Stained concrete is a big no no.

Rainwater collection for water is a much wiser choice.

Heat and air with ductless units

Tankless hot water. Propane, not electric.

I only mentioned it because my dad and I were guests a couple of times at a place that used a barndo for the hunting lodge before I knew what they were. Because the public area was so cavernous it felt weird walking into a standard height room from there.

Didn't mean any disrespect.

Why, exactly, is stained concrete a big no no? In planning our build, we don't want to put down any flooring. Rugs? Yes. Flooring? No.

Stained concrete is a viable option for flooring. It is not "maintenance free" as you need to maintain a wearing surface with wax.

Some people are scared of the permanent nature of it, but personally when we build, all common areas will be stained. I was in that industry for 13 years, so I have a pretty strong background with it.

AgLA06 - I didn't read any disrespect in that. We were already a bit worried about it and your comment happened to come in between us looking for a solution and us finding a solution. If anything, you helped motivate me to figure out a solution, so, much appreciations sir.

Wadd96 - I have the same question. Until now I've only heard good things about stained concrete.

That's what I understood about it as well. Does take maintenance.

Reality it's it is an inexpensive flooring option that looks really nice. My other idea is integral color slab and grind/polish the floor when done correctly, my biggest suggestion is for the stain to be purchased at a supply house (ram tool, white cap, or CMC) and not from a big box store (I have very little experience with the material from Sherwin Williams outside of a debacle I was called in to fix) but I believe that was an installer issue, not a product issue.

Is that pipe magnetized?

EagleFordEarl said:

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Is that pipe magnetized?

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Haven't checked yet but I give it a 50/50.

I've read you can wrap the ground lead a few times around the pipe to offset the magnatisim

I've also read you can pre heat sometimes, and that will take care of it.

If both of those fail, I may have to drag my MIG out there as I don't have AC stick machine

Do you have any experience dealing with welding magnetized? what are the tricks that work?

Per welding instructors, you'll never truly "weld" it if it's magnetized. But since you're not carrying load or pressures you can get it to stick pretty well. I make all of our H braces and corner H's at work out of old 3.5" oil field pipe. If you've got it lined up right, your puddle will damn near jump to itself when you strike an arc, when it's crosswise you have to jack with it quite a bit to establish your first connection/bead. Once I can get two pieces to connect I'll move to the other side of the run and it usually plays nice, but getting it to make that first connection can try your patience. Tight saddles will make everything easier.

Have a some family and friends coming in this weekend so we are a definite go on red iron this weekend.

Got all of the piers for the lean-to and porch columns drilled this weekend, will pour after red iron is up.

Wife and I got 2 pairs of rafters bolted together last night after work and set aside for this weekend.

Also, the OP has been updated with overall concept pictures and a little better resolution floorplan (hopefully)

That looks awesome. I'm very interested in your progress, might be planning something like this myself in the future.

Can't tell from the drawings, but do you have an air gap between the exterior wall sheets and the living space? My brother-in-law built one of these structures and left about a 6" gap for air circulation between the exterior and interior walls. It made a tremendous difference in cooling costs (as compared to his neighbor that built his with just insulation between the metal sheeting and studs/drywall.

Now, there's occasionally a critter that scampers back there, so that's the downside.

Is yours 100% bolt up? And are they torque to yield/lejeune bolts?

Hardware cloth will stop critters

I've heard this is good.

Stuf-fit Copper Mesh For Mouse Rat Rodent Control as well as Bat
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00149P89E/ref=cm_sw_r_sms_awdb_t1_3L3GAb3W47704

Marvin said:

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Can't tell from the drawings, but do you have an air gap between the exterior wall sheets and the living space? My brother-in-law built one of these structures and left about a 6" gap for air circulation between the exterior and interior walls. It made a tremendous difference in cooling costs (as compared to his neighbor that built his with just insulation between the metal sheeting and studs/drywall.

Now, there's occasionally a critter that scampers back there, so that's the downside.

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Working from the outside in:

1. Metal building sheeting

2. 8" wall purlin

3. 2x4 wood wall framing

4. drywall


The living area will be spray foam insulated. I believe that will go directly on the inside of the metal building sheeting. The spray foam will hopefully close up any cracks and crevices from the outside. One the framing is up, I am going to figure out a way to critter-proof the shop-house interface. The products above have been noted (thanks guys!)

So before insulation there is a 11.5" air gap, should be plenty after insulation (8.5 - 9.5"?).

Quote:

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Is yours 100% bolt up? And are they toque to yield/lejeune bolts?

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The building is 100% bolt up. The lean-to's (porch, parking area, and shop lean-to) are all weld up. The bolts are nothing fancy (A325 I think). Looks like they try to design the connections to be mostly in compression so bolt torque isn't a major concern. Reading through their install manual, the most detailed they get is -

Quote:

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Joints not subject to tension loads need only be tightened to the snug tight condition, defined as
the tightness attained by a few impacts of an impact wrench or the full effort of a man using an
ordinary spud wrench.

Joints Subject To Tension Loads

Two tightening procedures are specified for A325 bolts in joints subject to tension loads, turn-of-the-
nut method and direct tension indicator.

Turn-of-the-nut method When turn-of-the-nut method is used to provide tension, first bring
enough bolts to a "snug tight" condition to ensure that the parts of the joints are brought into good
contact with each other. Next, place bolts in all remaining bolt holes and bring to "snug tight".
Then additionally tighten all bolts progressing from the bolts nearest the web, to the free edges.
During this operation there shall be no rotation of the part not turned by the wrench.

Tightening by use of a direct tension indicator Tightening by this means is permitted provided
it can be demonstrated, by an accurate direct measurement procedure, that the bolts have been
tightened to specified tension.

Consult latest edition of the AISC Manual of Steel Construction for more complete instructions for
installing high strength bolts.

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Locogringo,

Would you happen to know the size of the I-beam for both the columns and the rafters? Looking to do some 3D modeling of some metal buildings for my pops for him to get an idea of how big of a building he will want.

Thanks

What was the cost for just the bolt up frame?

BKS_Aggie08 said:

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Locogringo,

Would you happen to know the size of the I-beam for both the columns and the rafters? Looking to do some 3D modeling of some metal buildings for my pops for him to get an idea of how big of a building he will want.

Thanks

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I thought it was surprising but very few pieces were actual wide flange beams (or what we all call "I-beam") but rather they were Built-up sections (meaning the "I" shape is achieved by welding 3 pieces of flat stock together). Nonetheless, the columns were made with 3/16"x10" plate for the web and 1/4"x6" plate for the flanges. The rafters were made with 10GAx14" plate for the web and 1/4"x6" plate for the flanges.

Quote:

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What was the cost for just the bolt up frame?

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The furthest down I can break down the invoice they gave me is : bolt up frame, all sheeting (colored walls and roof), all trim (colored), all bolts and screws, gutters w/ downspouts, anchor bolts, etc. is right at 32K.

Very nice where did you get it from?

It's a Mueller building.

I don't like bad mouthing people, but I think next time I will go with a weld up building though a local guy. For the premium you pay for the Mueller name, there was too many small issues to justify it. It isn't terrible by any means, but I think it would be worth trying the weld-up route to compare.

What were the issues if you don't mind me asking? we did a weld up at my parents a few years back and it was a pain in the butt

The one issue that should not have even had a chance of happening is that one entire framed opening for a window is missing. Luckily it will be an easy fix, but REALLY?

Another that ticked me off was the cables for bracing. There are 4 cables, all the same length. I was given 4 cables with 3 different lengths. Only one cable was close to the correct length, 2 were too short, 1 was WAY to long. Again, easy fix but it shows that the guy manufacturing it did not give 2 sheets about his work.

The delivery was pretty bad too. I didn't mind the big pieces knocking around together on the fork lifts, prolly not going to hurt anything. At one point they were stacking a bunch of the wall and roof purlins, a piece of wood slipped from its position and instead of getting off the lift and re-setting the blocking, he just dumped the load on top of the rest of the pile. These bundles of purlins are thick, probably close to 1000 LBS, and he just dropped it all over the pile and left it twisted up. Again, ended up not hurting anything but just shows a lack of caring. Also had one sheet get crumpled, I saw it happen, was a true accident, and Mueller is replacing it.

The last bay of the building had 2 of its members dinged up and twisted pretty good. That bay is the only one out of square and is still causing an issue with an eve strut. Again, I can fix the eve strut issue, and the out of square wont hurt anything, but for the "premium" you pay for Mueller, I expected more care and attention to detail.

Those things combined with a bunch of little piddly stuff made me pretty unsatisfied with Mueller (the red-oxide paint job is atrocious, I understand runs and stuff, but there are big sections with no paint) (many bolt holes weren't cut round which required some file work to get bolts in)

Not a ton of work done that's very fun to look at. I did get my 2 walk doors welded in

Before:



After:



Also got all of the base angle nailed down that I could (Mueller didn't send enough fasteners for all of it...) Not exciting to look at, didn't even take a picture.

Also cut a bunch of extra base angle that will get welded under the first wall purlin for some 3' sheets to tie into. That ended up being a major (unexpected) pain in the arse. Again, not exciting, no pics.

It was a decent weekend, not amazing. Really showed me how much having Mrs. Gringo around helps keep the pace at a good rate, even the times she is just playing the role of bird dog. Unfortunately this weekend I'll be solo-gringo again, but fortunately I still have more than enough solo-style work on ground level.

I don't know if you've done one of these before, but we had a problem with ants getting inside the building once it was finished.

I ended up caulking the entire base angle and around the columns and that solved the issue. I would recommend caulking it before setting it and then nailing it down.

Too late now, I only lack a handful of pieces. I like the idea. However, did you have any gaps between the base angle and columns? I have roughly 1/4 inch everywhere the base angle meets a column. Most of the pieces were cut to length already and I followed suite with the ones I had to cut. If I figure a way to plug these gaps, I think the caulking would be well worth it.

And I guess the foam closures that go between the sheeting and base angle keeps the ants from just climbing over the base angle.

What a neat project! I've really enjoyed following your progress. I had stained concrete floors in a previous home. They were beautiful, and easy to clean, but really hard on our knees and ankles. We ended up putting down hardwood and carpet which helped tremendously. Just something to keep in mind. Thanks again for all the updates and insight!