Probably because they hunt with crossbows.
In all seriousness I think it is a good question.
In all seriousness I think it is a good question.
Tarpon Junkies
111,622 Views |
643 Replies |
Last: 10 mo ago by Stat Monitor Repairman
It's probably got a lot to do with the conditions the fish are hooked under (length of cast/amount of line out when hooked, the depth the fish are caught/hooked at, the strength of the current, etc..) Could also be the drag not being set too strong to crank in the fish, could be the angler, could be the the time/fight growing into a fishing story, etc.. Could also be that some fish fight a helluva lot harder and more than others and just don't want the be caught, no matter how big/small they are... Tarpon are no different than any other fish in that regard..
Don't think it's a big deal.. It's sporting either way. It's one of those to each his/her own deals... It's kinda like rifle vs bow hunting or using compound bow vs using a traditional recurve bow.. Either way as long as folks are conservation-minded it should be ok..
I'm not a fan of wearing fish out until they can barely swim away.. The guys I know that chase them video everything and try to pull a scale on each of their fish.. Never pick them up out of the water, etc...
Gonna give them a try a few times in the middle of August and am really looking forward to it... I've never specifically targeted them but hooked one in the surf between SLP and SS on a Corky Fat Boy several years ago that I was not expecting to one evening.. Fish was approximately 3 1/2 feet long and jumped just as high out of water about 20 feet from me and threw the lure on the second jump..
Don't think it's a big deal.. It's sporting either way. It's one of those to each his/her own deals... It's kinda like rifle vs bow hunting or using compound bow vs using a traditional recurve bow.. Either way as long as folks are conservation-minded it should be ok..
I'm not a fan of wearing fish out until they can barely swim away.. The guys I know that chase them video everything and try to pull a scale on each of their fish.. Never pick them up out of the water, etc...
Gonna give them a try a few times in the middle of August and am really looking forward to it... I've never specifically targeted them but hooked one in the surf between SLP and SS on a Corky Fat Boy several years ago that I was not expecting to one evening.. Fish was approximately 3 1/2 feet long and jumped just as high out of water about 20 feet from me and threw the lure on the second jump..
I'm not saying catching tarpon on conventional gear isn't sporting. Tarpon are such a challenge they're still sporting in gear.
It's a probably a combination of people being new to 100# fish and guides that mail it in when hosting tourists. That's how my first tarpon experience played out.
The drag was way too loose, but I had no clue what the limits were and what the settings should have been. Luckily, my tarpon broke away still green enough to survive.
The drag was way too loose, but I had no clue what the limits were and what the settings should have been. Luckily, my tarpon broke away still green enough to survive.
I would say that over the past 6 years since I've been taking annual guided trips with my non-fishing friends it's opened my eye a bit. So far it's been to catch Stripers (2x), trout in the White River, Snook on the Florida Gulf Coast, Blue Cats at Santee Cooper, Salmon in Lake Michigan, and an offshore trip in North Carolina.
This is a trip I specifically schedule for non-experienced fishermen. Bait dunking, trolling, etc. On at least 2/3 of these trips I have been AMAZED at the drag settings (among other things). Not that the guides weren't attentive, but they had the gear and their general set-up set to "idiot mode." Extend the fight, do anything in your power to make sure you don't lose the fish. Inexperienced fishermen too often let slack into the line, etc. so the easiest way to prevent that is to set the gear so that it's almost impossible to take line in. On at least 2 of the most recent trips when I was borderline unable to gain any ground on a big lake trout and a 20+ pound blue cat I told the guide we were changing the drag settings. If I lost a fish, so be it. None of them had a problem with it at all as we'd already caught a couple of fish and my guess is a guide can tell after 1 fish whether the person on the rod has a clue...
I don't even know that it's that the guides are mailing it in as much as it is they just assume that the client is a complete and total worthless moron. Then if he's anything more than that it's a pleasant surprise.
This is a trip I specifically schedule for non-experienced fishermen. Bait dunking, trolling, etc. On at least 2/3 of these trips I have been AMAZED at the drag settings (among other things). Not that the guides weren't attentive, but they had the gear and their general set-up set to "idiot mode." Extend the fight, do anything in your power to make sure you don't lose the fish. Inexperienced fishermen too often let slack into the line, etc. so the easiest way to prevent that is to set the gear so that it's almost impossible to take line in. On at least 2 of the most recent trips when I was borderline unable to gain any ground on a big lake trout and a 20+ pound blue cat I told the guide we were changing the drag settings. If I lost a fish, so be it. None of them had a problem with it at all as we'd already caught a couple of fish and my guess is a guide can tell after 1 fish whether the person on the rod has a clue...
I don't even know that it's that the guides are mailing it in as much as it is they just assume that the client is a complete and total worthless moron. Then if he's anything more than that it's a pleasant surprise.
Good points. I hadn't thought of that.
One of the things all 3 of the tarpon guides I've caught tarpon with told me is that "you can't fight a tarpon like you're afraid to lose it." Basically, you've got to put the heat on them, let the fish know you're there, and pull like hell. A tarpon in the water weighs like 1/16th of it's actual weight so a 120# fish is effectively 7.5# in the water and using a fly reel it's very, very few people who can actually put 7.5# of pressure on a fish.
One of the things all 3 of the tarpon guides I've caught tarpon with told me is that "you can't fight a tarpon like you're afraid to lose it." Basically, you've got to put the heat on them, let the fish know you're there, and pull like hell. A tarpon in the water weighs like 1/16th of it's actual weight so a 120# fish is effectively 7.5# in the water and using a fly reel it's very, very few people who can actually put 7.5# of pressure on a fish.
quote:This is very good advice. Fishing unguided means you have to learn things on your own and this is one I personally battle with because I still, even more so if the kids are with me, want to touch the fish. As the realization sets in that MOST of them are going to get away anyway - it gets a little easier to play the game like we're supposed to.
"you can't fight a tarpon like you're afraid to lose it."
Also have to consider the different perspectives... A guide thinks he's done a good job if he finds the fish. After all, he can't make tarpon eat, and he can't fight the fish for the client. However, a lot of customers only count boated fish. In order to meet the higher benchmark, a guide has incentives for weak drags and heavy lines.
quote:
Also have to consider the different perspectives... A guide thinks he's done a good job if he finds the fish. After all, he can't make tarpon eat, and he can't fight the fish for the client. However, a lot of customers only count boated fish. In order to meet the higher benchmark, a guide has incentives for weak drags and heavy lines.
I had a guide who fishes the Everglades and Keys tell me that a conventional gear guide buddy of his once said, "I need to switch to just guiding fly fishermen, those guys expect to not catch fish."
The funny thing is that I have a friend who doesn't fly fish and has struggled VERY HARD with soft plastics.
Do you know how far a pissed off tarpon can launch a 1/8 oz Norton lead head when want to?
Advantage - tiny hook and feathers.
Do you know how far a pissed off tarpon can launch a 1/8 oz Norton lead head when want to?
Advantage - tiny hook and feathers.
quote:
"I need to switch to just guiding fly fishermen, those guys expect to not catch fish."
Haha, unfortunately that sums up my experience.
All this talk about about Everglades tarpon in August prompted me to email the guide I used last year. He said 50# tarpon are plentiful right now. I have a trip to Marathon in late August without any guides booked... so now I'm trying to decide between a guide in the Lower Keys or ENP again... either way, I'm overdue for a tarpon, but I fully expect to not catch fish.
quote:quote:
"I need to switch to just guiding fly fishermen, those guys expect to not catch fish."
Haha, unfortunately that sums up my experience.
All this talk about about Everglades tarpon in August prompted me to email the guide I used last year. He said 50# tarpon are plentiful right now. I have a trip to Marathon in late August without any guides booked... so now I'm trying to decide between a guide in the Lower Keys or ENP again... either way, I'm overdue for a tarpon, but I fully expect to not catch fish.
When I fished out of Key West last August we saw a ton of tarpon but they weren't the giants. They were almost all in the 50# class.
But that's still pretty damn awesome time. And those smaller poon jump like crazy.
quote:
I have a trip to Marathon in late August without any guides booked...
Got an email you don't mind sharing? I can send some info / Google Earth stuff your way.
I got your email from a fellow tarpon junkie. Message sent.
MFBarnes with a state record.
If NW80 hadn't jumped in the middle of his sh*t he was going trying to just pass that off as his fish. I never thought of him taking credit for the record, but I doubt he anticipated the reaction to a dead tarpon.
After re-reading to check on Barnes' record I also realized I still has some days to burn in August and September....
You are lucky that a big part of the CP90 deck crew is moving into a dorm in CS in a few weeks.
I may not be as smart as that one, but I'll try to keep up
We're getting close boys and girls. I'm getting all the "your trip is just around the corner" emails from airlines, hotels, and rental cars. 6 DAYS to ENP!!
Boarding the plane. 20 hours to the boat ramp.
I hope you have are a very particular set of skills, skills you have acquired over a very long career. Skills that make you a nightmare for tarpon.
As we saw on my Colorado trip I'm just as likely to hook myself as I am a fish.
Thankfully Centerpole90 keeps reminding me to set the hook on a tarpon like a tournament bass fisherman. Just rip that rod tip to the sky!! So I've got that goin' for me. ;-)
No matter what happens I'm going to catch a good time. ...and probably Zika.
Thankfully Centerpole90 keeps reminding me to set the hook on a tarpon like a tournament bass fisherman. Just rip that rod tip to the sky!! So I've got that goin' for me. ;-)
No matter what happens I'm going to catch a good time. ...and probably Zika.
Don't forget the Immodium
Knock on wood, better on that front.
Sean- did we miss your fishing report from the Florida trip? No poon or what?
quote:I'd like to point out that one of our resident tarpon junkies, Dr. Ted Margo, a/k/a "Teddy Eyeballs" is in that film.
This just came out.
http://c1films.com/searching/
quote:You did, but only because i haven't done it yet.
Sean- did we miss your fishing report from the Florida trip? No poon or what?
I had a blast, but it was a day dominated by small fish for me. We had some nice topwater action early in the morning, mostly snook with some jacks mixed in. I caught about a 3# jack on an 8 weight and I was once again amazed by the power of those suckers. I had one legit chance at feeding tarpon early in the day, my cast was too short and I ended up catching a snook on accident. That fish created enough commotion that he drew a shark which blew up on my pod of juvi tarpon and that was it. We chased poon a few other times, even went back into the still water back in the creeks and saw some big fish rolling, but never got any interest from them
My day was full of fish. Fish everywhere we went, probably 60 of them. But mostly small. Snook, mangrove snapper, specks, jacks, ladyfish, even some smacks at one point. But almost all smaller than a couple of pounds. I had a blast. Guide was frustrated, but worked hard. We spent a lot of time moving trying to get away from the little guys but just couldn't find the right combination to get on bigger fish.
In a completely un-Sean moment I took almost no pictures. I have a half dozen probably of landscape and my guide took a picture of the snook that lead to the death of a tarpon. Other than that I got nothing.
Here was the cause of the murder.
Finn Maccumhail
Joined:
Aug 21, 2007
Posts:
17,494
How long do you want to ignore this user?
DV04
Joined:
Aug 11, 2010
Posts:
584
How long do you want to ignore this user?
Got a trip report for you boys (outkicked my coverage protected)! Just got back from celebrating the big 3-0 with the rib down at El Pescador in Ambergris Caye, Belize. Stayed 5 nights and fished w/ a guide 3 days. One day rented a golf cart and ****ed around trying to DIY--blanked. The lodge was outstanding with the service being top notch and food great, Our guide was Cesar (highly recommend if you go to EP, him and his brother Junior have recently started dominating the Grand Slam board) who was awesome. My wife went with me and this was her first time fly fishing. She had taken some casting lessons with Stacy Lynn down in Houston and worked her ass practicing on her own. Still, she was a novice and Cesar being an IGFA cert caster worked nicely for on water instruction. Anyways, onto the good stuff.
Day 1: started after bonefish/permit since I haven't caught either. Started a some bad luck, had a nice 4# bone break off on a mangrove shoot after it's 3rd run. Didn't see a nicer bone the rest of the trip. My wife did well right off the bat and landed a 1.5# bone pretty quick. Battled cloud cover all day and landed 4 small bones each. We chased a nice school of permit for awhile but couldn't get a take. Picky *******s!
Day 2: headed out at 5am for poon up North, just east of Rocky Point. The conditions were pretty consistent for the entire trip...hot and still. We were able to go beyond the reef and it was glass. Almost immediately we were seeing large groups rolling but nothing close to us. Didn't get good visibility from the sun until about 6:45 but things heated up right away. Missed a few takes out the gate and about 7:30 got my 1st jump with a 3/0 purple/black toad throwing a Helios 2 10wt. Got him to jump 3-4 times and up to the boat in short order. It was the smallest of the day at 30# but landing my first jumped tarpon had me pretty pumped. No pictures with him on the boat (lets just say my wife worked too hard on her fly casting and forgot how to work a camera) but was able to get pictures in the water.
My wife got the bow next and she had a lot of shots from 20-40'. I think seeing the tarpon in gin clear water got her a little unnerved and she was having a hard time casting even on the close shots. No takes or fight for her today. About 11 things slowed down and we started noticing them rolling in deeper water. We moved spots and sure enough there seemed to be hundreds of tarpon everywhere about 5' below the surface. Switched to a 12wt w/ intermediate line throwing a 3/0 black/red death (first time throwing an intermediate, learned it's not that easy trying to pick up 40' of line to re-cast). After blowing a few shots trying to get used to picking up the line I was able to make a 70' shot and jump/land my 2nd tarpon of the day. A little bigger at 45-50', leadered it a few times before the hook came out. 2 for 2 on the day so far
My wife got on the bow again but with it getting hotter and hotter the 12wt wore her down pretty quick. She took a break and I got back on the bow. Almost right away the guide called 9 o clock, 80'. Threw it out, gave it a quick twitch and she turned her head and slammed the fly. My best of the day at 80# and made sure the guide had the camera so we could get some decent pictures. Danced for 15 min and was able to get her up to the boat for pictures this time. Had to be quick because she ate the fly. Snapped a few pics, cut the leader, revived her and sent her on her way. After that it was about noon, we were all beat so we used the last hour booze cruising back to El Pescador and celebrating just a day that blew away my highest expectations.
Day 3 started with the wife on the bow. Goal was to at least get a poon to jump for her. After that, possibly go for a Slam if the poon action stayed hot. Not as many rollers but still plenty of tarpon out there. About 7 AMmy wife got a 40' shot, take and was able to get it on the reel. Jump, jump, jump...fought for 10 min and leadered it 3-4 times. The guide tried to grab the mouth (a little early IMO), tarpon jumped and hook came out. Still, was able to get some pictures of the last jump so that was good.
After my wife's fish the guide got ill and we went to shore so he could get some shade and cool off. The apprentice and I took the boat and found some small permit right off the bat. Caught a rat bonefish first cast and we decided to go for a boat slam. Long story short, the guide was able to get his uncle to bring him his blood pressure meds so he was good. Spent 5 hours getting shot after shot at permit. Tried every fly I had--top, intermediate, sinking, shrimp, crab--it didn't matter. Had a few where it looked like they missed the fly, several follows but the majority ignored. I was able to teach those permit some new vocabulary, so they got that going for them...which is nice.
On the way back was able to get into a school of blackfin and landed one which was cool. All in all, a great fishing trip. My wife and I leadered all 4 tarpon jumps. She's hooked and already ready to go back. Now I just have to work on tempering her expectations and reminding her that we may go years without having another trip like that. But now, it's time to BTHOUcla
Bonus pictures, found our very own 87Flyfisher on the Grand Slam board. Hmmmm, must be the guide...
Day 1: started after bonefish/permit since I haven't caught either. Started a some bad luck, had a nice 4# bone break off on a mangrove shoot after it's 3rd run. Didn't see a nicer bone the rest of the trip. My wife did well right off the bat and landed a 1.5# bone pretty quick. Battled cloud cover all day and landed 4 small bones each. We chased a nice school of permit for awhile but couldn't get a take. Picky *******s!
Day 2: headed out at 5am for poon up North, just east of Rocky Point. The conditions were pretty consistent for the entire trip...hot and still. We were able to go beyond the reef and it was glass. Almost immediately we were seeing large groups rolling but nothing close to us. Didn't get good visibility from the sun until about 6:45 but things heated up right away. Missed a few takes out the gate and about 7:30 got my 1st jump with a 3/0 purple/black toad throwing a Helios 2 10wt. Got him to jump 3-4 times and up to the boat in short order. It was the smallest of the day at 30# but landing my first jumped tarpon had me pretty pumped. No pictures with him on the boat (lets just say my wife worked too hard on her fly casting and forgot how to work a camera) but was able to get pictures in the water.
My wife got the bow next and she had a lot of shots from 20-40'. I think seeing the tarpon in gin clear water got her a little unnerved and she was having a hard time casting even on the close shots. No takes or fight for her today. About 11 things slowed down and we started noticing them rolling in deeper water. We moved spots and sure enough there seemed to be hundreds of tarpon everywhere about 5' below the surface. Switched to a 12wt w/ intermediate line throwing a 3/0 black/red death (first time throwing an intermediate, learned it's not that easy trying to pick up 40' of line to re-cast). After blowing a few shots trying to get used to picking up the line I was able to make a 70' shot and jump/land my 2nd tarpon of the day. A little bigger at 45-50', leadered it a few times before the hook came out. 2 for 2 on the day so far
My wife got on the bow again but with it getting hotter and hotter the 12wt wore her down pretty quick. She took a break and I got back on the bow. Almost right away the guide called 9 o clock, 80'. Threw it out, gave it a quick twitch and she turned her head and slammed the fly. My best of the day at 80# and made sure the guide had the camera so we could get some decent pictures. Danced for 15 min and was able to get her up to the boat for pictures this time. Had to be quick because she ate the fly. Snapped a few pics, cut the leader, revived her and sent her on her way. After that it was about noon, we were all beat so we used the last hour booze cruising back to El Pescador and celebrating just a day that blew away my highest expectations.
Day 3 started with the wife on the bow. Goal was to at least get a poon to jump for her. After that, possibly go for a Slam if the poon action stayed hot. Not as many rollers but still plenty of tarpon out there. About 7 AMmy wife got a 40' shot, take and was able to get it on the reel. Jump, jump, jump...fought for 10 min and leadered it 3-4 times. The guide tried to grab the mouth (a little early IMO), tarpon jumped and hook came out. Still, was able to get some pictures of the last jump so that was good.
After my wife's fish the guide got ill and we went to shore so he could get some shade and cool off. The apprentice and I took the boat and found some small permit right off the bat. Caught a rat bonefish first cast and we decided to go for a boat slam. Long story short, the guide was able to get his uncle to bring him his blood pressure meds so he was good. Spent 5 hours getting shot after shot at permit. Tried every fly I had--top, intermediate, sinking, shrimp, crab--it didn't matter. Had a few where it looked like they missed the fly, several follows but the majority ignored. I was able to teach those permit some new vocabulary, so they got that going for them...which is nice.
On the way back was able to get into a school of blackfin and landed one which was cool. All in all, a great fishing trip. My wife and I leadered all 4 tarpon jumps. She's hooked and already ready to go back. Now I just have to work on tempering her expectations and reminding her that we may go years without having another trip like that. But now, it's time to BTHOUcla
Bonus pictures, found our very own 87Flyfisher on the Grand Slam board. Hmmmm, must be the guide...
FBG_Ag78
Joined:
Sep 18, 2007
Posts:
2,239
How long do you want to ignore this user?
rgarza35
Joined:
Sep 19, 2011
Posts:
2,051
How long do you want to ignore this user?
4stringAg
Jim Schlossnagle set to leave Texas A&M for Texas head coaching job
in Billy Liucci's TexAgs Premium
315
CreekBottom
Jim Schlossnagle set to leave Texas A&M for Texas head coaching job
in Billy Liucci's TexAgs Premium
262
Thunder18
Jim Schlossnagle set to leave Texas A&M for Texas head coaching job
in Billy Liucci's TexAgs Premium
258
PJYoung
McClain: Schloss lost all credibility outside of Austin
in Billy Liucci's TexAgs Premium
190