Seriously??? Only 5% of Americans 16 years old and older currently hunt. That number is expected to sharply decline over the next decade. There is a major shift in the outdoors world and it's numbers of participants are going down the toilet. 30 years from now fisherman and hunters both are going to be drastically different in numbers from where they are today.
Who's to blame? The answer is all of us including the peole who love the outdoors or claim to love the outdoors. We have enough people outside of sportsmen who bag on us for hunting and fishing. The last thing we need are grandstanding elitists who kill our sports from the inside.
Flyfishing is the only way to fish. If youre not flyfishing, you're not a fisherman. Use open sight rifles to hunt deer because scopes are not sporting. Use a .22 for squirrels because a shotgun is not sporting. A buck has to be 8+ years old or you shot the wrong one and are condemed to Hell. Crossbows shouldn't be considered bows and if you use one during archery season you suck/cheat. High fenced property regardless of size is not ethical or sporting and you're a dirt bag for hunting it. Stationary fowl of any type can't be shot because it's too easy and not sporting or ethical. Shooting a sleeping animal is not sporting and it's unethical. The list is much too long and I could go on forever but you get my point.
Reality: Kids or first timers in the outdoors are going to loose interest immediately following the grandstanders in the field. I kind of feel sorry for novices having to endure our sports with people like this.
A LOT of outdoorsmen have gotten too involved in what they THINK the sports are versus legal means and methods. It's your opinions and grandstanding that are keeping novices from taking up hunting and fishing.
It's pretty sad reading some the threads and posts throughout the whole outdoor board. I didn't know there were so many people who claim to be outdoor enthusiasts but bag on others enough so the individuals will give up on our outdoor passions.
As long as you are legally hunting and fishing, I am for it. Go out and get a limit of fish, ducks, deer or whatever you want. I am glad you were successful and maybe a little jealous. Congrats on everything you catch or kill. I'm here to enjoy the stories of fishing trips and hunts regardless of how you caught them or what method you shot the game with.

ttha_aggie_09 said:

---

What makes you say this?

From the little I know about African lion hunts, the ones that still have a heavy mane at maturity, are very likely pen/farm raised. This guy has a small mane but I don't know how mature he was.

I am genuinely curious if you're just spewing conjecture or if you have some information about THIS hunt that no one else does?

---

Look at the numbers - there are only about 20,000 - 30,000 lions left in in the world, and virtually all successful guided hunts are canned hunts (generally illegal, where the animals are heavily drugged, then killed in captivity), and captive hunts, where lions raised in captivity are released, then released to be shot. Before they are released, the legal "captive" lions are raised around people, and are frequently in petting-zoo like conditions (look up "walking with lions" activities), and become tame around people.

Then, they are released to be "hunted," where hunters can "stalk" a tame lion, then shoot it as it dozes. Frequently they don't know how to fend for themselves after being raised in captivity, so they are dehydrated, starved, and fairly docile before you shoot them.

Consider South Africa - there are only 1,000 - 2,000 wild lions left in South Africa, most of which live in the national parks where hunting is prohibited. But, there are 8-10,000 lions in captivity, and these are the ones that are (legally) hunted.

But, Bubba with oil money got his trophy, gets to import it back to the US to show off to his divorcee of the month, and tells his buddies he stalked and killed a wild lion.

Apache said:

---

Was the lion shot legally? If so, then it doesn't matter if the lion was sleeping or not.

It may not be ethical to some, but I don't really have a problem with it & have shot several hogs that I snuck up on when they were asleep.

Animals in Africa will go extinct because of poaching & habitat loss; not sport hunting. Period.

---

Thats not sport hunting! Period HTH

CaddisBlackAngud said:

---

Seriously??? Only 5% of Americans 16 years old and older currently hunt. That number is expected to sharply decline over the next decade. There is a major shift in the outdoors world and it's numbers of participants are going down the toilet. 30 years from now fisherman and hunters both are going to be drastically different in numbers from where they are today.
Who's to blame? The answer is all of us including the peole who love the outdoors or claim to love the outdoors. We have enough people outside of sportsmen who bag on us for hunting and fishing. The last thing we need are grandstanding elitists who kill our sports from the inside.
Flyfishing is the only way to fish. If youre not flyfishing, you're not a fisherman. Use open sight rifles to hunt deer because scopes are not sporting. Use a .22 for squirrels because a shotgun is not sporting. A buck has to be 8+ years old or you shot the wrong one and are condemed to Hell. Crossbows shouldn't be considered bows and if you use one during archery season you suck/cheat. High fenced property regardless of size is not ethical or sporting and you're a dirt bag for hunting it. Stationary fowl of any type can't be shot because it's too easy and not sporting or ethical. Shooting a sleeping animal is not sporting and it's unethical. The list is much too long and I could go on forever but you get my point.
Reality: Kids or first timers in the outdoors are going to loose interest immediately following the grandstanders in the field. I kind of feel sorry for novices having to endure our sports with people like this.
A LOT of outdoorsmen have gotten too involved in what they THINK the sports are versus legal means and methods. It's your opinions and grandstanding that are keeping novices from taking up hunting and fishing.
It's pretty sad reading some the threads and posts throughout the whole outdoor board. I didn't know there were so many people who claim to be outdoor enthusiasts but bag on others enough so the individuals will give up on our outdoor passions.
As long as you are legally hunting and fishing, I am for it. Go out and get a limit of fish, ducks, deer or whatever you want. I am glad you were successful and maybe a little jealous. Congrats on everything you catch or kill. I'm here to enjoy the stories of fishing trips and hunts regardless of how you caught them or what method you shot the game with.

---

You can call it "grandstanding" or "elitism" or whatever the hell else I've been called in this thread, but if you think for one minute that me as a hunter disagreeing with shooting a sleeping lion is going to turn more 'young people' and 'novices' off of hunting than a video of dude shooting a sleeping lion making the rounds on social media then you're out to lunch. That's the point here.

One thing is for certain: there are a lot more p*$$ies out in the world than there used to be.

And the same class of citizens that fake outrage at the killing of a lion (hunter paid what, $25,000?) don't bat an eye at the notion of leaving a newborn on a stainless steel table to die.

So you don't have anything factual, you're just assuming based on the population of lions?

Prince_Ahmed said:

---

ttha_aggie_09 said:

---

What makes you say this?

From the little I know about African lion hunts, the ones that still have a heavy mane at maturity, are very likely pen/farm raised. This guy has a small mane but I don't know how mature he was.

I am genuinely curious if you're just spewing conjecture or if you have some information about THIS hunt that no one else does?

---

Look at the numbers - there are only about 20,000 - 30,000 lions left in in the world, and virtually all successful guided hunts are canned hunts (generally illegal, where the animals are heavily drugged, then killed in captivity), and captive hunts, where lions raised in captivity are released, then released to be shot. Before they are released, the legal "captive" lions are raised around people, and are frequently in petting-zoo like conditions (look up "walking with lions" activities), and become tame around people.

Then, they are released to be "hunted," where hunters can "stalk" a tame lion, then shoot it as it dozes. Frequently they don't know how to fend for themselves after being raised in captivity, so they are dehydrated, starved, and fairly docile before you shoot them.

Consider South Africa - there are only 1,000 - 2,000 wild lions left in South Africa, most of which live in the national parks where hunting is prohibited. But, there are 8-10,000 lions in captivity, and these are the ones that are (legally) hunted.

But, Bubba with oil money got his trophy, gets to import it back to the US to show off to his divorcee of the month, and tells his buddies he stalked and killed a wild lion.

---

Wow there is so much wrong with this there is no point in discussing it with you. Do you work for CNN or just have it on 24/7

If it was a legal hunting method than yes you're negatively impacting our sport by socially denouncing his hunt. Any negativity for legal hunting methods will impact future/current hunters regardless if it comes from antis or hunters themselves.
FYI I was out to lunch buying dresses. Please let me know your size so it will fit nicely.

You're still arguing (trolling) this? Good lord man, what did you expect coming to the Outdoor Board?

Caddis......you posted some valid points, but practice what you preach......if you do that you have to respect Yelnicks opinion as well....you don't have to agree with him..............he has basically said he is a hunter but simply, per his own decision, would not shoot a sleeping or animal lying down...........he is still a hunter ( as I understand it)....so you can make your valid point without adding a child like smart remark about dresses. In you doing that you just contradicted your other well spoken post.
We need to learn how to have discussions on this board without the cutting down of people we don't agree with. At the end of the day most of us are Aggies and at least I thought our tradition was to always treat fellow Aggies with respect whether we all agree or not.

PorkEatingCrusader said:

---

Apache said:

---

Animals in Africa will go extinct because of poaching & habitat loss; not sport hunting. Period.

---

Thats not sport hunting! Period HTH

---

It's not Sport Hunting because that is a completely meaningless term and nothing more than an exercise in mental masturbation to make you feel better about yourself for the way you chose to hunt

If hunting were truly sporting, the animal would have relatively equal odds of killing you back. Just because a method is more difficult does not make it more sporting.

mtngoat3006 said:

---

If you were hunting in the mountains with a deer or elk tag and happen upon a big muley or bull bedded down at a distance (sleeping or just laying there), would you take the shot???

---

Yelnick McWawa said:

---

*EDIT* RE: Your "coming to the Outdoor board" comment. I've been on this board since it's creation (a few usernames ago). I was a member of the FB group until I ditched FB a few years back. I've met more than one poster on the board IRL. This notion that I'm some newbie to the board and not worthy of some strange OB respect/cred/decent debate is strange.

---

Second time, same thread:

Yelnick McWawa said:

---

Thanks, Gunny.

And for the record, yes I am a hunter. Birds only (migratory and upland). Not out of some moral issue of killing mammals, I just wasn't raised by a deer hunter and ergo never became a deer hunter.

---

So a bunch of big game hunters are telling you why they don't have a problem with shooting a sleeping animal, and are making very valid points that, depending on the circumstances, it can show a greater degree of hunting skill and make for a more efficient kill, and we're the *******s for disagreeing with you?

Do you think, maybe, possibly, you might want to consider that a bunch of people who have experience doing something you don't, who have a different view, might have a valid reason for their views?

It's pretty obvious you are (self admitted) ignorant on the topic yet that doesn't stop you from denigrating others.

Also seems you are talking out both sides of your mouth when you claim it's shameful based on what you were taught but later say you weren't taught a damn thing.

Yelnick McWawa said:

---

I'm sure STX will just post that eye roll gif again and the blue star brigade will pad his stats despite all that.

---