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Stock Markets - Swing and Longer Term Trades

162,415 Views | 930 Replies | Last: 2 mo ago by Bob Knights Paper Hands
KT 90
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AG
Quote:

I tend to like the so called leaders of sectors that are set up to outperform instead of going the sector ETF route which has burned me in the past (limited upside while still being volatile to the downside).

And this is pretty interesting.... would be an argument against something like BETZ that people have been getting into lately.

WGann3
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AG
Yeah DIS is of huge long term interest for me but I'm waiting to see if it gets annihilated before I scoop it up.
Brian Earl Spilner
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AG
LUV is unexpectedly trending up. Can't make sense of that.
Bob Knights Paper Hands
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Similar looking to BA, DAL, and UAL. All gap down to open but have been moving up the last 30 minutes.

AAL has looked a little different but may be heading back towards yesterday's close as well. Still scared of that one long term.
Tumble Weed
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ToddyHill said:

Bought AAPL as my only investment in 2007. Held it till 2020.

Liquidated a portion of my AAPL in 2017 and bought NVDA.

Liquidated everything in late January 2020 when I thought the pandemic would disrupt the stock markets.

I'm now back in, but have taken a more conservative approach....

Between my wife and I we own...

AAPL (I'll hold this forever)
NVDA (ditto)
MU (probably my most frustrating stock)
COOP (diamond in the rough)
OXY (wondering if this was a right play)
EDP (dividend play)
MMP (dividend play)
TJX (wife loves this place)
TSCO (daughter works at their corporate office)
LUV (while I'm not endeared to the airlines, I think these guys will make it)

10% of our holdings are in cash.

By the way, I'm 63, and am struggling with going conservative as I get closer to retirement. Had I been in AAPL 100% today I would have made a killing.

I don't do penny stocks, options, am not in Robinhood, and don't gamble on stocks (though I guess I do speculate)

By the way, great thread.
Glad that you posted your age.

Investing is easy for me in my 40s. In my 60s and beyond there will be a lot higher pucker factor.
59 South
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AG
Airlines in general don't get me very excited. I compare them to grocery stores. I've tried most of them out and never that impressed with any of them. They're necessary to modern life but operate on tight margins and don't ever seem to innovate.

LUV is kinda the exception much like HEB. The best of a poor pack?
Whitehouse Road
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AG
I think people just see the opportunity to buy them down here and wait for them to bounce back. Most everything else has already bounced.

I agree though I would only buy LUV. Ifit dips back down into the 20s I wouldn't mind holding it a few years. Not something I would keep once it bounces back I think.
AgDad77
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AG
So - If i haven't entered AMD yet what would be a good entry?
Brian Earl Spilner
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Picked up a few more shares of DIS @ $109.50.
59 South
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AG
AgDad77 said:

So - If i haven't entered AMD yet what would be a good entry?
51 is/was an interesting level but has to hold today. Pretty messy chart at the moment. Ascending triangle has broken and turned into a Darvas box (hopefully) with 50 as support. Could be a good entry there. But if that breaks, it's got some major room to the downside probably down around 200 EMA around 45-46. If it doesn't bounce back above 53-54 soon I've got some decisions to make.

It's been fairly predictable lately with clear channels setting up on the 1 hour chart so we need to see where the next channel forms. Once 54 was lost yesterday, it tried to set one up around 52.25 but failed today and is still trending down. Maybe 51 becomes support. I'd sit tight for now. That's what I'm doing before deciding whether to sell at a loss or double down to lower my cost average on a bounce back.

The next levels of support I have on it right now are 50, 47, 42, 40, 38....

ETA looks like a tight 51-52 channel may be trying to set up.
Tumble Weed
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Cashed out my TQQQ today. Man that thing has been a roller coaster! Ended up losing 15%. Expensive lesson to learn.

59 South
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AG
I just had to get cute and open up that AMD position. Should have bought WKHS at $6 instead! Geez.

All my other holdings are green today and showing relative strength with no sell triggers even coming close (SQ >>100 - wow, JD >60, NIO & ROKU absorbing massive recent breakouts well...)

Come on JD. If it reclaims 61, I'll be very confident in getting my $65 planned full exit.
59 South
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AG
Tumble Weed said:


Glad that you posted your age.

Investing is easy for me in my 40s. In my 60s and beyond there will be a lot higher pucker factor.
This. I'm 39. My pucker factor would be high right now with my exposure. I learned a lot just holding 401k through 2008-2009. In hindsight I should have sold plasma to put in the market back then. Instead I invested in Miller Lites.
Swollen Thumb
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59South, appreciate your contributions to this thread!

So these are some COVID impacted stocks I've been watching as potential value plays long-ish term, but have held off waiting for the other shoe to drop (something about trying to catch the falling knife). That hasn't really happened to a large degree, so wondering if this current dip on second wave Covid fears is a good time to enter.

Travel/Hospitality:
LUV
WYNN
LVS
DIS

Energy:
RDS
DRIP

Retail & REITs: Staying away from right now.

Also want to get into the following tech stocks but missed the recent run-ups although believe they have staying power long term as part of the WFH trend. Been waiting on a good dip to enter which hasn't come, so think I might just have to jump in with a long term view:
WDAY
DOCU
TDOC
ZS

Anyone have others they are considering along these lines or have thoughts on entry into those above?


Chef Elko
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Where should I learn about pricing/timing/strategies with LEAPs. I'm younger and push as much of my paycheck into the market I can. Biggest thing I see is liquidity and lately volatility is increasing. Any advice helps!
cottonpicker
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Looks like you have a chance at wkhs if you want. I'm watching but have not pulled trigger
Swollen Thumb
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Went ahead and bit on SQ and TDOC. Wish I would have done so 2 months ago when I started looking at them (or two-3 weeks ago on the slight pull back), but been wanting them for long term so said screw it. TDOC below 200 and SQ at 104. These will be 1+ year holds and I'd probably add if they see any significant dip.
59 South
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AG
Virtual fist bump. SQ to tha moooooon!
Johnny Danger
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ETF's
VUG
SCHD
VBIAX
Stocks
VRTX
NVDA
DG


59 South
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I'm off today and have a little free time so here's my take on AMD, why I entered and why I will be patient with it as long as it doesn't break and stay below 50. A flash on 50 would give me the opportunity to potentially double down for a quick bounce sell back to 52-54 to lower my position cost basis down to 50-52.

Weekly chart back to 2016. It has stayed on a clear trend up with quick rises where it breaks out and doubles and then goes sideways for a while. It was going to 75 before Covid hit and reset every technical for just about every stock out there. This sideways step with cup and handle has now given it room to 100 magnet with double from 50 this time. My target will be 80-100 if it breaks out to 60+. When these multi year trends set up, it is critical to buy with confidence when the bottom trend line is touched and sell with confidence when the upper trend line is touched. It's at a bit of a crossroads right now being exactly mid channel. I think it's pretty binary from here. It either explodes to double (see 2016 & 2018) or it drifts sideways range bound ~40-50 until it eventually hits the lower trend line (see 2017 into early 2018) On longer term charts, I like weekly or monthly on log scale:



Daily chart. It had a clear rising wedge that got tight with support around 54 which was confirmed by a tight hourly channel. That's why I entered. That rising wedge was broken to the downside and now a Darvas box is in play in purple. Bottom purple line is 51 with the flash down support level in yellow at 50. Look how it handled 51 yesterday (hourly chart next will show this better). It is clear that if 50 is lost, it will likely go sideways for longer before it has a chance of breaking to the upside. That could be a while. So if 50 is clearly lost, I sit tight and wait for a bounce back to 50 to sell out and take my ~7.5% loss. I would be ok with that in the long run because risking 7.5% is well worth the risk of a target 50-100% gain. If you do this enough times, you don't even have to bat anywhere close to .500 to win bigly in the long run. Hell you don't even have to bat .300 to outperform the market (no offense to you buy and forget index fund investors; this isn't for everyone and takes a lot of time and effort).

Almost every time a level like 50 (notice the big round number) is clearly broken, it will reverse back test it before drifting lower. There are traders out there who prey on stop loss raids and play the bounce back for a nice quick profit. So that's why I don't set a stop loss at 49 or 48 or 47. It could collapse fast, flash down to 47 and whip back to 50. That's when you get out. Note that if I play a $2-4 double down to lower cost basis down near 50 before it is broken, I basically get away with a failed trade with minimal or no loss.



Hourly chart. Look at all those channels. See how 54 set up as major support for several days? If macro would have carried on without the big dip a couple days ago, this would have likely broken up instead of down. 54 would have become 56 which would have become 57.50 quick and knocking on the door of a major breakout. 54 would have been the perfect entry.



This might be too many words so feel free to TLDR me but it summarizes how I approach the longer term trades. Long term weekly/monthly trends, daily set ups, hourly for entries. One good thing about hourly is that it filters the noise out that you see in 1 and 5 minute charts. Those shorter term charts can be useful though when entering and exiting to get a little better prices, but that's another discussion. On longer term trades like this, it's not about nailing entries perfectly. It's about patience, confident entries & exits, knowing the trends & levels and never panic selling.
Tumble Weed
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I implemented 10% trailing stops on my largest holdings. This is a new strategy for me, I have always been more "Hold on for dear life!".

If FB hits 220.66 today, it will hit my stop loss and will sell.

Anyone else use trailing stop loss % on long term holdings?

ETA: it stopped out on me. I sold 100%. I will take the profits and redeploy elsewhere.
Swollen Thumb
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AG
59, definitely not TLDR. Really appreciate you taking the time to lay out the thought process which charts ,etc in the context of longer-term entries and trades. Very interesting. I've always leaned on fundamentals and macro/micro economic trends to find opportunities because that is what I know, but I'm not too experienced with the in depth technical analysis which seems to be largely driving things at the moment. So having some insight on that is extremely helpful and much appreciated!
Swollen Thumb
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AG
Tumble Weed said:

I implemented 10% trailing stops on my largest holdings. This is a new strategy for me, I have always been more "Hold on for dear life!".

If FB hits 220.66 today, it will hit my stop loss and will sell.

Anyone else use trailing stop loss % on long term holdings?

ETA: it stopped out on me. I sold 100%. I will take the profits and redeploy elsewhere.

I've gotten screwed on stop losses several times and so very seldom use them when the market is as volatile as it is currently. My main issue when things get this volatile is how much a stock can move after hours on any little piece of news leading to a large gap down where you end up getting stopped out at market open at a price well below your target, only to see it recover almost immediately back to or above your target. I think MM sometimes do this on purpose to get over on retail investors as 59 describes above.

During calmer times, I might take more of a set it and forget it approach and rely more on stop losses. But right now I'm following things daily so don't see the upside in setting stops.
PA24
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AG
Workhorse is a workhorse!
WGann3
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AG
NKE (obligatory just do it comment) is having itself a day after those Q4 earnings reports.
PA24
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AG
SQ

Killing it

Good call 59

Swollen Thumb
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AG
Ubitag said:

SQ

Killing it

Good call 59


No doubt. That and FSLY are the only green for me today. Tech holding up pretty well overall though vs the broader market.
59 South
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AG
Glad y'all liked that SQ and WKHS. That SQ chart is just freaking loaded from a technical perspective.

I'll try to find some time to post some longer term charts and thoughts this weekend. JD, AMZN, SQ, ROKU....
59 South
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On AMD... is that 51 support strong or what? If you want in long term that's a low risk entry right now. Could it fail? Of course it could! Nobody is always right. Don't ever ever listen to stock advice in absolutes.
Jet Black
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Should have jumped on WKHS at 8.
59 South
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Same. But change 8 to 6 or even 3 that I considered at one point or another. Still have never owned.
WGann3
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59 South said:

On AMD... is that 51 support strong or what? If you want in long term that's a low risk entry right now. Could it fail? Of course it could! Nobody is always right. Don't ever ever listen to stock advice in absolutes.
I averaged down to $53 today, feeling good about it.

Thanks for sharing everything you've shared on this thread already, very helpful.
YouBet
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AG
Several funds across multiple channels:

  • 401k covers the vast amount of our holdings for your normal fund types: large cap, international, etc. Heavily represented by Vanguard but they have no ticker symbols since they are custom funds for our 401k. Frustrating for tracking.
  • Roth IRAs - REITs and other ETFs.
  • HSA has its own unique fund choices but are basic index types so fund picks there are in line with fund types in 401k to fill those buckets.
  • Taxable account contains fund types I can't get in my 401k like tax free muni bond and other alternatives.

On the stock front, we only have 1-2% of total portfolio in individuals stocks. All of these have been long-term holdings. I will occasionally buy more in a very down market (recently bought more XOM), but largely I don't mess with them.

  • XOM
  • WMT
  • MMP
  • PLUG - my most interesting stock; I first purchased this almost 20 years ago when the hydrogen fuel cell craze first starting getting some talk. My original foray into this was actually a different company that PLUG bought out; don't even remember what it was. My cost basis on this is about $0.50/share with 500 shares and it's currently floating around $6.75.

RightWingConspirator
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I'm in, although don't pay much attention to charts. Here are my long term holds:

XLE (etf)
EOG
COP
PXD
CRWD
TTD
ZNGA
MTCH
WEX
AMZN
MSFT
MA
"But it is easier to purchase products that denote superiority than to be actually superior in economic achievement." - Thomas J. Stanley
59 South
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AG
That was one heck of a bizarre last 15 minutes for AMD. Monday should shed some light.
 
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