And I will dismiss the controversy as silly every time someone brings it up.

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And I fully am still as prideful of our WS win as I was in 2017.

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It's your right to look as foolish as you want to look.

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And I will dismiss the controversy as silly every time someone brings it up.

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You're welcome to do that. Judging the reaction so far, not many in the baseball community will follow you, though.

Texaggie7nine said:

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And I fully am still as prideful of our WS win as I was in 2017.

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Translation: The end justifies the means.

Because everyone was openly doing it, and the league knew about it, and didn't care.

You're probably right that the cameras didn't matter much. But what if it did make a significant difference? What if the cameras were they key to victory? Would you still feel the same?

Just trying to find out what level of cheating you're comfortable with.

BMX Bandit said:

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TxAgPreacher said:

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No the ends dont justify the means, but the cameras had little to no impact on the game. About as much as a stupid deflated football.

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Then why do it?

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A lot of people do a lot of things that may not make sense. Especially in hindsight.

TxAgPreacher said:

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the cameras had little to no impact on the game

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False.

Astro's batting average at home (when using the cameras) was twice what it was on the road (without the cameras).

https://www.barstoolsports.com/blog/1505551/the-houston-astros-homeroad-splits-during-the-2017-postseason-are-laugh-out-loud-funny-and-you-might-need-to-take-away-their-title

I'm not comfortable with any cheating, but I don't consider what the Astros did as any different than what every team does by watching the game live, and trying to steal signals the normal way.

You have no clue if that's true or not!

Astros at Home (MLB Rank)
Record: 48-33
BA: .279 (3rd)
OBP: .340 (11th)
SLG: .472 (4th)
HR: 115 (9th)

Astros on the Road
Record: 53-28
BA: .284 (1st)
OBP: .351 (1st)
SLG: .483 (1st)
Runs: 501 (1st)
HR: 123 (1st)

Zooming in to a small sample of games doesn't prove your point. Your statistics are misleading.

Yes I do. No matter how you watch the signals they are the same and you have to crack the code. Think it through and you'll realize that every team has staff dedicated to watching the catchers signs. If you don't know that you're naive.

This statistically doesn't matter. Can't prove it did not help them.

It's not worth arguing against the blind arguers.

Chipotlemonger said:

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This statistically doesn't matter. Can't prove it did not help them.

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Nor can you prove it did. That's the whole issue at hand.

There is no "proof" that it helped, only assumptions.

"Can't prove it helped so it doesn't matter that they cheated" is the weakest argument

Those are very common stats, and some players go through slumps over short periods of time. Zoom out and you'll see the Astros had better percentages on the year on the road, and the players not listed there probably did during the series too. You proved nothing but your bias.

Oh because you're so holy... I'm just pointing out the hypocrisy of people blaming the Astros and not realizing it's a league wide thing. I didn't cheat. I'm just saying it's silly to be handwringing over something that didn't affect the game.

In regards to the 2017 playoffs, have they said how they were allegedly relaying signs from the dugout? The stadium would have certainly been too loud to do it with the trash cans, right? Also there would have been much more scrutiny. I was under the assumption this happened mostly in the regular season.

Every team in baseball cheats by stealing signs , the Astros and Red Sox took to another level.

I disagree. Think about it. How much faster they could crack the code than they could with traditional methods, or by using the same kind of tech everyone else uses with their ipads in the dugout? Not at all. It's silly to think this had an impact.

Chipotlemonger said:

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"Can't prove it helped so it doesn't matter that they cheated" is the weakest argument

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No where did I say I agree with what they did. But keep grasping at straws.

Except, you know, for the fact that they won. The inviesigation said it didn't effect the series and would not strip them of the title.

TxAgPreacher said:

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Oh because you're so holy... I'm just pointing out the hypocrisy of people blaming the Astros and not realizing it's a league wide thing. I didn't cheat. I'm just saying it's silly to be handwringing over something that didn't affect the game.

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If it didn't affect games, why the phauck did they do it for 180 games? People post hard data to support the accusation that it absolutely helped (plus, you know...they f'ing won the WS) and the only responses you can ever muster are "lol everyone else is doing it anyway" and "didn't affect the games...because I say so."

We answered this many times They had a better stats on the road. Ultimately they quit doing it because it proved to be a distraction, and found that it didnt help. They did it to keep a competitive advantage, because most teams were doing the same thing. They just haven't been snitched on to the same degree. It was obviously a mistake, but everyone acting like this is a big deal are just like people getting mad at deflate gate.

Here is the hard data:
Astros at Home (MLB Rank)
Record: 48-33
BA: .279 (3rd)
OBP: .340 (11th)
SLG: .472 (4th)
HR: 115 (9th)

Astros on the Road
Record: 53-28
BA: .284 (1st)
OBP: .351 (1st)
SLG: .483 (1st)
Runs: 501 (1st)
HR: 123 (1st)

Here are the facts:
1) Those road stats are RIDICULOUSLY GOOD. Has to be among the best of all time
2) It CLEARLY didn't help them win very many (if any) games
3) If anyone disagrees with #2, I'd ask them how they were so successful on the road if they needed to cheat to win at home