While I am not at all surprised by the story, I applaud the OP for at least attempting to take a stealership to task. Most people don't have the time, money, and/or energy to fight these sleezebuckets.
Car dealerships REALLY suck.
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Last: 2 yr ago by aggiedata
Rendered Fat said:NTXAg10 said:
It's an error to think this suit will hit their pocketbook. The suit will be turned into their insurance company who will foot the defense(under a reservation of rights) and ultimately any settlement reached.
This sort of thing is already priced into underwriting models so it's just another blip on the radar for the dealership. I say this as someone who has handled the claims for the carrier and who is now an underwriter.
You'll do more damage getting after their reputation on any website you can leave a review. Post the text chain. Hit them on social media. Use your education and make an emotional argument to the public for why no one should buy cars from people who screw over old people.
I know it sounds stupid, but I almost want to try and plead OUT of coverage so they can't just turn it over to the carrier and be done with it. This has nothing to do with money anyway. I'm going to draft the DTPA letter this morning and see how it goes. Looks like John Masten ("Beck and Masten") is the registered agent so hopefully I'll at least get his attention.
Carriers are extremely scared about bad faith allegations so you may have to get creative.
aggiedata said:Naveronski said:
I'm skeptical if "she" even exists, or if it's a shell account used by several employees to market the dealership, and that's why you couldn't speak with her.
I found her!
That's Barbara from Bangladeshi!
Oh we're definitely interested...
Didn't read the entire thread but there's a reason my go-to dealer is Sewell. Also purchased a couple from CarMax.
I know a guy who bought a used Jeep this weekend and today he got a call from the dealership and they told him he was undercharged by $3400, but they would "make it right" with him if he came in to pay an additional $1700. He obviously told them tough luck.
Might be the most unbelievable story I've ever heard about a car dealership, but I heard this first hand from somebody who hasn't lied to me in the 30+ years I've known him.
Might be the most unbelievable story I've ever heard about a car dealership, but I heard this first hand from somebody who hasn't lied to me in the 30+ years I've known him.
Rendered Fat said:
DTPA notice letter was mailed today via certified and regular mail. I'll keep y'all posted if anyone is interested in how this turns out. Thanks for all of the comments on this.
IN
OP didn't do anything wrong because he was coming for a specific vehicle they lied about having on the lot.
As for me in this house and car market insanity, reading up, especially the 4Runner Reddit, I'm really glad we got mine for the price and timing we did last month. Called the dealer at 5 and was signing at 6. It's nuts.
OP didn't do anything wrong because he was coming for a specific vehicle they lied about having on the lot.
As for me in this house and car market insanity, reading up, especially the 4Runner Reddit, I'm really glad we got mine for the price and timing we did last month. Called the dealer at 5 and was signing at 6. It's nuts.
Generally speaking I don't think anyone here is goaltending for dealerships. We all know 95% of them suck. After reading your text exchange, it just seemed "too easy" like maybe some of us are more surprised at the blind trust you had in them, more so than we're surprised at the dealer lying. if that makes sense.
One thing I did when I bought my Silverado in late 2019 was I asked for a pic, by text, of the door GVWR sticker. It was to verify payload, but also to prove he had it.
Good luck with your efforts.
One thing I did when I bought my Silverado in late 2019 was I asked for a pic, by text, of the door GVWR sticker. It was to verify payload, but also to prove he had it.
Good luck with your efforts.
thread status: bookmarked
If the seller actually has the vehicle and collects the earnest money; this is an easy contract to sign. The contract puts the burden on the buyer to complete the sale. If the buyer does not complete the sale, the earnest money is kept by the seller. The key here is earnest money at risk.Rustys-Beef-o-Reeno said:
If I'm a seller there is no way I'm agreeing to that contract.
Probably was not clear that the earnest money is part of the sales price, not an option to buy.
If the seller does not have the vehicle, they never sign the contract; thus don't have to waste any more time.
I've done this a few times without any issues.
TxAggieBand85 said:If the seller actually has the vehicle and collects the earnest money; this is an easy contract to sign. The contract puts the burden on the buyer to complete the sale. If the buyer does not complete the sale, the earnest money is kept by the seller. The key here is earnest money at risk.Rustys-Beef-o-Reeno said:
If I'm a seller there is no way I'm agreeing to that contract.
Probably was not clear that the earnest money is part of the sales price, not an option to buy.
If the seller does not have the vehicle, they never sign the contract; thus don't have to waste any more time.
I've done this a few times without any issues.
Yes I agree it should be easy, but read the entire contract post from above, there are potential monetary liabilities and damages that the seller is responsible for that they have no control over. With some tweaking sure I'm sure it could work but put that in front of any legal representative of a dealership and they will laugh in your face as they throw it in the trash.
Quote:
they will laugh in your face as they throw it in the trash.
Yes, thus no sale. Also if they were laughing in my face, I would already be there in person and closing the deal. I only make offers on vehicles that I can pay for on the spot. (financing if necessary is already arranged)
The travel reimbursement is there if and only if travel is required and is there to test if the vehicle actually exists and available for sale. Some tweaking can be done to get this right and signed.
We are just currently in a time where demand is higher than supply on many vehicles. Thus the dealers are ensuring their sales. That time will end at some point.
Will 2022 or 2023 be the return of eternal 'Truck Month?'.
Naveronski said:
This is why people buy from 1ags' and APT's friends, or Sewell.
Their "hookups" have great prices, but there's no hassle or wasted time.
Rendered Fat said:Cromagnum said:TulaneAg said:Cromagnum said:
Not sure what OP expects. The dealer can't sell you a vehicle they don't have, and isn't obligated to sell you one at the price you want. Sucks you wasted a lot of road time though.
That's what you got out of that story?
That's what I get out of it when there is no VIN# mentioned. At minimum this should have been pulled to verify that a specific truck (or trucks) is physically on the lot.
Of course they've canceled the link now, but the text that she sent me (that I alluded to above) was a hyperlink to a specific vehicle that had the VIN and stock number on the link. Thank God I had the foresight to screenshot the link before they deleted it. This wasn't for some arbitrary, pie in the sky truck. We had a deal on a specific unit. And I specifically asked her if the unit was on the lot and she replied "yes, it's here."
For the life of me, I cannot understand how some of you goaltend so hard for scumbag dealerships. It is utterly amazing.
Not goaltending for the dealer. But don't get surprised when people in an industry that is known for lying lie to you. Yeah it sucks but it's not surprising at all. Blow them up on social media, file suit, do whatever you feel is necessary, but nothing is going to change. Scummy people will still try to rip people off selling cars for the rest of forever. There are good ones out there, find them and reward them for being ethical.
Quote:
Scummy people will still try to rip people off selling cars for the rest of forever.
Only as long as we let our lawmakers force all car-buying to go through independent dealers.
If people had the choice to buy direct from manufacturers, crappy dealers would have a much harder time keeping the doors open. Would force dealers to make their pricing, inventory, financing, and buying experience positive enough to compete with an online custom order that gets delivered to their door at MSRP after it rolls off the line.
Quote:
I AM shocked that so many consumers are indirectly fine with it by refusing to do anything about it or even support holding them accountable.
We can't really hold them accountable until car buying laws change. They all have a captive customer base of basically everyone in the state.
You can get mad Dealer A and take your business to Dealer B, but there's always someone else who got made at Dealer B and took their business to Dealer A. As a group they can (and pretty much do) all suck, and they'll still have customers walking through the doors all day long because everyone HAS to buy from a dealer.
Only way to clean up the business is to make them compete with the brands to give people a non-dealer alternative that will actually cut into dealers sales and not just shift sales back and forth between crappy dealers depending on which one did the initial pissing off of a given buyer.
So back to buying a truck, what's your next move there?
What I did about it was keep my cars longer and always try to go private party for purchases when I can.
It's really no skin off the dealerships back because they don't really like customers like me. They prefer people who say "get me the best truck you can for $500 a month".
It's really no skin off the dealerships back because they don't really like customers like me. They prefer people who say "get me the best truck you can for $500 a month".
reproag said:Naveronski said:
This is why people buy from 1ags' and APT's friends, or Sewell.
Their "hookups" have great prices, but there's no hassle or wasted time.
Sorry!
I'm way late to this, but just read through this post. Good luck to you. I work in the auto industry (not for a dealer) and I can almost guarantee you that the dealership will eventually cave. Every dealership I work with does this. fights it initially to see how serious you are, then caves because it's way cheaper to pay you off than to fight the negative press.
But on this comment, I had a slight issue with:
The consumer has the ultimate bargaining power in any consumer transaction. The consumer has the ultimate say in the deal. I know that's not how a lot of people operate, but if you are a wise consumer, who has experience or knowledge in the type of transaction, you have the last say in the deal no matter what. If a dealer isn't willing to give you what you want, you leave.
That being said, I totally get that's not how the majority of transactions work in the real world, but that doesn't mean it's not true still.
But on this comment, I had a slight issue with:
Quote:
Maybe so, but if that's the case, the consumer has literally no bargaining power and no expectation of a fair and honest process. What a terrible and unfair position to be in.
The consumer has the ultimate bargaining power in any consumer transaction. The consumer has the ultimate say in the deal. I know that's not how a lot of people operate, but if you are a wise consumer, who has experience or knowledge in the type of transaction, you have the last say in the deal no matter what. If a dealer isn't willing to give you what you want, you leave.
That being said, I totally get that's not how the majority of transactions work in the real world, but that doesn't mean it's not true still.
What do we do? Go talk to our pro-business anti-regulation state representatives that all get a big fat check from major dealers and dealer associations? Hire an attorney to tilt at a windmill for us for a couple hundred bucks an hour?Rendered Fat said:coolerguy12 said:Rendered Fat said:Cromagnum said:TulaneAg said:Cromagnum said:
Not sure what OP expects. The dealer can't sell you a vehicle they don't have, and isn't obligated to sell you one at the price you want. Sucks you wasted a lot of road time though.
That's what you got out of that story?
That's what I get out of it when there is no VIN# mentioned. At minimum this should have been pulled to verify that a specific truck (or trucks) is physically on the lot.
Of course they've canceled the link now, but the text that she sent me (that I alluded to above) was a hyperlink to a specific vehicle that had the VIN and stock number on the link. Thank God I had the foresight to screenshot the link before they deleted it. This wasn't for some arbitrary, pie in the sky truck. We had a deal on a specific unit. And I specifically asked her if the unit was on the lot and she replied "yes, it's here."
For the life of me, I cannot understand how some of you goaltend so hard for scumbag dealerships. It is utterly amazing.
Not goaltending for the dealer. But don't get surprised when people in an industry that is known for lying lie to you. Yeah it sucks but it's not surprising at all. Blow them up on social media, file suit, do whatever you feel is necessary, but nothing is going to change. Scummy people will still try to rip people off selling cars for the rest of forever. There are good ones out there, find them and reward them for being ethical.
I'm not shocked that dealerships are by and large unethical scumbags.
I AM shocked that so many consumers are indirectly fine with it by refusing to do anything about it or even support holding them accountable. Almost to the extent of goaltending for them. In no other trade is that mentality present.
I sent my demand letter on Monday and have to wait 60 days before I can sue. I don't think they'll even respond, thinking I'm just bluffing, so we probably won't hear any updates for two months.
The only functional solution is buyer beware. No one is saying that the practices of shady dealerships are ok, but they are reality. Practically none of us buy enough vehicles to make a difference in the bottom line of a dealership and they're the only game in town. If you haven't noticed, supply is a little tight at the moment, so right now, we frequently don't even have the option to cross shop.
We can refrain from buying from dealers that do shady stuff, but I'm sorry, we aren't lawyers and we can all afford to hire a lawyer and sue a dealership every time they do something unethical or illegal. Even you admit that it's not a profitable strategy and the only reason you're doing it is spite.
Bureaucratic Capture:
What the dealership have done. And very impressively so.
What the dealership have done. And very impressively so.
Give 'em hell! If you get to a jury you win BIG.
If you decide not to sue, I will be happy to donate a few hours to negotiate a price on a vehicle with them then then walk right before the signature and drop your name as I'm walking out the door.
If you decide not to sue, I will be happy to donate a few hours to negotiate a price on a vehicle with them then then walk right before the signature and drop your name as I'm walking out the door.
I had the bait and switch from Planet Ford on 45. Found a truck I wanted online. Sent emails. Called and talked to the lady and she confirmed they had it. Hopped in the truck and headed there right then and when I got there they didn't have it. She never went to check the lot and probably knew they didn't have it
helgs said:
I'm way late to this, but just read through this post. Good luck to you. I work in the auto industry (not for a dealer) and I can almost guarantee you that the dealership will eventually cave. Every dealership I work with does this. fights it initially to see how serious you are, then caves because it's way cheaper to pay you off than to fight the negative press.
But on this comment, I had a slight issue with:Quote:
Maybe so, but if that's the case, the consumer has literally no bargaining power and no expectation of a fair and honest process. What a terrible and unfair position to be in.
The consumer has the ultimate bargaining power in any consumer transaction. The consumer has the ultimate say in the deal. I know that's not how a lot of people operate, but if you are a wise consumer, who has experience or knowledge in the type of transaction, you have the last say in the deal no matter what. If a dealer isn't willing to give you what you want, you leave.
That being said, I totally get that's not how the majority of transactions work in the real world, but that doesn't mean it's not true still.
Wow. A helgs sighting!
In before Jim Adler!
The Fife said:
In before Jim Adler!
The Texas Spammer
I had a "contractor" try to scam me a few years ago. He pulled the old "can I get a partial payment for materials" line on me, and I fell for it. I gave him a partial payment, he dropped of a small amount of lumber, and then disappeared. I got my money back, but come to find out he was scamming a lot of other people including the elderly.
I could have written off my money as a lesson learned, but when I found out he was doing it to other people I felt I should do what I reasonably could to stop any future scamming.
The only damages you have suffered to this point is your lost time in negotiating a bad deal that never executed. The real problem is their bait and switch tactic that they continue to use. Yeah, document, document, document.
I could have written off my money as a lesson learned, but when I found out he was doing it to other people I felt I should do what I reasonably could to stop any future scamming.
The only damages you have suffered to this point is your lost time in negotiating a bad deal that never executed. The real problem is their bait and switch tactic that they continue to use. Yeah, document, document, document.
I like this plan.lb3 said:
Give 'em hell! If you get to a jury you win BIG.
If you decide not to sue, I will be happy to donate a few hours to negotiate a price on a vehicle with them then then walk right before the signature and drop your name as I'm walking out the door.
Start with a take home test drive, then come back the next day and spend 5 or 6 hours negotiating the price get lots of dealer add ons but haggle on the price of each. Go back out on the lot to look at different wheel options, change mind 3 times, and to keep the salesman on the hook, switch vin numbers mid deal to a lower tier model (at same price) with a color you 'prefer' not available on the higher priced vehicle.double aught said:I like this plan.lb3 said:
Give 'em hell! If you get to a jury you win BIG.
If you decide not to sue, I will be happy to donate a few hours to negotiate a price on a vehicle with them then then walk right before the signature and drop your name as I'm walking out the door.
Because I was OK with 2WD, when I found a 2016 4Runner Limited for a good price at 76K miles the dealer said - "that's it, do you want to sign."
My superficial frustration: how about cleaning the thing out before a serious potential buyer comes to see you?
My superficial frustration: how about cleaning the thing out before a serious potential buyer comes to see you?
Allen Honda in BCS apparently charges a $1100 fee for getting a used car ready to sell.
They gave me a price that was mysteriously over a grand higher than it should have been and I questioned it.
That's like picking out a shirt to buy for $50 and taking it to the register and having it ring up for $60. "Oh, that's the added fee for taking it out of the box, folding it and putting it on the little table."
They gave me a price that was mysteriously over a grand higher than it should have been and I questioned it.
Quote:
"We charge $1050 for our service dept to check on the vehicles and get them right. it is only mysterious if you are paying that without it been disclosed like other dealers hide in their sales price."
That's like picking out a shirt to buy for $50 and taking it to the register and having it ring up for $60. "Oh, that's the added fee for taking it out of the box, folding it and putting it on the little table."
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