AggieUSMC said:

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Ag with kids said:

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AggieUSMC said:

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oldcrow91 said:

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AggieUSMC said:

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Disagree, either keep it the way it is or make standard time permanent. I don't want sunrise after 9 am thank you.

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I think sundown should always be at 8pm. I hate getting off work and it already be dark.

Or 9 pm. I'm flexible.

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Even if we had permanent DST, Sunset would be before 8pm.

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Technically, he didn't say he wanted DST. He said he wanted sundown at 8 or 9. So, a sliding time schedule it appears...

Changing the clocks would SUCK for his plan.

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Honestly, WTF does that even matter? Changing the clocks doesn't change the total hours of sunlight.

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Nobody on here has said that.

It's the amount of sunlight relative to the end of the workday that is the issue. That's the entire point of DST. Which is why we've gone from 6 mo to 7 mo to the current 8 mo of DST - people DO like having that evening light time.

fc2112 said:

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Just to clarify for everyone - noon is supposed to be when the sun is directly overhead. Thus the amount of daylight before and after noon are roughly equal. Each town had its own local time since the sun was directly overhead at different points of the day.

Modern travel created the need to standardize times. Time zones are about one hour wide, give or take for state boundaries, etc. Now, solar noon is early for some parts of time zones and late for others.



As you can see, the western edge of Texas is almost a full hour after solar noon. In fact, all of Texas is after solar noon. On DS, solar noon isn't until close o 2 PM for most of the state.

If we stuck with just one standard - preferably the one where noon is when the sun is close to being overhead - jobs and schools will adjust their schedules to make the number of hours before and after high noon work best for them. The problem now isn't whether he hour of daylight is early of late - the problem is that it changes.

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With our electronic abilities today, we could probably go back to this time and have the watches automagically adjust themselves depending on your location. For tv viewing, as streaming becomes more and more common, the tv schedules don't even matter.

For things like football games, the time displayed for the stat could be automatically set depending on where you are.

We really have no excuse, other than to make it easy on those who cannot adapt to modern life, not to go back to a more natural time.

Ag with kids said:

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AggieUSMC said:

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oldcrow91 said:

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AggieUSMC said:

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Disagree, either keep it the way it is or make standard time permanent. I don't want sunrise after 9 am thank you.

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I think sundown should always be at 8pm. I hate getting off work and it already be dark.

Or 9 pm. I'm flexible.

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Even if we had permanent DST, Sunset would be before 8pm.

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Technically, he didn't say he wanted DST. He said he wanted sundown at 8 or 9. So, a sliding time schedule it appears...

Changing the clocks would SUCK for his plan.

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Yeah. When would sunrise be in Fairbanks in the winter? 6 or 7 pm?

https://instagr.am/p/DB6nfuwPizt

By the way, I thought that the time change was supposed to always be after election day, not before.

Did something change?

eric76 said:

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fc2112 said:

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Just to clarify for everyone - noon is supposed to be when the sun is directly overhead. Thus the amount of daylight before and after noon are roughly equal. Each town had its own local time since the sun was directly overhead at different points of the day.

Modern travel created the need to standardize times. Time zones are about one hour wide, give or take for state boundaries, etc. Now, solar noon is early for some parts of time zones and late for others.



As you can see, the western edge of Texas is almost a full hour after solar noon. In fact, all of Texas is after solar noon. On DS, solar noon isn't until close o 2 PM for most of the state.

If we stuck with just one standard - preferably the one where noon is when the sun is close to being overhead - jobs and schools will adjust their schedules to make the number of hours before and after high noon work best for them. The problem now isn't whether he hour of daylight is early of late - the problem is that it changes.

---

With our electronic abilities today, we could probably go back to this time and have the watches automagically adjust themselves depending on your location. For tv viewing, as streaming becomes more and more common, the tv schedules don't even matter.

For things like football games, the time displayed for the stat could be automatically set depending on where you are.

We really have no excuse, other than to make it easy on those who cannot adapt to modern life, not to go back to a more natural time.

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You have no Earthly idea how complicated this would be to implement and how many new frustrations this would cause. No. No. No. No.

Agree with Op.
There is no good reason for this 2x per yr time
Change

I forgot about the time change until it finally dawned on me.

C@LAg said:

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BonfireNerd04 said:

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Ban DST and use Standard Time. Because it's "high noon", not "high 1 PM". Actually more like 2 PM in parts of West Texas.

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because it is actually only "high noon" in a limited band of locations and for a limited time.

ridiculous.

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Standard Time (where timezones are whole-hou4 offsets from UTC) is a reasonable compromise between having noon close to 12:00, and not making people adjust their watches for short trips.

DST is just arbitrary ******ed BS.

halfastros81 said:

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Agree with Op.
There is no good reason for this 2x per yr time
Change

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Disagree.
Where I live, because if DST, it stays light till 9:30 at night during the summer and when it changes back in the winter the kids are not standing for the bus in the dark. Win/Win. And all I have to do is change my clock twice a year. The horror.

I really don't understand the issue with just making ONE change and then we never have to change it again. Split the difference basically.

In this day and age there is no reason we could not MOVE IT HALF AN HOUR and leave it there.

Computers take care of all time differences with meetings, travel, etc. and clocks adjust automatically on phone and computers as we move.

Being a half hour off from Greenwich time would be no big deal. There are in fact places that are intentionally on half hour or even quarter hour boundaries that suit them better.

This would then get half the benefit of DST in the summer (sun might go down at 8:30pm instead of 9pm) and half the benefit of standard time in the winter (sun up by 7:30 ish instead of 7am on standard and 8am on DST).

And then we never have to move it again. Longterm THAT is the best solution.

Why everyone thinks it has to be either/or absolutely escapes my logical brain.

I don't understand why people don't like changing the clocks back

it's awesome to wake up in November on the east coast and it is NOT DARK at 0640...

life is much more pleasant and easier to start the day

unless someone is a farmer, why does anyone care about this?

LMCane said:

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I don't understand why people don't like changing the clocks back

it's awesome to wake up in November on the east coast and it is NOT DARK at 0640...

life is much more pleasant and easier to start the day

unless someone is a farmer, why does anyone care about this?

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I'm not sure farmers get in a row over this.

BonfireNerd04 said:

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C@LAg said:

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BonfireNerd04 said:

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Ban DST and use Standard Time. Because it's "high noon", not "high 1 PM". Actually more like 2 PM in parts of West Texas.

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because it is actually only "high noon" in a limited band of locations and for a limited time.

ridiculous.

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Standard Time (where timezones are whole-hou4 offsets from UTC) is a reasonable compromise between having noon close to 12:00, and not making people adjust their watches for short trips.

DST is just arbitrary ******ed BS.

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You must wear a Rolex. Modern watches should be able to adjust themselves.

It was so great being in pitch black at 545 PM! Lol

It's nice to have an issue that people can disagree with that doesn't involve core fundamental freedoms being challenged or that involves a core moral principle.

People can be on either side of this and be ok with me.

But I do prefer longer daylight in afternoon.

TriAg2010 said:

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eric76 said:

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fc2112 said:

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Just to clarify for everyone - noon is supposed to be when the sun is directly overhead. Thus the amount of daylight before and after noon are roughly equal. Each town had its own local time since the sun was directly overhead at different points of the day.

Modern travel created the need to standardize times. Time zones are about one hour wide, give or take for state boundaries, etc. Now, solar noon is early for some parts of time zones and late for others.



As you can see, the western edge of Texas is almost a full hour after solar noon. In fact, all of Texas is after solar noon. On DS, solar noon isn't until close o 2 PM for most of the state.

If we stuck with just one standard - preferably the one where noon is when the sun is close to being overhead - jobs and schools will adjust their schedules to make the number of hours before and after high noon work best for them. The problem now isn't whether he hour of daylight is early of late - the problem is that it changes.

---

With our electronic abilities today, we could probably go back to this time and have the watches automagically adjust themselves depending on your location. For tv viewing, as streaming becomes more and more common, the tv schedules don't even matter.

For things like football games, the time displayed for the stat could be automatically set depending on where you are.

We really have no excuse, other than to make it easy on those who cannot adapt to modern life, not to go back to a more natural time.

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You have no Earthly idea how complicated this would be to implement and how many new frustrations this would cause. No. No. No. No.

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It would be a bit complicated., but not undoable.

If the watch contains a GPS, it should be relatively easy to determine the solar time. Probably a single line function with the GPS coordinates as the variables.

The complications would be the users, not the technology involved.

eric76 said:

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TriAg2010 said:

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eric76 said:

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fc2112 said:

---

Just to clarify for everyone - noon is supposed to be when the sun is directly overhead. Thus the amount of daylight before and after noon are roughly equal. Each town had its own local time since the sun was directly overhead at different points of the day.

Modern travel created the need to standardize times. Time zones are about one hour wide, give or take for state boundaries, etc. Now, solar noon is early for some parts of time zones and late for others.



As you can see, the western edge of Texas is almost a full hour after solar noon. In fact, all of Texas is after solar noon. On DS, solar noon isn't until close o 2 PM for most of the state.

If we stuck with just one standard - preferably the one where noon is when the sun is close to being overhead - jobs and schools will adjust their schedules to make the number of hours before and after high noon work best for them. The problem now isn't whether he hour of daylight is early of late - the problem is that it changes.

---

With our electronic abilities today, we could probably go back to this time and have the watches automagically adjust themselves depending on your location. For tv viewing, as streaming becomes more and more common, the tv schedules don't even matter.

For things like football games, the time displayed for the stat could be automatically set depending on where you are.

We really have no excuse, other than to make it easy on those who cannot adapt to modern life, not to go back to a more natural time.

---

You have no Earthly idea how complicated this would be to implement and how many new frustrations this would cause. No. No. No. No.

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It would be a bit complicated., but not undoable.

If the watch contains a GPS, it should be relatively easy to determine the solar time. Probably a single line function with the GPS coordinates as the variables.

The complications would be the users, not the technology involved.

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Time would do some weird things as you were driving west and east.... moving really slow or really fast.

I mean up near 100 mph you would be about 10% of the speed of earths rotation and thus time would be 10% faster or slower.

Move schools start hours back so the kids don't have to wait for the bus in the dark in the morning and there is no need for the other 150 million of us to deal with the time changes.

halfastros81 said:

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Move schools start hours back so the kids don't have to wait for the bus in the dark in the morning and there is no need for the other 150 million of us to deal with the time changes.

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It's not just the kids. It was light when I drove to work this morning as well. My point is the poster said there is no benefit. There are many benefits. I honestly don't get the opposition. It's such a tiny thing. Plus our phones do the work for us. There are benefits in the summer. There are benefits in the winter. I just don't understand all the whining.

It's not tiny for everybody and it seems unnecessary .
Is it an insurmountable issue…. no… not really but why is
It needed?

halfastros81 said:

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It's not tiny for everybody and it seems unnecessary .
Is it an insurmountable issue…. no… not really but why is
It needed?

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Because of lobbying by Big Golf and whoever else benefits from "later" sunsets.

The hour hand should always point at the sun when the clock is parallel with the equatorial plane.

Ban 12-hour chronographs and Daylight Saving Time.

halfastros81 said:

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It's not tiny for everybody and it seems unnecessary .
Is it an insurmountable issue…. no… not really but why is
It needed?

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I'm glad you said it's not tiny for everybody. Can you explain how? I'm actually interested and not being a jerk. Trying to understand why people have such a hard time with it. I barely notice it, except for the benefits.

Here's a start

[link]7 Things to Know About Daylight Saving Time | Johns Hopkins | Bloomberg School of Public Health[/link]

halfastros81 said:

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Here's a start

[link]7 Things to Know About Daylight Saving Time | Johns Hopkins | Bloomberg School of Public Health[/link]

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I guess if the scientific consensus says so, it must be true, lol.

Honestly, its never affected me in any way. it's only an hour. It's not like flying back from Tokyo. I guess others must feel it.

I have read that one proposal is to reduce the world to a single time zone. The whole world would be on UTC.

That's going to mess up Dolly Parton's music.

https://observablehq.com/@awoodruff/daylight-saving-time-gripe-assistant-tool

Neat little tool

Daylight Savings kills. Increased heart attacks, fatal auto accidents, deer strikes, etc. Here are a couple findings from a CU study...

Quote:

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Researchers at the University of Colorado at Boulder studied the daylight saving time period (from 2002-2011) and found over 30 deaths annually (or 302 over the 10-year period) could have been caused by the DST change.

When daylight savings time ends, we lose an hour of afternoon sunlight. This may increase the likelihood of car accidents since more time is spent on the road in the darkness.

Studies have shown that more people are active during the evening. Without the added sunlight provided by daylight savings time, driver visibility is reduced, increasing the odds of a crash.

Adding an hour of sunlight in the evening year-round would save the lives of more than 170 pedestrians annually, according to a recent study in Accident Analysis and Prevention. The lives of nearly 200 vehicle occupants would also theoretically be saved by the change.

Some experts state that the abrupt time change that accompanies the start and end of daylight savings time leaves little time for people to adapt. As a result, drivers may still behave as if it's light outside even when it's dark. They may drive faster and, at the same time, pedestrians may be less attentive.

It takes about a week for most people to acclimate to the change in time and resume their normal levels of safe driving. Although we get an extra hour of sleep in the fall, this still results in changes in sleep patterns and behaviors, even leading to sleep-deprivation from the shift.

Martin Moore-Ede, a former professor at Harvard Medical School and an expert on driver fatigue, attributes the increase in accidents associated with daylight savings time to too many sleep-deprived drivers on the road at the same time. Studies have shown that drowsy driving impairs drivers to nearly the same extent as operating under the influence of drugs or alcohol.

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And for the morning drivers?

DST is the problem. Don't ever switch to it in the first place and you don't have to suffer when it ends.

Time change is stupid. I miss the days when I lived in AZ that I didn't have to deal with it. Amazingly, the world still went on and we simply adjusted our schedules as necessary. It wasn't hard at all.

TexasRebel said:

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And for the morning drivers?

DST is the problem. Don't ever switch to it in the first place and you don't have to suffer when it ends.

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I'd rather drive to work in the dark and get home to still have daylight in the evenings so I can be productive around my house.

Driving to work in the daylight and getting home after dark blows goats and is stupid.

As much as I hate early sunsets in the winter (especially when I used to work until 5pm), I don't think I can get behind the ridiculously late sunrises of DST.

Why not kill DST. Would rather have a little more dark in the heat of summer evenings