Waffledynamics said:
Deputy Travis Junior said:
Waffledynamics said:
I do want it to end.
I want Ukraine armed more, allowing them to mount some serious offensives, take back major swaths of territory, and then force Russia to give up the South and/or most of the Donbas that it's taken since 2022. At minimum.
I want to see Ukraine either in NATO or with Western security guarantees backed by peacekeeping troops in place.
I would love to see Putin dead, but his seat in hell just has to warm up longer, unfortunately.
My man, these simply aren't realistic goals. Those major swaths of territory are currently full of hundreds of thousands (maybe even a million?) Russian troops. That's not the sort of obstacle you can dislodge with anything short of a HUGE weapons transfer (on another level from what we've done so far) or NATO troops.
This invasion was evil and the way they've conducted it (specifically their intentional targeting of civilians) has been even more evil, but reality on the ground is that those areas are now Russian territory. That's not changing unless we take our involvement to another level, and there isn't a good reason for us to do that. So best case scenario is to stop the death in a way that doesn't hamstring Ukraine too much. That will require Ukraine to acknowledge reality (those areas are now Russian) and also to give Putin something he can sell as a victory at home.
I expressed my desires. Realistic or not, it's what I want to see. I think we can and should do more. Ukraine has been hampered by propaganda curtailing its Western support when they clearly have shown they are willing to fight for their land. Meanwhile, everyone is fine with Russia finding every advantage they can. It's been utterly bizarre seeing sentiments supportive or at least accepting of brutal Russia repression of stolen territory. The other concern is that a less than just peace will result in an emboldened Russia taking another attempt in the next 5-10 years, and an emboldened China will know the U.S. is not serious about supporting its allies.
These countries know and understand they can wait out democracies by embedding their agendas into public discourse. I find that to be a major issue that can only be solved by defeating them so soundly that they are crippled.
Rotarians know the drill.
Concerning aid to Ukraine and that that investment did not pay well:
1. Is it the truth?
2. Was it fair to all concerned (on the US/NATO side)
3. Did it bring goodwill and better friendship between allies and the people of Ukraine?
4. Was it beneficial to all concerned?
My score:
Truth meter was less than 50%. Suspected grift everywhere!
Fairness - U.S. paid a ton of money and for what?
Goodwill - When we questioned the continuous flow of money for arms we were told by Zelenshyy himself that we didn't provide enough. I doubt any European leader gave two farts either, as long as they didn't share the brunt of the aid. What about the Orthodox Church in Ukraine?
Beneficial - Biden was incapable of ushering in peace at the beginning. In fact, from what I've learned, Biden shunned peace talks. Meanwhile 7 million Ukrainians fled the country and the rest of war fighting age were conscripted to the tune of 500-750k dead. The Ukrainians have to fight a meat grinder that is slowing consuming the eastern parts of its country.
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