LIV and PGA Tour Merging

45,513 Views | 705 Replies | Last: 1 yr ago by Big Cat `93
AgLA06
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In reply to 98Ag99Grad • 1:39p, 6/9/23
AG
98Ag99Grad said:
PIP is probably going away. The whole thing about this being a private company now is the players can have equity. That's how guys like Rory, Tiger, etc will be taken care of.


Agreed. I don't see fines of any real substance happening.
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BreNayPop
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1:41p, 6/9/23
AG
There is no way they won't punish those guys in some
fashion… deserved or not. Because if they bring those guys back sans significant and specified benefit to the other players (or punishment for those guys), then the rest of the players will unionize. That was the threat floated yesterday. And none of LIV/PGA/DP want unionized players.
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MarathonAg12
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In reply to RogerFurlong • 1:43p, 6/9/23

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PJYoung
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1:43p, 6/9/23
AG
I think they will do something to keep the peace and reward the players that didn't jump.

I personally don't care one way or the other.

I love that the LIV players got paid huge $ from Saudi Arabian sources and now get to come back and play on the regular tour if they so choose. I love that the golf world will be unified once again.

I get a sense that the PIF wanted a seat at the table and a say in professional golf. They don't necessarily want to run the whole thing and they will be happy with the PGAT controlling things operationally.

But as well say, we will see what the future holds.
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XpressAg09
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1:47p, 6/9/23
AG
https://www.instagram.com/reel/CtM45RHA4fH/?igshid=MzRlODBiNWFlZA==
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RogerFurlong
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In reply to 98Ag99Grad • 1:54p, 6/9/23
That's a pretty good idea. You can qualify for equity. That'd be a pretty sweet deal to keep the big money draws playing late in their career.
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MarathonAg12
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In reply to XpressAg09 • 1:55p, 6/9/23
Man that was great.

I can't wait until next week
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MarathonAg12
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1:59p, 6/9/23
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cb1919
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In reply to JCA1 • 6:42p, 6/9/23
AG
JCA1 said:
Supposedly the details of the deal as relayed by its architect, Jimmy Dunne. According to this, Monahan will be in charge of both the PGAT and LIV and can disband LIV if he so chooses. Also makes it sound like not much is really happening at present. The deal is primarily forward looking, with the PIF being the Tour's exclusive investor going forward. Who knows.

https://www.si.com/golf/news/jimmy-dunne-the-architect-of-the-pga-tour-liv-golf-deal-lays-out-the-details


LIV is 100% going away. The PIF didn't sign up to invest billions of dollars into the PGA tour to keep writing blank checks to run LIV.
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Sea Speed
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In reply to Aggie369 • 8:53p, 6/9/23
AG
Aggie369 said:
Funny to watch people take such strong stances...


Funny since you've been in the conversation since day 1 and people have been SUPER hard stance about the whole thing from the get go. Pretty wild to see some of the visceral reactions of people here.
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98Ag99Grad
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9:37p, 6/9/23
AG
https://www.espn.com/golf/story/_/id/37827782/jimmy-dunne-outlines-plan-pga-tour-loyalists-liv-players-want-back

Here's the equity talk. That could be some serious cash.
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Hou-Ag
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6:09p, 6/10/23
AG

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Cowboy Curtis
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6:23p, 6/10/23
AG
My spidey sense tells me Rory was apart of the LIV plan all along.
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mavsfan4ever
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In reply to Cowboy Curtis • 8:40p, 6/10/23
AG
Huh? You're going to have to explain this one.
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clobby
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9:06p, 6/10/23
AG
I vote they keep a handful of LIV events across the world and have some team draft every season or before the events.
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AggieAL1
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9:10p, 6/10/23
So you take an old entity that admits it has no long-term financial viability under new payout procedures. You combine it with a new entity that admits it has not made a dime in its first two years and can show no prospects for ever doing so. And you call it a "for profit organization."

Could someone explain from where that profit is to come.
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Chipotlemonger
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In reply to AggieAL1 • 12:37a, 6/11/23
AG
Going forward, there won't need to be 9 figure payouts to players to get them to jump tours (I hope). That cost removal takes care of a lot of your question I think.
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Seven Costanza
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8:15a, 6/11/23
AG
I don't really understand what the agreement is at this point. Is it possible that it's actually nothing and basically a truce that allows the Saudis to safe face by appearing that they're joining forces with the PGA when it reality they're just folding a failed league, and the PGA Tour is onboard with the agreement to see LIV go away as quickly as possible?
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cb1919
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8:52a, 6/11/23
AG
I'm curious how forwarded thinking the PIF was. The lit $1.5-$2.0 billion on fire to create the LIV Tour, which wasn't commercially viable. On the other side, they were enough of a pain in the ass to the tour that they got the meeting to get us to where we are today. A meeting they probably tried to get before starting LIV. Now LIV goes away and they have a major stake in the PGA Tour. It's funny, but it's literally Michael Scott Paper Company.
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98Ag99Grad
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In reply to cb1919 • 9:57a, 6/11/23
AG
LIV was either going to take over golf or fail. Either way the Saudis would eventually get their wish of being in golf. When you have half a trillion dollars at your disposal you can force your way in to anything really. I read yesterday the PGAT already spent close to $100M on legal fees in addition to the money they were blowing on increased purses and pip incentives.
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Aggie369
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In reply to 98Ag99Grad • 12:14p, 6/11/23
AG
PGAT was estimating having to spend 400 million in legal fees

Saudi is basically the major sponsor of PGAT with a seat at the table. So yes...LIV goes away, legal battle (that PGAT was going to eventually win) goes away, Saudi saves face, PGAT gets huge influx of sponsor dollars
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DannyDuberstein
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12:20p, 6/11/23
AG
Yep, PIF/Saudis want legitimacy. You get that via the PGAT and its history vs some trumped up idea. How exactly they stick a fork in LIV, how quickly, and how the player financial commitments work/change, I'm not sure. But regardless of some of Norman's comments, it's gonna go away because a separate tour was not the real ultimate goal. LIV was a tool, not the goal.
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Seven Costanza
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In reply to Aggie369 • 6:22p, 6/11/23
AG
Aggie369 said:
PGAT was estimating having to spend 400 million in legal fees

Saudi is basically the major sponsor of PGAT with a seat at the table. So yes...LIV goes away, legal battle (that PGAT was going to eventually win) goes away, Saudi saves face, PGAT gets huge influx of sponsor dollars


Being a sponsor doesn't make sense to me since there aren't any products or services that they are marketing. I understand they want legitimacy, but "PGA Tour brought to you by the Saudi Public Investment Fund" doesn't really accomplish anything. I suppose it could soften their image over the extreme long term, but in the immediate term it would just rekindle negative thoughts every time they are discussed (for most people, I assume).
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DannyDuberstein
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In reply to Seven Costanza • 6:28p, 6/11/23
AG
They won't need their name on it. Their name isn't on LIV. The euro football clubs owned by Saudis/gulf states aren't that way either. But folks know whats up. What it does buy is access and influence.
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Seven Costanza
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6:33p, 6/11/23
AG
I guess it's shortsighted on my part, but it just doesn't do anything for me. We already know they have a ton of money and can buy anything. If they simply want to diversify their portfolio, that makes sense; but the legitimacy aspect isn't registering with me.
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ChemAg15
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6:11a, 6/12/23
AG
Saudi Arabia is trying to modernize and rebrand itself as a tourist destination before their oil money runs out. They're building cities, starting their own airline, buying sports teams, etc. LIV was just a way for Saudi to get a foothold in professional golf. I'm sure the new PGAT will have some events in Saudi.
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WhoopN06
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7:50a, 6/14/23
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MarathonAg12
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In reply to ChemAg15 • 7:56a, 6/14/23
ChemAg15 said:
Saudi Arabia is trying to modernize and rebrand itself as a tourist destination before their oil money runs out. They're building cities, starting their own airline, buying sports teams, etc. LIV was just a way for Saudi to get a foothold in professional golf. I'm sure the new PGAT will have some events in Saudi.


Yep. Parents are over there and have been for 10 years.

They have all sorts of plans and mega cities they are building. My mom was one of the first women to receive a driver's license in the KSA. Women can drive now!!! This was only a few years ago too lol
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cb1919
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In reply to WhoopN06 • 8:11a, 6/14/23
AG
WhoopN06 said:


Damn they've been parters for like a week and the Saudis are already trying to take him out!
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AgLA06
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In reply to cb1919 • 10:01a, 6/14/23
AG
cb1919 said:
WhoopN06 said:


Damn they've been parters for like a week and the Saudis are already trying to take him out!


Saudis don't try. They just do.
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ColoradoMooseHerd
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In reply to ChemAg15 • 7:07p, 6/14/23
ChemAg15 said:
Saudi Arabia is trying to modernize and rebrand itself as a tourist destination before their oil money runs out.
Their money is going to run out? Not in our lifetimes
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ChemAg15
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In reply to ColoradoMooseHerd • 7:40p, 6/14/23
AG
ColoradoMooseHerd said:
ChemAg15 said:
Saudi Arabia is trying to modernize and rebrand itself as a tourist destination before their oil money runs out.
Their money is going to run out? Not in our lifetimes


Correct. Saudi's vision goes beyond our lifetimes.
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P.H. Dexippus
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10:41a, 6/15/23
AG
Uh oh. DOJ to investigate merger for antitrust violation?

Quote:
The Justice Department has notified the PGA Tour that it will review the Tour's planned merger with LIV Golf's Saudi backers for antitrust concerns, people familiar with the matter said, initiating a regulatory obstacle to the stunning deal that the warring golf bodies hope will stabilize the divided sport.

A review by the Justice Departmentwhich had already been investigating the PGA Tour and other leading golf bodies for anticompetitive behaviorintroduces uncertainty to the planned joint venture between the PGA Tour and Saudi Arabia's Public Investment Fund. It also makes it probable that any transaction that is hammered out between the rivals won't take effect for some time.
-per WSJ (paywall)

https://www.sbnation.com/golf/2023/6/15/23761363/pga-tour-liv-golf-senator-letter-castigates

And of all the things that the DOJ could/should be investigating, it's this?
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Buck Compton
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In reply to P.H. Dexippus • 10:44a, 6/15/23
AG
P.H. Dexippus said:
Uh oh. DOJ to investigate merger for antitrust violation?
DOJ needs to sit down and shut up. God, I hate the government.

How could this possibly be any different than the NFL or any other league? Why was the PGA not investigated for Anti-trust before the split? We're essentially just returning to exactly how it was.
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AgLA06
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In reply to Buck Compton • 10:59a, 6/15/23
AG
The PGAT did have an antitrust investigation from the DOJ. Supposedly.
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