https://www.foxnews.com/us/former-classmate-recalls-trump-shooter-grilling-him-over-support-former-potus-did-not-like-politicians.amp

Ragnar Danneskjoldd said:

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Aggie Therapist said:

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Ragnar Danneskjoldd said:

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nai06 said:

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As more information comes up, I'm leaning towards this wasn't actually politically motivated at all. Seems like the shooter was depressed and wanted to go out in a way that would make people remember him. Trump happened to be the most convenient target that he had looked at. It's like suicide by cop but in an extreme manner.


I just find the whole thing sad.

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what information came up that led you to this? I haven't seen them release practically anything about the kid or how this happened. Just the SS blaming the locals. Why did a depressed kid have an encrypted cellphone?

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Because kids are smart as hell these days. Mental health issues don't make you stupid. He was hyper-fixated and on a mission.

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Dont understand what you mean? His intelligence has nothing to do as to why he has an encrypted cellphone. For what purpose?

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Is it really that hard to obtain an encrypted cell phones?

Honestly asking. I could reach out to a friend who is a pretty squared away signal officer and a professor at Colorado School of Mines who eats this stuff up.

I'll let you know what he says for discussion sake

THIS IS LONG SORRY

I appreciate the response. My hope was that this thread be a little more even tempered as opposed to what you might find on the politics board



This is what I understand so far. But if you have seen otherwise, please let me know! I would like to get understand as much as possible and new information can change my views. I'll post links to everything I' have read below

-The guy was not overtly political according to his classmates. He definitely supported conservative views, but wasn't radical by any means

-he tried out and didn't make his HS rifle team (twice i think). He was asked not to come back because they felt he was unsafe. Not because he was mentally unstable, but because he was just a really bad shot.

-he regularly wore camo clothes to school and didn't have a ton of friends.

-He was by all accounts pretty smart and friendly, with one person noting he was always happy to help explain class material

-He worked at Nursing home (in the kitchen). I don't see a lot of uncaring people in that line of work, especially for someone his age.

-He was a regular member of his local gun club and went there often for range practice with his dad

-He was wearing a Demolition Ranch tshirt when this happened. Demolition Ranch sounds scary but its a really popular youtube account focused on guns and shooting sports. I would compare it to the old Discovery Channel show American Guns. Its a place to see different types of guns in action especially rare, expensive, or unusual ones. It is NOT what I would associate with a radical element, Nazi, Accelerationists, extremists, etc. Basically guns and things go boom=entertainment.

-To my knowledge he did not have any special encrypted phone. The one pictured looks like a standard iphone or android and it was noted as being a newer model. All phones today have some basic enryption/password protection and I suspect that might be what you are referring to? In any case, the FBI was able to access the phone and his laptop

-He had searched for images of Trump and Biden (and saved them to his phone, along with info on the Trump rally and the Democratic National Convention. He also had saved photos of Merrick Garland, Mike Johnson, Fani Willis, Hakeem Jeffries, Christopher Wray, and members of the Royal Family.

-He also searched for info on Major Depressive Disorders

-Most of the searches and saved photos date back to the spring

-He appears to have had good yet distant relationships with his parents who were both Licensed Counselors in PA.

-Back in February had been accepted to the University of Pittsburgh as transfer student for the Fall 2024. A month later in March he changed his mind and withdrew his application.

-After the rally was announced Crooks visited the site twice before the day of the rally

-He had an explosive device/explosive materials in his car and a commercially available transmitter on his person. (I have seen conflicting reports that he also had explosives on him)

-Earlier in the day he went to home depot to buy a ladder and a gun store to purchase ammo.

-He drove to the event and used a bike to ride around outside to scope it out.

- One to three hours before the event he was stopped at a security check point for carrying a range finder. I've seen it described as a golf range finder so I am guessing its the monocular variety and deemed as suspicious but otherwise allowed to move freely.

-A SS source has recently revealed that he was able to hid the rifle ahead of time. That checks out since we know the building was not part of the secure area

-What happened when he climbed onto the roof is a little unclear. People obviously spotted him and reported him. Some reports say police went to confront him but backed down the ladder when he pointed the rifle at them. Others say police didn't do anything. We know he took 5-8 shots and was taken out by counter snipers in roughly 3 seconds.

-It has been reported that Crooks was deemed a threat about 10 minutes prior to the shooting but Trump was not removed from the stage.

-He had very little online social media presence. That it becoming more common with conservative youths. When compared to their liberal or liberal leaning counterparts, conservative youths tend to have a much smaller online social media footprint.

So where does that leave us? To me he comes across as a pretty average conservative young adult who was smart and a little weird in high school. Not a ton of friends but not an antisocial monster either. He probably had a caring family that maybe didn't see the signs he was depressed. Since he wasn't in a high school setting there probably weren't a lot of others that could notice the signs either outside of his work in the care home. I have to think that people in that line of work also tend to be caring and compassionate, but how well to your really know all of your coworkers?

An educated guess is that something changed for him personally earlier this year in the spring. He declined his acceptance to college and starts searching dates and photos for notable politicians. I think he made the decision to end his life and saw this as a way to do it. It solved a couple of issues for him. He had to have known this would end with him dying. You don't take on the USSS and expect to live. So doing this:
1. Ends his life
2. Makes sure he isn't the one to do it.
3. Guarantees he will not be forgotten when he is gone.


It's also very clear to me that there were some colossal **** ups by the secret service (and probably local police). They head of USSS should have resigned already IMO. This guy got way to close and had he not missed a former president and current candidate would be dead. That is inexcusable and honestly I am thankful Trump survived.

I might despise Trump and think he has no business being near the oval office, but I don't want him assassinated. I don't want any shot and killed, especially politicians. Political violence begets political violence. Had Trump been assassinated, I think you would have seen some retaliatory attacks, regardless of who the shooter was. Most politicians realize that so that is why you have seen pretty strong condemnations across the board

Anyways are a **** ton of links. I've have tried to be broad in what I am reading in terms of sources and reliability.
https://www.theverge.com/2024/7/15/24199239/fbi-encryption-phone-trump-shooter-pennsylvania-gained-access

https://www.inquirer.com/news/pennsylvania/thomas-matthew-crooks-trump-shooting-bethel-park-20240714.html

https://nypost.com/2024/07/17/us-news/thomas-matthew-crooks-cell-phone-and-transmitter-found-next-to-trump-would-be-assassin-body/

https://nypost.com/2024/07/18/us-news/trump-shooter-thomas-crooks-may-have-suffered-from-mental-illness/

https://www.wpxi.com/news/local/wpxi-exclusive-photos-show-cell-phone-transmitter-found-next-trump-shooters-body/CDQGAB4ZXNCINEGXNAYHAKTJFQ/

https://www.foxnews.com/us/trump-shooter-told-boss-he-needed-day-off-before-assassination-attempt-gave-three-word-reason-report

https://abc7chicago.com/post/trump-assassination-attempt-thomas-matthew-crooks-searched-dnc-chicago/15066011/

https://www.washingtonpost.com/nation/2024/07/18/trump-rally-shooter-phone-searches-biden-depression/

https://www.cnn.com/2024/07/17/politics/thomas-matthew-crooks-trump-shooter/index.html

https://www.newsweek.com/thomas-matthew-crooks-donald-trump-mental-health-parents-1926425

https://www.fox26houston.com/news/thomas-matthew-crooks-hid-rifle-advance-trump-rally-sniper-attack

Ragnar Danneskjoldd said:

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Aggie Therapist said:

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Ragnar Danneskjoldd said:

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nai06 said:

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As more information comes up, I'm leaning towards this wasn't actually politically motivated at all. Seems like the shooter was depressed and wanted to go out in a way that would make people remember him. Trump happened to be the most convenient target that he had looked at. It's like suicide by cop but in an extreme manner.


I just find the whole thing sad.

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what information came up that led you to this? I haven't seen them release practically anything about the kid or how this happened. Just the SS blaming the locals. Why did a depressed kid have an encrypted cellphone?

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Because kids are smart as hell these days. Mental health issues don't make you stupid. He was hyper-fixated and on a mission.

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Dont understand what you mean? His intelligence has nothing to do as to why he has an encrypted cellphone. For what purpose?

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iPhones and Android phones are both encrypted by default. Everyone has an encrypted phone.

Saying his phone is encrypted is about as shocking as saying his phone has text messaging.

In my experience, high school kids just don't give a **** about politics, or at least not a much as adult do. They certainly done care as much about politics as we think they do, even in an election year.

I'll also add that I have taught plenty of kids in High School that were just like Crooks. Smart, friendly, loyal, and a little bit weird. Not bad kids in anyway, just a little awkward socially. Some liberal some conservative, a lot with no discernible political views. None of them ended up being school shooters, attempted assassins, or otherwise violent people. They graduated, found their niche and continue to live their lives. Some are more productive and successful than others, but generally just regular people.

I was thinking about a former student (lets call him David).that could have fit the profile of Crooks to a T. He came from a very conservative family and only had a few friends at school. He was smart, did well in my class, contributed conservative views to class discussions, no behavior problems, etc. His parents also wouldn't allow him on social media or to have a cell phone. I always asked my students if they did anything fun over the weekend and he once told the class he went to a pro-life concert. Obviously not my scene but I showed genuine interest and he seemed to enjoy himself. He was always respectful and what I would call a genuinely good kid. Just a run of the mill high schooler trying to find his way in the world and where he fit.

Anyways Steve graduated and went on to join the military like many of his extended family had. He finished his basic training about two years ago and is now a Marine. We still keep in touch via social media and he still reaches out to ask my perspective on all sort of things, including politics. He just ended up being a regular guy like so many other people.


I think that is what concerns me about Crooks. From my perspective he seemed to be just a regular guy that had a shift in his life. He turned towards violence instead of seeking help.

Not to derail the thread:

But If he ended up having some sort of depressive disorder or mental illness, a longer conversation needs to be had about how we treat individuals in this country who suffer from mental illness. I don't just mean therapy vs medication vs institutionalization. We unfairly stigmatize mental illness when it is so common. We scare people away from getting help or make it prohibitively expensive. In my experience that tends to affect men and young boys more than women and young girls. And generally speaking, when me act out its in favor of aggressive actions or violence.

According to his former classmate he was very political. Link posted at top of page.

I've seen statements from a few different classmates some felt he was very conservative and others didn't know where he leaned politically. When I say he wasn't overtly political, I was meaning that he didn't appear to be an activist of any kind or at that level. As in it wasn't a core part of his personality or public persona. That seems to be a general consensus
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I also don't know how much bullying played into things either so I left that out. Some classmates said he was bullied a lot others said it really wasn't worse than anyone else. I'm not convinced that he was heavily bullied is an accurate statement right now.

That's entirely possible.

Have you seen any evidence to support that so far with crooks?



I am honestly trying to be open minded about this as possible. If he was a secret progressive who's plan was to take out Trump so he couldn't win in November, I want to know.

Based on what we know at the moment, I actually think Occam's Razor points to him NOT trying to take out Trump to save the world.

Seems less likely that you would have a political extremist that is both choosing to hide whatever political message he was trying to convey AND he was able to successfully conceal his affiliation.

Of course more info will come out and we will learn more. I wouldn't be surprised if you turned out to be right. But right now I think nai's explanation seems simpler.

Well there were multiple shooters soooo...

Anyone that tries to blow the head off a former president has issues. I thought that went without saying. But all of this vitriol directed at Trump is likely what harnessed those issues in a direction. Clearly he's not actually saving the world, but in his 20 year old dumbass nutter mind, he is

Very reasonable hypothesis. May turn out to be true.

Riiiight....he missed Trump's brain by inches by mistake. He was actually aiming for the pigeon flying 15 feet above his head and to the left.

He just is THAT bad of a shot and a Trump rally is the best place to go pigeon hunting.

It is absolutely hilarious to see leftists and concerned "moderates" twisting themselves in circles and knots trying to convince themselves that 8 years of the media and the celebrities they worship calling Trump a dictator, tyrant, and publicly saying he should be killed in the MSM and by celebrities didn't lead to this exact moment.

The denial and cognitive dissonance yall have is astounding.

Ags4DaWin said:

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Riiiight....me missed Trump's brain by inches by mistake. He was actually aiming for the pigeon flying 15 feet above his head and to the left.

He just is THAT bad of a shot and a Trump rally is the best place to go pigeon hunting.

It is absolutely hilarious to see leftists and concerned "moderates" twisting themselves in circles and knots trying to convince themselves that 8 years of the media and the celebrities they worship calling Trump a dictator, tyrant, and publicly saying he should be killed in the MSM and by celebrities didn't lead to this exact moment.

The denial and cognitive dissonance yall have is astounding.

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So what do you believe happened?

Ags4DaWin said:

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Riiiight....me missed Trump's brain by inches by mistake. He was actually aiming for the pigeon flying 15 feet above his head and to the left.

He just is THAT bad of a shot and a Trump rally is the best place to go pigeon hunting.

It is absolutely hilarious to see leftists and concerned "moderates" twisting themselves in circles and knots trying to convince themselves that 8 years of the media and the celebrities they worship calling Trump a dictator, tyrant, and publicly saying he should be killed in the MSM and by celebrities didn't lead to this exact moment.

The denial and cognitive dissonance yall have is astounding.

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My comments were only about Occam's Razor.

Just because a hypothesis has more elements doesn't mean it's a bad hypothesis. Might even be the best hypothesis. But if it has more dots to connect then it's not the one that Occam's Razor would favor.

Also there's no requirement to use Occam's Razor for this situation or any other. In fact there is probably really good reason to NOT use it in the assassination attempt investigation. It takes a LOT of dots to connect for China or Russia to be behind it but I bet that was one of the first things they looked into.

Ags4DaWin said:

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Riiiight....me missed Trump's brain by inches by mistake. He was actually aiming for the pigeon flying 15 feet above his head and to the left.

He just is THAT bad of a shot and a Trump rally is the best place to go pigeon hunting.

It is absolutely hilarious to see leftists and concerned "moderates" twisting themselves in circles and knots trying to convince themselves that 8 years of the media and the celebrities they worship calling Trump a dictator, tyrant, and publicly saying he should be killed in the MSM and by celebrities didn't lead to this exact moment.

The denial and cognitive dissonance yall have is astounding.

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Sounds just like someone who spend 70% of their Texags posts on a politics board. Hello, permaignore.

bagger05 said:

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Ags4DaWin said:

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Riiiight....me missed Trump's brain by inches by mistake. He was actually aiming for the pigeon flying 15 feet above his head and to the left.

He just is THAT bad of a shot and a Trump rally is the best place to go pigeon hunting.

It is absolutely hilarious to see leftists and concerned "moderates" twisting themselves in circles and knots trying to convince themselves that 8 years of the media and the celebrities they worship calling Trump a dictator, tyrant, and publicly saying he should be killed in the MSM and by celebrities didn't lead to this exact moment.

The denial and cognitive dissonance yall have is astounding.

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My comments were only about Occam's Razor.

Just because a hypothesis has more elements doesn't mean it's a bad hypothesis. Might even be the best hypothesis. But if it has more dots to connect then it's not the one that Occam's Razor would favor.

Also there's no requirement to use Occam's Razor for this situation or any other. In fact there is probably really good reason to NOT use it in the assassination attempt investigation. It takes a LOT of dots to connect for China or Russia to be behind it but I bet that was one of the first things they looked into.

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They didn't even look into securing a roof within shooting distance. You think they have already looked into Russia and China angles?

He is proposing that the shooter leans slightly conservative and had intentions other than an assassination.

The issue that I have is with the claim that the kid leans conservative. Because it makes zero sense and we have sources that also outright claim the opposite. All claims he was conservative are wishy washy at best while we have other credible witnesses that describe political arguments they had with the shooter where he passionately took leftist positions.

We know he scoped out the area at least once, probably 2-3 times based on cell phone pings.

Based on what we know he was either there to cause a mass shooting event or to try to kill the president.

No manifesto was found yet.

The bull**** that the kid leaned conservative makes zero sense for either scenario and it's a narrative the MSM likes to push at the outset of every incident like this to try to demonize the right and the 2nd amendment.

They do this in spite of the fact that 80% of politically motivated mass shooters are strict leftists.

So scenario 1) Shooter wanted to have a mass shooting event at a conservative/Trump rally. He got found out before he could start shooting into the crowd, panicked when he was spotted, took a shot at trump and got taken out before he could really start firing into the crowd. Fair enough.

BUTIf he was right leaning as the MSM and nai06 is claiming then why in the hell would he target conservatives, the very ideology the MSM is trying to pin on him. Makes no sense. Very illogical, even if you are talking about a crazy person.

Scenario 2- he was trying to assassinate Trump. If he was right leaning why would he try to assassinate the party nominee who looks very likely to defeat Biden?

My issue is not with the theories.

It's about the MOTIVATION for the theories.

When there is a mass shooting event, everyone likes to first try to pin it on conservatives and people who like to morally preen like to make it look like it is not only the POS shooter who was evil and conservative but all conservatives who want to protect the evil 2nd amendment are also lumped together with the shooter because they are conservatives too.

It's an attempt to create a guilt by association between conservatives, the shooter, and the 2nd amendment in an attempt to make conservatives look bad and further erode 2nd amendment protections and at the same time virtue signal.

It's sad. It's pathetic. It's profoundly dishonest. And it happens every time there is a mass shooting until the truth comes out that the shooter was a profound leftist.

And then all media coverage of the shooter disappears. And then the media uses the survivor's as a political tool to go after firearms manufacturers and supporters of the second amendment.

It is just profoundly funny to watch the MSM and the typical virtue signallers try to use that same playbook here.

He was a conservative like all those evil 2nd amendment defenders so he wanted to shoot fellow conservatives in a mass shooting event

he was a conservative so he wanted to assassinate the republican nominee...ya know...for reasons. See how evil conservative ideology is and how much it promotes violence?

Yeah the MSM and CM's and leftists have spent 8 years saying how Trump was a tyrant and a dictator who needed to be killed. Hell Kathy Griffin got a standing ovation for holding a beheaded and bloody Trump in effigy. We have spent 8 years advocating for violence against conservatives. But now we need you CONSERVATIVES to tone down the rhetoric because your rhetoric brainwashed this conservative kid to try to assassinate a conservative

^^these are the arguments and the propaganda that's being put out and it's hilarious to watch the same political hacks and the MSM try to pin this act on conservatives instead of owning the fact that their own brand of hateful rhetoric is inciting violence^^

Proposition Joe said:

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Ags4DaWin said:

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Riiiight....me missed Trump's brain by inches by mistake. He was actually aiming for the pigeon flying 15 feet above his head and to the left.

He just is THAT bad of a shot and a Trump rally is the best place to go pigeon hunting.

It is absolutely hilarious to see leftists and concerned "moderates" twisting themselves in circles and knots trying to convince themselves that 8 years of the media and the celebrities they worship calling Trump a dictator, tyrant, and publicly saying he should be killed in the MSM and by celebrities didn't lead to this exact moment.

The denial and cognitive dissonance yall have is astounding.

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While nai06 certainly seems to skate around the simple concept of "he was a depressed, impressionable youth and the media has been telling him 24/7 that Trump is Hitler" (whether or not that was his actual reasoning, it's certainly one of the more likely ones, especially absent any other "reason"), in no way did he imply the polar opposite of "it was all just a misunderstanding!".

You don't do your case any justice when you use strawman extremes.

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That's a very fair assessment of my thinking. And you're right, I didn't mention that in my post.

If he was a he was a depressed impressionable youth that was convinced by the media Trump "is LITERALLY hitler", I have a hard time squaring that with someone who by all accounts was a pretty average conservative guy. I don't deny that it's possible, but it just seems unlikely to me. Especially since it looks like he was looking for any high profile target.


In looking back at my post, I think I made an assumption that may be premature. I mentioned that I thought something happened this past spring that set this all into motion. He started all of the internet searches and declined is spot at Pitt in the fall. I don't think I can assume there was a specific event that triggered all of these actions. It could be a simple as that's when he finally decided to end his life.

All of things point to him being conservative in his views:

-Statements from classmates
-Demo Ranch Tshirt
-Conservative father
-Trump signs previously in the lawn
-Member of a gun club
-Regularly practiced at the range
-Active interest in fire arms
-registered Republican

All of these things point to him being liberal in his views
-Made a $15 donation to Act Blue in 2021
EDIT: Updates below
-Tried to kill Donald Trump
-a former classmate said he had a disdain for all politicians including Trump
(I'm putting this here even though the interview linked, quoted the student as saying he felt like Trump is/was a good president and Crooks insinuated he was stupid for thinking that. That same classmate also said the conversation took place in 2016, before Trump was elected)



So help me expand on the second list. What have you seen that leads you to believe he wasn't conservative in his views?

bagger05 said:

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Well he tried to kill Donald Trump. I think we need to throw that into the "evidence he might be liberal" column.

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lotta posters on this thread working really hard to ignore the colossal elephant that pretty much occupies the entire room. Weird take.

IT DOESN"T MATTER WHAT HIS POLITICAL BACKGROUND IS

Or at most, matters very little.

He was mentally ill, desperate, suicidal, something like that is MUCH MORE likely to be the main influence.

Now that is just my opinion based on the history of similar assassinations and attempts and what has been publicly shared online. I could be wrong, but I strongly feel mental illness related behaviors are MOST likely.

If his phone does not have any recording of his personal thoughts and motivations, and no note is found, and no friend steps forward with more info - then unfortunately this will forever be ripe for conspiracy theories and politically fueled nonsense.

Speaking of mental illness, the people that politicize EVERYTHING, who view an entire segment of America as out to destroy our nation based on how they voted, who talks politics all the time and spout talking points and buzzwords -I think that is a form of at least undesirable personality traits, if not a form of mental illness related to fear of control/fear of power/lack of personal control/etc. I think it's pretty easily treatable from many - disconnect from online political discussions, disconnect from 24 hour news networks, try to read voting histories/platforms/listen to audio of candidates with no one providing live reactions/etc.

Thanks. I can appreciate I have blind spots

Updated the list.

And there were other classmates who said he hated trump, as we have previously discussed.

Do you have a link to those interviews? I haven't read them yet.

The other point I'll make is that the shooter's background and motivations are mildly relevant in the grand scheme of things. Somewhat of a red herring.

The bigger issue is that security detail made errors that 18 year old grunts 2 weeks out of basic wouldn't make. The real question is whether it was a comedy of incompetence or a deliberate hit.

I am leaning towards the lesser know Hanlon's Razor

"Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity."

nai06 said:

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Do you have a link to those interviews? I haven't read them yet.

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Go to the top of this page.

ThunderCougarFalconBird said:

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bagger05 said:

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Well he tried to kill Donald Trump. I think we need to throw that into the "evidence he might be liberal" column.

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lotta posters on this thread working really hard to ignore the colossal elephant that pretty much occupies the entire room. Weird take.

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A lot of posters in this thread also ignoring that a lot of conservatives don't like Trump...