you watch him play for club or just country?
aggiephoenix02
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KCup17 said:

Do you watch him play for club or just country?
Nothing but country, which is all I care about. I trust Gregg. I'm sure my point of view is colored by my dislike of his father, and having seen Gio's limited success with his time on the USMNT.

I'm okay with being wrong if he turns things around, but that's gonna be a long way away. I was bummed when he got injured in qualifying, and if that hadn't happened perhaps he'd have played his way into an integral part of our tactics, but that didn't happen.

Chances are he gets injured again, flames out, continues to be a pain in the butt teammate, etc, the least likely thing is that he turns it around and leads our team to World Cup glory. But I'm only basing this on what he has and hasn't done with his opportunities on this team, and not speculating based on what he's done on other teams other places…
TRM
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AG
oh no
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AG
I can definitely see both sides re: Gio. Both can be correct or, more likely, truth is somewhere in the middle.

Could he use an attitude adjustment when he's with the national team? Possibly. Is his attitude a demonstration of his competitiveness and possibly a good thing? Possibly.

i suspect Gio is going to be difficult to manage no matter who the manager is, but hopefully Gregg and Gio's relationship isn't irreparably damaged if Gregg is going to be retained for a second cycle.

I have little doubt all of this Gio discussion could have just blown over had Gregg not foolishly thought telling this story wouldn't get out.
Dre_00
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Sorry for the Dre rant but I just got to get this out of my head because the more I think about it, the more it infuriates me...

Here's the thing...the whole Gio is a bad teammate and/or doesn't give enough effort. That's a story that plays out literally hundreds if not thousands of times at all levels of professional soccer. There are tons of current soccer players, with all different levels of ability, who are *******s or who are bad teammates that don't give forth enough effort. One of three things happen...they either change completely and cause no issues going forward, they change a little so that maybe they still cause issues or some teammates still think he's an ass but it's manageable relative to the output that player produces, or they don't change at all/enough and they get dumped off the team...perhaps multiple times (Ravel Morrison at club level immediately comes to mind here but there are ample examples). I have no idea which bucket Gio will ultimately fall in but I do know that wherever he falls, it will be far from the first time a player has fallen into it.

But what is new here, to me, is how this information got out. Yes, this information may have all come to light eventually but HOW information gets out and WHO lets it out is extremely relevant. The fact that it was Gregg who spilled the beans is either intentionally destructive or extreme incompetence. Sure he didn't name names but he provided so much detail that he effectively did name names. People were already guessing it was Gio purely based on his story before it was confirmed that it was Gio.

And that's a huge problem. One that I don't think there's much precedence for at the national team level (probably a little more so at the club level but still rare I think). It is WILD that the national team coach is the one who created this story. He is the last person who should be creating this story. There is no advantage to him creating this story. It brings nothing but problems. In one fell swoop, he's completely undone the culture he claims he was trying to build over the last 4 years. He's alienated a 20 year old, albeit problematic, hyper talent and it's not like he can get rid of him. He can't be sold. He's always going to be available for selection. By trumpeting his ability to create an environment where it was possible for players to take the lead in these decisions, he's effectively taken away their leadership. "Yeah, we have great leaders and culture on this team but I'M the one who fostered it all." Even were that true, you don't say it. Let others say it. It's just a monumental failure of team management which is what he was probably most respected for.

The only rational reason for doing this, in my opinion, is that he made the decision that he didn't want to continue and he wanted to control the narrative in his favor for future employers at the club level. Or maybe he's just an idiot who doesn't realize what he did was idiotic. Either way, he needs to be swiftly discarded and US soccer needs to move on. This is far more insulting to me than any of his results.
OregonAggie
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I'm no Berhalter fan and I don't like the way this came out BUT Gio isn't a good teammate based on this. He needs to get his **** together because he would've been a key part of the game plan although maybe not a starter. I'm sure that's disappointing but being on the borderline of being sent home means that he was only thinking of himself.

Anyone that played competitive sports knows what this disappointment feels like but it's up to the individual to let it bury them or motivate them…he didn't choose correctly. Hopefully that changes in the future no matter who's coaching the team.
deadbq03
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jeffk
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Interesting.

The Gio situation isn't unique in its face in athletics. Coaches at all levels have to learn to deal with that sort of player and disruption, and it would seem that GB did… until he talked about it to the media which, on or off the record, was a really, really poor decision. Can't imagine that would sit well with any player on the roster.

Gio will either grow up or he won't. It'd be a bummer to lose a player of his talent, but he's not Messi or Ronaldo either, so I'm not burning my Beckerman jersey in despair for our 2026 chances. That said, it's probably a sign that the GB era needs to be over. It's a natural time to transition anyway, and this "feud" is going to be a huge distraction going forward I think.
tysker
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Or he got sick of the 'why not play Gio more' question and told the truth. Or should we perpetuate the Gio is a injury prone player myth?
deadbq03
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Given the context, I can think of other reasons he might have said this in the forum he did. These kinds of events always have a Q&A afterward so it's possible this was a specific answer to a specific question and this happened to be the story that was fresh on his mind. I think it's a bit presumptuous to think this was all an effort to puff up his own leadership abilities.

That said, I agree 100% that it was really dumb even if it was shared with the best of intentions.

I'm hoping this turns into a win-win… Ggg gets pushed out and Gio grows up.
Rudyjax
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Any possibility that Ggg thought he was off the record and the reporter reported it hoping it would hurt his renewal situation?
KCup17
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It's not really a myth. He gets hurt a lot. Specifically muscular injuries.
Aston94
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I just don't understand Gregg at all. Why in the world would he feel like sharing this would be beneficial for him, the team, or Gio? What is the upside of dealing with this?

Players are not going to want to play for Gregg anymore, if they do something wrong is he going to run to the media with it? Dealing with things in house means keeping it in house.

Stuff like this might leak out over time, an asst Coach or player might let it slip. But the head coach the week after you get eliminated? Absolutely moronic.
Rudyjax
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Aston94 said:

I just don't understand Gregg at all. Why in the world would he feel like sharing this would be beneficial for him, the team, or Gio? What is the upside of dealing with this?

Players are not going to want to play for Gregg anymore, if they do something wrong is he going to run to the media with it? Dealing with things in house means keeping it in house.

Stuff like this might leak out over time, an asst Coach or player might let it slip. But the head coach the week after you get eliminated? Absolutely moronic.

I was thinking along these lines when I asked this, "Any possibility that Ggg thought he was off the record and the reporter reported it hoping it would hurt his renewal situation?"
 
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