Russia/Ukraine from Another Perspective (Relaunch Part Deux)

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Teslag
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In reply to PlaneCrashGuy • 11:41p, 12/15/24
AG
PlaneCrashGuy said:
Teslag said:
PlaneCrashGuy said:
Teslag said:
PlaneCrashGuy said:
Teslag said:
And as usual the proof is in the results. If Ukrainians were deserting in "droves" the Russians should be able to gain more than 15 miles in one tiny area of the front in a year.

They haven't. Why?


Actually, tonight the proof is western media sources proving you wrong.


False.


Now you're just harming Ukraine, per actual Ukrainians

" "Being quiet about a huge problem only harms our country," said Serhii Hnezdilov "


Harming them would be purposely invading their country, murdering and raping them in the street, launching cruise missiles in their homes and power stations to freeze them to death, and killing their sons and husbands because they dare oppose your attempt to subjugate them.

I've never done those things. Nor have I supported those that do. But I know someone who does…


Not saying I disagree, but the quote from an actual Ukrainian is pretty clear to me. "Being quite about a huge problem only harms our country" and that is exactly what you're doing.


Why does that single Ukrainian matter more than the ones fighting and dying because they don't want to be Russians?
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Teslag
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In reply to PlaneCrashGuy • 11:44p, 12/15/24
AG
And all wars have cowards. The south had cowards that aided the union. The colonists had loyalists. The French had citizens aid the Nazis.

And Ukraine will have cowards that desert. It's a part of it. But far more have chosen to fight and stand their ground. Far more don't want to be Russians, no matter how badly you want them to be.
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nortex97
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4:04a, 12/16/24
AG
Sounds like the French training kicked into gear.




Free book documents the mythology around the maidan protesters who were shot largely by (hired Georgian) snipers in the hotel Ukrainski, not the police under orders of the democratically elected government, used by Nuland et al. to execute a coup.


Russian advances continue;
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nortex97
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5:07a, 12/16/24
AG


I like the reference to Biden's(*) current strategy being a blank check 'forever war:'
Quote:
U.S. President-elect Donald Trump's team is discussing how to end the Russia-Ukraine war permanently rather than merely "pausing" it, Trump's pick for national security advisor, Mike Waltz, told CBS News on Dec. 15.

Trump, taking on Jan. 20, 2025, said he aims to bring a swift end to the war without revealing specifics of how to achieve the goal. Some ideas floated within the president-elect's team reportedly include delaying Ukraine's entry into NATO in exchange for arms while freezing the war along the current front lines.
When asked whether the upcoming Trump administration plans to restrict how Ukraine can use U.S. arms, Waltz said that a "blank check... just isn't a strategy," adding that such steps threaten to turn the conflict into a "forever war."

Trump recently criticized the outgoing Biden administration's decision to permit Ukraine to strike targets within Russian territory with ATACMS missiles. At the same time, the president-elect indicated he does not plan to "abandon" Ukraine and instead leverage the U.S. assistance for Kyiv to push Russia to the negotiating table.
Two DPR villages liberated, 4 patriot launchers destroyed, Zelensky whines:
Quote:
Over the past two months, the Russian army has made its fastest advances since the escalation of hostilities in February 2022, gaining control of approximately 1,500 square kilometers of territory.

Earlier this week, Zelensky expressed frustration with Western arms donors for not meeting his requests for additional air defense systems, as Ukraine faces challenges on the battlefield and struggles to defend key locations from long-range attacks.

Insulting, par for the course.
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PlaneCrashGuy
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In reply to Teslag • 8:06a, 12/16/24
AG
Teslag said:
PlaneCrashGuy said:
Teslag said:
PlaneCrashGuy said:
Teslag said:
PlaneCrashGuy said:
Teslag said:
And as usual the proof is in the results. If Ukrainians were deserting in "droves" the Russians should be able to gain more than 15 miles in one tiny area of the front in a year.

They haven't. Why?


Actually, tonight the proof is western media sources proving you wrong.


False.


Now you're just harming Ukraine, per actual Ukrainians

" "Being quiet about a huge problem only harms our country," said Serhii Hnezdilov "


Harming them would be purposely invading their country, murdering and raping them in the street, launching cruise missiles in their homes and power stations to freeze them to death, and killing their sons and husbands because they dare oppose your attempt to subjugate them.

I've never done those things. Nor have I supported those that do. But I know someone who does…


Not saying I disagree, but the quote from an actual Ukrainian is pretty clear to me. "Being quite about a huge problem only harms our country" and that is exactly what you're doing.


Why does that single Ukrainian matter more than the ones fighting and dying because they don't want to be Russians?


I'm not saying he matters more, just that he's specifically asking people to not do what you're doing. He is saying that what you are doing is causing harm. I think that is worth considering.
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PlaneCrashGuy
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In reply to Teslag • 8:08a, 12/16/24
AG
Teslag said:
And all wars have cowards. The south had cowards that aided the union. The colonists had loyalists. The French had citizens aid the Nazis.

And Ukraine will have cowards that desert. It's a part of it. But far more have chosen to fight and stand their ground. Far more don't want to be Russians, no matter how badly you want them to be.


Completely agree. But he was clear that he believes downplaying the issue is hurting Ukraine.
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nortex97
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8:18a, 12/16/24
AG
Excellent editorial in, of all places The Hill. "Ceasefire in Ukraine comes too late."
Quote:
The biggest "mystery" is, why some do not want to stop the almost instantly stoppable killing in Ukraine.

Another mystery is why some were so anxious to lead the world to the edge of World War III. Another is why some want no accountability for the hundreds of billions sent into Ukraine. And the last "mystery" is why so many in the media and in "leadership" positions in the U.S., the United Kingdom and France have deliberately ignored or downplayed the horrific casualty counts in Ukraine?

Since day one, this war has stunk to high Heaven. Three men instantly opposed it while warning of the ultimate horror it could spawn Trump, Vice President-elect JD Vance, and Robert F. Kennedy, Jr.
…
Trump is right today to articulate that, just as he, Vance and Kennedy, have been right to issue warning after warning for the last almost three years.

There is going to be a ceasefire. There was always going to be a ceasefire. Except now, Ukraine will be in a much worse position because it has lost dramatically more territory since the first ceasefire was contemplated.

Worst of all, hundreds of thousands of more men, women and children have been needlessly killed or maimed because "leaders" from the West wanted to continue to play a board game from the safety of their offices thousands of miles away from the battlefield using those men, women and children as cheap, disposable, pawns.

Enough with "leaders", "experts" and profiteers sending young people to their deaths.
The grotesque war-porn addiction is obvious online, and not just on X etc (not referencing any TA users of course).
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Teslag
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In reply to PlaneCrashGuy • 8:20a, 12/16/24
AG
PlaneCrashGuy said:
Teslag said:
PlaneCrashGuy said:
Teslag said:
PlaneCrashGuy said:
Teslag said:
PlaneCrashGuy said:
Teslag said:
And as usual the proof is in the results. If Ukrainians were deserting in "droves" the Russians should be able to gain more than 15 miles in one tiny area of the front in a year.

They haven't. Why?


Actually, tonight the proof is western media sources proving you wrong.


False.


Now you're just harming Ukraine, per actual Ukrainians

" "Being quiet about a huge problem only harms our country," said Serhii Hnezdilov "


Harming them would be purposely invading their country, murdering and raping them in the street, launching cruise missiles in their homes and power stations to freeze them to death, and killing their sons and husbands because they dare oppose your attempt to subjugate them.

I've never done those things. Nor have I supported those that do. But I know someone who does…


Not saying I disagree, but the quote from an actual Ukrainian is pretty clear to me. "Being quite about a huge problem only harms our country" and that is exactly what you're doing.


Why does that single Ukrainian matter more than the ones fighting and dying because they don't want to be Russians?


I'm not saying he matters more, just that he's specifically asking people to not do what you're doing. He is saying that what you are doing is causing harm. I think that is worth considering.

Again, why does he matter more than the others?
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Teslag
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In reply to nortex97 • 8:26a, 12/16/24
AG

Quote:
There is going to be a ceasefire. There was always going to be a ceasefire. Except now, Ukraine will be in a much worse position because it has lost dramatically more territory since the first ceasefire was contemplated.
From your article, which is complete BS. The supposed "peace negotiations" the article refers to in the Spring of 2022 occurred while Russia controlled both Kharkiv and Kherson. Since that time, those cities and land areas, which comprise over 2 million Ukrainians, have been liberated by Ukraine. Under that "deal" they would be Russian cities now. And Ukraine then retook over 60% of Russia's gains made in the spring of 2022.

It was never a "peace deal". It was surrender. And now both Kharkiv and Kherson will remain Ukrainian.
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Teslag
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9:24a, 12/16/24
AG






If Ukraine would have taken that "peace deal" Ukraine would look like it did in March of 2022 (image at top right). As it was, they were able liberate what they did by November of 2022. That deal was never worth accepting. And as you can see by the image at the lower right, basically nothing has changed in two years.
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PlaneCrashGuy
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In reply to Teslag • 11:22a, 12/16/24
AG
Teslag said:
PlaneCrashGuy said:
Teslag said:
PlaneCrashGuy said:
Teslag said:
PlaneCrashGuy said:
Teslag said:
PlaneCrashGuy said:
Teslag said:
And as usual the proof is in the results. If Ukrainians were deserting in "droves" the Russians should be able to gain more than 15 miles in one tiny area of the front in a year.

They haven't. Why?


Actually, tonight the proof is western media sources proving you wrong.


False.


Now you're just harming Ukraine, per actual Ukrainians

" "Being quiet about a huge problem only harms our country," said Serhii Hnezdilov "


Harming them would be purposely invading their country, murdering and raping them in the street, launching cruise missiles in their homes and power stations to freeze them to death, and killing their sons and husbands because they dare oppose your attempt to subjugate them.

I've never done those things. Nor have I supported those that do. But I know someone who does…


Not saying I disagree, but the quote from an actual Ukrainian is pretty clear to me. "Being quite about a huge problem only harms our country" and that is exactly what you're doing.


Why does that single Ukrainian matter more than the ones fighting and dying because they don't want to be Russians?


I'm not saying he matters more, just that he's specifically asking people to not do what you're doing. He is saying that what you are doing is causing harm. I think that is worth considering.

Again, why does he matter more than the others?


He's not saying not to fight. He's saying don't downplay the desertion issue.

You're doing something an actual Ukrainian has declared harmful, so who and how exactly do you think you're helping?
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Teslag
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In reply to PlaneCrashGuy • 11:25a, 12/16/24
AG
No one posting on a college football fan forum is helping or hurting anyone on this war.


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nortex97
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1:24p, 12/16/24
AG
Goodness.


True:

Also true:
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nortex97
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4:25a, 12/17/24
AG
Sitrep: 'Ukraine loses more territory.'
Quote:
The strikes were followed by immediate reports that as much as 70% of Ukraine was without power, at least temporarily. It seems with each strike the system is buckling but it's uncertain if it can or will ever fully 'collapse', nor if Russia even intends for it to do soas opposed to bringing it just to the brink.

Despite claims Gerasimov had spoken to head of Joint Chiefs of Staff Charles Brown and that ATACMS strikes subsequently immediately stopped on Russian territory, Ukraine in fact launched another ATACMS strike on Taganrog, between Mariupol and Rostov. Perhaps there's chance Gerasimov's warning really did result in a moratorium but Zelensky decided to 'test the limits' of both sides' red lines. After all, the target (geolocation: 47.23737, 38.86234) is mere kilometers from the Ukrainian border and just 'barely' constitutes 'Russian territory'. Why waste a "long range" ATACMS to strike at such a shallow depth unless you were hoping to sit on two chairs and cause a provocation without angering your 'partners' too much?

Either way, the MOD claimed negligible damage as the ATACMS were reportedly both shot down and deflected by EW.

Trump has now stated allowing ATACMS to be launched into Russia was a big mistake:
A Russian running the biolabs in Ukraine investigation (Soros/Rosemont Seneca/Hunter etc) was assassinated by a scooter containing an IED.
Quote:
Belousov confirmed this by stating the total number for 2024 enlistments is 427,000. Divided into 12 months, this totals ~35,600 monthly enlistments:
Quote:
  • In 2024, Russian troops liberated almost 4.5 thousand square kilometers of territory occupied by the Ukrainian Armed Forces.
  • An integrated information environment for decision-making at the tactical level will be created.
  • Over 427 thousand people have entered service under contract since the beginning of 2024.
  • Compared to 2022, the Russian military receives 7 times more tanks, 3 times more infantry fighting vehicles and armored personnel carriers, and 23 times more drones.
  • Large bases should be replaced by a layered network of warehouses.
  • It is necessary to ensure the protection of arsenals and fuel bases within the range of the Ukrainian Armed Forces' weapons.
…
This is about right, sadly:
Quote:
On the optimistic side, it could be as low as 4-5k monthly net loss, which would take many months to reach depletion of hundreds of thousands.

Russia on the other hand is said to still recruit 30k monthly according to Putin. My best estimate at current Russian losses is 100-200 dead per day, which fluctuatessometimes a little less, sometimes more. This would generate 4500-6000 monthly dead and probably 10-12k total monthly permanent losses (including disabled) which should in theory be easily covered by the mobilizations while retaining a net gain.

Some may ask, by the way, why North Korean troops are necessary in Kursk if Russia is doing 'so well' with troop replenishment. And it is a good question, but my personal take is that the potential North Korean contingents don't have as much to do with troop replenishment as they do with Russia cementing and formalizing the strategic partnership agreements with North Korea as a show of force against NATO.
More at the link, as they say. From the comments, some negotiation as to whether Russia will next strike the gas transmission system (going from Ukraine to Hungary etc). This is critical to European energy storage/heating in the winter. Hopefully not.

All for PR/spin:
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Old Army Ghost
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8:05a, 12/17/24
russia loses another general because he ordered chemical weapon use

Ukraine assassinates Russian chemical weapons chief in Moscow bombing

Kyiv had charged the top general with orchestrating numerous attacks with banned weapons. A few hours later he was dead.

https://www.politico.eu/article/notorious-russian-general-chemical-weapons-chief-killed-moscow-blast-assassination/
Old Army has gone to hell.
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Birdwatcher
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8:19a, 12/17/24
AG
Glory to Ukraine! We must defeat Putin at all costs
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nortex97
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In reply to Old Army Ghost • 8:20a, 12/17/24
AG
I mentioned that, but the real nexus is the biolabs and his investigation of Hunter/Biden crime familia etc. That's why the 'good guys' wanted him dead. Russia hasn't used chemical weapons etc. in Ukraine. And we've shipped plenty of non-compliant with treaties cluster munitions etc. to the UFA, who have generally flailed them against Russian population centers.





This war will be stopped by the new administration, whether the blob likes it or not.
How the blob got the war all started:
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Teslag
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In reply to nortex97 • 8:44a, 12/17/24
AG

Quote:
And we've shipped plenty of non-compliant with treaties cluster munitions etc. to the UFA, who have generally flailed them against Russian population centers.

What's good for the goose...
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Teslag
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In reply to nortex97 • 8:50a, 12/17/24
AG

Quote:
This war will be stopped by the new administration

Yep, Putin is about to get an iron fist of Trump right up his backside. He's no longer dealing with a weak Biden.
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nortex97
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8:59a, 12/17/24
AG
I'm sure the folks celebrating this will be excited to clap for the much more bloody response too.







Forever war. Sad. And make no mistake, the pending loss of the forever war in Ukraine (after our election) is why 'we' had to get rid of pesky Assad finally, to expand war in that adjacent theater.
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Faustus
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In reply to nortex97 • 9:44a, 12/17/24
nortex97 said:
I'm sure the folks celebrating this will be excited to clap for the much more bloody response too.
. . .
Best just Ukraine keep its head down and take its beatings I'm sure.
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Teslag
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In reply to Faustus • 9:56a, 12/17/24
AG
Faustus said:
nortex97 said:
I'm sure the folks celebrating this will be excited to clap for the much more bloody response too.
. . .
Best just Ukraine keep its head down and take its beatings I'm sure.

It's Ukraine's fault for walking down the street in a mini skirt at night.
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J. Walter Weatherman
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In reply to Faustus • 10:11a, 12/17/24
Faustus said:
nortex97 said:
I'm sure the folks celebrating this will be excited to clap for the much more bloody response too.
. . .
Best just Ukraine keep its head down and take its beatings I'm sure.


Definitely. How dare Ukraine actually fight back against a country that invaded them.
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Pepe SiIvia
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In reply to nortex97 • 11:51a, 12/17/24
AG
Epic post! I love how every page you post on takes an extra 40 seconds because you can't not post random tweets no one gives a **** about!
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No Spin Ag
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In reply to Teslag • 12:57p, 12/17/24
Teslag said:
Faustus said:
nortex97 said:
I'm sure the folks celebrating this will be excited to clap for the much more bloody response too.
. . .
Best just Ukraine keep its head down and take its beatings I'm sure.

It's Ukraine's fault for walking down the street in a mini skirt at night.


Nailed it.
There are in fact two things, science and opinion; the former begets knowledge, the later ignorance. Hippocrates
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No Spin Ag
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In reply to Old Army Ghost • 12:57p, 12/17/24
Old Army Ghost said:
russia loses another general because he ordered chemical weapon use

Ukraine assassinates Russian chemical weapons chief in Moscow bombing

Kyiv had charged the top general with orchestrating numerous attacks with banned weapons. A few hours later he was dead.

https://www.politico.eu/article/notorious-russian-general-chemical-weapons-chief-killed-moscow-blast-assassination/


You hate to see it.
There are in fact two things, science and opinion; the former begets knowledge, the later ignorance. Hippocrates
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No Spin Ag
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In reply to J. Walter Weatherman • 12:58p, 12/17/24
J. Walter Weatherman said:
Faustus said:
nortex97 said:
I'm sure the folks celebrating this will be excited to clap for the much more bloody response too.
. . .
Best just Ukraine keep its head down and take its beatings I'm sure.


Definitely. How dare Ukraine actually fight back against a country that invaded them.
There are in fact two things, science and opinion; the former begets knowledge, the later ignorance. Hippocrates
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General Jack D. Ripper
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1:01p, 12/17/24
The only way The Comedian will ever enjoy the money stolen from US taxpayers is if Putin is dead.
I wish I was a messenger, and all the news was good. Eddie V.
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nortex97
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1:09p, 12/17/24
AG
LOL (note, this isn't affiliated with Trump himself, but probably reflective of conservatives overall. Click thru for results live).


Pre-coup Ukrainian President: 'mobilization campaign a failure'
Quote:
In an interview on the Espresso TV channel on Monday, Poroshenko, who was in office from 2014 to 2019, when Ukraine was trying to quell a popular uprising in Donbass following a Western-backed coup in Kiev, criticized the government of Vladimir Zelensky for what he called a botched mobilization drive.

"Take a look at the statistics. How many deserters do we have? Tens of thousands. Why are we forcing people into minibuses and sending them to the front line, who come to the brigades and then flee? In these conditions, we must admit that this idea is discredited and ineffective," Poroshenko said.

Zelensky could rectify the crisis and increase overall motivation by introducing a demobilization process, guaranteeing draftees' rights and keeping those qualified from taking part in assaults, where the risk of dying is the highest, according to the former president.
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GAC06
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1:10p, 12/17/24
AG
Dang, three years in he was just about to blow the biolab case wide open. I guess we'll never know now.
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nortex97
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In reply to GAC06 • 1:30p, 12/17/24
AG
GAC06 said:
Dang, three years in he was just about to blow the biolab case wide open. I guess we'll never know now.
The guy who made this chart just had to die before Trump/RFK etc. are sworn into office.



And yes, he was due to make another report next week, and no, terrorism isn't ok (note his assistant was also killed). Most all of this is already known, just ignored and/or suppressed in our media (long thread).

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GAC06
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In reply to nortex97 • 1:43p, 12/17/24
AG
Whoa you're 100% right. That is a chart.
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Teslag
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In reply to GAC06 • 1:46p, 12/17/24
AG
GAC06 said:
Whoa you're 100% right. That is a chart.


And it only took two random tweets.
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No Spin Ag
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In reply to nortex97 • 1:55p, 12/17/24
nortex97 said:
GAC06 said:
Dang, three years in he was just about to blow the biolab case wide open. I guess we'll never know now.
The guy who made this chart just had to die before Trump/RFK etc. are sworn into office.



And yes, he was due to make another report next week, and no, terrorism isn't ok (note his assistant was also killed). Most all of this is already known, just ignored and/or suppressed in our media (long thread).

If Russia alleges, you know it has to be true and, more importantly, believed (every American Putin sycophant).
There are in fact two things, science and opinion; the former begets knowledge, the later ignorance. Hippocrates
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nortex97
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In reply to GAC06 • 1:58p, 12/17/24
AG
GAC06 said:
Whoa you're 100% right. That is a chart.
Correct. There are more. Bidens, Daszak, Ecohealth, Coronavirus, bats, Rosemont Seneca, Nathan Wolfe, Ghislaine Maxwell, In-q-tel, The Ukrainian ministry of defense.





It's all there. The 'good guys.'
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