Vestal_Flame said:

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Quote:

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. you intentintionally leave off "punishable by up to six months' imprisonment, a fine, or both"

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Actually, I didn't know that.

I knew that the penalty for a misdemeanor is generally "less than a year." But, you're right, the penalty unlawfully entering the country is shorter than I had expected.

Like I said, it's not my area of practice.

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yeah we know you have no clue what you are talking about. Libs struggle with illegals being illegal

I don't disagree with that, but we have to operate within the current law. Find the misdemeanor, deport. If misdemeanor runs, it is escalated to criminal and all bets are off.
Also work to change the current law

Before today I would have agreed with you about Watson but after his press conference performance this afternoon, not so much.

Old Army Ghost said:

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Vestal_Flame said:

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Quote:

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. you intentintionally leave off "punishable by up to six months' imprisonment, a fine, or both"

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Actually, I didn't know that.

I knew that the penalty for a misdemeanor is generally "less than a year." But, you're right, the penalty unlawfully entering the country is shorter than I had expected.

Like I said, it's not my area of practice.

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yeah we know you have no clue what you are talking about. Libs struggle with illegals being illegal

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Exactly. It's like rocket science to them.

BQ78 said:

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Before today I would have agreed with you about Watson but after his press conference performance this afternoon, not so much.

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I probably need to watch it. He used to not be an asshat. When I see Watson on the street, I actually stop to speak to him.

My reaction to Casar is closer to my reaction to the mentally ill homeless people, except without any sense of compassion.

KBTX lead with this tonight. Attorney blamed ICE for everything under the sun.

TyHolden said:

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KBTX lead with this tonight. Attorney blamed ICE for everything under the sun.

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Of course; KBTX makes Pravda look unbiased.

Until Rusty is gone, it will always be nothing but a mouthpiece for the left in everything.

I haven't read all this but has it been determined whether or not he was illegal?

Sounds like he still is.

jja79 said:

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I haven't read all this but has it been determined whether or not he was illegal?

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Illegal with a final removal order.

jja79 said:

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I haven't read all this but has it been determined whether or not he was illegal?

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According to some on here, no one is illegal.

jja79 said:

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I haven't read all this but has it been determined whether or not he was illegal?

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Given that the coverage in the Statesman did not address the question, I assume that he is in the country illegally.

He's going to be an illegal with a long rap sheet. Just wait for the facts to come out. Non criminals don't run from the police.

The guy had an order of final removal. He can get the **** out. He's had his "due process."

Vestal_Flame said:

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This is not my area of practice, but my general understanding is that:

It is generally worth remembering that, under the law of the United States, being in this country without papers is not a criminal offense. It is a civil law violation.

It is generally worth remembering that, under the law of the United States, unlawfully entering this country is a misdemeanor.

That misdemeanor only becomes a felony if you re-enter after being formally deported.

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It is generally worth remembering that, under the law, a misdemeanor is a crime.

Rapier108 said:

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jja79 said:

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I haven't read all this but has it been determined whether or not he was illegal?

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Illegal with a final removal order.

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No wonder democrats are so outraged. They hate America and Americans.

Vestal_Flame said:

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Yeah, I'm willing bet a case of Shiner beer that this one leads to protests.

The "word of mouth" version of the story is that ICE boxed in a Venezuelan guy and shot him in the back of the head, in his car.

I have to imagine that this version of the story was written before the shots were fired.

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Yep, they've enraged the useful idiots enough that one went and died for their cause. Let the protests commence. Great job useful idiots. Thank you for dying for the cause.

Thunderstruck xx said:

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Garrelli 5000 said:

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Of course Greg Casar is immediately stirring the pot. That effeminate vocal fry ***** is is a bigger ***** than John Holmes wife's.

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All this without and real proof of what happened yet.

The horror has come to our city: ICE has shot a person in Austin this morning.
As the facts emerge, I am demanding a full, independent investigation, immediate release of the body camera footage, and accountability for any ICE officer who broke the law.
Over and over, ICE has…

— Congressman Greg Casar (@RepCasar) September 20, 2026

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The left are such evil pieces of ***** "The horror?" Just rallying the useful idiots so there can be more death and destruction while the elites dine and drink.

Old Army Ghost said:

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Vestal_Flame said:

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This is not my area of practice, but my general understanding is that:

It is generally worth remembering that, under the law of the United States, being in this country without papers is not a criminal offense. It is a civil law violation.

It is generally worth remembering that, under the law of the United States, unlawfully entering this country is a misdemeanor.

That misdemeanor only becomes a felony if you re-enter after being formally deported.

---

why do libs tell half truths?

you intentintionally leave off "punishable by up to six months' imprisonment, a fine, or both"

Being illegal is illegal.

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Half-truths... lying by omission. Libs/democrats.

Attorneys lie, too.

Do you think the guy in the picture in the comment you quoted is a bastion of honesty?

MidRatsAg said:

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aginlakeway said:

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Vestal_Flame said:

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The Unforgiven said:

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10 to 20 million plus illegals isn't just simply crossing the border. That is an invasion. Invaders can get the death penalty.

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Please be so kind as to point me to the section of the Untied States Code that authorizes the death penalty for the crime of invasion. This is not a troll. I actually want to know what you mean.

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Invasive won't getting you killed. Running from the police when they're trying to arrest you can be fatal.

Is that so hard to understand?

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That's interesting. When I was in the military, it was drilled into us that in order to use deadly force, we had to know that the person we were inflicting deadly force upon had the opportunity, capability, and intent to use deadly force on us or others. I was under the impression that law enforcement had similar requirement for use of deadly force.

Running away does not meet the requirements of that CIA triad. Why does running from police constitute use of deadly force?

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Why doesn't running from the police...

Quit defending the invaders and take a stronger position for America. Jesus Christ, man, be a Patriot.





Edit: sp America

So…

How was illegal Wilber Rafael Garces Perez doing Door Dash deliveries without a Social Security number?

Unless…

Wilber had a stolen Social Security number.

Do you think Wilber had car insurance?

It’s only going to get worse for Wilber as details come out.

Bet on it. pic.twitter.com/XGHTox6Bsi

— C3 (@C_3C_3) September 21, 2026

So, just a poor illegal door dasher. Courtesy of Xiden, of course, with a final order of removal.

Homeland Security Investigations, with the assistance of the Federal Bureau of Investigation, is leading the investigation into the officer involved shooting of an illegal alien from Venezuela, who illegally entered our country under the Biden administration and had a final order…

— Homeland Security (@DHSgov) September 21, 2026

Get well soon, and then venga de aquis Caracas.

ETA text.

Quote:

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Homeland Security Investigations, with the assistance of the Federal Bureau of Investigation, is leading the investigation into the officer involved shooting of an illegal alien from Venezuela, who illegally entered our country under the Biden administration and had a final order of removal, during a law enforcement operation today in Austin, TX.

The illegal alien's condition is stable, and he is in federal custody pending removal.

This is a developing situation, and we will update the public when more information becomes available.

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I see absolutely no issue with a little lead therapy ventilation on an illegal alien previously ordered to leave the country.

But I'm a patriot.

Vestal_Flame said:

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The Unforgiven said:

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10 to 20 million plus illegals isn't just simply crossing the border. That is an invasion. Invaders can get the death penalty.

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Please be so kind as to point me to the section of the Untied States Code that authorizes the death penalty for the crime of invasion. This is not a troll. I actually want to know what you mean.

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It's hyperbole...

JamesPShelley said:

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MidRatsAg said:

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aginlakeway said:

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Vestal_Flame said:

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The Unforgiven said:

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10 to 20 million plus illegals isn't just simply crossing the border. That is an invasion. Invaders can get the death penalty.

---

Please be so kind as to point me to the section of the Untied States Code that authorizes the death penalty for the crime of invasion. This is not a troll. I actually want to know what you mean.

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Invasive won't getting you killed. Running from the police when they're trying to arrest you can be fatal.

Is that so hard to understand?

---

That's interesting. When I was in the military, it was drilled into us that in order to use deadly force, we had to know that the person we were inflicting deadly force upon had the opportunity, capability, and intent to use deadly force on us or others. I was under the impression that law enforcement had similar requirement for use of deadly force.

Running away does not meet the requirements of that CIA triad. Why does running from police constitute use of deadly force?

---

Why doesn't running from the police...

Quit defending the invaders and take a stronger position for Ameica. Jesus Christ, man, be a Patriot.

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I am a Patriot. I believe in the Constitution and due process.

I don't want an authoritarian government. Police are required for our country to function. Running from police can be a crime. Running away is never a crime that authorizes use of deadly force. If we don't hold police to standards, we will have a tyrannical government.

jtkk said:

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jja79 said:

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I haven't read all this but has it been determined whether or not he was illegal?

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According to some on here, no one is illegal.

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And that would be belief of a certain somone who is running for Senate from Texas. His beliefs bring open borders to criminals, housing shortages,,theft o entry level jobs from US citizens and ultimately riots and destruction of property when they are asked to follow our laws, and when they are caught breaking our laws, they hide behind destruction. Biden and Talarico- behind the destruction of America- an America of legal immigrants and decendents of legal immigrants. But who are getting screwed by liberal/ communists who call themselves democrats.

MidRatsAg said:

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JamesPShelley said:

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MidRatsAg said:

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aginlakeway said:

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Vestal_Flame said:

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The Unforgiven said:

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10 to 20 million plus illegals isn't just simply crossing the border. That is an invasion. Invaders can get the death penalty.

---

Please be so kind as to point me to the section of the Untied States Code that authorizes the death penalty for the crime of invasion. This is not a troll. I actually want to know what you mean.

---

Invasive won't getting you killed. Running from the police when they're trying to arrest you can be fatal.

Is that so hard to understand?

---

That's interesting. When I was in the military, it was drilled into us that in order to use deadly force, we had to know that the person we were inflicting deadly force upon had the opportunity, capability, and intent to use deadly force on us or others. I was under the impression that law enforcement had similar requirement for use of deadly force.

Running away does not meet the requirements of that CIA triad. Why does running from police constitute use of deadly force?

---

Why doesn't running from the police...

Quit defending the invaders and take a stronger position for Ameica. Jesus Christ, man, be a Patriot.

---

I am a Patriot. I believe in the Constitution and due process.

I don't want an authoritarian government. Police are required for our country to function. Running from police can be a crime. Running away is never a crime that authorizes use of deadly force. If we don't hold police to standards, we will have a tyrannical government.

---

When you recognize the facts in this case, instead of jumping to conclusions, will you admit you were wrong?

TexasAggie81 said:

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Vestal_Flame said:

---

This is not my area of practice, but my general understanding is that:

It is generally worth remembering that, under the law of the United States, being in this country without papers is not a criminal offense. It is a civil law violation.

It is generally worth remembering that, under the law of the United States, unlawfully entering this country is a misdemeanor.

That misdemeanor only becomes a felony if you re-enter after being formally deported.

---

It is generally worth remembering that, under the law, a misdemeanor is a crime.

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Sorry bro

Texas is not falling for an Abigail Spanberger style "I'm definitely not a radical Dem running as a moderate Republican to get elected and then will go full Stalinist the second I'm elected"

I'm hearing he was shot 4 times in the torso. I suspect had he been shot in the back we would have heard about it, so "running away" appears to be out the window. We also know he was not some random brown guy, but someone who knew he should have been gone already and wasn't going to give up easily.

bobbranco said:

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MidRatsAg said:

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JamesPShelley said:

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MidRatsAg said:

---

aginlakeway said:

---

Vestal_Flame said:

---

The Unforgiven said:

---

10 to 20 million plus illegals isn't just simply crossing the border. That is an invasion. Invaders can get the death penalty.

---

Please be so kind as to point me to the section of the Untied States Code that authorizes the death penalty for the crime of invasion. This is not a troll. I actually want to know what you mean.

---

Invasive won't getting you killed. Running from the police when they're trying to arrest you can be fatal.

Is that so hard to understand?

---

That's interesting. When I was in the military, it was drilled into us that in order to use deadly force, we had to know that the person we were inflicting deadly force upon had the opportunity, capability, and intent to use deadly force on us or others. I was under the impression that law enforcement had similar requirement for use of deadly force.

Running away does not meet the requirements of that CIA triad. Why does running from police constitute use of deadly force?

---

Why doesn't running from the police...

Quit defending the invaders and take a stronger position for Ameica. Jesus Christ, man, be a Patriot.

---

I am a Patriot. I believe in the Constitution and due process.

I don't want an authoritarian government. Police are required for our country to function. Running from police can be a crime. Running away is never a crime that authorizes use of deadly force. If we don't hold police to standards, we will have a tyrannical government.

---

When you recognize the facts in this case, instead of jumping to conclusions, will you admit you were wrong?

---

1. I was responding to general statements with general statements. I will not admit that I'm wrong regarding deadly force not being authorized for running from police (save for special circumstances in which the police have good reason to believe that the escape of the individual will inevitably result in that individual harming another person).

2. Depending on the facts of the case, the ICE agents certainly may have been justified in using lethal force to protect themselves or others, and if that's the case and Perez had the opportunity, capability, and intent to cause severe bodily harm or death to the ICE agents or others, then I will be very vocal that the ICE agents were right in using deadly force.

So far, I know that a final order of removal was issued for Perez. So ICE was certainly justified in pursuing him. That does not automatically mean they were justified in using deadly force.

I don't like the rhetoric that the Democratic leadership in Austin is using which seems to make ICE out to be guilty until proven innocent. Fox has also reported that Chip Roy, a Republican, referred to Perez as "the shooter." I haven't heard anything about Perez shooting at ICE from any other source, so if it turns out to be the case that Perez didn't shoot at ICE, I would also condemn him for spreading an unsupported narrative that benefits the other side's agenda.

If someone can provide video of what happened, specifically body cam footage, I think that would be best. Transparency is the best policy here so we can begin to reinstill trust in our institutions, including our border and immigration police.

Finally, I think the protestors jumped the gun before they had all the facts and no matter the facts, they have no right to block roadways.

Quote:

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It is generally worth remembering that, under the law, a misdemeanor is a crime.

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Excellent.

If the allegation is that a person is a criminal, then that is fine. We have courts of law, run by judges, for the processing of persons accused of crimes.

If the allegation is that he has committed a federal crime, then we bring him before an Article 3 judge.

Quote:

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Fifteen hours after a man shot by ICE agents was released from the hospital, attorneys say they have been unable to locate him as of 8 a.m. Monday, "which is highly unusual," attorney Kristen Etter told the Statesman. "It has been 15 hours since ICE takes you, whisks you from the hospital, and we have not been able to locate him." She said her client has not shown up in traditional databases used by attorneys. "We have no idea what type of condition he is in."

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B-1 83 said:

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I'm hearing he was shot 4 times in the torso. I suspect had he been shot in the back we would have heard about it, so "running away" appears to be out the window. We also know he was not some random brown guy, but someone who knew he should have been gone already and wasn't going to give up easily.

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There are photos of his car with bullet holes in the passenger side and it looks like there was a collision on that side as well. Maybe he was just trying to get away. Maybe he tried to ram his car into theirs, in which case I think that might constitute use of deadly force.

TBD.

aginlakeway said:

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It is generally worth remembering that, under the law, a misdemeanor is a crime.

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When I took defensive driving years ago, the instructor came in and started right off by saying "Welcome Criminals!"

EFR said:

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I am simply pointing out that ice is usually not what anyone would call transparent when it comes to OIS, so no, we won't get body camera. We will be left with "trust us, we investigated ourselves and found ourselves to be innocent".

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I love when yall try to fight and kill ICE. LOL never change.