J. Walter Weatherman said:

---

Science Denier said:

---

J. Walter Weatherman said:

---

Science Denier said:

---

LOL, seems the few DeSantis supporters left are fine with "Trump - Epstein" BS, but don't like to be reminded about their own partying with HS kids when he was their teacher.

---

Well, Trump actually did fly with Epstein. DeSantis "partying with HS kids" is a blatant lie that even the left gave up on. Not surprising Trump cultists are desperately trying to keep it going though.

---

Business Insider

Quote:

---

Former students of Ron DeSantis said he was a 'total jock' who partied with students and thought it was 'very special' that he graduated from Yale

---

Actual news article. Also from that story, here is a quote from DeSantis trying to downplay that photo

Quote:

---

I'd just say this. I spend my time delivering results for the people of Florida and fighting against Joe Biden [...] I don't spend my time trying to smear other Republicans

---

But, he references this Epstein BS. Oops. Spending time smearing yet another Republican. Yet another DeSantis flip-flop. No wonder even Republicans don't like him.

---

Where did DeSantis mention the Epstein stuff?

---

His lacky did (see above), and according to the DeSantis supporters, I'm assured that is the same thing.

jrdaustin said:

---

BluHorseShu said:

---

And if Trump couldn't control the DOJ, that's on him. Its under the executive branch. So either they didn't trust him, respect him, or just chose to continue operating as they had been.

---

Bookmarked. I don't want to hear a peep out of you when the next Republican chief executive cleans house in the DOJ.

---

Trump hasn't even said he will fire Wray and he has no real plan for doing this. Haley sure as hell doesn't. The only guy who does and actually understands how to to it is DeSantis. Always has been.

The guy in the middle is the convicted predator Joel Greenberg

MAGA Twitter is exploding with rage because of a 20-year-old photo of Jimmy Kimmel with a man who once was a chef for Epstein. Nothing so far on Trump's seven flights with Epstein, or the dozens of photos of Trump with Epstein. Of course, all of it is nonsense that means nothing.

Meanwhile, just read that the debt is now 34 trillion dollars. 100k for every person in the U.S. Trump seven years ago, Trump said he'd balance the budget. Here are the budget deficits for each of Trump's fiscal years.

• FY 2021: $1.5 trillion
• FY 2020: $4.2 trillion
• FY 2019: $1.2 trillion
• FY 2018: $1.3 trillion
  
  

GAC06 said:

---

I'll vote for conservatives. I won't vote for Trump. Pretty easy.

---

....and then you'll whine and complain about whatever POS democrat that wins elections.

Ags77 said:

---

Honestly, this isn't going to be a big deal at all, imo.

Those that aren't going to vote for trump ( myself and family) aren't going to see this as an " I knew it" moment. I think I have a pretty good handle on what kind of man Trump is. I don't need any more evidence.

Those that are Trump followers aren't going to blink no matter what came out as news. There could be video of Trump with underage girls and those folks are going to stay with him. What could Trump do that would change their minds ? Nothing.

If Nov is Trump vs Biden , the country has lost already, imo. We deserve better than two old bad candidates.

But if that's the case and those two are the choices, let's just see how the vote goes and pick a president.

---

See, this is some of the absolute dumbest things said on this site.

You know that old saying that the left projects everything they do on the right in an attempt to hide or shield themselves from what they are doing? Yeah, it's true.

P.U.T.U said:

---

Trump would be 78 if he got elected, I am tired of 80 year olds running this country. Honestly Biden and Trump are off my list from age alone. Don't trust someone to make decisions about the future of the country when they have a very limited future to live with the decisions they make

---

See - this is an actual logical argument against Trump or anybody that should be retired. It has substance and actually can stand the litmus test of "why".

More people should take this stance, with every single politician regardless of party.

Science Denier said:

---

J. Walter Weatherman said:

---

Science Denier said:

---

J. Walter Weatherman said:

---

Science Denier said:

---

LOL, seems the few DeSantis supporters left are fine with "Trump - Epstein" BS, but don't like to be reminded about their own partying with HS kids when he was their teacher.

---

Well, Trump actually did fly with Epstein. DeSantis "partying with HS kids" is a blatant lie that even the left gave up on. Not surprising Trump cultists are desperately trying to keep it going though.

---

Business Insider

Quote:

---

Former students of Ron DeSantis said he was a 'total jock' who partied with students and thought it was 'very special' that he graduated from Yale

---

Actual news article. Also from that story, here is a quote from DeSantis trying to downplay that photo

Quote:

---

I'd just say this. I spend my time delivering results for the people of Florida and fighting against Joe Biden [...] I don't spend my time trying to smear other Republicans

---

But, he references this Epstein BS. Oops. Spending time smearing yet another Republican. Yet another DeSantis flip-flop. No wonder even Republicans don't like him.

---

Where did DeSantis mention the Epstein stuff?

---

His lacky did (see above), and according to the DeSantis supporters, I'm assured that is the same thing.

---

You specifically said DeSantis brought it up. It's ok to admit you lied.

LMCane said:

---

schmellba99 said:

---

aggie93 said:

---

Rockdoc said:

---

I'm sorry but this means nothing to anybody other the TDS crowd. And again, I'm voting for Desantis in the primary, but WILL vote for the (R) in the general.

---

So you think they will go after Clinton and ignore Trump's connection to Epstein because the press plays fair?

I am voting the same way I'm just not going to goaltend for Trump or allow him to live by his own rules anymore. If that means I have "TDS" so be it. Trump is a pretty terrible human, the only question is how terrible. I know he is not someone I want to vote for unless I have no other choice.

---

These comments always make me laugh - why don't you list the ways he is such a terrible human.

I'm not talking about getting some strange and divorcing his wife, because he's no different than half (or more) of married folk in that regard. I'm not talking about using existing law to mitigate losses on a few bankruptcies with companies that didn't pan out, because that happens to companies across the country every day of the week, even those mom and pop "really good people" companies.

Is he the second coming of Jesus Christ? Absolutely fuggin not - but - and be specific - how is he so bad that you, who I assume has no interaction with the dude outside of what you parrot from hearing on the news or seeing on message boards (which are parroting what is said on the news) - just *know* he is a "terrible" human?

---

because he personally and has his sycophant grifters lie and defame the best conservative leader we have had since Reagan?

is that what a "good person" does?

---

That's it? That's all you have? You are disparaging somebody for using the primary system in the method in which it was intended to be used?

Yes, terrible indeed. BURN HIM!!!!

J. Walter Weatherman said:

---

Science Denier said:

---

J. Walter Weatherman said:

---

Science Denier said:

---

J. Walter Weatherman said:

---

Science Denier said:

---

LOL, seems the few DeSantis supporters left are fine with "Trump - Epstein" BS, but don't like to be reminded about their own partying with HS kids when he was their teacher.

---

Well, Trump actually did fly with Epstein. DeSantis "partying with HS kids" is a blatant lie that even the left gave up on. Not surprising Trump cultists are desperately trying to keep it going though.

---

Business Insider

Quote:

---

Former students of Ron DeSantis said he was a 'total jock' who partied with students and thought it was 'very special' that he graduated from Yale

---

Actual news article. Also from that story, here is a quote from DeSantis trying to downplay that photo

Quote:

---

I'd just say this. I spend my time delivering results for the people of Florida and fighting against Joe Biden [...] I don't spend my time trying to smear other Republicans

---

But, he references this Epstein BS. Oops. Spending time smearing yet another Republican. Yet another DeSantis flip-flop. No wonder even Republicans don't like him.

---

Where did DeSantis mention the Epstein stuff?

---

His lacky did (see above), and according to the DeSantis supporters, I'm assured that is the same thing.

---

You specifically said DeSantis brought it up. It's ok to admit you lied.

---

The few followers of DeSantis has said many times that if a candidates lackey says something, it's directly from the candidate.

I'm just following your rules.

Science Denier said:

---

J. Walter Weatherman said:

---

Science Denier said:

---

J. Walter Weatherman said:

---

Science Denier said:

---

J. Walter Weatherman said:

---

Science Denier said:

---

LOL, seems the few DeSantis supporters left are fine with "Trump - Epstein" BS, but don't like to be reminded about their own partying with HS kids when he was their teacher.

---

Well, Trump actually did fly with Epstein. DeSantis "partying with HS kids" is a blatant lie that even the left gave up on. Not surprising Trump cultists are desperately trying to keep it going though.

---

Business Insider

Quote:

---

Former students of Ron DeSantis said he was a 'total jock' who partied with students and thought it was 'very special' that he graduated from Yale

---

Actual news article. Also from that story, here is a quote from DeSantis trying to downplay that photo

Quote:

---

I'd just say this. I spend my time delivering results for the people of Florida and fighting against Joe Biden [...] I don't spend my time trying to smear other Republicans

---

But, he references this Epstein BS. Oops. Spending time smearing yet another Republican. Yet another DeSantis flip-flop. No wonder even Republicans don't like him.

---

Where did DeSantis mention the Epstein stuff?

---

His lacky did (see above), and according to the DeSantis supporters, I'm assured that is the same thing.

---

You specifically said DeSantis brought it up. It's ok to admit you lied.

---

The few followers of DeSantis has said many times that if a candidates lackey says something, it's directly from the candidate.

I'm just following your rules.

---

Cool, so you're confirming that you lied and that DeSantis never said anything about Epstein and Trump? Given all the lying you do on here on behalf of Dear Leader it would be a big step to admit it.

Foreverconservative said:

---

The guy in the middle is the convicted predator Joel Greenberg

---

Thanks. It's interesting to find out that he was friends with Gaetz.

Did he travel with DeSantis or spend time with him like Trump did with Epstein?

jrdaustin said:

---

schmellba99 said:

---

aggie93 said:

---

Rockdoc said:

---

I'm sorry but this means nothing to anybody other the TDS crowd. And again, I'm voting for Desantis in the primary, but WILL vote for the (R) in the general.

---

So you think they will go after Clinton and ignore Trump's connection to Epstein because the press plays fair?

I am voting the same way I'm just not going to goaltend for Trump or allow him to live by his own rules anymore. If that means I have "TDS" so be it. Trump is a pretty terrible human, the only question is how terrible. I know he is not someone I want to vote for unless I have no other choice.

---

These comments always make me laugh - why don't you list the ways he is such a terrible human.

I'm not talking about getting some strange and divorcing his wife, because he's no different than half (or more) of married folk in that regard. I'm not talking about using existing law to mitigate losses on a few bankruptcies with companies that didn't pan out, because that happens to companies across the country every day of the week, even those mom and pop "really good people" companies.

Is he the second coming of Jesus Christ? Absolutely fuggin not - but - and be specific - how is he so bad that you, who I assume has no interaction with the dude outside of what you parrot from hearing on the news or seeing on message boards (which are parroting what is said on the news) - just *know* he is a "terrible" human?

---

I'll play.

I'll start by saying that though I normally agree with aggie93 with respect to the election, Trump & DeSantis, I think he's out over his skis on this one, and blowing a nothingburger out of purportion unnecessarily. Sure, the media was going to run with the loose association, but they always were. That doesn't justify giving them the air to do so...

Now for the list. First, Trump isn't a terrible human. He's just flawed in a few egregious ways.

1. He's an insufferable narcissist. He takes personal credit for everything good that happens, and spin everything everything else as someone else's fault. Best President ever? Please. Even if he was, that's one of the things you don't say out loud. But he's not.
2. He demands unconditional loyalty. Loyalty is more important to him than principle. That's a dangerous worldview to have if you're POTUS.
3. Because of #2, he demonizes - and fires - any capable people who disagree with him. Even if they are competent and correct, he'll jettison them because they aren't "yes" people.
4. Also because of #2, his first criterion of who he surrounds himself will be "loyalty", not competence. As such, I fear what his cabinet will look like. And because of this inane litmus test, he's reduced the pool of candidates to work in his administration to a fraction of what it should be.
5. Trump has an irresistable urge to "punch back". As such, he is easily baited. He will find himself in unnecessary squabbles when he should have stayed above the fray and let surrogates fight personality battles. The media has - and will - take advantage of this flaw ad nauseum.

There's more, but these are the main things that concern me, and why I will vote for DeSantis in the Primary.

As you can see from the above, NOTHING in this list has ANYTHING to to with Epstein, plane trips, or young girls.

---

....and none of those make him a "terrible human being". Only someboy you don't like.

I'll give you a hint - pretty much every single successful business person, especially those who run massive corproations, fit under #1 and #2. And since everything else in your list is contingent upon #1 and #2, there are a whole lof of people you probably admire that are also "terrible people". I'll also argue agianst #3 - because you don't run a company and grow it in the manner he did by only having yes people around, you have to have the dissenting opinion or differing point of view to question things and force you to look at your plan from multiple angles. I think it's well documented that Trump actively listens to those around him, but ultimately makes the final decision himself. Which isn't all that unusual at all.

I'm still waiting for something that truly makes him this terrible, horrible, awful human being that you and 93 are parroting from whatever news site you listen to.

aggie93 said:

---

schmellba99 said:

---

aggie93 said:

---

Rockdoc said:

---

I'm sorry but this means nothing to anybody other the TDS crowd. And again, I'm voting for Desantis in the primary, but WILL vote for the (R) in the general.

---

So you think they will go after Clinton and ignore Trump's connection to Epstein because the press plays fair?

I am voting the same way I'm just not going to goaltend for Trump or allow him to live by his own rules anymore. If that means I have "TDS" so be it. Trump is a pretty terrible human, the only question is how terrible. I know he is not someone I want to vote for unless I have no other choice.

---

These comments always make me laugh - why don't you list the ways he is such a terrible human.

I'm not talking about getting some strange and divorcing his wife, because he's no different than half (or more) of married folk in that regard. I'm not talking about using existing law to mitigate losses on a few bankruptcies with companies that didn't pan out, because that happens to companies across the country every day of the week, even those mom and pop "really good people" companies.

Is he the second coming of Jesus Christ? Absolutely fuggin not - but - and be specific - how is he so bad that you, who I assume has no interaction with the dude outside of what you parrot from hearing on the news or seeing on message boards (which are parroting what is said on the news) - just *know* he is a "terrible" human?

---

Banging a porn star while your pregnant 3rd wife is at home makes you a terrible human. Trump also lies with ease and has never cared much about morality. Are there worse humans? No doubt, hell he is probably at least par as far as politicians go. BTW, I've been married 28 years and can't relate to saying that cheating on all 3 of your wives isn't a big deal. To me it just means you are an untrustworthy and selfish person, especially if it is done repeatedly and without remorse (I can at least understand how someone can make a mistake as we are all human). Trump flaunts it.

Trump has done some really good things as well. He's shown generosity with his money and I think he genuinely likes to help people. He gave a lot back to NYC and to Vets in particular. Still none of that really impacted his lifestyle or cost him anything and it doesn't erase the rest. I don't think Trump is some sociopath but he is definitely a narcissist and someone I would never, every trust.

Still I voted for the guy and I'll probably end up voting for him again, I'm just not going to say that he is anything but a terrible human though.

---

Why don't you just admit that you'll believe any single negative thing about the dude, no matter what, without even a second thought? And your disdain of a dude you've never met or interacted with has you so clouded that you have convinced yourself of all of these scenarios, regardless of anything?

An ex porn star that was broke made a claim. Easy to argue that she was looking for a way to cash in on something to get another payout. And simply because there was a payout doesn't equate to guilty - we see this all of the time across all forms of business, because it's faster and cheaper sometimes to just throw some cash at a problem and have it go away versus fighting a long drawn out battle in court that will cost orders of magnitude more.

BTW, you have disdain and hate every Founding Father, or at least the overwhelming majority of them. And most every single president, ever.

schmellba99 said:

---

jrdaustin said:

---

schmellba99 said:

---

aggie93 said:

---

Rockdoc said:

---

I'm sorry but this means nothing to anybody other the TDS crowd. And again, I'm voting for Desantis in the primary, but WILL vote for the (R) in the general.

---

So you think they will go after Clinton and ignore Trump's connection to Epstein because the press plays fair?

I am voting the same way I'm just not going to goaltend for Trump or allow him to live by his own rules anymore. If that means I have "TDS" so be it. Trump is a pretty terrible human, the only question is how terrible. I know he is not someone I want to vote for unless I have no other choice.

---

These comments always make me laugh - why don't you list the ways he is such a terrible human.

I'm not talking about getting some strange and divorcing his wife, because he's no different than half (or more) of married folk in that regard. I'm not talking about using existing law to mitigate losses on a few bankruptcies with companies that didn't pan out, because that happens to companies across the country every day of the week, even those mom and pop "really good people" companies.

Is he the second coming of Jesus Christ? Absolutely fuggin not - but - and be specific - how is he so bad that you, who I assume has no interaction with the dude outside of what you parrot from hearing on the news or seeing on message boards (which are parroting what is said on the news) - just *know* he is a "terrible" human?

---

I'll play.

I'll start by saying that though I normally agree with aggie93 with respect to the election, Trump & DeSantis, I think he's out over his skis on this one, and blowing a nothingburger out of purportion unnecessarily. Sure, the media was going to run with the loose association, but they always were. That doesn't justify giving them the air to do so...

Now for the list. First, Trump isn't a terrible human. He's just flawed in a few egregious ways.

1. He's an insufferable narcissist. He takes personal credit for everything good that happens, and spin everything everything else as someone else's fault. Best President ever? Please. Even if he was, that's one of the things you don't say out loud. But he's not.
2. He demands unconditional loyalty. Loyalty is more important to him than principle. That's a dangerous worldview to have if you're POTUS.
3. Because of #2, he demonizes - and fires - any capable people who disagree with him. Even if they are competent and correct, he'll jettison them because they aren't "yes" people.
4. Also because of #2, his first criterion of who he surrounds himself will be "loyalty", not competence. As such, I fear what his cabinet will look like. And because of this inane litmus test, he's reduced the pool of candidates to work in his administration to a fraction of what it should be.
5. Trump has an irresistable urge to "punch back". As such, he is easily baited. He will find himself in unnecessary squabbles when he should have stayed above the fray and let surrogates fight personality battles. The media has - and will - take advantage of this flaw ad nauseum.

There's more, but these are the main things that concern me, and why I will vote for DeSantis in the Primary.

As you can see from the above, NOTHING in this list has ANYTHING to to with Epstein, plane trips, or young girls.

---

....and none of those make him a "terrible human being". Only someboy you don't like.

I'll give you a hint - pretty much every single successful business person, especially those who run massive corproations, fit under #1 and #2. And since everything else in your list is contingent upon #1 and #2, there are a whole lof of people you probably admire that are also "terrible people". I'll also argue agianst #3 - because you don't run a company and grow it in the manner he did by only having yes people around, you have to have the dissenting opinion or differing point of view to question things and force you to look at your plan from multiple angles. I think it's well documented that Trump actively listens to those around him, but ultimately makes the final decision himself. Which isn't all that unusual at all.

I'm still waiting for something that truly makes him this terrible, horrible, awful human being that you and 93 are parroting from whatever news site you listen to.

---

Dude. Do you even read?

Look at the third paragraph. ONE SENTENCE!

I gave you an honest, good faith assesment of Trump and then you turn around and attack me? You're pretty pathetic. Great ambassador for Trump, tho.

jrdaustin said:

---

schmellba99 said:

---

jrdaustin said:

---

schmellba99 said:

---

aggie93 said:

---

Rockdoc said:

---

I'm sorry but this means nothing to anybody other the TDS crowd. And again, I'm voting for Desantis in the primary, but WILL vote for the (R) in the general.

---

So you think they will go after Clinton and ignore Trump's connection to Epstein because the press plays fair?

I am voting the same way I'm just not going to goaltend for Trump or allow him to live by his own rules anymore. If that means I have "TDS" so be it. Trump is a pretty terrible human, the only question is how terrible. I know he is not someone I want to vote for unless I have no other choice.

---

These comments always make me laugh - why don't you list the ways he is such a terrible human.

I'm not talking about getting some strange and divorcing his wife, because he's no different than half (or more) of married folk in that regard. I'm not talking about using existing law to mitigate losses on a few bankruptcies with companies that didn't pan out, because that happens to companies across the country every day of the week, even those mom and pop "really good people" companies.

Is he the second coming of Jesus Christ? Absolutely fuggin not - but - and be specific - how is he so bad that you, who I assume has no interaction with the dude outside of what you parrot from hearing on the news or seeing on message boards (which are parroting what is said on the news) - just *know* he is a "terrible" human?

---

I'll play.

I'll start by saying that though I normally agree with aggie93 with respect to the election, Trump & DeSantis, I think he's out over his skis on this one, and blowing a nothingburger out of purportion unnecessarily. Sure, the media was going to run with the loose association, but they always were. That doesn't justify giving them the air to do so...

Now for the list. First, Trump isn't a terrible human. He's just flawed in a few egregious ways.

1. He's an insufferable narcissist. He takes personal credit for everything good that happens, and spin everything everything else as someone else's fault. Best President ever? Please. Even if he was, that's one of the things you don't say out loud. But he's not.
2. He demands unconditional loyalty. Loyalty is more important to him than principle. That's a dangerous worldview to have if you're POTUS.
3. Because of #2, he demonizes - and fires - any capable people who disagree with him. Even if they are competent and correct, he'll jettison them because they aren't "yes" people.
4. Also because of #2, his first criterion of who he surrounds himself will be "loyalty", not competence. As such, I fear what his cabinet will look like. And because of this inane litmus test, he's reduced the pool of candidates to work in his administration to a fraction of what it should be.
5. Trump has an irresistable urge to "punch back". As such, he is easily baited. He will find himself in unnecessary squabbles when he should have stayed above the fray and let surrogates fight personality battles. The media has - and will - take advantage of this flaw ad nauseum.

There's more, but these are the main things that concern me, and why I will vote for DeSantis in the Primary.

As you can see from the above, NOTHING in this list has ANYTHING to to with Epstein, plane trips, or young girls.

---

....and none of those make him a "terrible human being". Only someboy you don't like.

I'll give you a hint - pretty much every single successful business person, especially those who run massive corproations, fit under #1 and #2. And since everything else in your list is contingent upon #1 and #2, there are a whole lof of people you probably admire that are also "terrible people". I'll also argue agianst #3 - because you don't run a company and grow it in the manner he did by only having yes people around, you have to have the dissenting opinion or differing point of view to question things and force you to look at your plan from multiple angles. I think it's well documented that Trump actively listens to those around him, but ultimately makes the final decision himself. Which isn't all that unusual at all.

I'm still waiting for something that truly makes him this terrible, horrible, awful human being that you and 93 are parroting from whatever news site you listen to.

---

Dude. Do you even read?

Look at the third paragraph. ONE SENTENCE!

And then you turn around and attack me? You're pretty pathetic. Great ambassador for Trump, tho.

---

I read extremely well - and you were specifically responding to my comment of "provide specific reasons why he is such a terrible human". Your little caveat doesn't make you immune from the fact that you listed all of the ways you think he's this terrible person.

Also - if that is "attacking you"...then you are a thin skined soy boy and I feel sorry for you.

For the record - I don't give a single sht whether Trump, Desantis or any other R ultimately get the nomination because none of them are perfect, all have significant issues that I'll disagree with, won't be anywhere close to militant enough for me on defending 2A and striking every single law off the books that restricts my right to own firearms or systematically dismantling the absolute corrupt institutions in Washington or work hard enough to reduce taxes, the financial issues we have as a country, actually make the feds secure our border, etc.

But even with all of the flaws I'll personally have with any of them - they all are better than anything the democrats will ever crap out on the podium, and I'm fine with that.

I just think the TDS that some folks have is beyond stupid, and it also is proof that the simple minded are easily swayed by what they hear and read, which is a very scary thought given our 24/7 news cycle and the overwhelming power of the media and group think.

jrdaustin said:

---

BluHorseShu said:

---

And if Trump couldn't control the DOJ, that's on him. Its under the executive branch. So either they didn't trust him, respect him, or just chose to continue operating as they had been.

---

Bookmarked. I don't want to hear a peep out of you when the next Republican chief executive cleans house in the DOJ.

---

I hope he does. But if its Trump and he doesn't, I expect you'll be back to say that Trump just can't get it done, yes?

Desantis could do it.

BluHorseShu said:

---

jrdaustin said:

---

BluHorseShu said:

---

And if Trump couldn't control the DOJ, that's on him. Its under the executive branch. So either they didn't trust him, respect him, or just chose to continue operating as they had been.

---

Bookmarked. I don't want to hear a peep out of you when the next Republican chief executive cleans house in the DOJ.

---

I hope he does. But if its Trump and he doesn't, I expect you'll be back to say that Trump just can't get it done, yes?

Desantis could do it.

---

You're damn right I will.

No Spin Ag said:

---

Foreverconservative said:

---

The guy in the middle is the convicted predator Joel Greenberg

---

Thanks. It's interesting to find out that he was friends with Gaetz.

Did he travel with DeSantis or spend time with him like Trump did with Epstein?

---

Neither he nor DeSantis own a plane so that question is kinda moot, but they were known associates for years, he was the jacksonville County Tax Assessor I believe and ran in the political crowds. If I remember right he was he was sentenced to 11 years in prison for a litany of crimes, including trafficking teenage girls. I think him and Gaetz may have been college buddies or roommates at one time.

But trying to loop Trump in with Epstein is pretty comical. Did they run in the same circles? Yes. Were they close friends? No. The ultra rich circles are pretty small. Epstein was pretty darn rich, I think the actual source of his wealth was in great question. Wexner's money, and/or high ends pedephile clientel that paid exuberant amounts of money to the sick SOB absolutely but it seems the basis for his wealth revolved around Les Wexner's weird self. Hard to see it any other way. Supposedly Epstein had full power of attorney over Wexner's billions.

schmellba99 said:

---

jrdaustin said:

---

schmellba99 said:

---

aggie93 said:

---

Rockdoc said:

---

I'm sorry but this means nothing to anybody other the TDS crowd. And again, I'm voting for Desantis in the primary, but WILL vote for the (R) in the general.

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So you think they will go after Clinton and ignore Trump's connection to Epstein because the press plays fair?

I am voting the same way I'm just not going to goaltend for Trump or allow him to live by his own rules anymore. If that means I have "TDS" so be it. Trump is a pretty terrible human, the only question is how terrible. I know he is not someone I want to vote for unless I have no other choice.

---

These comments always make me laugh - why don't you list the ways he is such a terrible human.

I'm not talking about getting some strange and divorcing his wife, because he's no different than half (or more) of married folk in that regard. I'm not talking about using existing law to mitigate losses on a few bankruptcies with companies that didn't pan out, because that happens to companies across the country every day of the week, even those mom and pop "really good people" companies.

Is he the second coming of Jesus Christ? Absolutely fuggin not - but - and be specific - how is he so bad that you, who I assume has no interaction with the dude outside of what you parrot from hearing on the news or seeing on message boards (which are parroting what is said on the news) - just *know* he is a "terrible" human?

---

I'll play.

I'll start by saying that though I normally agree with aggie93 with respect to the election, Trump & DeSantis, I think he's out over his skis on this one, and blowing a nothingburger out of purportion unnecessarily. Sure, the media was going to run with the loose association, but they always were. That doesn't justify giving them the air to do so...

Now for the list. First, Trump isn't a terrible human. He's just flawed in a few egregious ways.

1. He's an insufferable narcissist. He takes personal credit for everything good that happens, and spin everything everything else as someone else's fault. Best President ever? Please. Even if he was, that's one of the things you don't say out loud. But he's not.
2. He demands unconditional loyalty. Loyalty is more important to him than principle. That's a dangerous worldview to have if you're POTUS.
3. Because of #2, he demonizes - and fires - any capable people who disagree with him. Even if they are competent and correct, he'll jettison them because they aren't "yes" people.
4. Also because of #2, his first criterion of who he surrounds himself will be "loyalty", not competence. As such, I fear what his cabinet will look like. And because of this inane litmus test, he's reduced the pool of candidates to work in his administration to a fraction of what it should be.
5. Trump has an irresistable urge to "punch back". As such, he is easily baited. He will find himself in unnecessary squabbles when he should have stayed above the fray and let surrogates fight personality battles. The media has - and will - take advantage of this flaw ad nauseum.

There's more, but these are the main things that concern me, and why I will vote for DeSantis in the Primary.

As you can see from the above, NOTHING in this list has ANYTHING to to with Epstein, plane trips, or young girls.

---

....and none of those make him a "terrible human being". Only someboy you don't like.

I'll give you a hint - pretty much every single successful business person, especially those who run massive corproations, fit under #1 and #2. And since everything else in your list is contingent upon #1 and #2, there are a whole lof of people you probably admire that are also "terrible people". I'll also argue agianst #3 - because you don't run a company and grow it in the manner he did by only having yes people around, you have to have the dissenting opinion or differing point of view to question things and force you to look at your plan from multiple angles. I think it's well documented that Trump actively listens to those around him, but ultimately makes the final decision himself. Which isn't all that unusual at all.

I'm still waiting for something that truly makes him this terrible, horrible, awful human being that you and 93 are parroting from whatever news site you listen to.

---

You could look at it that way, or you could look at it the way it is also well documented...That Trump didn't listen and did what he wanted to do with disregard to more experienced advice. There is a long list of successful business people who don't demand unconditional loyalty and aren't inherently narcissistic to the detriment of their morality, their employees and the business. Some people seem completely comfortable looking past all of the red flags of his leadership to justify their continued support. History is fraught with leaders that went off the rails because people tried to overlook all of the red flags because they were convinced their guy wouldn't take advantage of their blind support.
At some point, a reasonable person has to stop saying 'Its everyone elses fault, not Trump'.
He may be a better option than Biden...but that doesn't mean we have to lie to ourselves about the warning signs.

schmellba99 said:

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jrdaustin said:

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schmellba99 said:

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jrdaustin said:

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schmellba99 said:

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aggie93 said:

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Rockdoc said:

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I'm sorry but this means nothing to anybody other the TDS crowd. And again, I'm voting for Desantis in the primary, but WILL vote for the (R) in the general.

---

So you think they will go after Clinton and ignore Trump's connection to Epstein because the press plays fair?

I am voting the same way I'm just not going to goaltend for Trump or allow him to live by his own rules anymore. If that means I have "TDS" so be it. Trump is a pretty terrible human, the only question is how terrible. I know he is not someone I want to vote for unless I have no other choice.

---

These comments always make me laugh - why don't you list the ways he is such a terrible human.

I'm not talking about getting some strange and divorcing his wife, because he's no different than half (or more) of married folk in that regard. I'm not talking about using existing law to mitigate losses on a few bankruptcies with companies that didn't pan out, because that happens to companies across the country every day of the week, even those mom and pop "really good people" companies.

Is he the second coming of Jesus Christ? Absolutely fuggin not - but - and be specific - how is he so bad that you, who I assume has no interaction with the dude outside of what you parrot from hearing on the news or seeing on message boards (which are parroting what is said on the news) - just *know* he is a "terrible" human?

---

I'll play.

I'll start by saying that though I normally agree with aggie93 with respect to the election, Trump & DeSantis, I think he's out over his skis on this one, and blowing a nothingburger out of purportion unnecessarily. Sure, the media was going to run with the loose association, but they always were. That doesn't justify giving them the air to do so...

Now for the list. First, Trump isn't a terrible human. He's just flawed in a few egregious ways.

1. He's an insufferable narcissist. He takes personal credit for everything good that happens, and spin everything everything else as someone else's fault. Best President ever? Please. Even if he was, that's one of the things you don't say out loud. But he's not.
2. He demands unconditional loyalty. Loyalty is more important to him than principle. That's a dangerous worldview to have if you're POTUS.
3. Because of #2, he demonizes - and fires - any capable people who disagree with him. Even if they are competent and correct, he'll jettison them because they aren't "yes" people.
4. Also because of #2, his first criterion of who he surrounds himself will be "loyalty", not competence. As such, I fear what his cabinet will look like. And because of this inane litmus test, he's reduced the pool of candidates to work in his administration to a fraction of what it should be.
5. Trump has an irresistable urge to "punch back". As such, he is easily baited. He will find himself in unnecessary squabbles when he should have stayed above the fray and let surrogates fight personality battles. The media has - and will - take advantage of this flaw ad nauseum.

There's more, but these are the main things that concern me, and why I will vote for DeSantis in the Primary.

As you can see from the above, NOTHING in this list has ANYTHING to to with Epstein, plane trips, or young girls.

---

....and none of those make him a "terrible human being". Only someboy you don't like.

I'll give you a hint - pretty much every single successful business person, especially those who run massive corproations, fit under #1 and #2. And since everything else in your list is contingent upon #1 and #2, there are a whole lof of people you probably admire that are also "terrible people". I'll also argue agianst #3 - because you don't run a company and grow it in the manner he did by only having yes people around, you have to have the dissenting opinion or differing point of view to question things and force you to look at your plan from multiple angles. I think it's well documented that Trump actively listens to those around him, but ultimately makes the final decision himself. Which isn't all that unusual at all.

I'm still waiting for something that truly makes him this terrible, horrible, awful human being that you and 93 are parroting from whatever news site you listen to.

---

Dude. Do you even read?

Look at the third paragraph. ONE SENTENCE!

And then you turn around and attack me? You're pretty pathetic. Great ambassador for Trump, tho.

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I read extremely well - and you were specifically responding to my comment of "provide specific reasons why he is such a terrible human". Your little caveat doesn't make you immune from the fact that you listed all of the ways you think he's this terrible person.

Also - if that is "attacking you"...then you are a thin skined soy boy and I feel sorry for you.

For the record - I don't give a single sht whether Trump, Desantis or any other R ultimately get the nomination because none of them are perfect, all have significant issues that I'll disagree with, won't be anywhere close to militant enough for me on defending 2A and striking every single law off the books that restricts my right to own firearms or systematically dismantling the absolute corrupt institutions in Washington or work hard enough to reduce taxes, the financial issues we have as a country, actually make the feds secure our border, etc.

But even with all of the flaws I'll personally have with any of them - they all are better than anything the democrats will ever crap out on the podium, and I'm fine with that.

I just think the TDS that some folks have is beyond stupid, and it also is proof that the simple minded are easily swayed by what they hear and read, which is a very scary thought given our 24/7 news cycle and the overwhelming power of the media and group think.

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Ahh! So it's either Trump is perfect, or he's a terrible human. Now I get it. And that little caveat you gave in your third paragraph doesn't mean you were asking about Trump in good faith, does it?

And for the record, doubling down on ad homs is your schtick, isn't it? No soy boy here, I simply called out your pathetic little tactic which you can't seem to resist throwing shade on anyone who doesn't agree with your take. You also like painting with an incredibly broad brush.

And also for the record, I stated who I'm voting for in the PRIMARY. But of course since you read extremely well, you've ignored that little fact so you could throw more shade.

Nice job, champ.

jejdag said:

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Was Biden ever on a flight there, or was there enough sniffing and groping opportunities elsewhere?

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All he had to do was hop in the shower

schmellba99 said:

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aggie93 said:

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schmellba99 said:

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aggie93 said:

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Rockdoc said:

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I'm sorry but this means nothing to anybody other the TDS crowd. And again, I'm voting for Desantis in the primary, but WILL vote for the (R) in the general.

---

So you think they will go after Clinton and ignore Trump's connection to Epstein because the press plays fair?

I am voting the same way I'm just not going to goaltend for Trump or allow him to live by his own rules anymore. If that means I have "TDS" so be it. Trump is a pretty terrible human, the only question is how terrible. I know he is not someone I want to vote for unless I have no other choice.

---

These comments always make me laugh - why don't you list the ways he is such a terrible human.

I'm not talking about getting some strange and divorcing his wife, because he's no different than half (or more) of married folk in that regard. I'm not talking about using existing law to mitigate losses on a few bankruptcies with companies that didn't pan out, because that happens to companies across the country every day of the week, even those mom and pop "really good people" companies.

Is he the second coming of Jesus Christ? Absolutely fuggin not - but - and be specific - how is he so bad that you, who I assume has no interaction with the dude outside of what you parrot from hearing on the news or seeing on message boards (which are parroting what is said on the news) - just *know* he is a "terrible" human?

---

Banging a porn star while your pregnant 3rd wife is at home makes you a terrible human. Trump also lies with ease and has never cared much about morality. Are there worse humans? No doubt, hell he is probably at least par as far as politicians go. BTW, I've been married 28 years and can't relate to saying that cheating on all 3 of your wives isn't a big deal. To me it just means you are an untrustworthy and selfish person, especially if it is done repeatedly and without remorse (I can at least understand how someone can make a mistake as we are all human). Trump flaunts it.

Trump has done some really good things as well. He's shown generosity with his money and I think he genuinely likes to help people. He gave a lot back to NYC and to Vets in particular. Still none of that really impacted his lifestyle or cost him anything and it doesn't erase the rest. I don't think Trump is some sociopath but he is definitely a narcissist and someone I would never, every trust.

Still I voted for the guy and I'll probably end up voting for him again, I'm just not going to say that he is anything but a terrible human though.

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Why don't you just admit that you'll believe any single negative thing about the dude, no matter what, without even a second thought? And your disdain of a dude you've never met or interacted with has you so clouded that you have convinced yourself of all of these scenarios, regardless of anything?

An ex porn star that was broke made a claim. Easy to argue that she was looking for a way to cash in on something to get another payout. And simply because there was a payout doesn't equate to guilty - we see this all of the time across all forms of business, because it's faster and cheaper sometimes to just throw some cash at a problem and have it go away versus fighting a long drawn out battle in court that will cost orders of magnitude more.

BTW, you have disdain and hate every Founding Father, or at least the overwhelming majority of them. And most every single president, ever.

---

Hold on, so you really believe Trump didn't sleep with Stormy? Lol. Well we do know based on the settlements that his first 2 marriages involved cheating on a pretty wide scale and Trump even jokes about how he cheats on his wives. There aren't many Trump supporters who actually think he isn't a horndog that has spent most of his life screwing hot women every chance he got but you be you.

I don't "hate" Trump I just recognize him for who he is. He has many strengths to go with his many weaknesses. I do love the Founding Father inference though, not sure where they hell that came from. Trump is not a moral or honest person and to his credit I suppose he is kind of lighthearted about it. Believe what you will I guess. I said "I" think he is a terrible human but if you are one of those folks that buys the "Trump is Jesus" books that's your call (those things are weird as hell btw).

You also aren't going to find me talking about how most politicians are virtuous. There are a few but very few. I do actually think DeSantis is one based on everything I have read and heard about him. Still I guess you never know. If he screws around on his pretty wife with those kids at home I'd think he is a terrible human as well, I just have no reason to think he does as he seems to spend every moment he can with them and he was known to be a guy that didn't like to even go to cocktail parties in DC or drinks with the guys, he slept at the office a lot and worked out a bunch. Then he left after 3 terms in large part because he missed being home with his wife and kids.

I've come to the conclusion that the TDS'rs don't have jobs. Is that right?

annie88 said:

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None of them went to the island. This was a man that many people were hanging around at that time including Dershowitz and others, and these flights are all between Newark, DC and Palm Beach. And many of them had members of his family and children on it with him. Many were same-day trips.

But to you that something bad?

We've known about all of these for a long time. This is not new news. It's not more flights than they always were.

You are getting really desperate.

---

Dershowitz was hanging out with Epstein too so it's cool

any proof of Trump abusing minors, like Clinton, he should burn with the rest of them...

As of now there is nothing, and I guarantee if there was a smidgen of Trump involved with minors it would be out by now.....

Plenty indicating Trump knew what was going on and did nothing. That's the best case scenario, and he should burn for that alone

GAC06 said:

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annie88 said:

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None of them went to the island. This was a man that many people were hanging around at that time including Dershowitz and others, and these flights are all between Newark, DC and Palm Beach. And many of them had members of his family and children on it with him. Many were same-day trips.

But to you that something bad?

We've known about all of these for a long time. This is not new news. It's not more flights than they always were.

You are getting really desperate.

---

Dershowitz was hanging out with Epstein too so it's cool

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He was his attorney for several years

Foreverconservative said:

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GAC06 said:

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annie88 said:

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None of them went to the island. This was a man that many people were hanging around at that time including Dershowitz and others, and these flights are all between Newark, DC and Palm Beach. And many of them had members of his family and children on it with him. Many were same-day trips.

But to you that something bad?

We've known about all of these for a long time. This is not new news. It's not more flights than they always were.

You are getting really desperate.

---

Dershowitz was hanging out with Epstein too so it's cool

---

He was his attorney for several years

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Whose attorney? Epstein? Trump? Yeah.

Raiderjay said:

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any proof of Trump abusing minors, like Clinton, he should burn with the rest of them...

As of now there is nothing, and I guarantee if there was a smidgen of Trump involved with minors it would be out by now.....

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If not, there was certainly a desire.

Trump reportedly said about Cohen's 15 year old daughter, "I want some of that."

And he talked about what it would be like to have sex with his own daughter. Some of his pictures with her hardly seem normal.



https://content.api.news/v3/images/bin/de2e802203ab201d0fedf0b9ee6c9fd1

LIke it or not, he's the complete package -- a total creep.

eric76 said:

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Raiderjay said:

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any proof of Trump abusing minors, like Clinton, he should burn with the rest of them...

As of now there is nothing, and I guarantee if there was a smidgen of Trump involved with minors it would be out by now.....

---

If not, there was certainly a desire.

Trump reportedly said about Cohen's 15 year old daughter, "I want some of that."

And he talked about what it would be like to have sex with his own daughter. Some of his pictures with her hardly seem normal.



https://content.api.news/v3/images/bin/de2e802203ab201d0fedf0b9ee6c9fd1

LIke it or not, he's the complete package -- a total creep.

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Seek help

GAC06 said:

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Plenty indicating Trump knew what was going on and did nothing. That's the best case scenario, and he should burn for that alone

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Got a link?

Why are you posting that picture?

Quote:

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If not, there was certainly a desire.

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LMFAO!!

These are the truly entertaining posts on this board. I mean, no proof, no facts, just pure TDS on display for us to laugh at.

If TDS allows you to realize this, Trump liked his side pieces around 20-25 years old. yea, young but well over the age of consent. Had you wanted to bash Trump with morals, there is certainly enough to go for.

But, no. TDS pushes one to claim that Trump "certainly had the desire' to abuse minors.

Classic!!!