So sorry man. Stupid that Docs would do this
Hydroxychloroquine...........
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Last: 11 mo ago by Jabin
Probably a few doctors who are writing dozens of scripts. This is fraud and malpractice. They need to be investigated.texaggie90 said:
My wife takes HydroxyChloroqine for Lupus and not a single pharmacy has any left now. We're scrambling trying to find it for management of her lupus.
Pharmacist told me everyone and their dog has been getting scripts from their docs to "have it on hand just in case."
Ridiculous.
Do people in India take this normally?
The way I heard it, Fauci clarified that there isn't a that big of difference between his position and the president's. There is hope that it works vs prove that it works. That's the fundamental difference between the two men. It's not that big of a divide. Currently, doctors around the country are using the drug in hospitals "off label" and it is showing promise.Fitch said:
This isn't intended to be a commentary on the President, but the press conference showed a clear divide between POTUS and the medical professionals in the room in terms of optimism and hedging on the efficacy of the drug.
It was reiterated that they don't have enough data to show if it's working or not, and that programs are being setup to collect data -- not saying that it is a silver bullet.
Supply is the big issue and that is being addressed as well.
#science #fuwuflu
culdeus said:
Do people in India take this normally?
My understanding was no. They don't. I don't believe they have the kind of disposable income nor the manufacturing to produce that amount of anti-malarial pills.
They all kind of gave me the shoulder shrug, Meg, when I asked about it.
People in India must have the immune system of a bat given the squalid and unsanitary conditions found there. I am not sure if malaria is a big issue in IndiaOl_Ag_02 said:culdeus said:
Do people in India take this normally?
My understanding was no. They don't. I don't believe they have the kind of disposable income nor the manufacturing to produce that amount of anti-malarial pills.
They all kind of gave me the shoulder shrug, Meg, when I asked about it.
What if you are allergic to z strips? I had an allergic reaction to erythromycin as an infant (at least that is what my mother has told me for years) and I've always avoided anything n the mycin family. Any alternatives for this treatment?
And pharmacists have every right not to fill those prescriptions.
Here is the interview with Dr. Grace from last night regarding the HCQ treatment (scroll down page of link):
https://www.independentsentinel.com/lennox-hill-has-no-deaths-from-the-virus-after-using-hydroxychloroquine/
https://www.independentsentinel.com/lennox-hill-has-no-deaths-from-the-virus-after-using-hydroxychloroquine/
Holy crap I never thought of that. Very interesting.longeryak said:
Explains why south of the equator malaria areas haven't been hit.
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perfectly fine with that, if they assume the liability from bad outcomes from not filling the RxMoxley said:
And pharmacists have every right not to fill those prescriptions.
No material on this site is intended to be a substitute for professional medical advice, diagnosis or treatment. See full Medical Disclaimer.
I know someone that got some yesterday and does not have any symptoms, still hasn't told me how they got it.Moxley said:Probably a few doctors who are writing dozens of scripts. This is fraud and malpractice. They need to be investigated.texaggie90 said:
My wife takes HydroxyChloroqine for Lupus and not a single pharmacy has any left now. We're scrambling trying to find it for management of her lupus.
Pharmacist told me everyone and their dog has been getting scripts from their docs to "have it on hand just in case."
Ridiculous.
Possibly. Correlation something something causation.KidDoc said:Holy crap I never thought of that. Very interesting.longeryak said:
Explains why south of the equator malaria areas haven't been hit.
Chloroquine and hydroxychloroquine are synthetic forms of quinine. Does anyone think cinchona bark extract, which contains quinine and other compounds known to have antimalarial effects, would have a similar prophylactic or antiviral effect as do the synthetic forms?
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azithromyacin and hydrochloroquine combo is supposedly what a lot of the lesser developed countries like Pakistan are using to combat this thing and its apparently working for them (for the time being). not sure how reliable their numbers are, or if there will be side effects/consequences down the road.
I'm curious about the math on the pills.
I think we have something like 6 million pills currently committed from a couple companies that are already in stock.
I'm assuming there is a standard mg size for the pills.
Is 30 pills per person a decent estimate of a course of treatment? Something like 4 a day for a week?
So we should have enough for 200,000 patients available within next 7-10 days or so as these pills rush their way thru distribution channels?
And one company says it has enough raw material to make 50,000,000 pills by end of the month, which I take to mean they will be rolling out pills for availability on a daily basis.
That would be enough to treat another almost 1.7m patients, and that's without input from any other sources.
We really should be able to start using this on the less serious cases in short order. IF this thing works even close to as well as hoped, and you combine with increased testing allowing you to start the regimen before it gets too severe, we could really get thing down to a much less scary, much more manageable level.
I think we have something like 6 million pills currently committed from a couple companies that are already in stock.
I'm assuming there is a standard mg size for the pills.
Is 30 pills per person a decent estimate of a course of treatment? Something like 4 a day for a week?
So we should have enough for 200,000 patients available within next 7-10 days or so as these pills rush their way thru distribution channels?
And one company says it has enough raw material to make 50,000,000 pills by end of the month, which I take to mean they will be rolling out pills for availability on a daily basis.
That would be enough to treat another almost 1.7m patients, and that's without input from any other sources.
We really should be able to start using this on the less serious cases in short order. IF this thing works even close to as well as hoped, and you combine with increased testing allowing you to start the regimen before it gets too severe, we could really get thing down to a much less scary, much more manageable level.
I pray that all of this comes true.
If this stuff works, isn't the real failure in this saga our lack of sufficient dosages of this on hand? I keep reading that other countries are already using it and it "seems" to work. How do we not already know one way or the other? And if there was any chance at all, why weren't we pumping this stuff out left and right to get ready for this potential scenario? Even if it went unused, it would have been far less costly than what we're seeing now.
Drinking a G&T right now. Stay healthy my friends!
Isn't there an additional quantity already spread to pharmacies today? Beyond the 6 million?
AgLiving06 said:
Isn't there an additional quantity already spread to pharmacies today? Beyond the 6 million?
Yes, but it sounds like that's being burned thru pretty quickly. You can definitely add a significant number of additional patients who can be treated from the already distributed stock to the total.
If my math checks, we're probably close to 2,000,000 who could be treated by this over the next month or so, without additional input of product from other sources.
I'm guessing the DOD has a big stockpile of maliaria drugs for one example, although I don't know if this one would be the favored drug or not.
In general the FDA strives to not approve any medication for any specified use without double blind placebo controlled trials. They are starting these but they take time and cases. These types of trials are generally what doctors accept as proof that something works. Claiming a certain treatment worked ome time on uncle Joe for whatever condition is not proof, it is an anecdote._mpaul said:
If this stuff works, isn't the real failure in this saga our lack of sufficient dosages of this on hand? I keep reading that other countries are already using it and it "seems" to work. How do we not already know one way or the other? And if there was any chance at all, why weren't we pumping this stuff out left and right to get ready for this potential scenario? Even if it went unused, it would have been far less costly than what we're seeing now.
No material on this site is intended to be a substitute for professional medical advice, diagnosis or treatment. See full Medical Disclaimer.
We will know very soon. There are currently 16 clinical trials being undertaken to address this issue, and all of them will undoubtedly be expedited to publication. I think the issue is that no one expected the president to get up on national TV and talk about specific, yet unproven treatments. Many also didn't expect doctors, dentists, and mid-levels to start hoarding this medication and inappropriately prescribing it prior to more substantial efficacy data being released. Mostly, no one was operating with any sort of foresight._mpaul said:
If this stuff works, isn't the real failure in this saga our lack of sufficient dosages of this on hand? I keep reading that other countries are already using it and it "seems" to work. How do we not already know one way or the other? And if there was any chance at all, why weren't we pumping this stuff out left and right to get ready for this potential scenario? Even if it went unused, it would have been far less costly than what we're seeing now.
The lack of foresight is why we now have hospitals (including my own) running out of PPE for healthcare workers, running low on viral swabs (yep, we have literally started running out of swabs and are now being reserved for patients being admitted), and now a national shortage of plaquenil. Everyone is looking out for themselves rather than considering the consequences of their actions. I guess it is human nature, but unfortunate, nonetheless.
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Marcus, thanks for the original post to create worthwhile discussion. Good to luck to you and the others with direct exposure at this point. I had already indicated to my colleagues several days back that should we turn Covid -positive then plaquenil was they way to go. The French data is very promising and we have updated our recommendation to include zithromax. Absolutely no reason to prescribe for prophylaxis at this point. If there was an abundance of meds in the near future due to serious ramp of up production then a 2 pronged attack on treatment and prevention could occur if there was more positive data on prophylaxis.
This pandemic is making days feel like weeks with it's rapid evolution and identification. Hopefully resources are directed to our colleagues in NY and other burdened sites. Randomized control trials (RCT) are nice but the race to stem the tide is on. Fortunately one treatment plan involves long standing generic approved meds with known profiles. That is a lucky break if the response to the regimen continues. It would be another thing with newly developed or unknown meds. Other potential options for treatment are fascinating. Hopefully multiple strategies evolve.
Stay healthy!
This pandemic is making days feel like weeks with it's rapid evolution and identification. Hopefully resources are directed to our colleagues in NY and other burdened sites. Randomized control trials (RCT) are nice but the race to stem the tide is on. Fortunately one treatment plan involves long standing generic approved meds with known profiles. That is a lucky break if the response to the regimen continues. It would be another thing with newly developed or unknown meds. Other potential options for treatment are fascinating. Hopefully multiple strategies evolve.
Stay healthy!
No material on this site is intended to be a substitute for professional medical advice, diagnosis or treatment. See full Medical Disclaimer.
What dentist would actually prescribe this medication and for what purpose? I am a dentist and have never had a reason to prescribe this. Unless you know of specific dentist doing this, might want to keep them out of the conversation. if they are, I believe that is wrong.
The French data is actually pretty concerning, and also terrible data. They excluded 4 patients as "lost to follow up" in a treatment arm of 24 people who either died or were admitted to the ICU. In most trials you typically don't exclude patients that get worse. Compared with their control group that had no deaths or ICU admissions. It is a terrible study; however, so you can't make much out of it either way.Quote:
The French data is very promising and we have updated our recommendation to include zithromax.
No material on this site is intended to be a substitute for professional medical advice, diagnosis or treatment. See full Medical Disclaimer.
Well piss in my cherios, dr not drDr. Not Yet Dr. Ag said:The French data is actually pretty concerning, and also terrible data. They excluded 4 patients as "lost to follow up" in a treatment arm of 24 people who either died or were admitted to the ICU. In most trials you typically don't exclude patients that get worse. Compared with their control group that had no deaths or ICU admissions. It is a terrible study; however, so you can't make much out of it either way.Quote:
The French data is very promising and we have updated our recommendation to include zithromax.
This is per a pharmacist friend of mine who has had to deny numerous requests for the limited supply they have left. She states pharmacies around the community are getting rx's for this from people with no business prescribing this medication who are prescribing to themselves as well as family despite being asymptomatic or not having a positive test.
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The strength and weakness of our system is the same, the FDA. We want US data to confirm what others have hypothesized. The US is fortunate that we are at the back end of this thing as we can draw info from other's experience. (I suspect the China travel ban did indeed confer a level of flattening the curve. ) Being Country #1 adds the complexity of the complete unknown.
I truly feel for Italy. Overwhelming numbers of patients with the inability to deal with them. That is a complete war zone. God Bless them.
I truly feel for Italy. Overwhelming numbers of patients with the inability to deal with them. That is a complete war zone. God Bless them.
No material on this site is intended to be a substitute for professional medical advice, diagnosis or treatment. See full Medical Disclaimer.
Doctors are currently prescribing this to confirmed patients.
Sorry,, prescribing what? HCQ and zithromax?barnyard1996 said:
Doctors are currently prescribing this to confirmed patients.
Doctors on the forum: if we had unlimited HCQ would this entire pandemic be neutralized ? I mean in the sense of shutting down the global economy
JP_Losman said:
Doctors on the forum: if we had unlimited HCQ would this entire pandemic be neutralized ? I mean in the sense of shutting down the global economy
It's clearly way too early to conclude that definitively.
I am not a doctor, but in daily contact with a couple good dr friends on the ground. One in Conroe said HCQ wiith Azithromycin. One in the Houston Med Center said HCQ with Ribovirin.2wealfth Man said:Sorry,, prescribing what? HCQ and zithromax?barnyard1996 said:
Doctors are currently prescribing this to confirmed patients.
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